So the cost of 1 and a half Stern node boards here in the U.K....?

I’d say Proc is a bargain in comparison

Just you mate!

Nay to Evil dead but yay to Meatloaf, are you really 27?

You probably know that better than I do. When I got out of my morning meetings, R&M was sold out! My email to Charlie and Kayte that day was a heartfelt congratulations.

I can't imagine anybody would ever need a full set of replacements. If a board makes it through testing, the odds of one of our boards dying from normal use are super low. Maybe have a spare of each in case of an accidental short? You can always replace your spare later if necessary.

- Gerry
https://www.multimorphic.com

By my count there at least 18 different ponies including Twilight Sparkle, Rainbow Dash, & Applejack. You'll need multiple boards if each character has a switch/mode/shot.

Like how you think !!!

Waynes World has Meatloaf in it as well..

would love a Die Hard or Fifth Element

Hmmm...a team up of companies.

A2080744-AAD4-401A-96C1-F51D6529E478 (resized).jpeg

In regard to PROC, I think one of the overlooked aspects is that the board set has been "out in the wild" for a number of years and has done very well. Don't underestimate the importance of a rugged circuit board set that can handle the rigors of continuous use. I also like that the PROC system is widely available and reasonably priced, especially in comparison to the Stern node boards.

While a new board set from Ben may have great features and a reduced price, it will take a few years of the board set being used in games to see if it has the longevity to withstand the rigor of everyday use. Just due to that unknown, I prefer the PROC option since it is already proven itself to hold up. I am curious what other features the new board set that Ben is making will have though.

I’d be curious to know but honestly does it really matter? Chances of you needing one board replaced is slim to none, the chance of a full set is likely never gonna happen.

What’s plainly obvious is the PROC board set is not only more robust than Sterns nodes, likely more competent too, but a hell of a lot cheaper in the event of a replacement.

Last I checked, in Rick and Morty, there is 1 P3-ROC, 2 PD-16s, 4 SW-16s, and 5 PD-LEDs. The reason it gets expensive is that I insisted on using a crap ton of direct drive RGB LEDs. This requires extra PD-LED boards. If I would have been able to get serial LEDs working reliably enough under a playfield, I could have gotten away with 1 PD-LED.
--Scott

Remember.... that is retail pricing, not bulk OEM pricing.

Scott must be doing lights!

Just wait till you add in replacements for the metal and plastic parts in your machine that might actually wear out. You'll have $20k worth of retail parts in your closet before you know it!

One beauty of a modular system is that when the one annoying screw finally works itself out, causing a bracket to drop and short out a SW-16, you're paying $45 for a new board instead of possibly 10-20x for a new single board solution or $100+ for somebody to fix it.

Like I said before, if you operate machines on location and want to be able to fix problems immediately, maybe get 1 of each board as a spare. At this point, you might have other machines that use our boards. So you'll have those covered as well.

- Gerry
https://www.multimorphic.com

875 at retail pricing to completely replace all of the boards doesn't sound that unreasonable to me.

How much would it be to completely replace a Spike2 boardset?

I really don't understand what you are driving at here. Plenty of people have and will continue to try and make new board sets for pinball, but thus far P-roc is winning out due to cost and ease of use.

I guess the closet competitor is the Fast boards? how are they doing in the wild?

Spike 2 CPU is about a grand I think...?

Not sure what Hilton’s agenda is to continue poking at P-ROC. It’s probably not even the most expensive part of the game.

You’re ignoring the years and years of development experience in the ecosystem, the highly mature frameworks that make games like ACNC, TNA and now R&M possible.

As someone who wasted over a year on a “cheaper” solution before going to P-ROC and finally vanquishing all my board issues forever, you need to look at more than the pure dollar (and RETAIL at that) values. It’s certainly cheaper than STERN boards but I don’t hear any crying about that from you.

On the topic of the CGC board set it seems optimized to handle emulation duties primarily vs original content. Not sure it’s even in the running.

@jwilson, what "cheaper" solution were you working with? I'm planning out a homebrew pin and want to be fully informed for engineering decisions.

He didn't get defensive he cleared up a bunch of misconceptions and assumptions that you were throwing out.

You still haven't given a good reason for Spooky to move on from the P-Roc system other than some vague guess at possible improvements elsewhere.

I think I love Gerry

Yeah, Gerry is awesome !

LTG : )

Argue about circuit boards all you want. I'll be over here concentrating on making a satisfying mechanical game under the glass.

Can't wait to see Ben Heck unleashed. What a great thing for pinball !

LTG : )

How many people will buy this game just for the heck of it?

Pics?

Open Pinball Project.

Not to knock Ben, but he's not actually an electrical engineer and probably shouldn't be designing control systems meant to go into thousands and thousands of machines. Meanwhile, there's a board designed by actual EEs that is installed in hundreds of machines RIGHT NOW with a proven track record, across multiple manufacturers. Why switch?

How much design and prototyping time has been poured into this new boardset? I'm not seeing the savings.

I think chickens are more likely than bats.

As for the PROC vs other board sets, honestly they should just pick what works best for them. If Ben is coding it, there is no doubt it will be his board set that will be the quickest solution for him.

We went down the path of PROC vs something else, and we picked something else first. While the cost savings to the BOM looked great for us when looking at the retail pricing and low quantities, that pretty much evaporates at higher quantities.

I can say that the boardset costs for Kingpin are quite a bit lower than we expected when looking at quantity pricing (believe me, looking at retail pricing scares the shit out you at first), and that coupled with the documentation, multiple frameworks/tools available, and support from their dev community all saved us a**loads of time.

For us, PROC was the right choice, but I fully understand that for others it may not be.

Paul

Sounds like Ben is making am EM

If Ben was the designer of the board set then this would be a valid concern but your just sprouting #Fakenews

Pinheck was designed by me.

Yay P-Roc systems. Love building games with those board sets.

Not crapping on qualified degree engineers or LonghornEngineer or @gstellenberg, but just having a degree certificate / education does not equal being a great engineer. Passion, experimentation and thinking outside the box (text book) are also important components in being a great engineer / creator - keep up the great work Ben & Gerry and others in this space.

Hey @benheck, there has been a variety of speculation in this post about what the game could be. Can you give us a little hint and tell us from the list below one of our guesses that is completely wrong? That would be cool!

Evil Dead
Army of Darkness
Rocky Horror Picture Show
Fight Club
Meat Loaf
Jaws
5th Element
Big Trouble in Little China
Predator
Scooby Doo

Nice try.

Ok, who thinks any of the above list are AAA titles? I don’t put any of these in a triple A marketing space. Basically, if you walk down the toy isles of Walmart, how many toys from these properties are on the shelf? Maybe Predator... possibly Scooby Doo, but doubtful. I would not put up any of these titles as a good pinball theme if sales of machines to the mainstream masses are your goal. Boutique level interest may be there, but mainstream properties, these are not, IMHO.

Hmmm... If only there was a theme with a rabid fan base and Walmart carried a shit tonn of their toys...

Do not say LEGO.... and Stern pooched the Star Wars property already...

NRA? Big Buck Hunter Pinball 2?

I stand corrected. How many revisions is it up to now, eight?

You are missing the point. That list is not about what is or is not a good theme, it is to see if we can get a clue of what the game could be. Process of elimination and everything. Now, let's be quiet on this front and see if Ben will grace us with a clue

I think he already alluded that it was NOT Evil Dead. But he didn't rule out Army of Darkness

Will you invite Kaneda to play your mechanical marvel first when it’s completed?

A pinball machine is only as good as the circuit boards that control the mechs

Kaneda TWIPY Madness mode.