Sydney, Oz
Looks like the VE will be the new LE. A bit like Luci.
(Topic ID: 150213)
Linked Games
Spider-Man VE
Stern, 2016
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Quoted from jgentry:game that was originally a pro
It was not. SM was just SM. The black was Stern's first go at a Limited edition. And it wasn't called LE. It was called Black. There was no Pro line when SM was launched.
Quoted from jgentry:Call it whatever you want. It was at pro pricing,
No it wasn't. It was at pinball machine pricing of the day. If Stern did a rerun now of any of the machines from before their current tiered pricing model it would not be sold at the price of the initial launch. An exact replica of any machine from back then would be sold at higher prices today.
Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:26+ years of collecting.
20+ years as a technician.
10+ years as a operator.
Two decades working with distributors, brokers, and manufacturers.
600+ machines through my personal hands.
It is unlikely this is personal stress.
I simply do not like watching new collectors get burned by running with their wallets open.
Watched it, many times.
They then complain they got "deceived".
They did not.
People should be HIGHLY concerned about quality, otherwise the bar gets lowered, engineering design is sloppy and more technical problems result, which in terms effects reliability and interest in the hobby.
Just like the acceptance of the continued increase of NIB prices at a FASTER rate then at any time in the history of pinball.
This has nothing to do with the economy or cost of production issues, it just is massive testing of manufacturer and people are falling for it completely.
Maybe you are not, but many are.
Most do not "use PinSide" or any other forum.
Things like Bally/Williams playfield slide bar locking mechanism for maintenance was a result of complaints by operators for improvement, for example.
It did not just "happen" by accident or at the amazing technical innovations of Bally/Williams.
Operators were installing their OWN first.
Stern does not even use them anymore to reduce costs, but the prices went up anyway.
Why should this even be considered an "aftermarket" kit?
Simply, it was "accepted".
They did when they were conjoined with Sega and Data East (some modification required).
Stern "Pro" games do not even have rails.
That is moving backwards in terms of development.
We are not in the 1970s and 80s.
I have seen more first time owners get so frustrated that their NIB game "does not work", it cause a lot of long term issues.
I agree nobody "needs" a NIB game, or has to buy it.
I help as many as I can, but sometimes a person's first bad taste is their last in this hobby.
Nobody should want another pinball dry spell to occur, because in their period of revival, it has promise.
Stern remains a critical link in the popularity of pinball.
Poor quality machines is not going to pay dividends in the long run.
JJP knows that, and "raised the bar" for a reason (initial production, code, and design "teething" problems aside)
This whole post is based on a premise of lowering quality, then details a reduction in inclusions. How about, just for once, the "lowering quality" argument actually takes some componentry, like a flipper mech or something, and tells us all how the quality is reduced. And not quality "control" either. Someone's diverter not working properly because of an alignment issue is a statistical certainty given the number of hand assembled components.
Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:How many examples do I have provide across the entire internet from this hobby?
50. I want to see 50 different people complaining like this. Then we can compare that to the thousands of people who buy pinball machines who DON'T make any noise. Everyone I know in real life who has anything to do with pinball just gets on with it. No drama. All good fun. A few saddies in the Internet is not a statistically sound representation of the ownership base.
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