(Topic ID: 551)

Sorcerer (Williams 1985 - System 9) - game will not start


By nsmith1002

10 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 11 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 11 months ago by DRDAVE
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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#1 10 years ago

Sorcerer (Williams 1985 - System 9)

I'd like some help here with a Sorcerer pinball. First of all, I should let you know
that I work at a small amusement park and one of my many duties is the maintenance
and repair of electronic games, including 20 pinball machines. I've been doing this for 20
years now.
Earlier this fall my dentist asked me if I would look at his pinball machine and if I could possibly repair it. It's was a Williams Sorcerer from 1985 which is bit older that the ones I'm used to working on (our oldest machine is a Williams Cyclone from 1988). The problem with the machine was that most of the playfield lights would not activate and the game would not start all of the time.
When I looked at it in his home I noticed that I could get some of the lights to come on by
tapping on the glass on the backbox. I was able to get a game started but when the first
ball drained the game didn't recoginse that the ball was lost and did not dispense another
ball.
I took the machine to my shop and wasn't too surprised to discover that connector 1J7 (lamp column) was burnt and cracked so that was the cause of the lights problem. I replaced the connector. Now all the lights worked.
I also found (again no surprise) that the batteries had leaked so I replaced the battery holder and installed new batteries. I also carefully cleaned and checked all circuit board traces and components that had got any of the corrosive fluid on them.
The problem is the game will still not start. I checked the game start (credit) switch and it
is OK (good contact). The wiring from the switch back to the CPU board is OK (good continuity).
The diode on the switch tests OK by using the diode test function on my multimeter.
The switch (SW 3) tests OK in the switch test mode. In the test mode ALL of the switches, lights and solenoids test OK. The memory chip test, activated by pushing the DIAGNOSTIC button on the CPU board, indicates "test passed". That means that Game ROMs 1 & 2 (U18 & U20) are OK and not corrupted.
I did find low voltage when measuring across pins 7 and 14 on any of the 14 pin DIP chips
on the CPU board. I measured 4.85 volts. I took a brand new computer type power supply and connected it to the CPU board (+5V, +12V & -12V). I now was getting a much better 5.15 volts across those chips but this still did not fix the problem!

It all comes down to this: the machine powers up OK and is in "attract mode" with the playfield lights flashing in patterns. The game start button is pressed but the game won't start or do anything (still in attract mode). If the start switch is functional and tests OK in switch test mode, why won't the game start? Is there some condition that I'm not aware of that is needed for the game to start?
I've also looked at http://www.pinrepair.com/sys11/ for info but a quick look did not see anything about my problem, I'm going to have to read it more closely. Any help from here would be most welcome, thanks!

#2 10 years ago

I believe that is a two ball system and can have that problem if the ball troughs/switches are not adjusted just right so both balls are sensed properly. This is just a WAG from dealing with this kind of problem once on another two ball machine. The machine won't start if it thinks a ball is missing no matter if everything else is fine.

Thanks for asking us for help. I hope we can help you figure it out.

#3 10 years ago

Those two switches are indicated as being activated in the switch test mode when the two balls are in the trough, so that's not it. It's one of the first things I checked. Thank you anyway! One of the frustrating about this is that the machine appears to operating just fine with all switches, lights and solenoids working in test mode and attract mode working; it just won't start the game!

#4 10 years ago

I'll keep thinking. I've been in alot of these Williams machines. They can be such a PIA even when things are passing as you already know. Sorry if some suggestions are basic .. I'm sure your level of expertise is as good as or better than mine. I've been an electronic tech for almost 25 years now.

I'm just curious. Is it still running the L1 eproms or has it been upgraded to the L2 ?
They upgraded them for a reason I can't find yet on that machine.

#5 10 years ago

Even if we don't help find your problem please stay active on the forum. With your experience you will be able to help so many others.

#6 10 years ago

<<I'm just curious. Is it still running the L1 eproms or has it been upgraded to the L2 ?
They upgraded them for a reason I can't find yet on that machine.>>

The eproms are labeled REV1. I guess I'm not sure what L1 or L2 means. I really do need to study the http://www.pinrepair.com/sys11/ pages, I just haven't done it yet.

<<Even if we don't help find your problem please stay active on the forum. With your experience you will be able to help so many others.>>

I'll try to be of help...

#7 10 years ago

There is a Revision 2 (L2) of the eproms. You can download them from IPDB. I'm sure you know somebody with a burner. Thanks for sticking around and helping out.

Here's the link:

http://www.ipdb.org/files/2242/Williams_1985_Sorcerer_Revision_L_2_ROMs.zip

1 week later
#8 10 years ago

Thanks for the ROMs .zip file. Unfortunately, I don't know anyone with a burner.

9 years later
#9 11 months ago

I had the EXACT same issue with the Sorcerer I was working on.

Finally found the solution to mine.

#10 11 months ago

What does "inactive member" mean?

#11 11 months ago
Quoted from DRDAVE:

I had the EXACT same issue with the Sorcerer I was working on.
Finally found the solution to mine.

Solution in thread here:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/sorcerer-wont-start#post-4967158

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