(Topic ID: 285505)

Spike 2 Node 9 OVERCURRENT PROTECTION / G.I. Failure (Stern JPLE)

By timlah79

3 years ago


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20
#14 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

I've verified continuity with the 2 sockets in question as well as 4 other ones that do turn on. All show an Ohms value and all don't look bent more than any other prong on any other socket in the machine. I'm giving up for tonight. I don't think this is something that forum messages back and forth can resolve. I also don't understand why I'm the only JP owner describing these issues and asking for help. Someone else has to have come across this particular GI issue before with JP and figured out root cause.

It's not specific to JP, but Spike2. MANY people have had this issue on Spike 2, and in every one I can think of it's was a short in a bulb or socket.

NODE 9:
node-9-connectors (resized).jpgnode-9-connectors (resized).jpg

I'd start by powering off and removing the CN15 light connector from the Node 9 board and see if that clears the problem because this connector powers the area the error message says is the problem. Node 9 is at the MIDDLE of the playfield, NOT the identical-looking one near the flippers (which is Node 8). Reboot and check if it cleared the error. If it DID clear the error, follow the wires coming from pins 2 and 6 on that CN15 connector. One of the lights or light sockets connected to those wires has your short, and your search area is dramatically smaller.

Or, you can just cheat and check the bulbs I've highlighted in this image. They're all on CN15 and the area the error message is pointing to. ONLY check these if disconnecting CN15 cleared the error.

JP_CN15_GI (resized).jpgJP_CN15_GI (resized).jpg

If taking off CN15 DOES NOT clear the message when disconnected, power off again and take off CN2 and CN14, too and then reboot and check that to see if the error is clear.

Quoted from timlah79:

What about the Node 9 board connections, where would I start with that if needed? Forgive my ignorance on the pinball electrical aspect but why isn't the OVERCURRENT "feature" alert nor GI/mode board 9 tests telling me which of the many GI sockets/coils/whatever is the problem?

Because Stern's Spike2 system diagnostic messages suck ass, and Gomez recently admitted that and vowed to make them better (ProTip: Don't hold your breath). It's crazy that 6 years in, Stern's STILL done little to improve the system menus they ported from SAM so they can communicate the full range of diagnostics Spike2 can SUPPOSEDLY give when JJP has done this WAY BETTER for YEARS and Bally/Williams had graphical diagnostics that pinpointed EXACT bad bulbs/sockets on a graphical map of the playfield on their Pinball 2000 system TWENTY years ago.

Quoted from timlah79:

I am now on page 46 as directed at the multimeter step:
"At the node board, measure the source wire of the G.I. to ground. Use the manual to determine wire color."
I have no idea what it means by "source wire of the G.I." nor what exactly to test with my multimeter. The JP manual doesn't note a "source wire" for the G.I.

Just for the record and posterity (because I already highlighted the bulbs and sockets in question for your issue), yes, the manual does tell you the source wire. It's on page 21 of the JP LE game manual on the row numbered 154, "Top GI-Left". The Src Wire is listed as Yel Blk.

#17 3 years ago
Quoted from russdx:

Can you remove the GI connectors off the node board? And see if it boots without warnings?

SEE: Post 14.

#19 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

Thank you so much vireland ! Getting somewhere. Good news = Removing only CN15 has made all errors go away. So I'm now going through all the 154 labeled bulb sockets. However, I'm not sure what I'm looking for. I am physically inspecting the spring inside and the solder points on the arms to look for anything suspicious. I've inspected 5 of the 9 sockets so far and nothing stands out. I have used my multimeter to check continuity between each sockets' arms. I'm getting readings on all of them so far.
How do I now perform a process of elimination? For example let's say (theoretically) I got incredibly lucky and removed the bulb from the socket causing the issue, leaving all other sockets with bulbs. If I then power up the machine and get no errors/alerts, have I proven that one is the bad socket? Or will the errors still occur even when the problem socket has no bulb in it? Again none of this has happened, just an example.
The two sockets that I suspected were the problem (b/c these were the ones that remained off during the overcurrent test + were wired into the two mezel mods) do not currently have bulbs in them but I still get the errors/alerts. I also get the same errors/alerts if I put normal LEDs in them. So are these two not part of the problem or is there something else I need to check with them?
At this point, I'm trying to understand what I'm supposed to do in "checking" to eliminate the good sockets from the bad and narrow this down to the problem one.

I would next power off and remove ALL (as in every single one, no shortcuts) of the 154 highlighted bulbs at once, then reconnect CN15 and reboot. Is the error still gone? If it's gone, then one of those bulbs is bad and you'll need to power off, insert a bulb, power on, check, repeat until you find which bulb (or bulbs, it can be two or more, don't get complacent and not test them all) is the bad one. If it's down to testing bulbs, I would just make the easiest socket of the nine 154 sockets to get to your "test" socket and run all 9 bulbs through it one at a time (power off, bulb in, power on, check, power off, remove bulb, repeat).

If taking all the bulbs out and plugging in CN15 you have the error still, then it's one of the nine 154 sockets that has a physical short. They'll all need to be inspected top and bottom. Probably a broken spring, but since you were in there messing with mods before this happened, you may have moved something and made a short outside the socket, so hard to say.

But let's not worry about the socket short scenario until you confirm that it's none of the bulbs by removing all the 154 bulbs and testing.

#23 3 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

With CN15 unplugged, all bulbs removed. I'd take a meter to each of the two wires on each socket and see if one is shorted.
9 sockets, only take a few minutes and might turn up what your eyes don't see.
LTG : )

For sure. But if all bulbs out fixes the issue, it's most-likely a bulb or bulbs. I wasn't going down that road until a bulb or bulbs were ruled out.

Stern really needs to fine-tune their on-screen diagnostics at least to the more user-friendly level WMS pins had TWENTY YEARS AGO.

#25 3 years ago
Quoted from 2manyhobbies:

CN 15 connectors for your Node board are included in this manual last page 6, giving voltages.

You replied to the wrong post. I'm not having issues. I'm helping the OP solve his.

#30 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

Right but like I said all 9 report continuity between all of their respective "arms" with no bulbs in any of them. Can you please elaborate on exactly how I should test each socket if what I mentioned is me simply doing it wrong?

It sounds like you have a short along one of the wires. Have you followed both wires from the CN15 connector to the end, looking (and FEELING) for physical damage, a nick, a screw barely touching one of the wires, a pinched wire, etc?

#32 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

I haven't yet clipped all the zip-ties and such, no. That feels like its going to be a huge mess but also difficult to follow all the wires without doing so. Outside of the already zip tied bundles, yes I have multiple times followed every wire I can to every connector and reseated even though none appear to be disconnected. It's highly possible I'm missing an obvious disconnect or "pinch" but there's tons of stock wiring and connectors from this upper playfield/node board around to the back of it. Again physically I have yet to see anything wrong. But the irony of that statement is that I think at this point it is physical since that's the only thing that's changed = me lifting the playfield and putting it back down over and over again while troubleshooting the seemingly unrelated helicopter opto issue in the first place before all this happened (as I described earlier). As I also mentioned in my just now edited reply above I did confirm at least proper DC voltage is coming through the CN15 pins on the node board.

Then maybe post some well-lit hi-res pics of the bottom and top of each of the 9 sockets to see if anything stands out to people here.

#41 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

RESOLUTION! 1/10/21 8pm PST: Houston, we have a resolution!!! This is all thanks to a) everyone who posted here and most importantly, b) vireland who got me a huge step forward with his incredibly detailed advice and bent98 who spent probably 4-5 hours on the phone with me today going step by step through testing.

...I learned a lot through this and I hope this thread helps others too. I will surely post detailed info if I do figure out exactly which wire caused the shorting.

Glad you're back in business. And yes, these kinds of ordeals tend to stick with you, so now you'll be better prepared for the next Stern issue you have.

#43 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

NEVERMIND, STILL UNRESOLVED 1/10/21 10:30pm PST: I should have waited and played more before declaring resolution. After 5 plays I'm back to the same issue again. I've updated my last post about it: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/spike-2-node-9-overcurrent-protection-gi-failure-stern-jple#post-6066265
I haven't taken the glass off, picked the playfield back up, moved the machine, nothing since I posted the resolution, just played some games.
I have spent my entire weekend as well as wasting others' weekends trying to figure this out. I'm extremely deflated that it's now happening again seemingly out of nowhere. I have to walk away from this for tonight. Thanks again for everyone's continued support and expertise.

You're FAR ahead of where you were at the beginning of the weekend, so consider that your headstart when you dig back into it.

#46 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

I'm not sure I'm even at a headstart at this point. I've now conjured a new alert and even more confusing behavior. See my edited post. https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/spike-2-node-9-overcurrent-protection-gi-failure-stern-jple#post-6066265

Fix the short on CN15 with the 154 GI bulb chain. Ignore everything else until you have that. It may be artifacts of whatever's going on with your CN15 string.

#48 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

How do I fix a short when I can't even figure out where the short is?? Everything about this issue is now intermittent. Everything you and others have recommended, I've already done except for unsoldering then resoldering all 9 sockets one by one. Which I think is a lost cause. I've already proven it's not a bad socket, just a wiring issue that is apparently nearly impossible to pinpoint, right?

Did you ever post hi-res pictures of every 154 socket, top and bottom?

You jump to defeated/hysterical too easily. Yeah, it can be frustrating, but you're not left to figure this out with no assistance. You're not the only n00b that was clueless on pin repair at the beginning. All of us were at some point. Well...except maybe LTG. I believe he came out with a multimeter probe in his hand. At least, that's what I heard.

Problems on pins can sometimes be difficult and require careful, step-by-step diagnosis to eliminate possible causes. There's no getting around it. If it's too much for you, hire someone to repair it to get it fixed easily.

Take a break, come back to it later, and don't take the process personally. There are a number of people in this thread to help you.

#52 3 years ago
Quoted from Markharris2000:

Disconnect CN15 and see if all is well in the GI routines. I suspect you still have a short in that string since you never quite found the smoking gun.

He has already found that taking CN15 off clears the problem, so the area that needs to be checked is clear and fairly small.

#55 3 years ago
Quoted from Eagle14:

Have you tried switching the node boards around? I had this exact same issue on a brand new TMNT and I switched the nodes boards around (they will reprogram themselves on boot). Fixed my issue. Seems not all nodes boards can handle the same currents etc.

Might be the cause, but this is A> more advanced and prone to introduce more issues if done wrong and B> way down the road on diagnostic steps. As scattered as he's been, I was trying to keep him on a step-by-step elimination of potential causes.

#59 3 years ago
Quoted from mbwalker:

Translating: It might not be the GI causing the over current, but rather the trough...and the lights just shut off as a result (not the problem). Or I could be wrong

Removing CN15 (which ONLY handles GI, 1-3 is power and 5-7 is the returns) removes the problem and clears the error. That almost 100% means it's just in the GI. Could maaaybe be the node board, but swapping them isn't advised when the GI possible causes haven't been eliminated. Focus is the problem here, and all these other possible causes are doing is stopping the progression that will eventually fix the issue.

So the situation is likely the other way round from what you posit - that the GI short is causing the false trough error. And since eliminating all the possible causes of that short hasn't been done, everything else is a waste of time.

#61 3 years ago
Quoted from mbwalker:

Perhaps the OP just leaves CN15 unconnected and plays a bunch of games and see if it still throws a fault eventually.

It won't. Pretty sure the trough fault is a ghost error due to the GI short. I've seen that kind of thing before. Unplug CN15 and you won't see either error again, but you also have lost that GI. Better to just buckle down, stay focused, and finish tracking down the short in the GI. It's a very small area to check, relatively speaking. Resisting doing the steps because soldering is a pain is just delaying resolution.

#66 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

Again thank you ALL for all of this help!

Where the arrow is pointing, is that solder? It shouldn't be there, and if it's running down, it could be making a short.

Also, the area highlighted in red is the metal plate for the playfield rail to slide and rest on. Is the GI wiring over that area in the picture pulled away from that and tied back before the playfield is lowered so it's not pinched? That would DEFINITELY cause a short, and if it was pinched at some point in the past, may have created the short you have.

Also, have you tried power on with the playfield up and CN15 plugged in? Does that work? If it DOES, try wiggling each segment to see if one segment causes the GI to go out.

For the record, the yellow wire is the voltage lead. White is the return.

jurassic-park-corner (resized).jpgjurassic-park-corner (resized).jpg
#70 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

Yes with or without the bulb in, socket attached or reattached, CN15 attached or not, *when the errors are happening* EVERY socket in this GI has continuity.

Wait. So you're saying WITHOUT CN15 plugged in, you have gotten the overcurrent error?

#72 3 years ago
Quoted from cpr9999:

If this is the case he should definitely swap the node board.
Also, typically the wiring / bulb would be the issues - but if he truly exhausted this, then maybe by putting a "load" on the board ...it is showing a fault in the board (kind of like a car battery saying voltage is good....but it is a bad battery).

I'm waiting for confirmation that is really what he meant to say before saying anything else because it's extremely hard to keep him focused, and I don't want to be doing this forever.

It's the first time he's said this. Prior he's always said if CN15 was unplugged, the error never happened. Which points directly to GI short.

#74 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

GOOD NEWS: I literally just may have figured out root cause & resolution but I'm giving the machine some time to be sure...If what I just figured out is right, it was a socket all along (the GI short you and all have been saying all along).

Great news. Fingers crossed.

#81 3 years ago
Quoted from timlah79:

I have since started at this socket over and over again. Just now I decided to take a ton of pics of it to post here. As I was going through the pics on my computer, I saw the tiniest little copper wire inside the socket housing. I couldn't for the life of me see this with just my eyes and flashlight. The pic I took with a flash shows it clear as day (pic attached).

This is exactly why I was asking for hi-res pictures of the top and bottom of each socket days ago.

The problem you have is not specific to JP, it's actually too common for Spike, so that's why when you kept wanting someone with JP that had the issue to chime in and tell you the answer, it was a waste of time because the issue had been seen many times before, it was almost always a short in a bulb or socket, and Spike2's very rudimentary diagnostics was telling you 9 specific places to look (which is why the intermittent trough error and other ghost problems were a waste of time to investigate until the GI problem was solved).

So now that you've been through this (and documented the outcome well), you can be on the lookout for someone else's sudden Spike overcurrent nightmare and help them. It won't need to be a JP, it can be any Spike game and the process and likely result will be the same.

Glad you got to the fix in the end and your JP will be back in business "shortly." <-- haha

#87 3 years ago
Quoted from Manny65:

Well done Tim, so glad you were able to find the culprit and while frustrating at the time, it is so rewarding when you solve the problem. Hope it doesn't take too long in getting the GI back together and you can get back to playing some games!!
Also great work vireland not just in helping Tim but being new to Stern machines myself it's helped me understand the Spike2 system better and how to troubleshoot. I feel more confident (to a degree ) in being able to tackle an issue. Thank you.

Spike diagnostic messages are maddeningly obtuse and incomplete, especially for the novice. Glad I could shine a little light on this issue and how to narrow down the areas to look for the cause of this problem. That said, know that in Spike knowledge, I'm only a few steps ahead of you, so don't creep up too fast, or you'll be ahead of me and on your own.

#89 3 years ago
Quoted from Bos98:

Your help in this thread for sure helped me sort out my Batman 66 like I said above! Kudos to you sir!

Ah, that's great. I somehow thought you were talking about that happening sometime in the past. I didn't realize you had just done it.

The crazy thing about the Stern Spike diagnostics sucking is Gomez was involved with Pinball 2000, more than 20 years ago, which had a diagnostic system with animated menus that showed you where the problem was, which JJP basically copied and improved on. It would tell you what bulb was out, too (created problems when LED bulbs came out later, but that's another issue). So why doesn't Gomez make it a priority to get this into Spike 2? He KNOWS it's bad, and he's been involved with a platform where it was done right...

#94 3 years ago
Quoted from RandyV:

Maybe it's a patent issue. If WMS has a patent on the Pin2K diagnostic system Stern may not be able to just clone it without getting in trouble.

If that were the case, JJP would be in trouble. They basically ripped it off and extended it. One of the reasons their service menu is the best in pinball.

No, I don't think that's the issue. Smells like Stern has an ongoing case of lazy/goodenough-itis.

10 months later
#103 2 years ago
Quoted from kidAtHeart:

I received a new Godzilla yesterday and upon power up, I was greeted with with the Overcurrent node 9. Running diagnostics it was I-Red(x9), or 9 bulb group 163. Removing the bulbs, I still got the error. Disconnecting CN15, I measured a short across the light mount. Also disconnected, as expected on power-up, the error went away. So somewhere in that look, or in at least one connector lies a short.
Not wanting to hack into a day old machine, I put the bulbs in and powered it up. To my surprise, no error, bulbs in group 163 work.

You may have a shorted LED bulb. Try removing all of them in group 163 and trying them one by one somewhere else on the machine.

IF they all check out, you likely have a socket with a bit of metal in it shorting it (often a piece of broken spring). Check all the bulb sockets inside and out in group 163 with good lighting and magnification.

#105 2 years ago
Quoted from Manny65:

As per PinMonk post and timlah79 image below this is what you are looking for - taking the LEDs out and putting in bulbs may have simply move the metal shard enough to stop it shorting, however with the vibrations in the machine it'll most likely reoccur
[quoted image]

Exactly. But first I'd take all the bulbs out in the affected section and test them one at a time in a known good section to make sure it's not just a shorted bulb, which can do the same or similar things. Then if those check out, proceed to looking for a piece shorting the socket.

3 weeks later
#108 2 years ago
Quoted from Crash1977:

I just took delivery of a brand new JP Premium and after about 20 games got the Node 9 over current detection.
Given the previous posts should I direct the dealer to just check every LED for the short ?

You don't need to check every LED. The error will tell you which section has the short, and that's the only one that needs to be checked. Post a pic of your error screen and I'll tell you where to look

10 months later
#112 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

This post has been extremely helpful in isolating my issue. Appreciate everyone’s input. Nonetheless, I’m stuck.
I have a LE Deadpool that is having a similar issue with CN15 on Node 9 (the same overcurrent issue). I’m also getting the same trough issue which could be a phantom error.
Some unique symptoms: balls will autoshoot randomly at the start of a ball, start of the game the ball might not shoot but give you ~90,000 points and lock you out of selecting the top lane skillshot light.
My error is on backpanel GI. If anyone has any recommendations on where to start looking for a short(s), or the logic/explanation on how to determine where based on the schematics, that would be greatly appreciated.
Light reference ID 156 for Backpanel GI points to Ret. Pin 7 Wht Blk and Src. Pin 3 Yel Blk. I guess just start following these wires?

Did it always have this problem or is it new?

Can you take a picture and post all overcurrent error screens it puts up?

#114 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

Problem is new. Errors below:
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Do you have any fish paper?

#116 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

No, but I can purchase some if that’ll help.

I'm assuming the issue is with metal residue, a broken spring, or a shorted bulb in one of the 13 156 GI connectors in the backbox. However, it could be a common problem with poor assembly of the GI wiring under the flipper plates that throws phantom errors elsewhere.

In the absence of fish paper, I'd take some nice-quality paper and cut it into rectangles wide enough to fit between the screws on the flipper plates and deep enough to go to the back of the flipper plate, then slide that under both flipper plates, in between the GI wiring and the flipper plate (also check for fraying of the GI wiring where it contacts the edge of the flipper plate where it exits). Then power up and see if that solves your issue. If it DOES, power down and remove the paper and order fish paper for a more permanent fix. I also documented a more PROPER fix here (fish paper is a band-aid for Stern's crappy assembly design of the GI in that area):

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/fixing-a-common-spike2-node-reset-issue

deadpool_backboard_gi (resized).jpgdeadpool_backboard_gi (resized).jpg

If adding the paper doesn't solve the issue (after powering down and removing the flammable paper), remove ALL the 156 GI bulbs from the backbox. Power up and try it. Is the overcurrent gone? You probably have a shorted LED bulb. In that case start adding the bulbs back one at a time until the error returns and when it returns, that's the bad bulb. Note it can be more than one. If removing all the 156 bulbs DOESN'T fix it, leave the bulbs out and proceed...

Carefully photograph each socket with flash or good light in the socket, the zoom in on each pic, looking for little metal pieces in the socket that may have broken loose and contacted the socket.

#119 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

Paper didn’t fix it. Though perhaps I’m not doing something correctly… I didn’t take the flipper off — just slide paper under. When that didn’t fix it, I took the eight 1/4 screws out and got paper in between a bit better. Still resulted in node 9 overcurrent protection.
Additionally, removing the 13 bulbs does not remove the error.
Obviously, disconnecting CN15 from node 9 gets rid of the error (which I neglected to explicitly state the first post).

So you're down to leaving the 13 bulbs out and taking a close picture of each socket with bright lighting, then zooming in on the picture to see if you can see any debris in there besides the spring.

#122 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

Checked all 13 light bulb sockets. The top 6 are rather easy to inspect. Look fine. The bottom 7 are a tad rough to get pictures of — but each enough to inspect with a flashlight. I really can’t see anything… :/
What’s next? Blow them out with compressed air? Contact cleaner? Yeesh.
For what it’s worth, I’ve only had this machine since late September. I think remember seeing that error early on, but I didn’t fully understand the machine at the time.
Anyway, thanks for all the help. I’m sure I’ll figure it out eventually.

You can't do a visual inspection alone. You have to take a picture so you can blow it up. The bit causing the issue can be like 1mm, and easy to miss without magnification.

But if you've had the problem since the beginning, it's possible that there's an assembly error where an errant blob of solder dropped or there's a loose-ish wire on the daisy chain of GI lights for the backboard, so you might want to take a photo or three of the back side, zoom in on that, and look at the bottom side of the sockets

#125 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

Makes sense. I was able to take pictures and zoom in on the front 6. There’s a few suspect pieces perhaps? Between the T-Rex and Juggernaut lights and maybe between Juggernaut and Mystique. I attached what I got pictures of and I’ll try to get some of the bottom 7. Might require bending the metal brackets for lights away from the backboard.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Yeah, the T-Rex/Juggernaut one might be suspect. When you're taking pictures close, on some phones you can hold your finger on the focal point on the screen for a couple seconds to do a focus/aperature lock so they're sharper.

#128 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

Some of them are me trying to do that and some not. I couldn’t tell much of a difference between the two. I’m on an iPhone 14 pro too, so the camera is brand new.
I uploaded around 80 pictures. And deleted over 100. Ha.
I can try and get some more if you think they’re too unclear. I went through all of the photos and couldn’t really see any other issues. Maybe some of the solder points are suspect… but solder is often not pretty. My partner took a bunch too. She didn’t have much better luck with quality/clarity of photos (she’s on a 13 pro fwiw).

If you're too close, focus lock won't matter because it just can't focus closer than a certain amount.

Did you reduce the pictures to post them on imgur? The backboard ones are 2048x1536 which isn't that big when you're looking for small details. I think the max res on iphone 14 is 8064 x 6048, like 4x more, which would help.

Do you have a multimeter?

#130 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

No, I didn’t reduce any. Just cropped my face out of a few (hence the awkward rectangular shape of a few). I took some close and some from a bit back.
I do have a multimeter!

If you set your multimeter to continuity, (power off) you could put one probe on the ground side of a 156 socket where the wire connects and then touch the hot side on each of the 156 GI sockets to see if there's a short somewhere. You shouldn't get continuity between them.

#131 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

No, I didn’t reduce any. Just cropped my face out of a few (hence the awkward rectangular shape of a few). I took some close and some from a bit back.
I do have a multimeter!

Did you make any progress on this?

1 week later
#136 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

Alright, so I’m not sure I’m doing this correctly. I tested every positive with every negative. No continuity.
It’s likely I’m just ignorant… But I’m not sure where the ground is. Unless you just meant the negative. I think that’s how it works in DC. Or I guess better stated, the negative and ground are the same thing?
Either way, I disconnected the CN15 and tested each positive to each negative. Nothing.
[quoted image][quoted image]

Is that GI bundle on a connector?

Basically you're just testing to see if there's a short from ground to hot on the wire run. So put the black probe on the ground wire of the first bulb in the chain and then touch the red wire to the hot side of each socket. It's tough because they had the legs wrapped with shrink, so you'll have to angle the probe in past the shrink on the base of the socket to get to metal. Also, make sure your tone is enabled on the multimeter so it will beep when there's continuity.

That said, the fact that it worked one time when you put the bulbs back in makes me think it is a small amount of debris in one of the sockets, and putting one of the bulbs in shifted it so it worked once. ONCE. I didn't see anything in the pictures you posted, but there were still shadowed areas in some of the sockets, especially near the bottom, so it may have been hiding there.

2 weeks later
#142 1 year ago
Quoted from Klemp:

Update: took this wire out of CN15 - no longer getting the Backpanel GI error or the Trough error! So it’s definitely on the Backpanel GI. It was causing the phantom trough error, the auto shooting, random points before shooting, etc. That’s all gone now. Just no backpanel lights at the moment, ha.
When checking the positive and negatives on the backpanel GI (and unplugging the connector), there’s about 12 ohms showing between all connections. I think it should be open loop… so there’s definitely a short if I understand correctly. I think it’s likely time to unsolder and resolder all of the bulb sockets. Can’t find anything in the sockets. Took all of the zipties off, couldn’t find any seemingly damaged wires. Nothing of note for shorting…
https://imgur.com/a/IB4ENy4
[quoted image]

At least you have it narrowed down to the backpanel itself now, and not the other three possible areas on that connector. Sucks that this is so tedious, but you're closing in on the solution.

3 months later
#145 1 year ago
Quoted from Forehead_Slap:

Can I ask for some help here? Using this amazing thread, I was able to diagnose an Node 9 overcurrent in a Led Zepp premium. De-soldiered the GI housing and it has a dead short across the tabs. I've looked with a magnifying glass and nothing is obvious, so I'm assuming it's beneath the paper insulators.
I was just going to replace it, but calling Game Exchange..... they don't stock them and would have to order one from Stern. (really??)
Is there a way I can take this apart and find what's making connection? If you rotate the housing top, it breaks continuity but I don't want to leave a faulty component in the pin.

Just get a new socket from Pinball Life for less than $2. They have a number of types in stock now, I'm sure one matches the one you're replacing. Like this one?

https://www.pinballlife.com/miniature-bayonet-base-2-lead-socket-with-short-mounting-bracket-for-stern-gi-lighting.html

It may just be an issue of the insulation between the layers having a tear in it, or a burr in the metal of the part that is being insulated is poking through. If you've narrowed it down to that socket, and nothing is obviously wrong visually, I'd just replace it.

Order some replacement coil stops for Stern while you're at it so you're not wasting the shipping on a couple sockets. With Stern, you'll need them eventually...

1 month later
#148 11 months ago
Quoted from Klemp:

Update: bad socket isolated. Removed. Ordering new socket. All of the remaining work now.

Thanks for following up on this! Glad you have the problem cornered.

#150 11 months ago
Quoted from Drussksu:

Hey PinMonk stumbled upon this thread as I was having problems with my node 8 resetting in the middle of games on my rush pro. I noticed when I first set up my rush the spirit of the radio light was dim or off. I forgot about it as it started working fine after a few hundred plays. As a result I was suspecting that light board that contains the spirit of the radio light may be the problem. I unplugged the CN3 connector from the Node 8 board and the problem went away. Do you have any idea what I should be looking for on that board that may resolve this problem.

If you go into the system menu you're not getting any error messages related to the overcurrent? If not, try running a node test on the system diagnostics and see if you can get an error that will narrow down where to look. LMK.

#152 11 months ago
Quoted from Drussksu:

Hey PinMonk stumbled upon this thread as I was having problems with my node 8 resetting in the middle of games on my rush pro. I noticed when I first set up my rush the spirit of the radio light was dim or off. I forgot about it as it started working fine after a few hundred plays. As a result I was suspecting that light board that contains the spirit of the radio light may be the problem. I unplugged the CN3 connector from the Node 8 board and the problem went away. Do you have any idea what I should be looking for on that board that may resolve this problem.

Essentially you want to eliminate the boards connected to node 8B first (the one connected to CN3 at node 8).

SO, on node 8b, you have CN2 and CN3 next to each other on the light board. Make sure CN3 is plugged in again on your Node8 then remove CN2 on the Node8b light board and play. If the problem persists, put CN2 back and remove CN3 on node 8b then play again. Hopefully one of those two being removed will clear the problem, which will tell us where to look. Report back once you have that done.

#154 11 months ago
Quoted from Drussksu:

Okay, PinMonk I think we made some progress. Problem went away when CN2 is unplugged from the node 8b board.

Ok, pretty easy job from here. There are only 2 active light pins on that connector on a pro. You just need to figure out which light off CN2 on node 8b has the issue by removing one pin at a time from the connector, taping it off, then playing and seeing if the problem goes away. If it does not, re-insert that pin and try the next one.

Pin 5 Left Sling (LED3)
Pin 6 Right Sling (LED4)

RUSH_Pro_Node_8b (resized).jpgRUSH_Pro_Node_8b (resized).jpg

Here's a how-to for removing those connector pins (don't bend the spur that holds the pin in the connector too much, you need to push it back out a little once you have it out so it will grab when you put it back):

Once you isolate the problem light, you need to replace either the bulb or clear the socket of whatever is causing the intermittent short.

#157 11 months ago
Quoted from Drussksu:

Disconnected right sling flasher and problem is gone

Almost there! So it's either:

1. A bad bulb. Plug the lead for the right sling socket back in to the connector to the node board, then transfer the known good light bulb from the left sling in the right sling, leave left sling empty for now and see if that fixes it

if that doesn't work...
2. Loose metal or solder in the socket. There may be some solder or metal shorting out the socket (remove bulb from right socket and look carefully inside the socket with good light and clear pics you can zoom into with your camera phone). Also look under the playfield at the underside of the socket for shorting metal or random solder touching.

if that doesn't work...
3. Check the wire (visually and by feel, some may be subtle) going to the socket for nicks in the insulation that may be shorting on something.

if that doesn't work...
4. A bad socket. Replace socket.

#159 10 months ago
Quoted from 20SidedDies:

I’m so curious to know the ending of this story! I hope it’s fixed after the last comment! I had this issue on my black knight pro, but luckily it was just a bulb.

Yep, waiting for Drussksu to post the epilogue to his issue. Maybe waiting for parts?

#163 10 months ago
Quoted from Drussksu:

Okay some more developments stern sent me a new light board. So I’ll throw that in first to see if it makes a difference.

Maybe there's a drive circuit on the light board Stern thinks went bad. That's possibility 5 I suppose...

#165 10 months ago
Quoted from Drussksu:

That’s what I am thinking. I’m going to inspect that disconnected light. I’m also going to inspect where that cable passes under the flipper mech, make sure there is no damage.

You can also swap the "good" flasher lead onto the "bad" lead slot in the light board connector. If it still fails the problem is on the board. If it passes, then it's the wire, socket, or bulb on the flasher you disconnected.

#169 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

New Foo premium…this thread was helpful. Hoping I can figure mine out too. Removing C14&15 was recommended by my distro and it removed the overcurrent error. Stern tech seems to think the upper playfield leaf switches may be making contact causing the issue? Ugh my first NIB.
[quoted image]

Removing BOTH Node 9 CN14 and CN15 at once isn't helpful. Did you try removing just one? CN14 only to see if it clears, and if not, then (put CN14 back) CN15 only? Once you have it narrowed down to one connector it will be a lot easier to narrow down the issue. If if it has to be both removed to make it go away, that can be dealt with, but one or the other will be easier.

So much for Stern basic QA before they load it in a box...

#171 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

No kidding! My first NIB too. Ok I’ll try removing each connector when I get a chance tomorrow and report back. Thanks in advance Pinmonk. You’re 1 for 1 so far so I appreciate your help and anyone else for that matter!

Yeah, this thread accidentally turned into a Stern overcurrent help line. I think there's been at least 4 or 5 positive outcomes from it.

Crazy thing is, if the internal diagnostics on Spike2 are as good as Gomez has hinted, it can give users a LOT more information about where the actual problem is, but they just are too lazy to redo the Spike2 system UI so it can communicate issues more precisely. It COULD be more like Pinball 2000's visual diagnostics which would show exact sockets with bad bulbs or shorts, etc (which Gomez was also involved with). Boo.

#174 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Haven’t had any time today to mess with the machine but I did notice the GI lights on the back wall only have the red ones working and the 3 white GI lights never turn on. I tried swapping in some new bulbs and those don’t light up either. Weird. Maybe one of those sockets has a short? With none of those white bulbs installed I still get the Node 9 error

You would still get the error if it was a shorted socket.

Remove pin 5 of CN15 connector on Node 9, tape that pin off and see what happens. That disables the upper white GI.

Pin removal tutorial:

#176 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

With 48v applied to the playfield in the service menu, it comes up with this. My white GI lights on the back wall have never worked. I assume this has to narrow it down to this? I tried swapping bulbs and adjusting the leads to no avail. Currently emailing back and forth with Eddie Yates at Stern tech.
Really bumming me out for my first NIB. Hope it gets sorted out.
[quoted image]

Did you remove pin 5 of CN15 on Node 9? That's the beginning of figuring this out.

#179 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

I haven’t yet but will prob end up doing so. I want to make sure I follow Stern tech before I jump ahead so they don’t say I messed up the machine.

Stern already messed up the machine. This is on them. Forge ahead in fixing their problem.

Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Removing CN15 on Node9 clears the error so definitely narrowing it down to one of those four wires on CN15 connector.
All five back wall GI are out now. Without removing pin 5 on CN15 specifically pulled, could it be a different issue besides one of those five back wall GI?
Thanks for your help man!
[quoted image]

We can speculate all day, it's not productive. Removing pin 5 on CN15 to verify the problem is cleared with that out and taped off is the first step to fixing it.

#182 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Just to clarify 100% (we’re getting out of my comfort level), pin 5 is the white/black wire correct?

Yes. I'm going off the manual, but it days pin 5 is wht/black.

Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Ok Pinmonk, you’re the man. I pulled the white/black wire Pin 5 on the CN15 connector and my overprotect error has gone away. Lead the way sir…THANK YOU IN ADVANCE

Haha, I guess you already got it.

Okay, so now to try to narrow down WHAT is the cause on that GI string. It could be a shorted bulb, a shorted/bad socket, or a shorted wire on that string.

Power off. Then, bend out the spur a bit on the pin you removed so it will grab again, pull CN15, and return the pin to the pin 5 position and plug CN15 back in.

First, start by eliminating the bulbs. Remove ALL TEN white GI bulbs (see locations on image below). Don't leave any installed, and count to make sure you have all ten. they have to all be out.

Power on. See if that fixes the overcurrent.

Foo GI Upper White (resized).jpgFoo GI Upper White (resized).jpg
#184 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Ok. All ten bulbs out. Still showing overcurrent error. So either a socket or wire issue?
According to Stern “214” are the white bulbs. Each were pulled.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Yeah. Down to socket or wire. Do you have a multimeter?

#186 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Please tell me we are just doing continuity test…‍

Yeah, easy-peasy. Leave the white GI bulbs out.

Put the multimeter in continuity mode, make sure it's set to beep if there is continuity (test by crossing the probe tips to make sure you get a beep). Some multimeters you don't have to turn beep on, it's automatic.

Then touch the exposed part of the legs on each socket. Red probe touching one leg, right probe touching the other. They are shrinked, so the only exposed part is right at the curve closest to the socket. Obviously you'll have to go behind the backboard and under the playfield. For the under PF ones, double check you are on the correct socket since it can get a bit confusing when a lot of sockets are close. Use the daisy chained wire colors as your guide when double-checking.

You shouldn't get a beep on any sockets unless one is bad, OR on multiple sockets if there's a short along the wire feeding them somewhere.

probes for white GI (resized).jpgprobes for white GI (resized).jpg
#188 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Hmmm. I’ve tested five sockets under the playfield so far with a lead on one leg and the other side of the other leg. I’ve gotten continuity on all of the sockets so far. That’s bad or that’s good? I have my meter set to beep.

Sounds like a short, maybe a wire with a screw through it or something.

First, sanity check. On the backboard, take out the red bulb on the left next to the white bulb socket you have out. Check that for continuity. You should get nothing. There's no problem on the red chain.

#190 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Also just to clarify I’m testing continuity with power off. That’s correct right? I’ll test the red bulb socket legs next on the back wall

Yeah, power off, definitely.

#192 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Ok we are sane. Pulled red bulb on back wall and no continuity when testing leads.
All three white bulb sockets without bulb in them on the back wall have continuity. Ugh

So that just confirms you have a short in a bulb socket or the wiring to it on the white GI chain. Take high res pictures of the sockets inside and also on the back side of the sockets and see if you can see anything out of order - a stray blop of solder, a small metal fragment in the socket, etc. If you're coming up empty, post the pics and see if anyone else can see the issue. Try to make the photo almost entirely taken up with the socket, not the surrounding things, so it's easier to focus.

#194 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Ok will do. So the short in a socket would cause continuity among all the sockets on that string? Thank you so much for the guidance

Basically that bad socket (or shorted wire) created a bridge from the yel/black to the yel/white wire so everything on that daisy chain will show a short.

Given your switch errors, I think the socket 214 at the front mid of the mini playfield (by switch 73/74) is suspect (target mounting screw pinching wire, my guess) OR the target right by the white GI socket (switch 60) on the backboard in the middle. I'd check the backboard target area carefully first, since it's easy to get to.

If you can't see any obvious issues with a visual inspection, a way to cut the search area down is to unsolder a socket in the middle, or closest to where you suspect the problem might be. That will halve your search area. Do you have a soldering iron?

#197 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

I do have a soldering iron. Damn this is becoming worse than working on my 30 year old Bad Cats!! PinMonk can’t thank you enough for your time. I’m working on it as we speak.

I would leave the bulbs on that string out until you're done. You can mark them with painters or electrical tape if you want a notation that you checked them.

#199 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

This one seems kind of suspect. A lot of gold colored on the inside compared to others.
[quoted image]

It does look kind of munged at the bottom. Unsolder it, then check continuity of the legs, and if there's continuity between the legs in isolation with no wires connected, it's bad.

#201 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

This has gotta be it. Compare these two sockets. The one is not normal right?? I’m gonna desolder now
[quoted image][quoted image]

Yeah, it looks real bad. Definitely want to unsolder and test that one. Honestly, I'd replace that one anyway even if it doesn't test shorted.

#204 10 months ago

Just tape each of the two wire end stubs with electrical tape so the GI daisy chain is unbroken, but those two stubs are taped off, then power on and see if your overcurrent is gone. If it IS you can put all the white bulbs back in so the game works while you're waiting for a new socket. If it's NOT you still have another issue on that chain to find.

#208 10 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

I placed an order from PinMonk.com to support a great dude. I recommend doing the same if he helped you out!

You didn't HAVE to, but it's appreciated, thanks!

1 week later
#212 10 months ago
Quoted from jyeakley:

Figured out the issue. There was a tiny wood splinter in one of the bayonet bases. I assume this is why it was intermittent since the vibrations from the shaker could cause this splinter to move around....removed it, put bulbs back and now everything works!

Bulb short or socket debris are the easiest fix, so I always recommend step one of these overcurrent fixes is removing all bulbs from the affected string (once you know which one that is) and seeing if that fixes it. If it does, putting the bulbs back on at a time, and testing between each addition will narrow down the problem bulb. Glad you're back in business!

4 months later
#214 5 months ago
Quoted from JurassicPark:

Following, pin monk is the man as well!
I currently have a node 8 over current out of no where but my left flipper is not working.

Is it also a JP?
Did it work for a long time, then suddenly happen, or is this a NIB?
Did the left flipper stopping working when the error happened?
Is there any electrical smell?

#216 5 months ago
Quoted from JurassicPark:

It is a Stranger Things pro. I have had it for 2 years now. This started to happen just out of the blue on my first game after about 2 months. The left flipper just stopped working and upon reboot this error and not working since. I have started looking for the issue but have become stuck. No electrical smell. Game never had issues for the last 2 years

Do you have a multimeter?

First, if you can take a picture or pictures (if it's more than one screen) of the node error message on the screen, that may help. Sometimes there is more than one screen and you use the flippers to advance through them. That will help narrow down the issue.

After you've done the pictures of the error message(s), turn the power off (make SURE!), raise the playfield and remove connector CN8 from the Node 8 board (that's the rectangular board nearest the flippers under the PF. With that disconnected (that connector has both flippers and some other items), power back up and see if the node overcurrent goes away.

#219 5 months ago
Quoted from splitcms:

Having issues with my flippers dying for a brief second.
I don’t actually receive an over current error. Stern just had me remove cn15 from node 8 to see if the flippers still die. They do not once I remove cn15. I removed all the gi bulbs that are assigned to node 8. When I had cn15 plugged back into node 8 and all the gi bulbs removed, it acted fine for awhile but the flippers did eventually die out. It happens for a brief second then they come back. I think I have some serious issues going on with my game.

So it's probably a short in one of the sockets. Do you have any mods on this that tap into the GI using alligator clips or something similar?

If YES, remove that first and see if the problem goes away.

If NO, Proceed.

Some piece of debris or solder came loose and is now shorting one of the sockets. We need to narrow it down more. On Node 8, pins 5 (white/black) and 6 (violet/black) control GI. You need to remove those two pins from the connector and then wrap them in a pinch of electrical tape so they're not connected to anything and don't short on something else. To remove the pins, you just need to press on the little spur visible through the window on the plastic connector. There's one window for each pin, and that spur is raised slightly so the pin won't slide out. You need to push the spur in with a small screwdriver and slide each pin out, then tape each off separately. Then plug the connector back in. See if the machine is still stable.

#220 5 months ago
Quoted from bwalter:

Just discovered this thread after it was referenced on the Venom owner's club thread. It's been a riveting read; been ignoring my job for the last hour while I read it all. Anyway... my month-old JP30 LE has been having issues similar to OP’s EXCEPT that I have never, ever once ever gotten an OVERCURRENT error (or other error) from the service menus.
Could I be looking at something similar (a short in a GI bulb socket or similar) but in such a way that it would never generate an OC error?
In my case, it's an intermittent (yet common) problem where the Node 9/9a LEDs and GI will reset frequently during gameplay. Also some missed shots (optos and switches, presumably) on Node 9 ramps like the T-Rex. Or hitting the raptor gate during a new game will sometimes trigger the Node 9 reset instead of causing the door to lower.
I haven't looked inside the sockets yet but I've gone over the underside of the playfield with a magnifying glass and found nothing.
Still, the interesting comparison to all the stories in this thread is that my JP30 hasn't ever once reported an overcurrent error. That's what I'm fixated on... thoughts?

So, first we need to see what's causing the problem on Node 9. It's very commonly GI, so we'll start there. Power off. Remove connector CN15 from Node 9 (the rectangular board furthest from the lower flippers). Power on and play (you won't have any GI). Does that solve the problem? If yes, then we need to narrow down the issue on that connector. If NO, then we'll remove another connector. Report back.

Quoted from bwalter:

P.S. I already have three fan kits from you, PinMonk, including one waiting for installation in JP once I figure out this EE issue...

No purchase necessary for assistance, but it's appreciated!

#223 5 months ago
Quoted from bwalter:

….never mind. After walking back into the game room following my update post, I see the problem is reoccurring. It simply took longer this time. Multiple shorts, maybe?

Ok, power off. Put CN15 back on, take off CN14. Power On. You'll lose the stepper motor for the PF and the left and right sign lights. See if it doesn't happen with Node 9 CN14 off.

#225 5 months ago
Quoted from bwalter:

Still occurs with CN14 disconnected. Full power-off in between.
It might be pure coincidence, but it started occurring much sooner.

At this point it could be a bad node board or a short in the switches or drivers. The easiest way to make sure it's NOT the board is to swap Node 8 and Node 9 and see if the problem moves or disappears. Both nodes are the same board, you just change the dip switches to tell the board which one it is. So power off, swap the boards, swap the dip switch settings so one becomes the other and vice versa, then power on and test.

#227 5 months ago
Quoted from bwalter:

I swapped the Node 9 and Node 8 boards (including dip switches) with the power off. On power-up, I immediately got a Node 8 Overcurrent error. So that looks like it's following the Node board. Interesting that previously, Node 9 never gave me an overcurrent error.
Bad board? I looked at the suspect Node board (now in the Node 8 position) under a magnifying glass in bright light and can't see any obvious flaws. No solder blobs, stray wire filaments, damaged traces, pins soldered together, etc.

Yeah, given that removing CN14 and CN15 gave zero insight in the Node 9 position, I suspected the node board may be flaky/bad. The items being driven are different for Node 8 vs Node 9, so it may just be that in the Node 8 position it pulled enough more power to realize there was a problem.

But at least you know it's the board now and don't have to waste time trying to find a machine wiring issue that doesn't exist. You're under warranty and can fortunately get it replaced free, but Stern warranty can be SLOOOOOOOOW, so if you want to play while you wait for a replacement, you can borrow a node board from one of your other Spike2 pins, OR you can just buy a $126 spare from pinball life to have on hand:

https://www.pinballlife.com/stern-spike-spike-2-node-board-520-5017-72.html?Category_Code=

Also, for people reading this later that may not be under warranty, ChrisHibler and Borygard repair node boards.

#230 5 months ago
Quoted from bwalter:

Could the Node board's issue (whatever it is) have been *caused* by a short or wiring flaw in the Node 9 downstream assembly somewhere? In other words, even if I put in a replacement, could I end up right back where I was? I'm sure it's technically possible, of course, but is that likely?
ETA: What made me ask this? PBL's warning: "If your machine's node board is not working, be sure to fix the issue that caused your node board to fail before installing a replacement, or the newly installed node board will immediately fail. Some aftermarket mods are causing node board failures."
(This particular machine has no mods of any kind except adding Stern's own headphone kit upon delivery.)

It's *possible*, but if that were the case, your Node 8 that was swapped to the Node 9 position would likely be exhibiting problems now, too since that's where the trouble first showed itself. The problem just traveled to Node 8 when you moved the board and is isolated there, instead of duplicated on Node 9. So it suggests that the wiring on the Node 9 area of the pin wasn't the cause of the problem. Could be a slow burn and show up later, but I think it's unlikely.

I think the PBL warning is more for questionable mods (alligator clips are the devil, IMO) and outright shorts in wiring that blow up node boards.

#232 5 months ago
Quoted from bwalter:

I swapped in a Node board from a Deadpool Pro (2018 build) and now JP30 seems to be running much better. Several games played plus the DIAGS > LAMPS > TEST ALL LEDS test running for over an hour and I'm not seeing the node shutdown issues I was seeing earlier.
(My T-Rex ramp is still failing to register the occasional clean shot up-and-around, but that's probably something else, for another thread elsewhere.)

Great news! Yeah, the ramp thing is probably unrelated normal pinball stuff. Now you just need to get a replacement on that bad node board under warranty.

#234 5 months ago
Quoted from JurassicPark:

Pin monk I ended up unplugging Cn8 and restarting the machine and the error was still there. First time of booting up I got a troth error as well as a overcurrent error as you can see in the two pictures. I then proceeded to take out one at a time all the CN connections and then turn the machine on and off again after each one. Still the error persisted on all ten re-boots, the Troth error went away after the first time, as for the multi meter I have one but I am not handy with it and need to change that sooner than later. I’m leaning twords thinking the board is going if not gone what are you’re thoughts? Thanks so much again for you’re time!
[quoted image][quoted image]

CN8 includes the ball trough coil, so it's not surprising you got a trough error with it unplugged. But at least you're getting an actual overcurrent error instead of a dead flipper only.

Let me think about the next step...

#236 5 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Just a reminder to visit Pinmonk.com and buy something. This guy has spent hours fixing all of our shoddy ass Stern machine issues. He’s got some killer products!

Appreciated, but not required. I'm happy to help, I know how frustrating these issues can be.

If you DO go to get something I have an EXPO '23 code for 10% off at pinmonk.com until Sat night, EXPOMONK at checkout will take 10% off the order.

#238 5 months ago
Quoted from JurassicPark:

Pin monk I ended up unplugging Cn8 and restarting the machine and the error was still there. First time of booting up I got a troth error as well as a overcurrent error as you can see in the two pictures. I then proceeded to take out one at a time all the CN connections and then turn the machine on and off again after each one. Still the error persisted on all ten re-boots, the Troth error went away after the first time, as for the multi meter I have one but I am not handy with it and need to change that sooner than later. I’m leaning twords thinking the board is going if not gone what are you’re thoughts? Thanks so much again for you’re time!
[quoted image][quoted image]

When the flippers go dead momentarily, pay attention to the following lights on the playfield:
Right Outlane
Right Return/In Lane
Left Outlane
Left Return/In Lane
Spell of Protection

If any are on before the loss of flipper power, do they go off and them come back on quickly?

Also, does it seem to happen at random? Pay attention to the shot you were making or activity that was happening JUST BEFORE you lost flipper power briefly.

On average, how frequently do the flippers blip power off then on when you play a game? Every 10 seconds? Every minute? Every 5 minutes?

#240 5 months ago
Quoted from JurassicPark:

The left flipper will not flip at all anymore. It went from 1 ball intermittent to will not flip at all.

If the problem is limited to just the left flipper and it's gotten progressively more intermittent and then it won't work at all, it sounds like you have a problem with the switch blade on the flipper button for the left flipper.

Turn off. Lift the playfield, look at the switch blades that are at the left flipper button inside. Fully depress the flipper button and see if the blades touch. I think your back blade has moved too far away from the front blade so it won't make contact properly when the button is fully depressed. Bend the back blade closer to the front blade so they touch easily when the button is depressed.

#243 5 months ago
Quoted from JurassicPark:

Unfortunately that was the first thing I did. They are not corroded and are making good contact. That is why I am scratching my head. It seems un-normal.

With the coin door open, and the white peg inside the coin door frame pulled (so you have power to the PF), go to coil test and use the test to fire the left flipper. Does it still work in coil test mode? Similarly, go into switch test mode and press the left flipper button. Does the button register?

Check the connectors on the actual left flipper coil, then. It may be broken solder or not in firm contact so it only intermittently works. You might have to slide back the protective tubing to really check.

If all three of the above check out, I would power off and swap node boards (node 8 into node 9 and vice versa), remembering to change the dip switched so the boards know their new role. Then power on and see if you get your flippers back.

1 week later
#245 5 months ago
Quoted from JurassicPark:

Hey Pinmonk,
Sorry for the late reply as work has erupted all around me and I've had very little time to do anything with the Stranger Things pinball, but now I have an update.
First and foremost, I wanted to thank you so much for all of your help. You are one of the biggest assets Pinside has. So after doing a coil test and a switch test on the left flipper, neither were working. But the left flipper was engaging through the service menu and I was able to toggle with the left flipper during the troubleshooting.
So I then looked at the solder on the coil and flipper switches and nothing looked off. I mean they looked brand new. So before replacing the coil, I decided to switch board 8 and 9's position. As you know, node 8 has, I believe, 6 coils connected to it while node 9 has 2 on Stranger Things, creating quite a discrepancy in power needs between the two boards. As soon as I switched boards, the game booted up and played perfectly fine and the flipper and coil worked as if nothing was ever wrong.
Now I'm only 3 games in and I'm hoping it doesn't show itself again with a longer session. But as of right now, it seems as if the board itself couldn't handle the current, which I have read does happen from time to time. But the game is working 100% thanks to your help and teaching us noobs how to find issues.
I plan on putting an order in soon with your company, like I did a few months ago as a thank you for all of your help. If anything else arises, I will update this chat.
Cheers and Happy Holidays.

Glad you got it narrowed down to the Node board. Note that ChrisHibler and Borygard can fix many node board issues. Also, you could buy a new Node board from pinball life for about $140 (ish? offhand...) so you'll have a replacement on hand when you have another failure. If you buy one, make SURE you order using the part number from the manual. There are similar node boards but they are Spike1. You don't want that.

Glad to help. No purchase of pinmonk stuff is required, but if you actually need something I sell, your support is appreciated.

1 month later
#254 3 months ago
Quoted from TigerLaw:

So, what is the over current protection solution?

Find the short and eliminate it. It's situational.

Given Stern's crappy Spike2 on screen diagnostics communication, finding the short is the part people have trouble with.

#256 3 months ago
Quoted from BrewersArcade:

Basically PinMonk is our volunteer Spike2 troubleshooting guide. Best way to support him back is to purchase from his store!

Not required, but appreciated, thanks.

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