Anyone seen this series? Looks great...

Few uneven episodes but generally a good series. Second season started shooting I think.

Already a trailer for it so I think it's done shooting

Is great!

FFS, a prequel to a prequel?

The movie was pretty horrible so you've got a solid foundation

I mean I guess I'd watch it before Falcon & The Winter Soldier.

High praise indeed.

I just watched Revenge of the Sith on Disney+. I only saw it once when it came out.

What a pile of dung. Guess we have to be a bit more kind with these new piles of dung, they had some help along the way.

Ah c'mon. Other than Empire, these are weighty dramas. At best, they move forward balancing action, and light drama/character development.

At worst, they're an editing and structural nightmare like these last three movies.

The prequels were incredibly coherent, hate them or not. And the characters had drive and a reason to exist.

The midichlorians were none too coherent, doesn’t it seem curios that Obi Wan and Yoda never mentioned them to Luke? It’s almost as if Lucas decided to clumsily retcon the entire basis for his universe in midstream.

And as far as drive and reason to exist, are you telling us you bought Anakin’s heel turn? I found it ... unconvincing.

To deliver the worst dialog you've ever heard in an unconvincing manner?
"Incredibly coherent?" Wow.

Funny you mention Empire, I'm watching that now.

The prequels and newever films make Empire look like Citizen Kane.

"I Hate You"

"NNNOOOOOOOOO"

Barf.

It is what it is. Far more convincing than Han being on a leash for two movies. And even Luke, why did he even bond to Han and Leia? Lando makes the big flip, why...guilt?

Lucas' dialog is basic and contrived for every film. As if "I love you. I know." is Shakespearean.

Lest we forget pig nosed Luke whining and saying "It's impossible!!!!" Vader is so stark and badass in that scene, whereas Luke isn't really even likable, frankly.

Empire is a solid film, but on it's own, it's bizarre. The original trilogy is shit for tonal coherence. They feel entirely like they were crafted by three different directors...because they were. Hate them or love them, the prequels at least feel structurally similar and familiar.

Meanwhile, Lucas and his films, and Spielberg, helped shovel dirt on arguably the greatest action flick director of their era. Far, far more imaginative, skilled, and consistent.

78-88' is absolutely the most amazing run by any modern director. Pity that Carpenter wasn't as widely worshipped as those two.

Screenshot_20200205-020016_Chrome (resized).jpg

@wesman, I admire your persistence. It’s a little hard to believe you like the prequels and don’t really care for the original trilogy (other than Empire, maybe?), but then again there’s probably someone out there that likes Godfather III and thinks the first two were crap. There truly is no accounting for taste, and a good thing or these threads would get pretty stale.

I love Carpenter as much as anybody, but you've got it all wrong.

Did you go to movies during the 80's when it was all happening?

Lucas didn't write empire strikes back. So you're just sort of making it up as you go huh?

Made this prediction a few weeks ago, Disney needs content for their streaming services, projected 4 billion dollar loss for this year.

They need that content like nobodies business and the Mandalorian is like a ray of sunshine for Disney+. I would not be the least bit surprised if they came up with a few other series and had them staggered so there was always one running on the service.

So they already have mandalorian, falcon & Winter, vision show...what was the 3rd one they announced at SB?

I appreciate the prequels in the sense that the whole is greater than it's parts. Conversely I feel the OT is more effective with it's parts than as a whole.

The prequels were clearly designed by Lucas as a full project, love them or hate them. The OT was a victim of it's own success. The Emperor feels cobbled in. Why does Luke even have such a strong emotional reaction at the end of Empire? As in. I'd feel maybe in Jedi, that reveal and strain would feel a bit more earnest. There are just a hodgepodge of things that don't flow well from film to film. Whereas the prequels blend incredibly well. Doesn't make them spectacular at all, but they at least feel like they're all a part of a whole, a grand design.

I do like the OT films, for sure. A New Hope is the best isolated film, for me obviously, as a whole project. It has a beginning, and an amazing ending. Empire is the most exciting, weighty dramatically, and most visually impressive of any Star Wars film, without question. Jedi suffers from a poor middle act, and an unfortunate retread during the third act, which is otherwise incredibly rewarding solely via the Throne Room.

I was speaking in generalities for the entire tone of the OT series. He at least wrote the story, and I'd wager he definitely had input on dialog. The writing style is pretty consistent throughout that series.

What do I have wrong? 9/10 of those films in that ten year span are absolutely fantastic, and a couple of them are pretty genre defining. Not sure of anyone else pumping out so many quality films, with such varying style and genre types in that period of time...or ever.

I was born in 76, so I saw movies here and there in the 80's for sure, but unfortunately not a lot of Carpenter upon release until the 90's. I can't imagine being a kid, and seeing Big Trouble in a theater. That kinda shit would have gotten a better reaction from me, than the Goonies, for sure.

I'd also imagine Carpenter stuff wasn't a massive success or talk of the town, like his work has become a bit more over the years. Pretty sure the Thing, wasn't a massive release.

Loki

For sure, Disney planned from the start to lose billions on Disney+ for the first few years, there's just no way to avoid it if you want to compete with Netflix and Amazon Prime in the cutthroat streaming business. They're thinking build market share with low low prices and expensive exclusive shows, and hope to hold onto a decent slice of those subscribers when they raise prices in a few years to cover actual costs. They'll need ongoing new exclusives to get viewers to stick around, and episodic content for "tent-pole" properties like SW and Marvel that are only available on Disney+ has to be a big part of that plan. Otherwise we'll all get sick of streaming old Mickey Mouse Club episodes and quit when they try to get us to pay more than $4/mo.

As for me, I think it will largely depend on what my kids are into when my 3 year sub runs out, but it's hard to imagine hanging onto Disney+ vs Netflix, Amazon, HBO, and all of the other options out there unless they continue to be the cheapest thing going.

Please tell me you're talking about the Death Star blowing up and not that nonsense awards ceremony!

A wager you would lose.
Edit right now if I knew how to cut and paste from my new phone

I mean, as in the third act. From leaving Yavin, and forward.

Does it really matter? The entire trilogy has a fairly similar dialog tone.

Yes, because you're posting things are not true but passing them off as facts. Then when you are shown truth you shrug it off like a smarmy douche.

Ah yes Loki...I might actually watch that one, like Loki. The vision one looked frickin wacky so that gets a look also, and I'm no big Marvel Fan.
Wondering how they pull of Marvel shows when they are notorious being ball busters and having everything on a strict timeline.

I really don't know what you want here. These are all opinions, back and forth. Why does it matter to you personally if my post was valid or not? This is a discussion forum, and largely a lot of hot air, time wasting, and for entertainment.

Lay off the insinuation based name calling. It's stale and unnecessary, and overall unfriendly. I try to give you, as well as anyone, respect and viability as a forum member. The same would be appreciated.

Re: "The Boys" discussion from up the page a bit, no firm release date for Season Two but Karl Urban tweeted that shooting has wrapped and the show runner said to expect it "about the same time as Season One," which would suggest a July 2020 drop. Still feels like a while.

According to wikipedia, Lucas had significant creative input regarding The Empire Strikes Back.

"Lucas conceived Star Wars as a single film but split it into parts after his drafts became too long. Following the success of Star Wars, Lucas hired Brackett to write the sequel; after Brackett's death in 1978, he outlined the Star Wars saga as a whole and developed the script himself before hiring Kasdan. Lucas chose not to direct due to his obligations at Industrial Light & Magic and handling the financing, and passed the duty to Kershner, his former professor."

"With no writer available, Lucas had to write the next draft himself. It was this draft in which Lucas first made use of the "Episode" numbering for the films; The Empire Strikes Back became Episode II.[40] His disappointment with the first draft probably made Lucas consider different directions in which to take the story.[41] He made use of a new plot twist: Darth Vader claims to be Luke's father. According to Lucas, he found this draft enjoyable to write, as opposed to the yearlong struggles writing the first film, and quickly wrote two more drafts,[42] all in April 1978.[43]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Empire_Strikes_Back

I had just taken six months to write Raiders of the Lost Ark from scratch. I handed it in, and George said, “do you want to write Empire Strikes Back?” Literally, he threw it on the desk and asked me to write Empire. He said, “we’re in big trouble. Leigh Brackett [who wrote the first draft] has passed away. They’re building sets in England. And I don’t have a script.”

I said, “maybe you ought to read Raiders first.”

He said, “I’m going to read it tonight, and if I don’t like it I’ll call you back tomorrow and take back this offer.”

Brackett's treatment, delivered on February 21, 1978, is similar to the final film, but Anakin Skywalker appears as a ghost to instruct Luke, and Vader is a separate character.[38][page needed] Lucas was disappointed with Brackett's draft, but before he could discuss it with her, learned that she was in the hospital; she died of cancer in mid-March.[39] With no writer available, Lucas had to write the next draft himself. It was this draft in which Lucas first made use of the "Episode" numbering for the films; The Empire Strikes Back became Episode II.[40] His disappointment with the first draft probably made Lucas consider different directions in which to take the story.[41] He made use of a new plot twist: Darth Vader claims to be Luke's father. According to Lucas, he found this draft enjoyable to write, as opposed to the yearlong struggles writing the first film, and quickly wrote two more drafts,[42] all in April 1978.[43]

This plot twist of Vader being Luke's father had drastic effects on the series, including the audience's interpretation of the original film.[44] Lucas outlined a new backstory: Anakin Skywalker had been Ben Kenobi's brilliant student, and had a child named Luke, but was swayed to the dark side by the Emperor (who was really a Sith Lord). Anakin battled Kenobi on the site of a volcano and was horribly wounded, but was resurrected as Darth Vader. Meanwhile, Kenobi hid Luke on Tatooine while the Republic became the Empire and Vader systematically hunted down the Jedi.[45]

With this new backstory in place, Lucas decided that The Empire Strikes Back would be the second film of two trilogies, designating it Episode V by the fifth draft.[42][46] Lawrence Kasdan had just completed writing Raiders of the Lost Ark,[47] and Lucas hired him to write the next drafts with input from director Irvin Kershner. Kasdan, Kershner, and producer Gary Kurtz saw the film as a more serious and adult film, helped by the new, darker storyline, and developed the series from the light adventure roots of the first film.[48]

Crazy that there were FIVE drafts. It's amazing they got something so well done, from so many hands in the kitchen.

Ultimately so many people contributed. It's not like any director is the sole contributor for any film. Citizen Kane had such a battle between Mankiewicz and Welles.

Seems, at least via reading wiki, I don't know Lucas very well, and the first screenwriter died... But definitely Brackett, Lucas, Kasdan, and even Kershner had a hand in writing the script.

So you wished to call me out, for some reason unknown to me, for being wrong about screen writing credits, but in turn aren't able to say...."Oops."

Given I wrote that jumble of crap last night, at 3AM or so, and had a good 4/5 high level ABV beers in me, I'd say it wasn't entirely spectacularly dumb, not entirely anyway.

I'm wrong often, more so than I'm right. I'm largely an unskilled laborer, failed at art, blah, blah, etc. There are many ways I'm fallible. I did some plumbing work yesterday too, probably did a half arse job at that as well. I wish I could have had some unrequested criticism there too!

You seemed oddly aggressive towards me in a thread a week ago, and I asked if you had an issue with me. You said no. Now a week later, same thing here. So again, please feel free to PM me if you'd like to chat about anything. I'm here to read and talk about pinball, among other subjects, and also make some friends along the way, not enemies.

Anywho....

So that’s the key to finding coherence in the prequels ... get shitfaced first! Will give that a spin if I ever venture back to them.

Were you drunk last week to? that would make more sense now

Honestly, that's isn't too bad for rewrites. You think five drafts is too many?

You get props for the Welles reference.

Did you guys see this, I know its a comic but they will change anything.

https://ca.ign.com/articles/star-wars-darth-vader-twist-marvel-comics-padme-returns-survived-anakin

Can't believe people read this crap.

When does ROS come out on BluRay?

I would like to watch it again at home with the Fam.

Saw it in the theater with my Wife and 3 YR old Boy.

I on way out he said... "Daddy...... That was a good movie!"

I like it too.

Curious to see how it holds up after a few more watches.

I just watched the first 5 episodes of "Doom Patrol" on the flight back from Australia, it was really well written, great cast too. I can't believe how many perfectly good substitutes for crappy comic book movies are out there, you just have to sift through a whole lot of losers to find them.

That did seem rather sudden, but he has been talking about retirement for years. I hope the new guy can right the ship as to Star Wars and put good movie making above all other considerations, to the extent it’s his call anyway.

The CEO of a massive company like Disney has to put $$$ above all other considerations. And I'm not sure having CEOs involved in creative decision-making generally leads to good places. But it's certainly possible the new Bob will consider shaking up the staff if he thinks they can wring more revenue out of the Star Wars franchise with different creatives in charge.

Yea, I agree with you. They could certainly wring more cash from me with a new direction.

Is this the new direction you're looking for?

To me, this reeks of the same problems that plagued the Rey Trilogy. Gender & ethnicity diversity, representation, corporate-group-think, on & on. It's like they've learned nothing from their past mistakes.

Fans just want them to tap into Extended Universe lore & give us an Old Republic film Trilogy. This is what they give the fans instead after group-thinking & teasing this project for over a year. Doesn't get me excited at all. Nobody cares about new books & comics.

What a shame. The new CEO needs to fire Kennedy pronto. I miss the days when Lucas ruled with an iron fist.

That is a diverse group of people. Just need a kid in a wheelchair.

On a side note, I've been watching Picard. Man, star wars ain't the only franchise getting it hard in the impulse engines..

You see what I did there??

Yea, that looks to be more of the same sadly. In fairness though, the new guy just got here, we know not what his future plans may be for Star Wars. I really don’t care who the actors/actresses are, I just want good and compelling story telling where the story not the message is the focus.