(Topic ID: 283835)

Special lights and match number lights advance problems

By e3thomas

3 years ago


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  • 18 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by e3thomas
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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Space Odyssey schematic.pdf (PDF preview)
Space Odyssey arrows (resized).jpg
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Williams switch (resized).JPG
Williams score motor (resized).JPG
Williams schematic alt (resized).JPG
Williams score motor (resized).JPG
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#1 3 years ago

Williams Space Odyssey
After you light the A-B-C feature below the swinging target, the red "Special" light comes on in the left outlane.
Something is supposed to make it switch to the right lane and switch back, but it stays on the left.
Also, the match stepper does not advance.
After fumbling through the schematic I found a Change relay and a Number alternating switch involved.
I found the Change relay, cleaned all switches, it looks OK, but where is the no. alt. switch?
Maybe in the number match relay?

Also, I just worked on the flippers, new coil stops, plungers, springs, sleeves.
One flipper "flutters" on the initial stroke.

Help!

#2 3 years ago
Quoted from e3thomas:

the match stepper does not advance.

The top switch on the score motor's cam 5 pulses the Number Match unit:

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#3 3 years ago
Quoted from e3thomas:

Something is supposed to make it switch to the right lane and switch back, but it stays on the left.

I just see the make/break on the Change relay controlling this.

Capture (resized).PNGCapture (resized).PNG
#4 3 years ago

Show us the circuit for the Change Relay solenoid/coil please.

#5 3 years ago

Sw. D

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#6 3 years ago
Quoted from MrBally:

Show us the circuit for the Change Relay solenoid/coil please.

Schematic and manual are on IPDB.

#7 3 years ago
Quoted from HowardR:

The top switch on the score motor's cam 5 pulses the Number Match unit:
[quoted image]

OK, remember you a dealing with a pinball dummy.
Which cam is #5 and should the switch be closed or open when the cam is on the low section?

Williams score motor (resized).JPGWilliams score motor (resized).JPG
#8 3 years ago
Quoted from currieddog:

I just see the make/break on the Change relay controlling this.
[quoted image]

The circuit on this switch is fine, the coil is not energizing/releasing to move the switch.
Does that make sense?
What controls the coil is what we're after.

#9 3 years ago

#5 is the cam next to the cam that has 10 little bumps like in the picture

Quoted from e3thomas:

should the switch be closed or open when the cam is on the low section?

The switch should be open most of the time, and it should close when the follower is on the short low section of the cam.

For a switch to work 3 things are necessary:
1) When open, there should be a small space between the contact points (duh)
2) When closing, the long blade's contact point should push the short blade's contact point enough to move the short blade
3) The contact points should be clean, which they usually will be if #2 is happening

#10 3 years ago

The change relay is powered by a blade switch on the 00-90 match unit cam that alternates the relay pull in and release.

1 week later
#11 3 years ago

OK, so far I checked the switch on the score motor, it does energize the match unit coil but the match unit does not advance.
Hard to see why, I will need to investigate.
Is the switch on the match unit the one in the schematic?
That one appears to control the change relay to switch outhole special lights.

Williams schematic alt (resized).JPGWilliams schematic alt (resized).JPGWilliams score motor (resized).JPGWilliams score motor (resized).JPGWilliams switch (resized).JPGWilliams switch (resized).JPG
#12 3 years ago

Yes that is the switch on the match unit. If the match unit isn't turning then that is your issue.

The sprocket on the right (in this picture) should open and close as the match unit turns.

Image is from http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index2.htm
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#13 3 years ago

Good job Argo!
Mine is missing, I'll check all the usual places for a replacement.
So that switch must also control the change relay which explains why my L-R outlane "special" lights do not switch.

Thanks, Ron

2 weeks later
#15 3 years ago

Ok, I replaced this ratchet assy.
Now my match unit advances whenever I hit a rebound bumper, we are good there.
The match unit also moves a switch on a separate cam, should that switch trip the coil on the Change Relay?

Still, after I light the A B C, my red outlane special light stays stuck on the left side only.
I realize the Change Relay has a make/break switch that moves the light to the right side.
What on the playfield trips the coil on the Change Relay to move the M/B switch?

ratchet (resized).jpgratchet (resized).jpg
#16 3 years ago
Quoted from e3thomas:

The match unit also moves a switch on a separate cam, should that switch trip the coil on the Change Relay?

Yes, the Change relay should alternate state with every movement of the Match unit.

Quoted from e3thomas:

What on the playfield trips the coil on the Change Relay to move the M/B switch?

Every time the motor runs (except when you score 5000), the Match unit should advance, alternating the Change relay.

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#17 3 years ago

The match unit "wheel" moves as it should and moves the alternating switch as it should.
I adjusted and tested the Alt. switch with an ohmmeter, but when it closes nothing happens at the change relay.
I noticed when I start a game the change relay coil is energized, don't know if this is supposed to happen.
During gameplay, after you light ABC and go in any one of the 4 kick-out hole (green arrows) the change relay should switch, this is not happening.

Space Odyssey arrows (resized).jpgSpace Odyssey arrows (resized).jpgSpace Odyssey schematic.pdfSpace Odyssey schematic.pdf
#18 3 years ago

Ok, with help from Barry.

When I got the game, the pivot that turns the match wheel (which also clicks the alternating switch) was missing.
After I replaced it, no change.
Turns out, someone along the way soldered a wire between the "C' relay coil and the "Change relay" coil.
Eliminated the wire, game works!

Thanks guys!

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