(Topic ID: 143978)

ST pro VS GOT pro

By dannunz

8 years ago


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#123 8 years ago
Quoted from Eskaybee:

For the record, I'm not a very good player. I just have a small lineup at all times so I get to play the same game over and over a lot. Luckily, STLE 'does it' for me where I haven't had to rotate it out. Prior to dwights code, I almost traded it out for a BDK, remember that!?

gonna ask you this since you know more about the rules, do you think ST rules are complete?

#126 8 years ago

What is the benefit or bonus for going three deep on each mission?

#133 8 years ago
Quoted from DaveH:

(sorry for quoting out of multiple posts, but they all make a point)
I don't think it is the fact that CIU and the others are quicker to get to, it is how they tell you that you are getting there. As you hit the coffin the DMD tells you how many more hits are needed, and when you get there, the insert for coffin lights up. Inside CIU when you hit it once, the insert lights letting you know that escape from CIU is 1/4 done.
I'm using MET as the example, but other games have a similar way to lead you through playing. As you play a bunch of games on a new machine, things feel random. Hey, what caused that callout. Hey, what did I do to light that insert. And you try to do it again. Tron yells out "Libations for EVERYBODY" and you watch closely the next game to see it happened when you hit the 4th Zeus standup. There are the harder ones like the fact that Gem finishes Quorra (!) on Tron, but you get the idea. After about 10 games you start to get the flow of a games rules. And after about 30 it really starts to click. Sometimes earlier, sometimes later. But parts along the way start to lay the tracks.
Some games are different like AC/DC, where your scoring strategy along with your tolerance for risk vs. reward can lead you. You could cash in that jackpot, or you could wait to build up a HUGE one. To me that game is all about the points you are willing to leave on the table as you play. But unfortunately AC/DC does require a bit of explanation of the rules. If you play the game with someone who knows it well the machine opens up and is amazing.
Your description of ST is probably the best I ever heard. I had NO idea how different and complex each mode was. Mostly because the game has never led me there. So when I play it, each mode doesn't feel special and new, they sort of feel the same. The game has been around for years, and yet this is the first explanation of the depth of the game that made sense to me. Huge parts of this were even lost on Bowen when he did his tutorial video on the game, and he is 10 times the player I could ever hope to be. So I guess it is possible that Stern went too far with the rules (I cannot believe I just said that).
Another big problem for the game was how long this complexity took to get into the game. I remember when it came out and I rushed out to play it. I thought it was really cool, but the feeling playing never clicked with me. The shots were fine (even the tough side shots for the away team), but the modes didn't capture me. And I was also ticked off that I lit 3 in a row, but there was NO reward for it back then even though it was written on the playfield. I stuck with it trying newer software for a while, but then I decided that the game didn't do it for me. I've probably only played it 5 or 6 times since then.
I guess that comes back to a huge knock on Stern for how they do things. I play a new game and get an impression of it good or bad. And then over the next 18 months the code is written so the game becomes what it will be. But sometimes it is just too late to turn around my feelings about a game. TWD is going through this right now. They finally turned the code into something good, but I am having such a hard time getting over my distaste for the game and the way the code used to play that it is hard to even give it a chance.
So I really appreciate your writeup of the modes. Knowing this maybe I'll take another crack at the game on the current code. I'm just getting the impression that I shouldn't even play a Stern for the first 18 months after they ship.

Well said, I still own the game, but it's not my favorite. Perhapse since I own so many other games, I have choices that I say to myself do I want to play TSPP or IM or Tron or AcDc. Just seems that ST gets pushed down the list that I don't really get it. I think it's probably good code but as you said it's not self explanatory. And while TSPP and AcDc are very complex, they both have very good rules sheets I can reference.

With ST I'm just at a loss on some of the basics that I never really get to the advanced rules where it might some day click. That's why I'm hoping someone will write up the rules. I'm going to watch Bowens tutorial, but I find as good as he is and and well as the tutorials might be, the fact is the video was made years ago before the new code and also he's playing the pin and the rules might not go exactly as well as if someone was to logically write down the rules such as these are the modes 1,2,3 (etc). This is how the Multiball works, this is how the super jackpot works, this is how the medals work etc...

IMO Star Trek either has poor rules in that they are not self explanatory, same with AcDc but with AcDc there is a full multi page rull sheat written up that I can read.

Even a very simple game like Tron, PotC and IM, I find that I appreciate the game rules much more if I can read them and get them in my head before I play rather than have to noodle out what I'm supposed to be doing.

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