(Topic ID: 205155)

*SPOILERS* Star Wars: TLJ is really bad and other Star Wars/Disney/Marvel talk *

By InfiniteLives

1 year ago

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    Topic poll

    “Star Wars: The Last Jedi was...”

    • garbage, the worst of the main films 201 votes
    • decent, better than the prequels 230 votes
    • really good, on par with the originals 75 votes
    • great! one of the best 71 votes
    • who cares, star wars sucks 41 votes

    (618 votes)

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    Post #2827 Analysis worth watching. Posted by gdonovan (11 months ago)

    Post #3520 Path to get Disney + discounted. Thanks @fosaisu Posted by fosaisu (3 months ago)

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    #560 1 year ago

    I was digging this movie until the 3rd act where it completely falls apart.

    Casino Planet plot turns out to be pointless, the suicide lightspeed through the ship (a massive literal plot hole that ruins all Star Wars combat) Finn's sacrifice being aborted by Rose and finally Hologram Luke Skype Battle.

    Some say "the movie is about failure so it makes sense!" but that's lame. You can deconstruct heros and tropes but you still need to have payoff for your setups.

    I did enjoy it more than the abysmal Rogue One at least.

    #598 1 year ago
    Quoted from TigerLaw:

    I was interested in her because the actress is a Game of Thrones star and pretty awesome. Sadly, it wouldn’t have mattered who was wearing that suit in the end, we get an eye only right before her death...anyone could have acted that part. Waste of an excellent actress’ talents.

    Are you kidding? She'll be back.

    She shouldn't have survived the last movie so I doubt she died in this one.

    #604 1 year ago

    Wonder what the 2nd weekend drop will be? Yesterday it was down 75% from its 1st Friday (worst in series)


    Han Solo (the movie they shot twice) will get pushed to December 2018 from its current May slot. To fix it up and save $ on VFX.
    If Han Solo isn't a blockbuster heads will roll.
    No more under-experienced indie filmmakers hired ever again.
    Disney moves Star Wars back to May to make room for at Christmas for the Avatar movies that they also now own.

    #609 1 year ago

    Imagine if Luke had raised his X-Wing from the water... effortlessly as opposed to Empire. The crowd would have gone BONKERS! Then he flies it to the battle and dies heroically saving his friends... again, crowd goes nuts.

    Or if Finn had been allowed to sacrifice himself to redeem his cowardice and save Rose, proving that is truly IS a hero.

    That's the most frustrating thing about this movie - it's just a few dumb mistakes away from being AMAZING, but those mistakes are so egregious (like serving a $100 steak with a turd on top) that it brings the whole thing down.

    #643 1 year ago

    Wow she hit the nail on the head.

    I just want a movie where things make sense. 3 of the dumbest things involved Finn and Rose their plot should never have happened:

    1) They're about to be executed, blades drawn, the explosion saves them. All the armored soldiers around them are dead, and Phasma has (for some reason) teleported 100 yards away. Wtf?????

    2) Rose not letting Finn sacrifice himself. I guess so they can have a love triangle? But can that happen? Disney seems to have a "no romance" policy across all its films now.

    3) Somehow Finn drags Rose back to base, across miles of terrain, faster than their ships took them in the first place, without being killed by 10 Walkers with "Leave no prisoners!" Orders.

    #703 1 year ago

    Justice League was basically filmed twice so it has to make a lot more to break even. (and home video sales are a shadow of what they once were)

    See also Han Solo, also filmed twice, and if it underperforms at all I could see execs getting the axe.

    Don't kid yourself Disney is concerned, else there wouldn't be so much spin coming down the news wire. Just yesterday a story was posted about Mark Hamill "regretting" his comments about the film - strong arm tactics anyone?

    #753 1 year ago

    Cinemascore is a rating of "How much did the movie meet your expectation?" not so much the quality.

    That's why turds like Transformers can get A's - because the audience expected a dumb robot movie and also got one.

    #823 1 year ago

    The character of Rey sucks. A real character needs to undergo change, adversity and hardship, to come out the other side as a better person. They could get away with it not happening in TFA but something should have happened in this middle movie (think of all the crap Luke goes through in Empire).

    Imagine a Terminator movie where Sarah Conner starts out as a badass and doesn't grow at all? Oh wait you won't have to imagine that - it was called Terminator Genysis and it sucked.

    #861 1 year ago

    Scripts suck in general because in this shared universe annual release world movies are "made backwards" from a set-in-stone release date.

    What I find so frustrating about TLJ is with some minor tweaks it could have been so much better.

    #898 1 year ago

    Remember folks, when you need to hire The Galaxy's Best Codebreaker the first thing you should do is call a bartender!

    #914 1 year ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Don't worry I'm sure they'll make a movie constructed completely around filling that plot hole and blow it

    "Maz Cantana: A Star Wars Story" follows everyone's favorite character (Maz Catana) from her early days as a street sweeper on the mean streets of Bespin. But everything in her life changes where she finds a drain clogged by a severed human hand, holding a weapon she's never seen before....

    #917 1 year ago
    Quoted from CaptainNeo:

    except, we already saw it leave cloud city and fall into the clouds in ESB. So we know it's nowhere to be found on cloud city. And why couldn't it just be lost? It's not like it's impossible to make anther one. Seems like people are making them left and right. Hell, Kylo made 3 of them into 1.

    Hm Bespin appears to be a gas giant planet, so if that lightsaber fell into the atmosphere, it's long gone!

    Though of course, this is the same series where Han/Finn bump into Rey at complete random on a PLANET SIZED BASE. (The Coincidence Awakens)

    #992 1 year ago

    For me, Rogue One is the worst SW film. (and it's hard to imagine how much worse it was before reshoots)

    2/3rds of that movie is completely pointless. Entire scenes are written as fan service, like where Darth Vader and Krennick discuss things the audience already knows about. The moral dilemma of "should I kill her dad?" is rendered moot when X-wings blow him up. A little girl would not have a Stormtrooper doll (would a French girl have a Nazi doll in 1943?) The main character has zero purpose or agency. The mom committing suicide instead of helping her daughter makes me wonder if the screenwriter ever knew a mother in their life.

    It's all a bunch of filler to get to the end battle - which is pretty good and actually more "Star Wars-y" than TFA or TLJ, but is like putting a cupcake on top of cow manure.

    The prequels were poorly directed and blandly acted, but at least every scene had a purpose, they were consistent within their own logic, and Anakin's choices as a character had effects on the story.

    #1031 1 year ago

    The only relevant information in the first 2/3rds of Rogue One is her dad's hologram message:

    "I built a flaw in the death star, here's why I did it, here's how to exploit it, find the plans on Scariff, and this message is genuine because I know my daughter's nickname"

    That's IT! That is all they need to know. Everything else is pointless filler until they get to Scariff.

    It's also stupid because the rebels now KNOW there is a weakness, yet in Ep4 Leia says "I hope once analyzed a weakness can be found".

    Would have made more sense for R1 to be about finding her dad (rather than Saw Gerrara) and he still dies, but in dying breath says "I built a weakness... plans are on Scariff... you'll know where to find them.... Stardust"

    Because then they'd actually be a point to finding her dad, and him dying would obscure the facts a bit.

    I enjoyed most of TLJ but it had a few major issues that dragged it down for me. But it's still better than the mostly pointless Rogue One.

    #1110 1 year ago

    Many people would have preferred Ackbar take command and do the "lightspeed suicide run" instead of Holdo (Laura Dern's character) but it causes some problems with the story (as presented)

    If Poe mutinied against a character we've loved since 1983 (either Ackbar or Leia) audiences would have been upset and hated him for it.

    Therefore, if the plot requires him to mutiny against a plan he considers bad, they have to bring in a new character (Holdo) that we are LESS vested in (than him) in order for the audience to accept his decision to mutiny.

    Problem is, in ANY OTHER MOVIE PRESENTING THIS SCENARIO, the Holdo character would have ended up being either 1) a spy or 2) incompetent. But TLJ is all about "subverting expectations!" so neither happens, making everyone's decisions seem pointless and unsatisfying.

    Poe (and to a lesser extent Finn and Rose) are responsible for all the extra needless deaths, yet Holdo is the one who sacrifices herself. And then Finn tries to sacrifice himself but Rose stops him. It just doesn't make sense from a character arc standpoint.

    None of the new Star Wars movies make any sense from a character standpoint. Consider this: Who would be more broken up over the death of Han Solo - Rey or Chewey? And yet, at the end of Force Awakens, Leia walks RIGHT PAST CHEWEY and instead hugs a woman she's NEVER MET BEFORE!!!

    #1177 1 year ago

    People may disagree on TLJ's qualities as a movie but financially? HUGE SUCCESS.

    But if you're waiting for a car crash to gawk at SOLO: A STAR WARS STORY could be it.

    1) A movie nobody cares about, replacing an actor everyone loves, telling a story we don't need to hear.
    2) Shot 90% of it before realizing directors were a bad choice (but in actuality they were probably the fall guys for a shit script)
    3) Hired King of Bland: Ron Howard, who spent 3 months doing reshoots which is enough to make the movie a second time.
    4) Another 3 weeks of reshoots inbound = Disney not happy with rough cut.
    5) Massively blown out budget will be compounded by compressed VFX schedules to make a May release date.
    6) Can't move Solo to X-mas 2018 because Wreck it Ralph 2, Nutcracker and Mary Poppins 2 already there (and Mary has been in the can for ages already)

    Disney is releasing so much stuff they don't even have breathing room for their own movies, let alone absorbing Fox (will Star Wars / Avatar trade alternate years)

    #1183 1 year ago

    Ted I don't know what blue milk you've been drinking but there's no way in hell TLJ makes it to 2 billion worldwide.

    #1219 1 year ago
    Quoted from kvan99:

    Or maybe the Chinese just know a crap movie when they see one. Star Wars probably doesn't translate well.

    It's an interesting thought - how good are these new SW films AS FILMS when you remove the nostalgia element? Does linking every movie to every other movie cause confusion when going into new markets?

    Hey check out what James Cameron's standalone movies do over there:



    Maybe Disney bought Fox for Avatar since SW is a dud in China?

    1 week later
    #1305 1 year ago

    The toy industry IN GENERAL is swirling the toilet because all kids want are tablets and Minecraft.

    So TLJ toys didn't fail because of the movie, but because they're toys.

    Which sucks for Disney (world's smallest violin plays) because they're used to making the ACTUAL big bucks on merchandise (which is why Cars kept getting sequels)

    2 weeks later
    #1352 1 year ago

    Hey remember when JJ Abrams spent two months justifying his choice in The Force Awakens?

    Oh wait he didn't...

    On Monday we get the Han Solo trailer! The production that is every bit as much of a disaster as Justice League but Disney is better at spin than WB.

    #1358 1 year ago

    Why spend $5 mil on a Super Bowl ad to reach 100 million viewers when you can release the trailer for free on YouTube and get 150 million views?

    #1360 1 year ago

    How is their canned water any different from their beers? OH SNAP!

    #1365 1 year ago

    The Han Solo teaser could have used more Han Solo.

    #1370 1 year ago

    English accents are used a shorthand in movies to imply "imperialism".

    Same reason the Romans had British accents back in the sword & sandal movies.

    #1392 1 year ago

    Oh for sure there's Star Wars fatigue. They're releasing a movie every damn year now!

    #1404 1 year ago
    Quoted from TigerLaw:

    If the product was good that would be a feature. Since the product was not good it’s a problem for them.

    It would still be a problem. Disney did this exact same thing when they over saturated their animated output in the 1990's thinking "everything will be as big as Lion King!" But when there's a movie a year it's no longer special.

    While I agree Last Jedi has a host of (storytelling) problems working against it it was never going to do Force Awakens money. That had the advantage of 10 years (or for prequel haters 32 years) of pent-up demand.

    Now if every annual release could do as well as Rogue One that's still VERY good. But they need to fix their pipeline (and stop rushing scripts) because the uber-expensive Rogue One and Han Solo reshoots are not sustainable.

    #1414 1 year ago
    Quoted from TigerLaw:

    The problem with the Marvel movies is they feel like there are no stakes. None of the good guys die. They don’t even get injured. War Machine was walking again by the end of the civil war movie.
    Marvel needs to take some chances and kill off some heros here and there. Civil War was a failure as nothing changed, not even how the characters viewed each other (with the cell phone message from CA to IM at the end letting him know they were still pals). Marvel needs to take a page from XMen movies and kill off characters every now and then to give a feeling of stakes.

    That's because they can NEVER END. There's always another movie or spinoff to advertise during the credits.

    Movies have lost their sense of completion, of voyeuristic absolution, of finality. 24 years ago we see Andrew Dufrane escape prison and make it to Mexico, and Red joins him. A happy ending! A cathartic release! Your life may suck but you can take solace in a story with a happy ending. Maybe your life will turn out OK too...

    Now if they made that movie we'd get a sequel where they both end up back in jail, the guards are even meaner, and they have to escape again.

    3 weeks later
    #1446 1 year ago
    Quoted from John1210:

    Yes it is depressing isn’t it when you envision what could have been if the film was given to a competent director with a good story and vision for much loved characters.

    Colin Trevorrow is nowhere near as good a director as JJ Abrams. Jurassic World was junk, and filled with character moments just as tone deaf (if not more) than what was in Last Jedi.

    But it was successful junk, made more than all Rian Johnson's movies put together times ten, so it is a bit weird he didn't have a bigger say.

    My personal theory is that Disney knew well in advance how divisive TLJ would be but couldn't course correct because they were already busy reshooting all of Han Solo. Internally they know there's a problem otherwise they wouldn't have released so much spin afterwards. But they had to put on a brace face.

    The story in TLJ went nowhere, but took several key characters with it. (Except Phasma she'll be back) It's like an Erector set with key pieces missing. If you want something good with what remains, you give it to a good filmmaker (Abrams) not merely a lucky one (Trevorrow)

    #1452 1 year ago
    Quoted from Pimp77:

    They will get invited to the next Disney movie pre-release for critics instead of having to wait for official release!


    Here's 2 YouTube channels I really love. They both found Force Awakens ho-hum and hated Rogue One (as did I)

    Then along comes The Last Jedi.

    This one didn't get invited to the premier:

    And this one did:

    Can you spot the difference in opinion?

    1 week later
    #1487 1 year ago

    These new movies need at least a few space politics scenes but because they "avoid anything the prequels did at any cost!" we get zero.

    Tiger brings up a good point. So Starkiller base blows up four planets (that are somehow all in the same shot... science much?) Out of what, the thousands in the New Republic? And the Republic just gives up? Even though the super weapon was destroyed? Why????? Oh because we need "Rebels vs Empire"

    Imagine if North Korea built one missile and used it to wipe out Hawaii. Would the USA just surrender? Look at how we retaliated against 9/11.

    A giant planet sized base is pretty dumb to begin with, so a lot of this is TFA's fault. New Order was basically like the Nazis who ran away to Brazil. But they suddenly had an aircraft carrier bigger than all of the US Navy put together... How? Who do they tax to pay for it?

    The might of the Empire in the OT made sense because it was formed from a very old Republic. And it wasn't transformed into an Empire overnight, even in Rogue One they make reference to keeping the Death Star a secret from what was left of the Senate.

    I think it boils down to Lucas actually basing his stories on history (governments turning evil, chancellors brainwashing the public, using crisis to acheive goals) and these new filmmakers just throw shit at a wall an hope it sticks, logic be damned.

    #1503 1 year ago

    There was no way Last Jedi was going to best TFA box office. And now that Disney releases a Star Wars film per year, that pent up demand is forever gone.

    That said it should have done better. It didn't make all that much more than Rogue One and is almost getting beaten right now by a C list Marvel character.

    Solo will be interesting. It was a disastrous production and is probably one of the most expensive films ever made by now. If it underperforms in the slightest expect heads to roll.

    2 weeks later
    #1584 1 year ago

    Watched it again tonight.

    Found it mostly boring. Humor didn't work on second pass.

    Some parts still good. I like the stuff with the kids at the end.

    BUT GOD. The part where Rose stops Finn from sacrificing himself for the greater good - still awful. Worst part of movie.

    Finn should have died, completing his arc of coward-to-hero. But NO! We need a love (quadrangle?) in next movie, so keep him alive for no reason.

    #1586 1 year ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Stop it...nothing is worse than Mary Poppins.
    On second viewing did they explain how Rose & Finn got back to the base?

    No. They did not explain it. Somehow he drags her back to the base faster then their ships got to the battlefront in the first place, and none of the Gorilla Walkers bother to shoot them, despite the "No quarter, no prisoners" order from Kylo Ren.

    I can handle a different take on Old Luke. But plot holes like I mentioned above? F**k that.

    #1596 1 year ago

    Re-watched it last night. Found it mostly boring this time, humor had no lasting appeal. Noticed even more plot holes, fresh in my memory:

    1) Why doesn't Hux just blow up Poe immediately instead of talking on phone?
    2) How does BB-8 fix the X-wing by short-circuiting it?
    3) Why are the bombers en route when Leia didn't want them to engage?
    4) The hacker betrays them by telling bad guys "Resistance is escaping on small, cloaked shops" HOW DOES HE KNOW THIS? (Rose and Finn don't)
    5) Light speed attack teleports Phasma 300 yards away from Finn and Rose (despite her standing right over them?)
    6) How does Finn drag Rose miles back to base with 10 Walkers looking right at them?

    It's also really distracting how powerful Rey is. Remember in Empire (which was set a few years after New Hope) how Luke could still barely grab his lightsaber in the ice cave? Rey can zip lightsabers across rooms with ease, despite mere MINUTES passing since first movie! I hope they at least attempt to explain this, like "the force choose you as someone who could stop Kylo Ren".

    Also FINN SHOULD HAVE DIED. It would have been a perfect arc from start of movie when he was running away. But NO. We need to keep him around for a Poe-Rose-Rey-Finn love quadrangle.

    So sick of movies that don't function as self-contained stories.

    #1603 1 year ago
    Quoted from fosaisu:

    How dare you?!? That’s about as close to SW cannon as you can get - cute robots can fix anything electronic with a quick taser blast.

    OK so I know Star Wars is space fantasy, not sci-fi.

    Still, it takes place "a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away" which means it takes place in OUR universe and thus the laws of physics still apply.

    #1643 1 year ago

    I'm the day-walker. I dislike both R1 and TLJ.

    rogue_zero (resized).jpg

    #1653 1 year ago
    Quoted from fosaisu:

    Sorry to hear this, anyone affiliated with "Rogue One" is in no position to bully other scifi projects.

    Wait... are you on "Team Rogue One Sucks" with me? I thought I was alone!

    #1657 1 year ago

    Wasn't bored while watching TLJ in theater, but found it a snooze-fest when re-watching on home video. It's also 30 minutes too long, like all movies these days.

    Rogue One bored me in the theater, and bored me once again on home video. It has worse plotholes than TLJ and even stupider character moments.

    BUT! The last 30 minutes is probably the most "Star Warsy" Star Wars stuff we've gotten since Disney took over. It ends strong, which makes most people forget about how pointless the first 2/3rds were (see my handy chart above)

    #1667 1 year ago
    Quoted from vicjw66:

    I'm always surprised to hear you guys actually claim to like TFA. That movie blew and was just a crappy retelling of the Original. Sure, it was better than anything put out since 1983, but that's not saying much.

    The first 40 minutes are good but it takes a nose dive once Grandpa Han Solo shows up.

    Just like Blade Runner 2049 starts to suck once Grandpa Deckard shows up.

    Just like Indiana Jones 4.... Hm maybe Ford should just retire already?

    #1673 1 year ago
    Quoted from kvan99:

    we all know engineers don’t make good artists...have you heard the voice overs for AMH?

    A pretty ironic statement for a Rogue One defender to make considering its story was conceived by the programmer of Photoshop: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Knoll

    #1675 1 year ago

    R1's core problem is that somebody insisted the movie revolve around "the daughter of the person who designed the Death Star."

    But she has no business being the main character. She has little to no effect on the plot, is poorly written, unlikable, and doesn't change or grow in any way (besides trusting the robot with a gun) The main character SHOULD have been the pilot who defected with the message.

    This is why I find the first 2/3rds of that movie so crap. The "plot" isn't working in service of the story, it's spending all of its time trying to justify why Jyn Erso is the main character.

    #1694 1 year ago

    I bought (4) Rose Tico action figures from a ToysRUs closeout.

    Gonna put them in a time capsule and give them to my niece... might buy her a new kitchen someday.

    It's always the crap nobody wanted that ends up being valuable.

    #1699 1 year ago

    Something's really fishy with this Solo movie.

    Sure the screenwriter wrote some classics, but aside from Force Awakens (which 100% felt like a JJ script) he hasn't had a hit since The Bodyguard. 26 years ago! And yet he has the clout to get the directors fired? (because they were improvising on his dialog) Since when does the screenwriter have ANY clout?

    #1743 1 year ago
    Quoted from TigerLaw:

    And able to completely subjugate an entire galaxy in about twenty minutes. Disney has shrunken the galaxy to where it is about the size of a small town...

    First Order is the biggest problem with these new movies because it just doesn't make sense.

    How does a splinter cell group build something 10 times bigger than the Death Star? Remember when all the Nazis who fled to Brazil started their own airforce and invaded North America? Me either.

    But again, Lucas drew from history while the new writers are drawing blanks.

    1 week later
    #1787 1 year ago

    Decided I won't give my Time Capsule Rose Tico toys to my neice for another ten years or so. She's such an Uber brat she'd probably rip them right out of the package and ruin the nice kitchen they'll one day buy here.

    3 weeks later
    #1798 1 year ago

    I'd agree the last 30 minutes of Rogue One was the "most Star Warsy Star Wars" since the 80s.

    But everything before that battle is crap. Filler, lame characters, stupid motivations and a plot servicing "why Jyn Erso is the main character" instead of her character servicing the plot.

    The prequels are still better than this Disney rubbish.

    #1805 1 year ago
    Quoted from rai:

    Can’t believe how badly they treated Po and was expecting Benito Del Toro to do a triple cross somehow.

    The First Order reward del Toro for what exactly? Telling them to look for small transports escaping the big ship? (Holdo's Secret Amazing Plan) Problem is... HOW DID HE KNOW THAT?

    The question then is "how COULD he know that?". Finn/Rose could have told him, then he betrays their trust. But if they knew [Holdo's] plan they wouldn't have done the Casino Mission in the first place. del Toro betrays them with information he could only gain if they had no reason to find him in the first place.

    It's storytelling so bad it becomes a logic paradox.

    #1808 1 year ago
    Quoted from InfiniteLives:

    if it didnt have the star wars named attached to it there is no way it would have near the rating it got from critics... its just so bad on so many levels.

    Disney's made plenty of sci-fi in the past. Black Hole, Tron, Rocketeer, Atlantis, John Carter. Problem was nobody cared.

    In my mind they weren't buying Lucasfilm, they were buying the FANS. So now they can make a half-ass sci-fi film, slap the SW name on and BOOM! Guaranteed smash hit.

    Point being, don't shit on the fans. They're the only reason the SW brand has value.

    #1812 1 year ago
    Quoted from gdonovan:

    If you are going to smuggle out a message to your daughter, just as easy to send the plans out too.

    Exactly and that's why the first hour and a half of R1 is pointless. The only relevant plot point is the father telling where to find the Death Star plans. Nothing else that happens has any effect on the outcome.

    Act 3 works because there is a plan, there are stakes, and there are consequences.

    #1838 1 year ago

    Considering how inflated Disney review scores are... at 71% Rotten Tomato's Han Solo must really suck.

    #1858 1 year ago

    I'm gonna go see it next Sunday. Mostly to see how many "predictions of stupid" Red Letter Media got right.

    Falcon would have been already pretty old even in the Solo time-line. So yeah, all about toys.

    For more info on how prevasive that practice is watch An Evening with Kevin Smith or Joel Schumacher's very humble commentary for Batman & Robin.

    #1881 1 year ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Yup sounds like trouble.
    ‘Solo’ Could Break $139M Stateside Memorial Day Opening Record; Global Conquest Eyes $305M+

    Sounds like a lot. But those are pretty weak numbers for a Disney movie in an age of $15 tickets and Marvel mega-openings. You know it's bad when they trot out "global" (usually when it underperforms, see Deadpool 2)

    Fandango seems messed up at the moment (worse than usual). Only certain showtimes for Solo even show seats. 11am Sunday didn't work, but noon did (was empty, now 3 of us)


    IMG_20180522_193313 (resized).jpg

    #1907 1 year ago

    Sounds like Solo is long, boring, bland and filled with fan service.

    So the Star Wars fans should love it! Since that basically also describes Rogue One.

    #1942 1 year ago

    Going to see Solo tomorrow. I'm expecting an incredibly average movie. Ron Howard is a competent director but he never elevates the material beyond what's on the page.

    Sounds like people are enjoying Solo, but the box office is definitely taking a hit. I'm sure part of this is because of TLJ, but probably moreso Star Wars fatigue and releasing it so soon after the last one.

    #1962 1 year ago

    Solo was fun. The lead character is an active protagonist who has an effect on the plot (unlike Rogue One) the movie pays off a lot of things the universe has set up (unlike Last Jedi) and it's not a remake of an earlier film (like TFA). There's also a love interest which is a breath of fresh air in this sexless universe.

    But alas. Thanks to the Last Jedi pissing on its fans, this movie is made to suffer.

    There's at least 2 "fans jump out of their seats" moments but sadly, no fans showed up.

    #1980 1 year ago
    Quoted from TigerLaw:

    If the Star Wars product was better it would do better over seas. Bad product is the problem.

    It's an interesting case study. "What is the value/quality of these movies AS MOVIES when you remove the nostalgia?" China allows a glimpse into this.

    I think if the new SW movies adhered to classic archetypes as much as ANH did they'd have a better chance (obtaining new markets) The farmer who becomes a General. The rogue you can't trust. The wise old man. The princess. The evil knight.

    Instead we get Super Amazing at Everything Rey (who needs a Hero's Journey?) bumbling fool Finn, Poe "I never get to do anything" Dameron, Leia Organa (not actually Leia just Carrie Fisher playing Old Carrie Fisher) and a bunch of bumbling Mel Brooks spoof Nazis as the First Order.

    #1999 1 year ago

    40 years from now when Rose Tico is a the rarest most valuable toy ever you'll kick yourself for not buying them all up.

    The Han and Chewie shower scene makes sense within the context of the movie.

    #2008 1 year ago

    Holy hell. If John "Professional Shill" Campea is against her, she must be toast.

    Solo might not even make it past 300 million WORLDWIDE. That's absolutely abysmal for any big movie in the modern era, let alone Star Wars, let alone a movie whose budget was nearly doubled with reshoots.

    But remember, "everyone loved" The Last Jedi and there was no backlash whatsoever <- official narrative.

    1 week later
    #2054 1 year ago

    I hope the Game of Thrones guys do an Old Republic trilogy.

    New characters (whom we don't know the dates of) new stories and NEW FRICKING IDEAS!

    Star Wars has been wallowing in the time period between Revenge of the Sith and A New Hope for decades. Is this universe so shallow that all we can do is Rebels vs Empire? Is the brand itself nothing more than the looks of the vehicles, the names of the characters and the music?

    #2068 1 year ago

    Solo is still in an INSANE number of theaters http://www.boxofficemojo.com/daily/chart/

    Make me wonder if some 1 month deals were in place just like TLJ. Usually theaters dump a bomb after the 2 week minimum.

    #2104 1 year ago

    Temple of Doom is awesome.

    Now Rocketeer, that's a movie that doesn't hold up. (and should be remade)

    #2117 1 year ago
    Quoted from gdonovan:

    Numbers I have heard for production was 250 mil for shooting, 200 mil for re-shoots and 100 mil for marketing. Possible, but another source stated 150 mil for marketing. 80% of the movie was re-shot but the big expenses are on the CGI and that is all done last.

    That seems a bit high. Best-case all-in spend was probably more like 400m minimum, but just like the equally troubled (yet much more successful) Justice League the studio is going to keep the actual numbers as secret as possible.

    #2120 1 year ago
    Quoted from gdonovan:

    Between shoots, re-shoots and marketing I'm sure they are over $400 million, but a fair number to work with.

    Studios never want people to know what they spent. There's many cases of "the most expensive movie ever" being made but under the radar. Who Framed Roger Rabbit, True Lies and most recently Pirates 4, whose whopping 410m PRODUCTION budget was only revealed because UK film credit tax laws were under scrutiny.

    Solo's worldwide box office won't top 400, putting actual rentals at 200m best case. Making most of its money in America will give Disney a boost since they get the best "rental" rates here (big movies often start 90/10 in favor of studio)

    In the old days many a movie was "saved" by home video but that market has dried up. Now movies are saved by China... Who don't care about Star Wars. Basically no way Solo isn't a huge loss.

    They need to take a break and let anticipation build. Used to be 3 Star Wars movies a generation... Now it's one every year. It's no longer special.

    #2127 1 year ago
    Quoted from TigerLaw:

    I respectfully disagree. All they need is a good product. American's don't get tired of anything...ever, so long as it is a good and compelling product.

    And to create a good movie product they need good scripts. But everything they make now feels rushed. Last Jedi felt like a first draft. A few changes would have made it awesome (change Luke's death, make Holdo a traitor, let Finn die...)

    Regarding Episode 9, Colin Trevorrow was let go after at least a year of work, giving JJ that much less time to make his version great. It's very much like what happened with the Hobbit, where years of Guillermo del Too work was thrown out the window when he left and Peter Jackson stepped back in.

    JJ can do wonders with shit scripts (Star Trek 2009 comes to mind) but I wouldn't expect any miracle recovers on this one.

    #2134 1 year ago

    They must have read my above post about not rushing scripts!

    Maybe now they won't have to reshoot every other movie they make. Perhaps they can get the story working on ultra cheap PAPER first and THEN hire super expensive crews to film it.

    #2144 1 year ago

    Disney is moving its chess pieces very slowly and methodically, but they are moving.

    They just announced new heads of Pixar and Walt Disney Feature Animation (to replace John Lasseter) and are in a bidding war with Comcast over Fox. I wouldn't expect any changes at Lucasfilm until after that battle is over.

    All of these small announcements (no more spin offs, hiring better directors) are setting up Kennedy's departure. Then they'll wait a few months and announce the cancelling of Rian Johnson's trilogy as well.

    #2193 1 year ago

    Solo's actually done "OK" in the US for a movie, but not a Star Wars movie in an age of $12 tickets.

    I think the real disaster is the overseas who no longer give a f**k about the property. Even if they hadn't spent a fortune on reshoots the total worldwide would still have been a failure.

    Curious to see what they do with Episode 9: Retcon The Movie...

    "And that is why Rey is so powerful, because she's a reincarnation or something..."

    "Hux you were the one who forget to engage the Hyperdrive shield"

    "Behold the possibly magical source of the First Orders power and wealth!"

    2 weeks later
    #2313 1 year ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    Oh yeah! I can see Lando going out in Episode 9 by smashing the Falcon into something with Nien Nunb back in the copilot chair. Right before the crash have Lando say "yeah baby!", cut to Nien Nunb doing his Return of the Jedi laugh and then epic explosion as the Falcon smashes into say Kylos capital ship. For Han and Leia!

    Don't you mean hyperspace warp through their capital ship?

    3 weeks later
    #2360 1 year ago
    Quoted from oktobernv:

    Filming of EP9 Got under way yesterday
    Mark Hamill is CONFIRMED to be in EP9
    Let's see how they can "un-fuk" what they did in TLJ
    Gonna be interesting.....

    I'm guessing a flashback scene to him being alive and kicking some ass.

    I still maintain that's all they really had to do in Last Jedi for people to love it (worked for Rogue One)

    1 month later
    #2539 1 year ago

    I maintain that none of the new Disney Wars movies have been very good, but the fans didn't really notice until TLJ.

    TFA = Awesome first forty minutes then turns into a slog once Han Solo shows up.

    R1 = Wastes most of its runtime explaining why Jyn Erso is protagonist. Great final 30 minutes through.

    TLJ = Felt like a first draft rushed into production. Lot of good ideas but arranged poorly. Could have been amazing with a few tweaks. Or at least ended strong and people would have accepted it (R1)

    They're gonna pull out all the 'memberberry stops on IX. I'm expecting they'll even whip out Thrawn, which is bait no Star Wars fan can resist.

    2 weeks later
    #2568 1 year ago

    Tron 3 got put on ice after Tomorrowland tanked (a studio would consider those the same genre)

    Had nothing to do with Star Wars.

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