(Topic ID: 205155)

*SPOILERS* -TROS* Star Wars: TLJ is really bad & other Star Wars/Disney/Marvel


By InfiniteLives

2 years ago



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    Topic poll

    “Star Wars: The Last Jedi was...”

    • garbage, the worst of the main films 210 votes
      33%
    • decent, better than the prequels 238 votes
      37%
    • really good, on par with the originals 78 votes
      12%
    • great! one of the best 72 votes
      11%
    • who cares, star wars sucks 42 votes
      7%

    (640 votes)

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    #2451 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    What? 342 think it's decent or better????

    if you only expect decent out of your star wars movies you can have em all, i had higher expectations and decent does not cut it for the cream of the crop movie franchise imho. Basically 1/3 of the voters voted for garbage (taking out the 36 who cares votes). Would think this is not what Disney would want looking at the investment they made in the franchise.

    what were you fav parts of the movie?

    #2452 1 year ago

    Actually, I just can't help myself!!!! lol.... all in good fun Infinatelives

    Exhibit A:
    So at the beginning the First Order tracks down the Rebels, yadda yadda yadda, then they TRACK THEM THROUGH LIGHT SPEED / HYPERSPACE
    and everyone is like, wow that is impossible! but they never deavle into the details of just how that was pulled off. stupid.

    *They actually mention this in Rogue One when they are looking up plans for the Death Star and they find a file regarding the Empires work on Tracking through Hyperspace. So It checks... Even though it is a throw away line.

    Exhibit B:
    The Rey with Luke stuff was pretty blah. Just was. Nothing really came out of it.

    * I agree, it sucks to see Luke the way he is but that is how JJ wrote it in an odd way. Why JJ decided to have Luke hiding out on some secret little island at the end of The Force Awakens kind of paints Rian in a corner. I probably would have done something better with Luke, but Rian went a different direction. So I will give you this point.

    EDIT: EXHIBIT C1: How could I forget about this one haha. When the rebel ships bridge gets blown up and Leia is floating in space, instead of freezing to death, running out of O2, or whatever would actually happen, she used the force to float back to an entrance of the ship and get back in. I was in disbelief at how bad that scene was.

    *Easily the worst part of the movie for me... Cringe Worthy!

    Exhibit C2:
    The whole Finn and, I think Rose?, going to some Casino town to get help was not great. I feel like they only added this stuff to check off the box of weird animals and puppet aliens. Then they meet some random guy who is going to be their code breaker who betrays them and it all just seemed so forced.

    *Not great. I get it, they are trying to show evil in a different light... but the scene was too long, and I hated those dumb creatures they rode on. Reminded me of those awful prequels. I will give you that one too...

    BONUS WTF MOMENT:
    They try and go to Maz for help. Like why? what is her role.

    *She is older than Yoda, knows a ton of shit.

    Exhibit D:
    Snoke! Like What the actual F&^K. He is the Supreme Leader. He tapped into the force to get Rey and Kylo to see and talk to each other. No back story on who he is/was and how he came to power. Super powerful in the force then gets cleaved in halve without ever fighting. We see a glimpse of his power with some lightning he jams at Kylo and that is it. Like what was the point of his existence other than to be "bad guy number 1" He was super strong with the force so he had to be around during 4,5,6 days but just nothing about his back story and hes gone. LAME

    *dude... come on. The emperor had even less back story and he ran the entire Empire. We got nothing from him. Why did you expect that Snoke was going to have this crazy backstory? They will probably do a book or something, so If you really care you could probably check it out. Or maybe they do what they did with the Emperor and just give him a prequel trilogy explaining how Snoke took power. But this is NOT his movie.

    Exhibit E:
    Speaking of being really strong in the force. Kylo stopped a blaster bullet in mid air in episode 7. Then in the fight with the elite guards after Snoke was killed he doesnt even use a single force push or choke or anything. You would think this kid could crush skulls with his mind. meh

    *Pretty cool when he stopped the blaster shot mid air... But I thought that fight scene was awesome. Plus didn't we see enough bad guys get pushed around in those shitty prequels? Better question, how many times did Vader or Luke force push anyone in the Original Trilogy?

    Exhibit F:
    Oh, the whole "Rey, your parents come from nothing, just a bunch of junk finders." Way to kill another plot point.

    *I loved loved loved that she is her own person! I love that she is special. Not her lineage! I love that she isn't a Kenobi, or Skywalker, or Solo, or Santa Claus. She has power, she always did, she is a survivor. It was never a plot point. She was ditched in The Force Awakens and youtube had to fill in some content and made a big deal about who her parents are. Fuck her parents! Let her be her own person. This Universe is Huge, how small would it have been if she was related to someone we already knew?

    Exhibit G:
    Well, so Force Ghost Yoda comes and visits Luke to give some advice. If they are going to use Force Ghosts and Vader came back to the Light Side as a force ghost, why wouldnt he just tell Kylo to quit being a D bag. But that is not related to this movie. What is questionable is that Yoda blows up the Jedi teachings, but alas, at the end we see Rey had taken all the old texts. Like Yoda and Luke couldnt sense that or what? Whatever.

    *Yoda knew she took them... It was just an old tree. What is the issue? And we really don't know much about Force Ghosts and who mastered it enough to appear when they want, etc. Obiwan and Yoda are the only ones that seem to be able to do it at will. We saw Anakin at the end of Jedi, but I have no idea if he can just summon himself at will. It was kind of explained in the Prequels that Quigon learned the skill, and passed it to Yoda who passed it to Obiwan. Not sure how Anakin became a ghost at the end of Jedi, that is a mistake on Jedi's part not LTJ.

    Exhibit H:
    Why not have droid manned ships just light speed thru all the star destoryers, or heck, the death star, anything really and blow them up. slippery slope.

    *This was explained in the expanded universe. I didn't get into reading about all that, but there is some excuse as to why they don't do that every time. I think it had to do with that particular ships special shields... I don't know. I'll give it to you though.

    Exhibit I:
    The part of the movie that I thought was the best was Luke projecting himself in front of Kylo and that whole fight/exchange. Super cool to finally see some of Lukes ultimate power. Oh wait, then he died right after. lame.

    *Hey man, it killed him. He knew he was sacrificing himself to become a Legend and to help restart the resistance. I thought it was cool.

    Sprinkle in some bad jokes for laughs and what not. bravo. made a star wars worse than the prequels.

    *Some jokes admittedly were bad. But at least I didn't have to listen to 2 and a half hours of battle droids going "Rodger Rodger" and "Ouch" when they got hit by a light sabre.

    I probably will never watch this episode again, and for sure not going to see the next one at a midnight showing. Very disappointing

    EDIT: added these things to first post so all my rage is listed here:

    Addendum 1: Ending episode 7 on a cliff hanger with Rey anding Luke his lightsabre, then Luke tossing it over his shoulder for a cheap laugh in E8
    *He wasn't into it I guess.... I wanted him to say after she hands him the lightsabre... "Hey there was a hand with this... you didn't see it did you?"

    Addendum 2: Showing Chewie eating those cute little critters for no reason, kinda messed up to portray a beloved character that way.
    *He didn't eat them... he felt guilty. But come on. He is a damn Wookie... the same beast that would rip your arms out of your socket if you looked at him wrong, or if you beat him in a game. He is supposed to be a badass... not a wuss.

    Addendum 3: Just a terrible plot device as "running out of gas" as being the big event that is causing all the turmoil.

    *Hey that is what they went with... the resistance almost dying out. Desperate... etc. I don't think it worked on the screen as much as it probably worked in the script. But I didn't hate it.

    Addendum 4:If they are just tracking the main ship, uh duh, warp to hyperspace in the other ships and stay alive and save your fleet. derrr

    *That is a great point, if they had the fuel than yep. I like that idea. I will give you that one.

    Addendum 5: Do the knights of ren even exist in this story anymore?

    *Another JJ mystery box item. You have to remember JJ loves putting all sorts of plot holes purposely without the intention of actually answering all of the questions. Remember Lost? Just more questions... every damn season.. more questions.... then he throws a damn polar bear in for fun... stupid.

    Addendum 6: The entire start of Ep 7 is about the map fragment to find Luke, who doesnt want to be found cause he has a sweet spear fishing spot with fresh, non-pasteurized alien tit milk all to himself!

    *He just doesn't want to be the hero... He read the texts and learned about the Jedi Order and how shitty they actually were. So he's a Jedi who grew disenchanted with the Jedi Order. Renounced his faith. Decided to die on that little spit of land because it reminded him of home with the two suns. He found peace. He wanted the Jedi order to end. And he was the last Jedi.

    Anyway that was my two cents... I can see we have crazy different views. I assume you were a fan of the Prequels which I think ended up almost killing Star Wars. But to each his own.

    -4
    #2453 1 year ago
    Quoted from InfiniteLives:

    if you only expect decent out of your star wars movies you can have em all, i had higher expectations and decent does not cut it for the cream of the crop movie franchise imho. Basically 1/3 of the voters voted for garbage (taking out the 36 who cares votes). Would think this is not what Disney would want looking at the investment they made in the franchise.
    what were you fav parts of the movie?

    I am 37 years old, I grew up with the Original Movies. I have watched them so many damn times... plus I have seen all the prequels in the theater (something I am not proud of). But I think the main reason why I liked TLJ was the fact that they surprised me. I had not been surprised from a Star Wars movie since I first sat down and watched the Original movies. The prequels were not cleverly written, and I really had a hard time getting into them. I hated how small the Universe felt. I hated that Vader made C3PO. Stuff like that closed off the Universe for me.

    So TLJ had some pretty great parts I never saw coming.

    Rey not being a Palpatine or anyone we knew. That was refreshing to me!

    Luke not being the hero at first. Then when R2D2 showed to original clip from ANH with Leia, I damn near cried! I thought that was super cool.

    I liked they brought back the puppet Yoda from Empire. That was a great touch! It was great to see Yoda and Luke interact again!

    I liked that Poe kept messing up... and that he isn't a perfect leader YET....

    I liked the dynamic of Rey and Kylo. If it was an unoriginal story, and followed the Star Wars troupes Kylo would have been turned by Rey after killing Snoke. But he resisted. He isn't a Sith, but he isn't a good guy either. That interests me. This story may end with Kylos death.

    I liked that the Skywalker story ended. I know I know... It is sad. But I feel like it could open up the Universe a bit and we could get new original Stories.

    Fin and Rose whole plot sucked. I agree. They really botched Fins character. And the Romance was killed, I have no idea if Fin likes Rey or Rose or Poe? No idea. That is one thing I miss a bit. Because the OT was really rounded out by Han and Leia's romance.

    I thought it was ballsy to kill Snoke.

    I thought the end with the kid opened up the Universe and allows us to get new Force users and new heros.

    Minus the bad Joke in the very beginning I liked the opening space battle.

    I loved the Throne Room battle, I think it was shot beautifully and I loved how Kylo and Ren worked together.

    I though DJ's character was wasted, but I hope he is in the new movie. I like some scoundrel in my Star Wars. We didn't get enough in the Prequels

    I hated BB8's rescue when he hopped in an ATST. What ever.

    I liked that Kylo didn't want to kill his Mother, and I thought they wasted a huge opportunity for Kylo to SAVE Leia when she got sucked out into space rather than Leia Mary Poppin it back to the ship.

    I liked Lukes duel with Kylo

    I liked those bad ass ATAT's on that salt planet... actually I loved everything about that ground battle.

    I got goosebumps when Rey "Moved Rocks" to save everyone. Now they see her power, and now we have a new Legend to emerge. She went from just a scavenger to the savior. Kind of reminded me of Neo at the end of the first Matrix.

    Oh and Leia and Lukes reunion.. was great. Would have loved to see Luke and Han have a moment in TFA but that never happend.

    Speaking of TFA, I dislike that movie more than TLJ. Because it was a remake of ANH. It wan't original and I really couldn't have been less pleased with how that movie turned out. I saw everything coming a mile away. I guess that is why I liked TLJ. I was surprised quite a bit.

    Those were just off the top of my head. I hope it made sense. Go easy on the downvotes guys I am sensitive, and we are just talking movies.

    @Infinatelives I like your style man! Keep up the good fight!

    #2454 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    Anyway that was my two cents... I can see we have crazy different views. I assume you were a fan of the Prequels which I think ended up almost killing Star Wars. But to each his own.

    The prequels were not good but not as bad as TLJ imo.

    at least we got a sweet pod racing game on N64 and in the arcade out of them

    where do you think the story goes from here? they closed all the developing plot lines except for maybe the Knights of Ren. There was no one left to even back the Resistance on their final hail Mary distress call.

    just a whole movie of kylo and rey force projecting to each other ? then broom kid comes in and slices and dices?

    #2455 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    I liked that the Skywalker story ended. I know I know... It is sad. But I feel like it could open up the Universe a bit and we could get new original Stories.

    whats interesting is they used to bill this trilogy as "the end of the skywalker saga"

    but looks like the ended it a movie too soon.

    the biggest disappointment is how they did not have a story board for the 3 movies and just seem to wing it with the different directors

    #2456 1 year ago
    Quoted from rai:

    I’m worried that these books are described as YA (young adult) reading.
    I may be better served with some other science fiction writing for adults?

    You want some Science Fiction novels for adults, then you might like the following: (I can suggest plenty more if you like good Sci-fi)

    No Mans War Series by John Scalzi - they are brilliant and definitely more aimed at adult readers.
    The Black Ship Trilogy, then the Expansion Wars trilogy by Joshua Dalzelle - Lots of space battles and tactics

    #2457 1 year ago
    Quoted from InfiniteLives:

    The prequels were not good but not as bad as TLJ imo.
    at least we got a sweet pod racing game on N64 and in the arcade out of them
    where do you think the story goes from here? they closed all the developing plot lines except for maybe the Knights of Ren. There was no one left to even back the Resistance on their final hail Mary distress call.
    just a whole movie of kylo and rey force projecting to each other ? then broom kid comes in and slices and dices?

    I agree, prequels were ok

    TFA was ok

    R1 was better than ok except CGI dead actor actor (IMO)

    TLJ = IJ4

    #2458 1 year ago
    Quoted from PinSinner:

    You want some Science Fiction novels for adults, then you might like the following: (I can suggest plenty more if you like good Sci-fi)
    No Mans War Series by John Scalzi - they are brilliant and definitely more aimed at adult readers.
    The Black Ship Trilogy, then the Expansion Wars trilogy by Joshua Dalzelle - Lots of space battles and tactics

    I'll look them up. I was used to reading the golden age SFF books.

    #2459 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    Actually, I just can't help myself!!!! lol.... all in good fun Infinatelives
    Exhibit A:
    So at the beginning the First Order tracks down the Rebels, yadda yadda yadda, then they TRACK THEM THROUGH LIGHT SPEED / HYPERSPACE
    and everyone is like, wow that is impossible! but they never deavle into the details of just how that was pulled off. stupid.
    *They actually mention this in Rogue One when they are looking up plans for the Death Star and they find a file regarding the Empires work on Tracking through Hyperspace. So It checks... Even though it is a throw away line.
    Exhibit B:
    The Rey with Luke stuff was pretty blah. Just was. Nothing really came out of it.
    * I agree, it sucks to see Luke the way he is but that is how JJ wrote it in an odd way. Why JJ decided to have Luke hiding out on some secret little island at the end of The Force Awakens kind of paints Rian in a corner. I probably would have done something better with Luke, but Rian went a different direction. So I will give you this point.
    EDIT: EXHIBIT C1: How could I forget about this one haha. When the rebel ships bridge gets blown up and Leia is floating in space, instead of freezing to death, running out of O2, or whatever would actually happen, she used the force to float back to an entrance of the ship and get back in. I was in disbelief at how bad that scene was.
    *Easily the worst part of the movie for me... Cringe Worthy!
    Exhibit C2:
    The whole Finn and, I think Rose?, going to some Casino town to get help was not great. I feel like they only added this stuff to check off the box of weird animals and puppet aliens. Then they meet some random guy who is going to be their code breaker who betrays them and it all just seemed so forced.
    *Not great. I get it, they are trying to show evil in a different light... but the scene was too long, and I hated those dumb creatures they rode on. Reminded me of those awful prequels. I will give you that one too...
    BONUS WTF MOMENT:
    They try and go to Maz for help. Like why? what is her role.
    *She is older than Yoda, knows a ton of shit.
    Exhibit D:
    Snoke! Like What the actual F&^K. He is the Supreme Leader. He tapped into the force to get Rey and Kylo to see and talk to each other. No back story on who he is/was and how he came to power. Super powerful in the force then gets cleaved in halve without ever fighting. We see a glimpse of his power with some lightning he jams at Kylo and that is it. Like what was the point of his existence other than to be "bad guy number 1" He was super strong with the force so he had to be around during 4,5,6 days but just nothing about his back story and hes gone. LAME
    *dude... come on. The emperor had even less back story and he ran the entire Empire. We got nothing from him. Why did you expect that Snoke was going to have this crazy backstory? They will probably do a book or something, so If you really care you could probably check it out. Or maybe they do what they did with the Emperor and just give him a prequel trilogy explaining how Snoke took power. But this is NOT his movie.
    Exhibit E:
    Speaking of being really strong in the force. Kylo stopped a blaster bullet in mid air in episode 7. Then in the fight with the elite guards after Snoke was killed he doesnt even use a single force push or choke or anything. You would think this kid could crush skulls with his mind. meh
    *Pretty cool when he stopped the blaster shot mid air... But I thought that fight scene was awesome. Plus didn't we see enough bad guys get pushed around in those shitty prequels? Better question, how many times did Vader or Luke force push anyone in the Original Trilogy?
    Exhibit F:
    Oh, the whole "Rey, your parents come from nothing, just a bunch of junk finders." Way to kill another plot point.
    *I loved loved loved that she is her own person! I love that she is special. Not her lineage! I love that she isn't a Kenobi, or Skywalker, or Solo, or Santa Claus. She has power, she always did, she is a survivor. It was never a plot point. She was ditched in The Force Awakens and youtube had to fill in some content and made a big deal about who her parents are. Fuck her parents! Let her be her own person. This Universe is Huge, how small would it have been if she was related to someone we already knew?
    Exhibit G:
    Well, so Force Ghost Yoda comes and visits Luke to give some advice. If they are going to use Force Ghosts and Vader came back to the Light Side as a force ghost, why wouldnt he just tell Kylo to quit being a D bag. But that is not related to this movie. What is questionable is that Yoda blows up the Jedi teachings, but alas, at the end we see Rey had taken all the old texts. Like Yoda and Luke couldnt sense that or what? Whatever.
    *Yoda knew she took them... It was just an old tree. What is the issue? And we really don't know much about Force Ghosts and who mastered it enough to appear when they want, etc. Obiwan and Yoda are the only ones that seem to be able to do it at will. We saw Anakin at the end of Jedi, but I have no idea if he can just summon himself at will. It was kind of explained in the Prequels that Quigon learned the skill, and passed it to Yoda who passed it to Obiwan. Not sure how Anakin became a ghost at the end of Jedi, that is a mistake on Jedi's part not LTJ.
    Exhibit H:
    Why not have droid manned ships just light speed thru all the star destoryers, or heck, the death star, anything really and blow them up. slippery slope.
    *This was explained in the expanded universe. I didn't get into reading about all that, but there is some excuse as to why they don't do that every time. I think it had to do with that particular ships special shields... I don't know. I'll give it to you though.
    Exhibit I:
    The part of the movie that I thought was the best was Luke projecting himself in front of Kylo and that whole fight/exchange. Super cool to finally see some of Lukes ultimate power. Oh wait, then he died right after. lame.
    *Hey man, it killed him. He knew he was sacrificing himself to become a Legend and to help restart the resistance. I thought it was cool.
    Sprinkle in some bad jokes for laughs and what not. bravo. made a star wars worse than the prequels.
    *Some jokes admittedly were bad. But at least I didn't have to listen to 2 and a half hours of battle droids going "Rodger Rodger" and "Ouch" when they got hit by a light sabre.
    I probably will never watch this episode again, and for sure not going to see the next one at a midnight showing. Very disappointing
    EDIT: added these things to first post so all my rage is listed here:
    Addendum 1: Ending episode 7 on a cliff hanger with Rey anding Luke his lightsabre, then Luke tossing it over his shoulder for a cheap laugh in E8
    *He wasn't into it I guess.... I wanted him to say after she hands him the lightsabre... "Hey there was a hand with this... you didn't see it did you?"
    Addendum 2: Showing Chewie eating those cute little critters for no reason, kinda messed up to portray a beloved character that way.
    *He didn't eat them... he felt guilty. But come on. He is a damn Wookie... the same beast that would rip your arms out of your socket if you looked at him wrong, or if you beat him in a game. He is supposed to be a badass... not a wuss.
    Addendum 3: Just a terrible plot device as "running out of gas" as being the big event that is causing all the turmoil.
    *Hey that is what they went with... the resistance almost dying out. Desperate... etc. I don't think it worked on the screen as much as it probably worked in the script. But I didn't hate it.
    Addendum 4:If they are just tracking the main ship, uh duh, warp to hyperspace in the other ships and stay alive and save your fleet. derrr
    *That is a great point, if they had the fuel than yep. I like that idea. I will give you that one.
    Addendum 5: Do the knights of ren even exist in this story anymore?
    *Another JJ mystery box item. You have to remember JJ loves putting all sorts of plot holes purposely without the intention of actually answering all of the questions. Remember Lost? Just more questions... every damn season.. more questions.... then he throws a damn polar bear in for fun... stupid.
    Addendum 6: The entire start of Ep 7 is about the map fragment to find Luke, who doesnt want to be found cause he has a sweet spear fishing spot with fresh, non-pasteurized alien tit milk all to himself!
    *He just doesn't want to be the hero... He read the texts and learned about the Jedi Order and how shitty they actually were. So he's a Jedi who grew disenchanted with the Jedi Order. Renounced his faith. Decided to die on that little spit of land because it reminded him of home with the two suns. He found peace. He wanted the Jedi order to end. And he was the last Jedi.
    Anyway that was my two cents... I can see we have crazy different views. I assume you were a fan of the Prequels which I think ended up almost killing Star Wars. But to each his own.

    Thanks but we've covered all of these already in the last 50 pages....Lol. The movie sucks not because we the few say it sucks, the whole fandom has turned against the franchise and Disney because of the piss poor story line. I mean yes, it's SW it's not Citizen Kane but still even for SW this movie sucked in a big way.

    PS: Btw, I was laughing at myself over the 50 pages comment, not you, I was just realizing I have no life.

    #2460 1 year ago
    Quoted from InfiniteLives:

    The prequels were not good but not as bad as TLJ imo.
    at least we got a sweet pod racing game on N64 and in the arcade out of them
    where do you think the story goes from here? they closed all the developing plot lines except for maybe the Knights of Ren. There was no one left to even back the Resistance on their final hail Mary distress call.
    just a whole movie of kylo and rey force projecting to each other ? then broom kid comes in and slices and dices?

    Lando will back them up.... and that wasn't all of the resistance. They still had some pockets of fighters. All I know the next movie's plot entirely depends on the timeline. To make any sensible movie there has to be a time jump a few years after TLJ. Where the Resistance has grown the the first order has faltered (they kind of hint a power struggle between Kylo and that nazi dude).

    It will be interesting to see where they take this though, I agree with you there.

    #2461 1 year ago
    Quoted from InfiniteLives:

    whats interesting is they used to bill this trilogy as "the end of the skywalker saga"
    but looks like the ended it a movie too soon.
    the biggest disappointment is how they did not have a story board for the 3 movies and just seem to wing it with the different directors

    Leia is still a Skywalker, and she technically did not die in that movie universe. So I guess they have to find a way using old footage to kill her off. I guess... eh.

    #2462 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    Leia is still a Skywalker, and she technically did not die in that movie universe. So I guess they have to find a way using old footage to kill her off. I guess... eh.

    still a sorry send off to the skywalkers lol. hardly anything in TFA and then we kill Luke in TLJ. will be interesting if they recast Leia. They had the perfect moment to kill her on screen and make it a super emotional moment for Kylos development.

    the way they took the story they should have just made this trilogy a whole separate thing taking place after all the originals characters were dead and long gone.

    Do you think the have done a good job of character development in these films?

    -2
    #2463 1 year ago
    Quoted from kvan99:

    Thanks but we've covered all of these already in the last 50 pages....Lol. The movie sucks not because we the few say it sucks, the whole fandom has turned against the franchise and Disney because of the piss poor story line. I mean yes, it's SW it's not Citizen Kane but still even for SW this movie sucked in a big way.

    I know... I also spoke on these points earlier. Just saying the fanbase hasn't 100% turned on the franchise. In fact lots say the hard core fanbase is what is ruining Star Wars.

    https://www.highsnobiety.com/p/star-wars-fans-toxic/
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2018/06/08/star-wars-toxic-fans-kelly-marie-tran-last-jedi-ghostbusters-oceans-8-incredibles/#81a4c76522a1
    http://observer.com/2018/05/star-wars-fandom-toxic-disney-lucasfilm/

    I agree to a certain extent some of the people online are hurting the franchise. I don't believe it is possible to make a movie that pleases everyone. And you have to admit, what high caliber Director wants to put his reputation at stake to make a movie that will surely incite rage from the fanatics? At this point the entire situation is toxic. You can't make a movie for the kids, you can't make a movie too close to the originals, you can't make a different type of movie, you cant make a movie about an existing character, and you cant make a movie about a character no one recognizes.

    Star Wars is held too dear. It's become a way of life to some, even close to a religion. I for one just want to get some enjoyment out of them without taking a movie about space wizards too serious.

    #2464 1 year ago
    Quoted from InfiniteLives:

    still a sorry send off to the skywalkers lol. hardly anything in TFA and then we kill Luke in TLJ. will be interesting if they recast Leia. They had the perfect moment to kill her on screen and make it a super emotional moment for Kylos development.
    the way they took the story they should have just made this trilogy a whole separate thing taking place after all the originals characters were dead and long gone.
    Do you think the have done a good job of character development in these films?

    I agree with the Leia thing... I read they are using old footage and not recasting nor doing CGI for Carrie Fisher. I have no idea how they will make her characters death powerful using just old footage. They lost a perfect opportunity in TLJ for sure.

    Character Development has been great for Rey, okay for Poe, and they crapped the bed for Fin. In my opinion.

    #2465 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    I know... I also spoke on these points earlier. Just saying the fanbase hasn't 100% turned on the franchise. In fact lots say the hard core fanbase is what is ruining Star Wars.

    What the media projects by the propaganda arm of Disney I have no interest in.

    I know what I saw and it was a crappy movie.

    They can make all the excuses they want but when a FAN EDIT is more watchable then the original you have a problem on your hands. Blaming the consumers whom you are trying to sell the product to instead of fixing the problem is not going to bring in more money.

    "The beatings will continue till morale improves." doesn't work.

    The sad part is we are not talking War and Peace here, its escapest entertainment.

    Something Marvel has been blasting out of the park for the last decade.

    #2466 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    I agree to a certain extent some of the people online are hurting the franchise. I don't believe it is possible to make a movie that pleases everyone. And you have to admit, what high caliber Director wants to put his reputation at stake to make a movie that will surely incite rage from the fanatics? At this point the entire situation is toxic. You can't make a movie for the kids, you can't make a movie too close to the originals, you can't make a different type of movie, you cant make a movie about an existing character, and you cant make a movie about a character no one recognizes.

    Or they could make a good movie with a good plot and no one would complain. The problem with The Force Awakens & The Last Jedi is they are not good movies. Their characters are boring & the plots are bad. Disney had a chance to make some very compelling movies based on the expansive star wars history but they didn't. Star wars is officially dead. It's in the same pantheon as Jurassic Park & Transformers.

    #2467 1 year ago
    Quoted from Tomahawkjim:

    It's in the same pantheon as Jurassic Park & Transformers.

    Jurassic Park you at least get your moneys worth, you know what you are buying.

    Men make dinosaurs, dinosaurs get out, eat men in various fashion.

    Rinse and repeat.

    #2468 1 year ago
    Quoted from gdonovan:

    Jurassic Park you at least get your moneys worth, you know what you are buying.
    Men make dinosaurs, dinosaurs get out, eat men in various fashion.
    Rinse and repeat.

    I wouldn't say the new JP is better than TLJ. You could argue that JP franchise fans weathered JP II and III and were so beat down this is all they've come to expect. But SW fans put up with much worse in the 90s and 00s.

    If you're saying the JP format is largely the same from movie to movie, fair enough, but the same critique could probably be applied to the Star Wars movies -- Death Star IV, anyone?

    #2469 1 year ago
    Quoted from fosaisu:

    If you're saying the JP format is largely the same from movie to movie, fair enough, but the same critique could probably be applied to the Star Wars movies -- Death Star IV, anyone?

    The multiple Death Stars has been well noted, lazy writing for sure. One of the exasperating things too when you have Admiral Thrawn right there to be plucked. The whole new trilogy is a train wreck. The rebels won at the end of Jedi.. and now they are the resistance? They were by definition the government, what the hell happened? All slapdash without out a plan. train wreck.

    Jurassic Park is nothing more than a horror movie franchise in my honest opinion which can be pretty shallow if that is all you purchased a ticket for.

    My wife loves them, I just can't watch. Don't open that door!... there goes another one. Every time. I like a little more depth to my movies.

    #2470 1 year ago
    Quoted from gdonovan:

    The whole new trilogy is a train wreck

    Second that. Ep:9 might not break the 1 billion mark if they don't do some major fan service.

    PS: no sooner I posted this that I got this in my feed:

    https://movieweb.com/star-wars-9-rumor-darth-vader-return/

    How is Vader going to come back? I don't get it but then again they need all the help they can get. I said it before, I'll say it again Abrams will find a way to reduce this trilogy to the dumbest, lowest common denominator. It's "Lost" in space....

    #2471 1 year ago
    Quoted from kvan99:

    Second that. Ep:9 might not break the 1 billion mark if they don't do some major fan service.

    I'm not even looking for fan service, is that not what The Force Awakens is aside from the flawless Mary Sue?

    Far as I'm concerned the next movie could be 50 years along the line with new characters and call it a reboot.

    No Deathstars. Clean sheet.

    Start with a galaxy in ruin, mysterious Jedi and Sith cults keeping a low profile and some hapless protagonist with a mcguffin someone wants. Hell make it Vader's lightsaber which is a key to some gizmo or temple or vending machine.

    #2472 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    Character Development has been great for Rey

    What character development? Have we been watching the same movies? I can't seem to agree with anything you post.

    #2473 1 year ago
    Quoted from kvan99:

    Second that. Ep:9 might not break the 1 billion mark if they don't do some major fan service.
    PS: no sooner I posted this that I got this in my feed:
    https://movieweb.com/star-wars-9-rumor-darth-vader-return/
    How is Vader going to come back? I don't get it but then again they need all the help they can get. I said it before, I'll say it again Abrams will find a way to reduce this trilogy to the dumbest, lowest common denominator. It's "Lost" in space....

    Force ghost party! Maybe Luke appears and says to Rey "I'm your father", then Obi Wan appears and says "No Rey, I'm your father", next Anakin appears and says "No, I am your father"...then finally Yoda appears and just does his crazy laugh.

    #2474 1 year ago

    They would probably use Hayden Christensen as Force ghost Vader. Ugh.

    #2475 1 year ago
    Quoted from gdonovan:

    Far as I'm concerned the next movie could be 50 years along the line with new characters and call it a reboot.

    Plot pitch: A reincarnate Yoda dons a Vader suit and bemuses various Sith with syntax resembling object-subject-dangling auxiliary verb. A running gag is the cane is a light saber that can’t be used as a cane because it sinks into every surface.
    2D4838FE-DD4B-4FED-A4DB-ACF79CA00854 (resized).jpeg

    #2476 1 year ago
    Quoted from gdonovan:

    The whole new trilogy is a train wreck. The rebels won at the end of Jedi.. and now they are the resistance? They were by definition the government, what the hell happened? All slapdash without out a plan. train wreck.

    Bingo. The new Star Wars could have been about the rebuilding of the Republic. The rebels could struggle with the issues of empire, and corrupting influences of power. Imagine Leia giving orders to bomb civilian targets like cities in order to destroy the old empire remnants in order to save more lives in the overall conflict. WWII thinking all over, with all of the moral complexity and soul searching. Think Dresden and Hiroshima. They are in charge now, and get all the blame and credit. Its easy to be the outsider political party and complain, much harder to govern. This could have been great, and maybe Disney could have explored Empire supporters who think they are doing good. Challenge the audience, maybe the Republic starts to turn into the "new" evil Empire, and restoration of the jedi order is needed to help moderate and temper this tremendous power empire creates.

    Instead Disney copped out. This is Social Justice Warrior propaganda, and you can't do that when you are the ones in power. SJW only works when you are the marginalized victim, so they needed a new bad guy. They could have gone for the progressive diversity message of Start Trek, but that has no grounding in identity politics. They also lacked the subtlety of Lucas who always painted the stormtroopers in white, and Vader in black. Images of absolutes of a totalitarian regime. Disney couldn't restrain themselves at all less the audience not "get" their political message, so the first order has to use all sorts of Nazi imagery to drive their message home with the nuance of a sledgehammer.

    I hope they fix this. The best thing we have going for us as Star Wars fans is that the backlash and outcry has been so overwhelming, Disney's financials are at risk. We have their attention, now it is their turn to make something great. Here's to hoping.

    #2477 1 year ago
    Quoted from tl54hill:

    Bingo. The new Star Wars could have been about the rebuilding of the Republic. The rebels could struggle with the issues of empire, and corrupting influences of power.

    This is the problem with turning your simple pulp serial movies into a multimedia empire.

    I'm sure these issues will be covered... in books, comics, video games, TV series, and stand alone films. Unfortunately, that doesn't help the absolute, complete dissonance from RotJ to TFA. The movies no longer tell the story on their own. I honestly think they're leaving intentional gaps to fill in with other media. Sadly, it's no longer simply entertaining supplemental material... they're making it more and more essential to make sense of the story. It's just so cynical.

    As for the guy who likes Rey's character development, well... it's hard to take anything else seriously after that. The character has none. She's a junk scavenger, and then she's a jedi. All on her own. It's like Luke dueling and beating Vader at the end of ANH, without even meetng Obi-wan.

    #2478 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    Character Development has been great for Rey, okay for Poe, and they crapped the bed for Fin. In my opinion.

    I'm not saying you aren't entitled to your opinion, but I'm saying your opinion on Rey's character development is wrong lol

    #2479 1 year ago

    Character development is like Spiderman weak kid, gets powers, doesn’t use power to stop criminal, criminal kills uncle etc.

    It’s storytelling 101, look at Dorothy, Bilbo Baggins, Karate Kid etc.

    The character development should drive the story, not used as a magic bullet to solve a problem.

    14
    #2480 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    I don't believe it is possible to make a movie that pleases everyone.

    Disagree strongly.

    They could have pleased everyone very easily. They could have thrilled children & adults alike & gave us the story we all wanted. It's completely comical how they effed it all up. But it is clear to everyone now that KK and her braintrust had an agenda. They threw Lucas' outline in the trash. They threw 30 years of beloved extended universe material covering the time period after ROTJ also right in the trash. They wanted to end the Skywalker storyline for some reason & give us all new characters. They severely misjudged the fan base & took us all for granted, and now they are paying the price for their arrogance.

    Basic synopsis here......but the entire basic backstory was right there in front of them. Empire utterly destroyed & collapses after ROTJ. Luke, Leia & Han spend next 30 years rebuilding the Republic. Leia & Han establish a new Senate, and have multiple force-sensitive children. Luke starts a new Jedi Academy & trains a new generation of Jedi, even falls in love & has children of his own. All is wonderful for 30 years. But unknown them, the Emperor had a secret master plan enacted upon his death. And his loyalists have been rebuilding the Empire in the unknown region of the galaxy for decades, and when the Republic least expects it, they strike back with a vengence. Grand Admiral Thrawn, cloned emperor, secret sith relic hunters, whatever. Literally whatever new threat they wanted. They could have come up with anything. All this makes sense to the fans.

    Let this storyline playout Episodes 7-9. Your new characters are Luke & Leia's children. One last struggle for Luke, Han & Leia, who die by end of Episode 9. Their children are the focus for all future movies. Let this storyline play out past Episode 9, because since Episode 1, these films are ALL ABOUT THE SKYWALKER BLOODLINE.

    We are left with utter shit now. A total cluster-eff of weak storytelling, awful new characters, and a one big huge face slap for the fans. And they wonder why the fans are rejecting this new garbage? Give me a break.

    #2481 1 year ago

    Honestly at this point I think it is JJ's job to somehow salvage the franchise. They will attempt to right the ship & give fans what they want. I expect vader flashbacks, Obiwan ghosts, the Hutts, tattoine, lando, Luke somehow returns, whatever. I really expect alot of shark jumping in Episode 9 to reverse everything Rian Johnson did in Episode 8. They have to explain somehow that Rey is a Skywalker. If they fix this, then they can keep the bloodline going & give the fans what they want for Episode 10 & thereafter.

    #2482 1 year ago
    Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

    give the fans what they want for Episode 10 & thereafter.

    ahhh please no make it stop, no episode 10 ahhhhhhhh

    #2483 1 year ago
    Quoted from InfiniteLives:

    ahhh please no make it stop, no episode 10 ahhhhhhhh

    Nonsense. Three Marvel movies a year, for last decade. People still can't get enough! Because they give the fans what they want, and the storytelling is outstanding. Fans will support Star Wars in perpetuity, only if it was done right though. Such a shame.

    #2484 1 year ago
    Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

    Nonsense. Three Marvel movies a year, for last decade. People still can't get enough! Because they give the fans what they want, and the storytelling is outstanding. Fans will support Star Wars in perpetuity, only if it was done right though. Such a shame.

    do you really want more of Rey's story?

    they need to "reboot" and start in the future or past from this travesty

    #2485 1 year ago

    Ha no, no I don't. She's god-awful. Poe, Fynn, Rose, Kyo, Hux, Snoke. Epic fail on so many levels. You are probably right. Let the past die, right? Blow up the Falcon while they're at it. Go out with a bang at this point.

    Perhaps they are saying "Well we really effed up here, so JJ let's just wrap up this storyline with Episode 9, go out with a bang. Give the fans everything they want, let's build some goodwill moving forward." Then fire everyone at Lucasfilm after release, and let the fan outrage cool off. Perhaps they don't release a Star Wars movie for the next 5 years. Then return with the Game of Thrones producer's well thought out, well written, all new story trilogy: STAR WARS - The Old Republic: Episode 1.

    That's probably best move, now that I think about it. Time to punt & regroup. Put this shitshow to bed.

    #2486 1 year ago
    Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

    Honestly at this point I think it is JJ's job to somehow salvage the franchise. They will attempt to right the ship & give fans what they want. I expect vader flashbacks, Obiwan ghosts, the Hutts, tattoine, lando, Luke somehow returns, whatever. I really expect alot of shark jumping in Episode 9 to reverse everything Rian Johnson did in Episode 8. They have to explain somehow that Rey is a Skywalker. If they fix this, then they can keep the bloodline going & give the fans what they want for Episode 10 & thereafter.

    I agree, they will throw the kitchen sink at it. That's what I was alluding to in my post, however, I just don't think Jar Jar Abrams can do justice with the shark jumping and fan service Either it will be paired with terrible dialogue, terrible storyline or weak characters (see Rey, Finn, Maz, Hux, Kylo etc..etc). I dunno, we need some fresh blood but we need someone like Matt Reeves, what that guy did with Planet of the Apes amazed me....a tired story,that everyone knew and seen in past iteration was suddenly turned into something fresh and (don't laugh) poetic with Cesar's role.

    #2487 1 year ago
    Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

    Ha no, no I don't. She's god-awful. Poe, Fynn, Rose, Kyo, Hux, Snoke. Epic fail on so many levels. You are probably right. Let the past die, right? Blow up the Falcon while they're at it. Go out with a bang at this point.
    Perhaps they are saying "Well we really effed up here, so JJ let's just wrap up this storyline with Episode 9, go out with a bang. Give the fans everything they want, let's build some goodwill moving forward." Then fire everyone at Lucasfilm after release, and let the fan outrage cool off. Perhaps they don't release a Star Wars movie for the next 5 years. Then return with the Game of Thrones producer's well thought out, well written, all new story trilogy: STAR WARS - The Old Republic: Episode 1.
    That's probably best move, now that I think about it. Time to punt & regroup. Put this shitshow to bed.

    holy shit i just changed someones mind on the internet! that never happens

    #2488 1 year ago

    in other disney news,

    guardians of the galaxy vol 3 on hold while director search continues

    http://www.ign.com/articles/2018/08/24/guardians-of-the-galaxy-vol-3-production-on-hold-as-director-search-continues

    #2489 1 year ago
    Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

    Nonsense. Three Marvel movies a year, for last decade. People still can't get enough!

    Not sure about that but they have kept the quality up to a decent level.

    The only ones that were sort of flat was Avengers Ultron and one or two of the Thor movies. Still entertaining though.

    -5
    #2490 1 year ago
    Quoted from vicjw66:

    What character development? Have we been watching the same movies? I can't seem to agree with anything you post.

    From Junk Collector to becoming a leader. Anyone that says she is a Mary Sue forgets about Luke in A New Hope... They guy in one movie goes from flying his little T-16 bulls-eyeing swamp rats to Piloting a Fighter and being one of the only survivors of the Battle of Yavin, oh yeah and blowing up the Death Star but whatever.

    We don't have to agree. I just thought Rey's development is far better than Poe or Finn... Finns has been god awful.

    #2491 1 year ago
    Quoted from InfiniteLives:

    I'm not saying you aren't entitled to your opinion, but I'm saying your opinion on Rey's character development is wrong lol

    Lol... it is all good... It's all in fun anyway. Can't take these movies too seriously. Like the previous poster said, this isn't Citizen Kane we are talking about.

    #2492 1 year ago
    Quoted from kvan99:

    I agree, they will throw the kitchen sink at it. That's what I was alluding to in my post, however, I just don't think Jar Jar Abrams can do justice with the shark jumping and fan service Either it will be paired with terrible dialogue, terrible storyline or weak characters (see Rey, Finn, Maz, Hux, Kylo etc..etc). I dunno, we need some fresh blood but we need someone like Matt Reeves, what that guy did with Planet of the Apes amazed me....a tired story,that everyone knew and seen in past iteration was suddenly turned into something fresh and (don't laugh) poetic with Cesar's role.

    I agree with this... JJ screwed this from the start... remaking ANH in TFA and really painting this trilogy into a corner. I too can't wait for this trilogy to end so we end this madness.

    I still don't think it's possible to make a Star Wars movie all fans will like. Take what enjoyment you can out of them. I stand behind my opinion about TLJ, I thought there were a lot of great scenes that I really really enjoyed. Enjoyment I havn't felt since the OT. But that is only one mans opinion. Thanks for hearing me out even though it seems I am on an island here, drinking milk from some fucking lazy purple cows tit.

    #2493 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    Thanks for hearing me out even though it seems I am on an island here, drinking milk from some fucking lazy purple cows tit.

    1522391094236 (resized).jpg

    you can own this for only $90 american

    https://johndc.bigcartel.com/product/milk-creature-3-3-4-custom-action-figure-and-milk-bottle

    #2494 1 year ago

    I bet this will be a rare collector item in 20 years.

    #2495 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    From Junk Collector to becoming a leader. Anyone that says she is a Mary Sue forgets about Luke in A New Hope... They guy in one movie goes from flying his little T-16 bulls-eyeing swamp rats to Piloting a Fighter and being one of the only survivors of the Battle of Yavin, oh yeah and blowing up the Death Star but whatever.
    We don't have to agree. I just thought Rey's development is far better than Poe or Finn... Finns has been god awful.

    1) Leader? She has done zero leading. Who has she lead?

    2) Luke failed his training and lost his hand for it and got his ass beat by Vader by the end of the second movie, what has Rey lost?

    Nada, nothing. Jedi Master right out of the box.

    #2496 1 year ago

    It amazes me people still hope for this series to get back to what it was. The original three were made by an independent filmmaker (and team) at a key time, bringing an entire film genre (sci fi/fantasy) to a respectful level where previously it was laughed at for decades. We got three great movies out of it.

    Even Lucas couldn't get the magic back 25 years after (I would say Phantom Menace came close with the first 15 minutes and the saber duel). Now in this modern world we really think it will return?

    The saddest part of all is that they actually had the three principals (and a few sides) back for a full move, and they blew it bad, real bad. Sure, kill the all off and watch people flock into theaters to see your next series.

    #2497 1 year ago
    Quoted from Captain-Flint:

    I agree with this... JJ screwed this from the start... remaking ANH in TFA and really painting this trilogy into a corner.

    I finally agree with you on something.

    #2498 1 year ago

    Supposedly the first act of ep. 9 has leaked online....pretty standard stuff. It picks up a few years after they escape, Leia is trying to rebuild the resistance.

    #2499 1 year ago

    Thought most of you would like this, it is mostly accurate.

    https://mentalfloss.com/article/63666/37-things-you-might-not-know-about-star-wars

    #2500 1 year ago

    I think they accidently said plot leak, instead of plot weak. Which means it's going to be on the lines of EP8.

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