(Topic ID: 200502)

Somebody explain Bitcoin to me


By Pinballlew

2 years ago



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    #6 2 years ago
    Quoted from KozMckPinball:

    It's value as a currency is smoke and mirrors.

    Clearly you are referencing US Gov fiat paper, correct?

    Fact: In the last 2 years, the value of U.S. fiat paper has decreased about 4%. U.S. fiat paper is regularly counterfeited. Finally, there is NO LIMIT to the amount of U.S. fiat currency being produced, therefore its value MUST decrease under the laws of supply & demand.

    Fact: In the last 2 years, the value of Bitcoin has increased roughly 7,000%. Bitcoin cannot be counterfeited. There is a finite limit to the total number of Bitcoins which can be mined. That number is 21,000,000 coins. Additionally: Unlike stocks, bitcoin can be traded in fractions. No, you cannot buy 1/100 of a share of Berkshire-Hathaway. But, you CAN buy 1/100 of a bitcoin, currently costing you about $57.63.

    Note: I own, and actively trade, Bitcoin, Ethereum & Litecoin. These are the 3 most popular of the dozens of crypto-currencies. I also use Bitcoin as a method of payment for goods & services.

    In my opinion, crypo-currencies are the future. Currently, there is a TREMENDOUS amount of short, and possibly long term upside in owning/trading cryptos.

    Again, in my opinion, stocks & fiat currencies are far too easily and frequently manipulated. Therefore, I currently have no faith in either of these financial products.

    Quoted from KozMckPinball:

    That's the important part, everyone eventually wants USD conversion, same with Bitcoin.

    Unfortunately this is incorrect. Bitcoin is a worldwide currency. The U.S. makes up a very tiny portion of the global crypto-coin market. It is unlikely that the entire world eventually wants a USD conversion. In fact, one of the largest trading platforms, Bitfinex, is ceasing all U.S. related trades and closing all U.S. accounts on Nov 9. In the global Bitcoin market, the U.S. is completely irrelevant. So, the reality is quite the opposite. People all over the world are trading in their fiat currencies for Bitcoin, etc. And the more businesses that accept bitcoin, and the more governments that accept bitcoin, the higher it goes.

    Supply and demand at its finest.

    #64 2 years ago
    Quoted from Tomahawkjim:

    The IRS wants theirs. You're definitely subject to taxes when profiting off of bitcoin or other crypto-currencies.

    Substitute the word Bitcoin, for any other word in the dictionary and the statement still holds true. Irrelevent. The IRS wants theirs whether one makes a billion dollars selling cocaine, or profiting from bitcoin.

    Quoted from vicjw66:

    I have multiple degrees in finance and accounting. Worked for years in corporate finance. Passed cpa exam.

    Quoted from iceman44:

    I won't let my legal, cpa and financial licensing get in the way though.

    All of that education, and all of those degrees still doesn't allow you the ability to predict the future.

    It's funny. Guys that won't hesitate to "speculate" on a new, unfinished, pinball machine for $10,000-$12,000 cash, are telling the rest of us that we're throwing our money away by speculating a few hundred, or a few thousand bucks on a basket of crypto-currencies. Fucking hilarious.

    I'll tell you what.... You geniuses sit on the sidelines, while us idiots dip our toes into the water.

    BTW - bubbles have a base, and a top. The base in bitcoin has not yet been set, therefore, theories of a bubble are completely unsubstantiated. As an example, oil used to trade regularly at $50bbl. But in 2008 or so, oil skyrocketed to $150bbl in a short period of time. Then crashed back down to near it's normal base. The same thing happened with the housing market. Those are bubbles kids.

    Crytpo-currencies are in their infancy. If you want to see what a real bubble looks like, and feels like, toss some money into the stock market right now. Because everybody knows that a 9 year bull market never....pops.

    #94 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    These are the companies that currently accept payment via Bitcoin (as of Oct 13th):

    Quoted from Astropin:

    lol...you have to click on it to see it clearly. It's a pdf file - three pages.

    And it's not even close to being accurate as it omits many other entities including foreign governments. You might want to mention that.

    Quoted from BrianBannon:

    I think if we see a like demand for this type of currency, say acceptance by mainstream retailers, it will be here to stay, otherwise it looks like simple speculation to me.

    Acceptance by mainstream retailers.... like, The D Hotel & Casino, Microsoft, Subway, etc. Are those not mainstream enough?

    Again, Bitcoin, and all crypto currencies are a global game. And the U.S. market is but a tick on an elephant's ass.

    Understand, I'm not pushing cryptos. I'm not selling this stuff. I'm a buy & hold player in this market when I'm not trading for profit. If I lose my entire $15k investment. BFD. I've lost more, faster, in the U.S. stock market.

    If I were concerned, I could pull my original $15k and just ride my current profit the rest of the way. No Risk/All Reward. There is absolutely no loss, for me personally, in that situation. But I have no fear, so I think I'll let my entire investment ride a while longer.

    If the shebang goes in the crapper, you can all have a good laugh at my expense. Much in the same way I laugh at those who "invested" their money in a BM66.

    #118 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pinballlew:

    So let's say you want to invest in Bitcoin...How do you go about buying and selling? Should you just buy the Bitcoin stocks or purchase the actual Bitcoins? I am not interested in mining for them.

    www.gdax.com

    You can buy/trade Ethereum & Litecoin as well.

    This IS NOT a recommendation, merely information to help you begin your research.

    #120 2 years ago
    Quoted from pezpunk:

    you can't buy bitcoin stock. (although you could buy AMD/NVIDIA, the companies that make the hardware that mine the coins. those stocks have been killing it)
    you can buy bitcoins themselves on an exchange such as bitfinix. https://www.bitfinex.com/
    as with any investment, it's probably not a good idea to invest any money you can't afford to lose.

    You can purchase a Bitcoin Investment Trust though. OTCQX US: GBTC

    In the U.S., you cannot buy anything on bitfinex. They have ceased all direct U.S. transactions months ago, and will be closing all U.S. based accounts on Nov. 9. There are ways around this, but I'm not getting into that here.

    #136 2 years ago
    Quoted from robertmee:

    I dunno....When I hear talk of the algorithm's are unhackable and bitcoins can't be counterfeited, I tend to roll my eyes. If it's on a computer(s) and contains 1s and 0s, it can and will be hacked at some point. Maybe not in the traditional way of number crunching, but some other creative circumvention. Nothing in the computer world, especially tied to the internet, has proven to be unhackable. Once the value exceeds the expense to hack and it becomes profitable to hack, it will happen. The world governments have spent billions on printing non-counterfeit-able currency. Why? Because each and every measure is eventually counterfeited.

    And yet somehow you manage to use credit cards, debit cards, electronic banking, etc., with no concerns about hacking?!?!?!?!

    Are those 1's & 0's somehow different?

    #145 2 years ago
    Quoted from CaptainNeo:

    who is making the things bitcoin goes into? Do the programmers have bitcoin to insert into these equations? They have a stockpile of them? Why would you even take the time to insert these "prizes" into things for others to find? What's stopping them from just duplicating unlimited supply of said coins?

    Start from post #1. Read all of the posts completely. All of your questions will be answered.

    #148 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pintucky:

    I have a question, if you would care to answer it.
    Let's say I have a spare $5,000.00+ and want to buy just one (1) Bitcoin. I go to Coinbase to purchase it. I 'slide over' the amount needed to buy that one Bitcoin. If the value of the Bitcoins are moving rapidly up and down, how do they nail down the amount to the Penny for purchasing that one Bitcoin? Is this an easy process?
    Also, let's say I park that one Bitcoin in 'cold storage', and in two years, after it makes a substantial gain, I decide I'm ready to cash it in. Do I just simply go back to Coinbase and put in a "Sell Order" and the REAL money appears in my bank account in the next day or two?
    I'm not afraid of losing the money or the other security issues. I don't have time for complex things like 'mining', etc. I just want to buy one unit . . . leave it alone . . . and then hopefully cash it in for a profit.
    Thanks for your time.
    Mike in Kentucky

    It's as simple as that, only a little more complicated. Yes, start by opening a coinbase account. You will not be able to "slide over" that much, that quickly as there are weekly deposit limits in place. These can be increased in just a couple of weeks, once you're verified, if I remember correctly. Once you get your $5k into the account, you'll simply purchase $5k worth of Bitcoin, which will yield you slightly less than a full coin due to the current price being north of $5k, and fees.

    Sit back, don't panic (the price can swing +/- 10-15% in a single day). Watch the "long term" trend.

    When you decide to sell, simply click on the full amount you hold, click sell, and you're back into USD.

    A point of note: Those that purchased 1 Bitcoin 2 years ago, paid $265.

    #179 2 years ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    If it's a currency of the future... then it will be available in the future. there is no reason to own it today except to speculate on its appreciation.

    I remember reading a very similar quotes when some companies went public. If it's the company of the future.... blah, blah, blah.

    "There's no reason to own Tesla today at $15.00 when you can wait a few years and buy it for $352.00.

    "There's no reason to own gold today, except to speculate on its appreciation."
    "There's no reason to own Alibaba stock today, except to speculate on its appreciation."
    "There's no reason to own land today, except to speculate on its appreciation".

    Almost ANY investment fits this sentence. It's all speculation, and it all comes with risk. Albeit some riskier than others.

    Wait here while I check on the investment money I sent to Bernie Madoff for my Enron shares.

    #180 2 years ago
    Quoted from guyincognito:

    How long did it take to confirm the transaction?

    Why does it have to be Bitcoin? Could it be Ethereum, a faster and arguably more scalable implementation of a "block chain" (distributed ledger)? Could it be Monero, which is arguably a more "anonymous" and private cryptocoin? Or how about the many other hundreds of cryptocoins that have been created since Bitcoin?

    It doesn't have to be Bitcoin. That just happens to be the topic of this thread. It could be Ethereum, Litecoin, or any other crypto. When I was able to trade on Bitfinex, I was buying about a dozen different cryptos. Since they have abandoned the U.S. market, I'm down to Bit, Ether, & Lite on the Gdax platform. But I actively day/swing trade these.

    #181 2 years ago
    Quoted from guyincognito:

    Thanks for your post and good for you. You seem cautiously excited about the future of the technology. Mostly what I hear about when Bitcoin is brought up is "don't be left out on our trip to the moon!" and it reminds me of junk bonds, dotcom stocks, and the real estate get-rich-quick schemes. Oh and Beanie Babies.

    And with all of your examples, there was a time to get in, and a time to get out. I'm willing to risk a few G's for that trip to the moon, although I can always decide to reduce my risk at anytime during the trip.

    Nobody complains of a bubble when they buy the bottom & sell the top. And even fewer of us complain when we sell the top, and then buy the bottom.

    #193 2 years ago
    Quoted from guyincognito:

    Well at least you're aware of the game you're playing and you're not someone looking to invest their retirement in something that has "a 1000% return every year indefinitely..."

    Yes, exactly! For a few grand, this IS a game to me. But it's not for everybody. Absolutely DO NOT invest any money you are not comfortable losing. I'm self employed in the family entertainment business. My entire life involves risk.

    I risk, on average, over $10,000 on each new arcade game I buy. I've bought 36 new arcade games YTD, with a couple more months left. Some games I can ROI in just a few months. Others haven't ROI'd after 4 years of operation. Risk.

    I'm currently working on a 10,000sf expansion of my arcade. Should set me back over $1 million to complete the project. Is this more, or less, risky than dropping $15k into Bitcoin, Ethereum & Litecoin?

    Quoted from Pinballlew:

    What are the fees when day trading these?

    Too minimal for me to care, or keep track of.

    Quoted from flynnibus:

    People buy and sell commodities because they are actually needed.

    Explain the "need" for art. You can't. And even if you tried, art has no intrinsic value aside from the cost of paint & canvas. So the overwhelming value in art, is in the agreement of it's value between at least two parties. If one of those parties decides it has no value, guess what, there is no market, and it has no value. Just because the seller is asking $10,000,000 means nothing.

    Quoted from flynnibus:

    I do not need to buy bitcoin now to buy that milk in the future. I would only buy it now because I am trying to speculate on the future valuation of bitcoin.

    Sure. "I do not need to buy "FILL IN THE BLANK" now to buy that milk in the future. I would only buy it now because I am trying to speculate on the future valuation of "FILL IN THE BLANK".

    Clear enough for you?

    Quoted from flynnibus:

    It's pure speculation - and not a long haul one. For time is actually against it. The more time that goes by, the more risks of alternatives, flaws, etc that can devalue its future.

    On this, I completely agree. Like all investments, have an exit strategy.

    Quoted from flynnibus:

    There is zero reason to buy bitcoin except as a spectator.

    I trust you meant speculator. So again: There is zero reason to buy "FILL IN THE BLANK" except as a speculator.

    #194 2 years ago

    A real world example in speculation and calculated risk:

    In my last career, I was a self-taught, self-employed numismatist specializing in rare die varieties of Morgan & Peace silver dollars.

    So I'm at a coin show and I was reviewing auction lots that day when I came across an 1878 Morgan that I attributed as an obscenely rare VAM 123. Not only was the variety rare, but it was certified by NGC as MS64 DMPL. The only other known example of the variety was an AU53 (almost uncirculated), and was firmly placed in a collection.

    At that time, a typical 1878 Morgan Silver Dollar graded NGC MS64DMPL traded at about $275. I, and I alone, estimated the value of this coin at $10,000-$15,000. I stood to make a tremendous amount of money…. If I was right. If I was wrong, I lost nothing because I would have paid $275 for a $275 coin…. Or so I thought.

    The auction begins. When the bidding on the coin exceeded $500, I confirmed my fear that at least ONE other numismatist also attributed this coin as a VAM 123 variety. As it turns out, it was just one other person.

    This is where I entered the pure "SPECULATION" aspect of this purchase. Remember, I was the only person on the planet who estimated that I could sell this coin, wait for it..... in the future, at $10-$15,000. I could have been completely delusional as there was no precedent. And without at least one other person in the world agreeing to MY value of this variety, its real world value remains at $275.

    The bidding on this $275 coin gets to about $6,500 when the other bidder bows out. With the juice, I owned this normally $275 coin, at $7,500. Fuck!!!!

    As expected, my attribution of the variety was completely correct. A couple of weeks later, I won my house in an auction. Then in an effort to quickly gather capital for the purchase, I immediately sold the coin to my best client for $10,000 without even shopping it around.

    #201 2 years ago
    Quoted from guyincognito:

    Any speculators have an explanation for why Bitcoin is trading on the markets at nearly 10x what it was just a year ago after sitting stagnant for almost 2 years?

    It wasn't just Bitcoin. Ethereum & Litecoin have experience similar rallies.

    Ever growing increase in exposure to new speculators. (I won't use "investors")

    Ever growing increased acceptance.

    Bitcoin is a global phenomenon. News regarding cryptos, anywhere in the world, could cause them to rise or fall. The U.S. market is a very small fraction of all Bitcoin trades & transactions.

    #202 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    And when do you conduct your "How to day trading crypto" classes?
    I really want to give it a shot, but I've been being a wus.

    Right after you pay my exorbitant training fees.

    Step 2 is stop being a wus.

    Edit: I have a MUCH higher tolerance for risk than most. Don't follow my path, create your own.

    #205 2 years ago
    Quoted from vicjw66:

    It's called bitcoin, because when people come to their senses and it all crashes down, 1 bitcoin will be worth exactly that. 12 and a half cents.

    Thank you. I'll accept that as your purchase offer if it does crash down.

    Now I finally have an exit strategy.

    #216 2 years ago
    Quoted from vicjw66:

    And just because it costs $1000 in electricity doesn't mean it's worth $1000. My turd this morning cost 1 $7 chicken sandwich I ate yesterday. Are you willing to pay me for it?

    He didn't say it's "worth" $1000. He said its "base value" is $1,000.

    How much are you asking for your turd? Just because it's base value was $7.00, doesn't mean it's worth $7.00. You could have the finest shaped and most pleasantly smelling turd in the world. It could be "worth" millions. Then again, you more likely will need to pay somebody to take your turd away. (sewer fees)

    Doesn't change the fact that it cost you $7.00 to produce the turd.

    #220 2 years ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    Yes, a typo - thank you. There are reasons to buy things besides speculation. This thread has been talking about "value" many times. But its clear your position and interest is purely one of a investment/speculation... and nothing about actually using it as a currency or its place in changing commerce.

    Agreed. Rather than "buy", the word should have been "invest".

    Most of my business purchases & cash investments ARE based on speculation. Speculation that my business will produce a profit. Speculation when I buy an arcade game that it will earn. Speculation when I trade stock options contracts. And certainly speculation when buying/trading crytos.

    Not quite purely, as I have used Bitcoin for actual purchases. In fact, an online pharmacy I use offers a 10% discount when paying with Bitcoin. So just by using Bitcoin to pay for goods, I'm actually coming out ahead. And if the price continues upward, and/or other retailers offer discounts for paying w/ Bitcoin, I may use it more frequently, thereby recouping & removing my original investment via spending the Bitcoin, rather than "cashing" out.

    #237 2 years ago
    Quoted from Taxman:

    Does this generate a taxable event? Will I get a 1099?

    Yes.
    No.

    All income, from whatever source derived, is taxable income per the federal tax code. Since the IRS collects taxes under our "voluntary compliance" system, you, by law, must claim your gains.

    #251 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pintucky:

    I just opened an account with GDAX with the intentions of buying some Bitcoin.
    Are you telling us (me) that THEY will be the source of the 1099?
    I noticed they needed my Social Security Number and was surprised. I thought one of the main advantages of these crypto-currencies was the ability to stay under the radar and remain anonymous. NO?
    Thanks for any comments.
    Mike in Kentucky

    I've only been in GDAX for about 3 months. I neither know, nor care, if they send a 1099. I have no interest in "evading" income taxes as I already have processes in place, completely within the IRS code, to legally "avoid" income taxes. I will not be explaining this statement any further. Consult with an accountant or other financial professional for additional information.

    I neither know, nor care, about being anonymous, flying under the radar, avoiding a paper trail, etc., as I have no ill intent or will. For those seeking anonymity, do your research. There are ways to accomplish this.

    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    Something tells me that paying your training fees would be worth it.

    That just means I've convinced you that I have a clue what I'm doing. I really don't.

    Remember, I'm not trying to "steer the horse to water". I don't advise that anybody get involved. I'm only providing what very little information I've acquired as well as my methodology in speculating this market.

    #269 2 years ago
    Quoted from vicjw66:

    Best to leave it to the "experts" on here.

    Right!

    That's all I'm saying too. Besides, I already know that if I fail at this Bitcoin thing, I can always lower my station in life and get into something stupid like theoretical physics, or, yuck, medicine.

    -2
    #270 2 years ago
    Quoted from lemonski:

    Here's my 2c on Bitcoin
    Firstly, from an environmental and ethical standpoint, I wouldn't touch Bitcoin with a 10 foot pole. The amount of electricity used by Bitcoin is horrifying, see https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption
    - Consumes the same amount of electricity as Ecuador
    - 7 US households could be powered for a day with the electricity used by one Bitcoin transaction
    - 2,000,000+ US households could be powered by the electricity used by Bitcoin
    No doubt blockchain is a clever idea for security of financial transactions, but really, whoever came up with Bitcoin as a currency should be awarded the ig Nobel prize for stupidity, if they have one. The transactional efficiency is so awful in terms of energy cost, I don’t see how it can ever be sustainable. Ethereum looks like it has the same problem.
    I found a video somewhere of the inside of a Chinese Bitcoin mine. I had this idea it would be a modern, clean, Google-like data centre humming away. It was some f-ing idiot who had leased the second floor of a crumbling building in the back blocks of China, and it was filled with shelves and shelves of mining computers, fans whirring, cables like spaghetti, the whole thing was a third rate ramshackle operation with an electricity bill of $80,000 a month, courtesy of coal-burning power plants. Mankind has enough ways to rape the environment in the name of greed, I don’t see why we need another one.
    Anyway, mini-rant over.
    The problem I see with Bitcoin as a currency is that there are only 21 million of them (correct?). Of course you can own fractions of a Bitcoin, but it’s still a finite number…(unless they start allowing smaller and smaller fractions of a bitcoin, in which case isn’t that the same thing as printing more traditional currency?)
    For it to be successful as a currency, it needs to be useful to people to buy goods and services. (The PDF listing places that currently take Bitcoin is a joke, when you have to have some obscure English Pub on the list, you’re clearly padding it). Businesses that sell goods and services accept specific methods of payment because they believe doing so will make it easier for people to do business with them. With a finite number of individuals holding Bitcoins there is little incentive for them to hop on board. Meanwhile, as Bitcoin holders want good and services that they can’t pay for with Bitcoin, they will at some point have to cash out in USD (or local currency), further reducing the number of Bitcoin holding individuals, and further reducing the incentive for merchants to accept them. If you don’t have as many people coming “on-board” as you do “cashing out”, Bitcoins are simply going to tend to pool in Exchanges, and like a giant game of pass the parcel, it will be a case of not being the one stuck with all of them.

    That's quite a diatribe there. I hope you didn't "invest" too much time into it.

    It's a shame that you failed to note the following, which is directly in your own quoted source.

    *******************************************************************************************
    "Energy consumption model and key assumptions

    Even though the total network hashrate can easily be calculated, it is impossible to tell what this means in terms of energy consumption as there is no central register with all active machines (and their exact power consumption). "
    *******************************************************************************************

    Now, I might be an idiot, and I'm certainly no genius, but when calculating the "IMPOSSIBLE" (energy consumption), with the only evidence being "ESTIMATIONS" and "ASSUMPTIONS", well, quite frankly, I just call that a flat out fucking lie.

    But thanks for your 2c. I've gone ahead and invested it into more Bitcoin.

    -1
    #272 2 years ago
    Quoted from VacFink:

    The kicker, its a certain bottom drop out. When the last coin is mined or the last few become too burdensom to produce.

    Between now, and that time long into the future, the price of Bitcoin will rise exponentially. That should really upset a bunch of people.

    Quoted from VacFink:

    So ride your pony and watch the waves I guess, maybe your what you say or maybe not.

    Oh, you can believe I'm riding it alright. And regularly adding to my positions. Hell, I recently scored 2c from some random dude.

    *
    *

    I really find it hilarious how some people can get all upset over something they actually have no interest in. So I can play this game all day, every day. Laughing all the way.
    *
    *
    *

    Here's a fun fact: I have invested less than 2% into Bitcoin, compared to the total amount that I've invested into pinball.

    -1
    #280 2 years ago
    Quoted from VacFink:

    Lemonski isn't questioning the value of the investment, but its cost, specifically in resources consumed to create the coin and sustain its use through transactions and that the cost increases in proportion to the value.

    Quoted from VacFink:

    As the coins become more limited and the number of transactions increase the amount of computers needed to do that increases exponentially.

    Resulting in an ever increasing value of Bitcoin. So far you've successfully convinced me to buy more. But please, continue..

    Quoted from VacFink:

    Nothing's perfect but your arguing to lemonski that there isn't an impact and that you can't calculate the energy used.

    Ahhh, you see, once you state I argued a point that never happened, you lost the entire discussion.

    I NEVER, I repeat, NEVER stated, claimed, or inferred that there isn't an impact. Period. I only proved that his so called source, was flawed and completely fabricated.

    Quoted from lemonski:

    Nice way to put your head in the sand. Because it can't be calculated exactly, it doesn't exist, right?

    You just stated that. I've never made that claim. You lose too.

    Quoted from lemonski:

    There's no way you can spin that to be environmentally or socially responsible.

    Again, I've never made that claim. You seem to want to argue with me about claims I never made. Continue losing.

    Quoted from VacFink:

    That matters to lemonski as it does to me, and its exactly why he's upset about a thing he 'has no interest in' affecting what he does have an interest in. I can understand and respect that.

    *
    *
    *

    I honestly think that those who are truly concerned about the demon Bitcoin consuming all the world's electricity, should get off their collective asses and do something about it, rather than trying to prove to one guy on a pinball forum that we're all going to die because he bought 1 Bitcoin.

    Because that, right there, is MASSIVE a waste of time and energy. So rather than WASTE your time and energy on me. INVEST it into taking down the evil crypto-currency industry.

    Your move.

    -2
    #290 2 years ago
    Quoted from RandomGuyOffCL:

    What is Bitcoin?
    Simply put, the smart money is already in and the dumb money is currently chasing...

    Bitcoin started in 2009, and is expected to take until 2040 to mine the last coin. We're 8 years into an expected 31 year run.

    With Bitcoin at about $6,050 today, the absolute most amount of money I could potentially lose is my initial investment of about $5,000.

    The amount of money that could potentially be made in that same time is unimaginable.

    I'm cool taking my chances.

    But I'm interested in hearing your opinion on how many years the stock market will continue its 9 year bull run, and whether you believe that "the smart money is already in and the dumb money is currently chasing..." in the United States Stock Market.

    #291 2 years ago
    Quoted from RonSS:

    But clearly our economies are strong and infinite.

    Agreed. Adding a couple Trillion dollars per year to a current $20 Trillion dollar +++ federal debt is obviously sustainable into eternity. Then once you add in interest and inflation, you're really building on solid financial base.

    1 month later
    #340 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Jesus....how long before it corrects from profit taking?

    Are you pulling money out?!?!?!

    I'm most certainly not. At this point, I just keep adding to my positions every week. When Wall street finally gets its greedy paws into this market, there's just no limit on how high it goes.

    #342 2 years ago
    Quoted from RonSS:

    Seems silly that "someone" would create Bitcoin and the like without actually gaining any profit from it, no?
    Or maybe they gave themselves a few bitcoins for their trouble?
    I have no idea of how this ponzi scheme operation got off the ground, but if I'm wrong about getting no returns for starting it, let me know. Being wrong just means I've learned something.

    The creator mined the first 1 million Bitcoins. You can extrapolate that figure into todays dollars.

    #351 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    BTC briefly hit 9k and is still hovering near it.

    When this thread was started, 40 days ago, Bitcoin was trading at about $5,500. Now passing $9,300 today.

    #354 2 years ago
    Quoted from phil-lee:

    I remember virtual "Real Estate" selling for a million dollars 15 or so years ago. Wonder how that worked out.
    At least The Sims will have something to spend and somewhere to live.

    But wouldn't it fun to be the guy that sold at all of his accumulated "real estate" for $975,000 15 1/2 years ago? Seems that it would have worked out pretty well for him.

    Quoted from BeaglePuss:

    The high today reached $9,484.91.
    Analysts and Pinsiders agree: $10,000 by Christmas.

    It has run up to $9,675 as I'm typing this 7:40pm Pacific. It could hit 10k before I go to sleep.

    Seriously, I see $10k within 2 weeks. And I've been doing what I can to help it along.

    Litecoin & Ethereum have been running strong too. They actually gained multiple percentages over Bitcoin during the last year, resulting in a better overall investment for the time period. They just don't get the publicity that Bitcoin does.

    I do suspect that when Bitcoin crosses $10,000, it will get a ton of press, and then rally even further to $12k before a much needed correction. But I'm in it long term, so these early moves are but a fart in a hurricane.

    But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

    #356 2 years ago
    Quoted from TRAMD:

    I sold all of my Bitcoin to buy tulip bulbs.

    I think you may have mis-timed both markets.

    #366 2 years ago
    Quoted from rai:

    sorry didn't read the entire thread, but if someone created the bitcoins that can be mined, why did they do it? I mean it sounds like someone put them in a mine and you need to use a computer to solve (mine) a problem. But what is the point of the computer (is there any value to solving the problem?).
    I'm just not getting this point, usually, when someone does work they get paid. For example, let's say you are stuffing envelopes and you get paid $1 for every 100 envelopes you stuff. The point being you are doing a job, and the person paying you needs the envelops stuffed and so both parties get something out of the work.
    With mining bitcoins, what is the value of the calculation?

    Google.com

    -1
    #392 2 years ago
    Quoted from Black_Knight:

    You've actually been pretty fair in your comments, except for your denial that this is in a mania cycle.

    Based on your posting in this thread, it appears that you're just a megalomaniac who believes that he has the superhuman ability to not only identify a mania cycle, but can actually predict the future.

    -1
    #395 2 years ago
    Quoted from Black_Knight:

    Dude, I was being funny, but it doesn't take superhuman powers to identify an economic mania.

    And it doesn't take superhuman powers to identify that this is the very beginning of the Bitcoin/cryptocurrency era of currency evolution.

    And it doesn't take superhuman powers to identify that as soon as Wall Street develops and sells financial products related to Bitcoin...

    Well, you haven't even begun to see the "economic mania".

    So just sit back, relax, and enjoy the show that us Bitcoin supporters provide you.

    #405 2 years ago
    Quoted from Black_Knight:

    Oh, you live in Vegas, helps explain why gambling is part of your retirement plan.

    For somebody who has everything figured out in the world of finance, I would imagine you would have better things to do than diddle around with a foolish idiot like me.

    I mean I was stupid enough to increase my exposure into cryptos another $14,588 just in the last three days.

    They don't call me a slow learner for nothin.

    So tell me your strategy on getting rich playing the lottery.

    #411 2 years ago
    Quoted from Black_Knight:

    I bought $500 worth some time ago because I know there would be greater fools out there and I am ready to get out

    Well, I'm a greater fool, and a buyer, so sell your Bitcoin. And hurry up before it crashes. How much do you have?

    #412 2 years ago
    Quoted from vicjw66:

    I just can’t get past all the resources used to mine these crypto currencies. I, in good conscious could not invest in them for that reason alone. They should be banned.

    Yeah, we heard. You mentioned it before. Lead the charge. Write your congress-person.

    #413 2 years ago
    Quoted from Black_Knight:

    Pintucky- if you are buying it at 10k you are not getting rich, so there is no rush. :$

    I will buy all of your Bitcoin, right now, in cash, at $10,000 per coin.

    Step up, or shut up.

    #415 2 years ago
    Quoted from solarvalue:

    I think this is a valid concern. I've looked into some of the more environmentally-friendly coins. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to find one yet that is a solid investment. Anyone have any suggestions?

    Pardon the pun, but gold and silver coins can be a solid investment. They're not minting any more of those for circulation.

    #426 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    Are you still buying Bitcoin? My bi-weekly purchase date is Friday and I'm on the fence because of the recent tear. I don't buy a lot, just a little every other week to compliment my 401k.
    Would you be opposed to throwing out what other cryptos you're buying? I've been looking at XRP and EOS.

    Yes, bought another $2k worth last night. I'm on the long term plan. While I fully expect there to be a pull back, this market is just too volatile for me to time my buys & sells, so I just buy and let it ride. So even if I pay $11k tomorrow, and it pulls back to $9k, this weekend, I'm not losing sleep.

    I'm buying & holding Litecoin & Ethereum as they are two of the more popular coins, and the only other coins sold on GDAX. Once I get onto another platform, I will buy into every coin available for a while and then watch it play out.

    I have a VERY high risk tolerance so I don't mind losing a little on some, while making a lot on a few. I don't recommend this strategy to anybody.

    When I was on another trading platform, Bitfinex, I was buying & selling XRP, EOS and about a dozen other coins. Bitfinex no longer accepts U.S. customers unless one opens a corporate account.

    #478 2 years ago
    Quoted from pezpunk:

    John McAfee is a looney toon, and has been for years.

    Agreed, but he's been absolutely brilliant for even more years. There's a fine line between genius & insanity. Unfortunately for all, he crossed it.

    #479 2 years ago

    "Can we please call it a mania now?"

    Quoted from pezpunk:

    nah. there's more to a bubble than a thing rising in value.

    To be fair, he questioned if it was a mania, not a bubble. And I agree that there is unquestionably a great deal of mania surrounding Bitcoin's crossing of $10k.

    The top won't be called for a long time, so the bubble is in zygote level right now. That's just my opinion, I could be wrong. Fuck, I'm been wrong about millions of things in the last 51 years.

    Why give up a good streak. Right?

    #480 2 years ago
    Quoted from UltraPeepi:

    There are a few reasons I didn't "invest" in Bitcoin several years ago (2013??).

    At the beginning of 2013, Bitcoin was trading at about $25 per coin. A $4,500 (Avg cost of a NIB) investment then would have given you 180 Bitcoin.

    If you sold it right now, at $9,475 ($2,000 Below its recent top) it would have net you $1,705,500. In 5 years. Doing nothing.

    So, honestly, how do you feel about not having "invested" at that time?

    I honestly just don't get it.

    #482 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    I'll admit that Bitcoin first caught my attention in 2014 when it was hovering in the $600-800 range. I didn't invest then becasue I didn't understand what it was and I didn't like the options/vehicles at the time for investing in it (they seemed "iffy/shady" to me)...so I forgot about it.
    Obviously the explosion that happened this year caught a lot more eyes...including mine (again). This time I did a LOT more research, and I liked what I saw. So yes I jumped on a speeding freight train...but not just becasue it was a speeding freight train but because of what I learned about it.
    The price increase this year appears absolutely insane...until you really start to think about the potential. That potential may never be realized; but if it ever is then 10k, 15k, 25k are all still early. If it really does become a new World Wide currency...even if it's just "in addition to" existing currencies...then 100k+ is well within reason.
    Remember that a single Bitcoin is highly divisible. Even if the value hit 1 million then the smallest denomination (one Satoshi) would still only be worth 1 cent. That's a lot of headroom....necessary headroom, if it's going to actually work as a currency.
    THAT being said there is a second option for value. Bitcoin could simply become an alternate store of value (yeah, yeah...sort of like gold). Under this scenario I do not see the eventual price going as high but we could still see prices tipping 50-100k.
    Thirdly - Do not forget about or ignore ATOMIC SWAPS (so don't forget to pick up Litecoin if you do pick up Bitcoin). Atomic swaps solves many of Bitcoin's big issues right now (cost and speed of use). Atomic Swaps allows two people holding tokens on two different blockchains to trade directly – and instantly – without the risk of one party running off with the other's money before the trade is complete. That is where the word 'atomic' comes in. It means that either the trade happens in its entirety, or it doesn't happen at all. So, if a Lightning node goes offline or Bob reneges on his end of the deal, everyone gets their money back. The swap happens FREE of charge. https://cryptovest.com/news/lightning-network-first-atomic-swap-between-bitcoin-and-litecoin/
    Then again it could ALL crash and burn (invest accordingly).

    To date, I've accumulated 2.2+ Bitcoin, 326 Litecoin, and 38 Ether. I should have picked up more of all of them this morning when there was blood in the streets. There may be more downside to come but I'm also looking at the long term potential, not the daily ebb & flow.

    #485 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    We are VERY close to each other....I have slightly more BTC and less LTC and Ether. Although I definitely would like to pick up more those.

    I just bought another 3.6 Ether & 14 Litecoin. I need to slow down...

    Or sell some more well routed pins, then further expand my crypto currency empire, and subsequent world domination.

    #488 2 years ago
    Quoted from rotordave:

    2.2 bitcoin = $20,000? Ish
    326 litecoin @86 = 28,000
    38 Ether (etherum?) @440 = 16,700
    = 65,000 ish.
    Out of interest, how much did that lot cost when you bought them?

    Less than that.

    Now calculate how much I've lost since the peak of each of those cryptos just a day or two ago.

    Oh and add another 3.5 Ether and 14 Litecoin to my existing wagers. I have no self control.

    Quoted from rotordave:

    PS there really are 1000+ crypto currencies!

    With that knowledge, could you afford to take $1,000 and buy $10 worth of the top 100 cryptos, based on market cap, and forget about them for 5 years?

    Your entire "risk of loss" will never exceed $1,000. The potential gains could be worth tens or hundreds of millions... Or you lost $200 bucks a year.

    Personally, I don't want to be the guy who saved $1,000.

    #494 2 years ago
    Quoted from rotordave:

    Personally, I come from a very basic business background. I would buy something for $1000, sell it for $1500, buy something else, sell it for more, eventually that $1000 has turned into business Parks.

    Sure, the red paperclip. Similar to what I did that with my previous rare coin company. Taught myself numismatics. Started selling coins on ebay hoping to make $5 per auction. Eventually reached a point where I was making multiple thousands on each coin.

    There are millions of ways to make money. What works for you would not necessarily work (as successfully) for me, or anybody else. We all create our own path through life.

    I started my current business by buying cheap arcade games, refurbishing them in my garage, then putting them out to earn... anywhere that would let me. All of my profits went into better games, more games, getting more accounts and better accounts. I worked 16 hours day/7 days week for the first 7 years growing the business. Now I work less, and play more.... until we close a deal for the arcade relocation/expansion. Then it's back to full time work for a year.

    Quoted from rotordave:

    ... everyone wants to be in on the ground floor of the next Apple stock ...

    Of course! That's the easy money. The money you for which one does not have to work, to get. It just magically grows whether you're shitting or sleeping. The American dream. I've never experienced the easy money until recently with the crypto currencies. I've worked very hard, for a very long time, to reach the level of success that I have achieved. And I'm not done.

    So the big question is: What are you going to turn business parks into?

    #510 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Good plan. I'm about to put some money into my regular SEP IRA. As "exciting" as crypto is, can't get carried away.

    Bought 100,000 shares of a marijuana stock this morning. Came back home this evening and it was up 17.82%. Beat Bitcoin.

    I also bought some put options contracts on MGM.

    Plus I put an offer on 6,000+ sf retail space just off of Fremont Street this afternoon.

    Now it's off to the Baccarat tables to close out the day.

    #512 2 years ago
    Quoted from cdnpinballer:

    @ extreme what pot stock?

    HEMP

    #519 2 years ago
    Quoted from snowvictim:

    Bitcoin is basically the modern day tulipmania. It's purely speculative at this point, from just north of 2k to crossing 10k USD per BTC a few days ago. The worst thing is that it's not actually a tangible asset, it's just information. The mining process is weird and complex, and liquidity is an issue. Basically you've got people hyped up about it cause they suddenly have a portfolio that's worth tens of thousands, maybe even a couple hundred thousands, dollars. Good for them, but it's all an illusion. Nothing appreciates in value this much, and I mean nothing that grows organically i.e. the growth is a result of book value, not market value. Bitcoin is heavily overvalued, largely a result of the speculative actions behind it. Remember what happened to the US housing market 10 years ago? That wasn't the result of houses, that was the result of speculation in non-tangible assets. Bitcoin claims to be a currency, but there range of commodities you can buy with it is still limited (largely due to the liquidity problems). The problem is that it's self-proclaimed status as a currency makes it liable to being taxed as income.
    My friend approached me back in September 2012 asking whether we should put up 500 British pounds each to buy some bitcoins. At that point, it would have gotten us about 50 Bitcoins each, so my portfolio right now would be worth around 500,000 USD. Would I liquidate? No, probably just because of the problems involved in it (it's not like selling stock on the market), the commissions and fees involved, etc. Also why would I? All Bitcoin had done was appreciate over the paste decade, it would be foolish to sell, right? One day Bitcoin will crash, and when it does it will really hit hard. This thing has an insane volatility rate. Fluctuation of 600-1000 USD are normal. When the crash comes, it'll take everyone with it just because it will be so hard to distinguish it from "normal" fluctuations.
    If you're looking into alternative currencies, try Glint. At least there you have some tangible asset.

    Very insightful. Very insightful indeed. I'm particularly impressed with your technical analysis of the Bitcoin mining process.

    Quoted from snowvictim:

    The mining process is weird and complex, and liquidity is an issue.

    And the liquidity issue, holy cow! What an issue it is indeed. Who knew there would be so many exchanges available so that one could quickly and easily convert Bitcoin into cash. Had you not mentioned that just now, all these good people might not know about liquidity. Thank you.

    I'm further impressed with your investment strategy of "better to make no money at all, than to make hundreds of thousands of dollars because of fees & taxes". Spot on my friend. Way to stick it to the man. A lot of the folks who sleep outside in the streets downtown are doing the same thing. You should consider getting together for a convention so that you can share your thoughts on all things financial.

    So the whole not making money thing.... how's that going so far?

    #522 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    I’ll have to check out HEMP. I got in on MJNA & SRNA trying to ride the pot wagon but they haven’t moved much.
    I’ve been eying SING. It’s *supposed* to be a crypto solution for the marijuana industry. What can possibly go wrong, crypto and pot.

    Looks like you should have been "eyeing" SING last week... Before it shot up 100%!!!!!

    I'd place a speculative wager on SRNA at .10c. I can't see paying more right now.

    #529 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    Tell me about it. I’ve been watching it for the last few weeks actually. Just didn’t pull the trigger. I’ve been funneling all my extra investment “play money” into crypto.
    Anyone have a trading platform suggestion where I can pick up crypto that isn’t the standard 3 they sell on GDAX?
    I want to sell some of my BCH and grab XRP.

    I'm just now looking into Kraken. I'll open an account later this week. I'm also going to research Gemini, Bittrex, Coincheck, Coinswitch, Bitshare, and Bitsave. As time allows.

    My Avatar LE sells at auction this weekend in Anaheim with a few old driving games. If I don't re-invest that cash into other arcade games, I'll likely toss it all into cryptos.

    #563 2 years ago
    Quoted from Taxman:

    Oh, and there are law enforcement agencies meeting world wide discussing these issues. They are saying in the future sudden undocumented wealth will be illegal.

    But in the future, will undocumented immigrants still be legal??? I kid. I kid.

    Please hold your applause.

    Who needs it to be undocumented?!??! One just needs to study IRS law, or hire a financial professional who has. Personally, I'm not trying to hide anything, from any entity, as clearly evidenced by this, and previous posts. I'll happily, and I mean very happily pay any and all taxes due on any capital gains. What's 15% anyway, if one is making massive amounts of money, essentially out of thin air. And if one is trading in a pre-tax Roth IRA, there are no taxes due on the gains.*

    BTW - With $12,000 in the rear view mirror, I've got my eyes on $15,000.....

    Before Christmas.

    * Consult with a financial professional before investing any money. One should only invest money one can afford to lose. Past performance is not indicative of future gains. Do not attempt to emulate anything I do. I'm not an expert, I'm just an idiot with too much time and money, at the moment. If I lose it all, you'll be notified by the immediate sale of my entire pinball collection. Enjoy the show.

    #568 2 years ago
    Quoted from pinball_happy:

    ...is now a good time to bring up crypto kitties and breeding virtual cats?

    Well you know right out the gate, I'm a buyer.

    #569 2 years ago

    I opened a Bittrex account last night. They only accept crypto deposits. I sent over 25 LTC to get started. I'll probably send over a little BTC to juice the account and start buying. I'll wait to unload the 25 LTC on the next pop up, and then buy an eclectic assortment of other crypto currencies.

    Spread my charm around this little crypto casino and see what happens.

    If anybody on here has an interest in modern pinball, GoTG pro was placed at the Big Apple Arcade at NYNY Casino today. AC/DC pro headed to the shop for refurb. Kiss pro out next, but I haven't decided on a replacement yet. Probably bring back WOZ.

    #583 2 years ago
    Quoted from acebathound:

    "By July 2019, the bitcoin network will require more electricity than the entire United States currently uses.

    Not a problem. China, in an on going effort to rid us of our worthless fiat currency, has offered to step up their energy production, so that we can send them more of our IOU's based in "faith", in exchange for their Bitcoin based in, well, faith.

    Quoted from acebathound:

    By February 2020, it will use as much electricity as the entire world does today."

    Making Bitcoin worth like a trillion dollars per coin.

    I might be an idiot, but I'm no moron... I'm selling in January 2020 before the lights go out. I should be good for $4-5 trillion by then. Enough to secure me a flight and a place to stay on the moon base with Richard Branson and Elon Musk.

    It's always good to have an exit strategy.

    :p

    #594 2 years ago

    I was doing more coin buying last night when it occurred to me to sell all of my LTC & ETH and dump it all into Bitcoin.

    I didn't. BTC shot up $3,000 per coin overnight.

    As I may have mentioned earlier, I'm an idiot.

    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    Just messing around. I can't believe Bitcoin reached $15k let alone $16k.

    $17,400 and counting....

    #595 2 years ago

    $18,800.

    I've made $4k since my last post.

    #596 2 years ago

    $19,500

    Another $2300 in the last few seconds.

    #598 2 years ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    Wow, this is insane.

    Sure, but is the insanity coming to a peak, or is the insanity just starting?!?!?!

    #604 2 years ago

    BTC hit $19,600 on GDAX before the platform crashed along with parent Coinbase. This is VERY peculiar.

    My Bittrex account is working fine and showing a 24hr high of only $15,825. Really, really strange.

    Quoted from Grayman_EM:

    Saw a report on national news about these. Youngest Bitcoin millionaire (19) invested $1,000.00 seven years ago and now worth over $1,000,000.00. Warren Buffett was warning about them. Get out while you can kid!

    And Mark Cuban called a bubble at $3,000. The market dipped slightly, he then bought into BTC claiming that he's always been a supporter of blockchain technology. So BFD what any billionaire SAYS, watch what they DO.

    Warren Buffet is either playing the "Mark Cuban" game to get in at a lower price, or he's afraid that if this goes high enough, he'll lose his place at the top end of the billionaire's club. Soon to be taken over by a bunch of millennials wearing headphones.

    As I've said many times before, I'm an idiot. Yet somehow I predicted (Post 354) the breakthrough past $10k, the rally to $12k (reached $11.6k), before my accurately predicted correction thereafter.

    I also predicted the breakthrough past $15k.

    But that doesn't make me a genius. I have no delusions of being some investing guru.

    When you really boil it all down, whether it's trading stocks, options, or crypto currency, I'm just playing around with some electrons. Sometimes those electrons move in my favor, other times, not so much.

    It honestly won't become real (to me) until it's cold hard cash/gold in my hands.

    That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.... see post #354

    #607 2 years ago
    Quoted from ExtremePinball:

    $18,800.
    I've made $4k since my last post.

    Quoted from ExtremePinball:

    $19,500
    Another $2300 in the last few seconds.

    Never mind. It's all gone.

    Fuckin electrons!!!!

    Anybody have a line on some cheap Ramen Noodles?

    I'm cool with the expired stuff.

    #608 2 years ago
    Quoted from pezpunk:

    the NiceHash hack has resulted in a hundred thousand noobs who can barely install a video card driver suddenly jumping into Monero pools, drastically raising the difficulty of the coin i've been happily mining for the last month!

    Hmmm... mining, none of the risk, all reward. Sorry bro, but your post regarding mining has actually inspired me to do the same...

    Er, on a much larger scale.

    Signed,

    Noob

    #610 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    My GDAX sell executed at $16,985. Within 30 minutes, I watched it climb to $19,200 and then abruptly crash to around $14,500. I got auto-logged out and was frantically trying to log in and buy it back, but it kept throwing an error.

    I JUST got on GDAX. BTC shows a low of $13,500, and a high of $19,697.

    Trading at exactly $17k right now.

    #611 2 years ago
    Quoted from ExtremePinball:

    I JUST got on. BTC shows a low of $13,500, and a high of $19,697.
    Trading at exactly $17k right now.

    Still trading at $15,500 on Bittrex.

    #643 2 years ago
    Quoted from TRAMD:

    Nope, I was wrong. If you bought $1000 of Bitcoin 7 years ago and held it all, that would be worth over $100 million now.

    And 7 years ago, I guarantee there were pundits calling Bitcoin a Ponzi scheme, a pyramid scam, and a tulip repeat, all while bragging how they weren't going to be the sucker who threw away $1,000 on this nutcase crap.

    #647 2 years ago
    Quoted from PhilGreg:

    So guys, if somebody has a few expandable bucks to gamble at this thing, what do you suggest?
    BTC because it's the big name in the game?
    Some others because they have more room to grow and aren't as wildly volatile?

    May I suggest splitting your bucks and getting a little bit of both?

    #668 2 years ago
    Quoted from Underspin:

    Hey Bitcoin suckers my original $400 is now down to $359.27. As we pinheads say $37.00 by Christmas!
    Let this be a warning to you. As long as I'm in the Bitcoin space it will shrivel like a raisin in the sun.

    $40 bucks huh? I think I might have you beat in the bad decisions department.

    Last night in a smoky haze I decide to sell 160 LTC @ $97. It's trading at $130 as I type this. A $5,280 mistake there.

    I take that capital and immediately buy 0.9 BTC @ $17,700. Currently trading at $16,400. A further $1,145 loss. All total, a $6,425 reduction in profit because of poor timing. A process that only took a few seconds to accomplish.

    BTW, I'm up to 5.3 BTC for those keeping score at home.

    Perhaps I'll get the next big trade right.

    #670 2 years ago
    Quoted from jorro:

    Do't wanna be a party pooper, or a Don Quichot fighting against windmills and i don't have a masters in economics.
    But i just want to say, we had a thing here with tullip bulbs in our past.......
    When the bubble of greed bursts you could be down a lot.
    Only play with what you can mis

    So you're suggesting I sell all of my Bitcoin and put it into Tulip bulbs??? Sorry, as I've noted before, I'm an idiot.

    I'm going to hazard a guess and say that you weren't actually invested in the Tulip craze, nor were you around to witness it. I'll further assume that you didn't write your PhD Thesis on the subject. So let's just all agree to drop the Tulip issue here. Bring up something like the crude oil bubble of 2008. Or the dot com bubble. Or the real estate bubble from which we are still recovering. And you won't have a proper analogy because there is no analogy. Crypto currencies are the future. This is a fact that cannot be argued. How it all plays out, and which ones come out on top, is yet to be seen. But you are witnessing a first-time human event with crypto currencies. There simply is no precedent.

    Now then, if we're going to play the bubble game, we should know the rules. The first rule of economic bubbles is that they don't pop or burst, they deflate. One must simply make an educated decision on when to get out, if what starts as a correction degrades into deflation.

    In my opinion, that decision should based on the risk/reward analysis aspect of investing, and not on the ramblings of some billionaire investor, nor on the writings of some random pinball enthusiast on the internet. I have never "warned" anybody that they won't make money if they don't invest. In fact I haven't, and still don't, recommend to anybody, ever (with the exception of my business partner), to get involved in this crypto craze.

    I trade stocks. Plenty of bubbles there. I trade options. Plenty of 100% worthless expired contracts there. There are plenty of ways to make money. When it comes to financials, more risk generally results in more reward. That's why I trade options more than I do stocks. Bigger risk as one could lose 100% of their investment in a matter of weeks. But when it goes right..... you could make multiples of your investment in the same number of weeks.

    For the last month or two, I've been investing a couple thousand dollars a day into cryptos. Unless I experience a loss of life, or electricity, tomorrow will be no different.

    I post frequently about my escapades on this thread. You'll know how it all turns out by sticking around here.

    #678 2 years ago
    Quoted from jorro:

    The idiot part i don't disagree on mister know it all.
    For the assume part, it makes an ASS out of U and ME!
    Yes a long time ago my family actualy made a lot of money with tullips (and lost a lot ), but that's not the point.
    It was just a easy to understand warning for all not so highly gifted like you, that it can be a deep pit and a los of money when the hype fades.
    But not to derail your economics topic on a pinball forum any further i will leave you to it teacher smartypants.

    Ok, I concede. This is EXACTLY like the Tulip mania of the 17th century. You are entirely correct and I will proceed with the same expectation as the Tulip mania, which lasted a number of years. I'm going to heed your advice and expect the same outcome. So if you don't mind, it's still on the upside of the bubble so I should still have at least a year to cash in on the Bitcoin mania before it all bursts. Thank you for the generous warning.

    In the season of giving, I thought I'd share a few unsolicited warnings of my own:

    Don't bet on a lame horse.
    Don't eat yellow snow.
    When tying one's shoelaces, avoid tying the left & right shoe together.
    Never lick a frozen light pole.
    If it looks like dog shit, and if it smells like dog shit, it's best to ASSUME that it's dog shit, rather than proceed with a taste test.

    You're welcome.

    #689 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    We're all big boys and understand the risks.

    Speak for yourself.

    I'm an immature, 51 year old child who actively seeks risk.

    #714 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Litecoin has skyrocketed

    Tulips

    #717 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    I saw that. Too bad I only have 5.

    It’s a bubble, run for your lives!!!!

    In typical fashion, I unloaded 250 LTC @ $144. I vaguely remember somebody noting something about an idiot in a previous post.

    Moderator Request: Since this Tulip shaped Bitcoin bubble isn't going anywhere for a while, we are currently in desperate need of a Tulip emoji and a Bubble emoji.

    I, no WE, thank you in advance.

    #739 2 years ago
    Quoted from guyincognito:

    'Bitcoin Jesus' explains his vision from the beach:
    » YouTube video
    He's pushing 'Bitcoin Cash' pretty hard over 'Bitcoin Core', but doesn't he have *both* in his 'wallet' (due to the split) and isn't the 'Bitcoin Core' currently trading at like 10x what 'Bitcoin Cash' is?

    I didn't watch the video, but I think it comes down to the multipliers. On two levels. Level 1 is that you get more "Bang for the Buck" by receiving 12 BCC rather than 1 BTC for the same (current) $16,800 investment. Level 2 is that it will become more difficult for a crypto like Bitcoin, currently trading at $16,800, than it will be for BCC, currently trading at $1,400, to double, triple, or quadruple in a short time period.

    One thing I do know is that Litecoin is up 160% in 4 days.

    The future looks bright, my friend.

    #741 2 years ago

    Ok, you've made your point.

    -2
    #760 2 years ago
    Quoted from rai:

    I was going to dip my toe into the bitcoin market but since it’s gone up 10,000% or whatever I think it’s more risky, less room to run.

    "less room to run"

    I'm curious, is it because you've already done all the research you need to identified the top of the Bitcoin life cycle, or is it just that that you don't know any numbers higher than 20,000?

    #761 2 years ago
    Quoted from rai:

    I’m probably going to pass on investing/speculating in crypto coins. Seems too shady to me.

    It is. Everybody knows that crypto coins are only used by drug dealers, arms dealers and murderers.

    Now try to figure out why I have so many.

    #766 2 years ago
    Quoted from bkbirge:

    The "less room to run" point of view has been voiced by many since btc was $1 and at every point along the way. Sure that will be the correct view at some point, but is it now? It hasn't been yet when all the experts have said it was. Keep in mind that the vast majority of people still have zero clue that bitcoin exists, and of the ones that do know about it there is a vanishingly small minority that understand it. My personal opinion is that when basic understanding filters out to the layperson people will be wishing they got in now.

    Fact.

    Additional facts from a NYT article on Coinbase written last week.

    "The number of people with Coinbase accounts has gone from 5.5 million in January to 13.3 million at the end of November"
    "Coinbase was sometimes getting 100,000 new customers a day"
    "Coinbase v. IRS - Coinbase fought the broad request from the I.R.S. and last week, while the price was skyrocketing, announced an agreement to hand over only the records of customers who made transactions involving more than $20,000 of virtual currencies — around 3 percent of the company’s customers.
    "At the beginning of the year, the company had 24 employees providing customer support. It now has around 180,"..."Daniel Romero, the general manager of Coinbase, said he wanted to have 400 customer support employees by the first quarter of next year"

    Think about that... fewer than 3% of Coinbase's 13 MILLION customers have accounts of $20k+.

    The real money hasn't even BEGUN to step in.

    -8
    #788 2 years ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    Don't be naive. Just because someone doesn't say it outright doesn't mean it's not there. It's one of the oldest tricks in the book... generate sales indirectly by raising awareness and setup the audience to make them draw the conclusion that they should get in, and don't delay or you may miss out! It plays out in so many cons...
    All these stories and blogs about how great bitcoin is and how "the sky is the limit" are not historical pieces Running around boasting to strangers about how hot and success you are for investing in crypto is self-serving because all prior buyers benefit from new money and interest in the product.
    It's not people just defending their own speculative purchases against external scrutiny. If it were, all they'd do is say "Scoreboard..." and laugh while counting their money.

    Listen snowflake, just because you have no self control, doesn't mean that the people here that support Bitcoin, and crypto in its entirety, also don't. Just because you are easily influenced into "fitting in", doesn't mean you can just project your personal character defects onto an entire community.

    It seems that you, and only you, are focusing on YOUR perception of the power of "persuasion", and making it seem like everybody supporting Bitcoin is a con artist pump & dump expert, while everybody just deciding to toy around is a guaranteed victim.

    Enough already. Find another thread to shit in.

    #789 2 years ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    And how many people do you think are really holding onto their own wallets vs people who are using online wallets? Still have to give (and maintain) identity information and banking details in those exchanges to realize any value.. and most now are doing that up front, because they aren't mining themselves... but buying.
    When sites promote 'make sure you keep your recovery phase' as the backup strategy.. that is not really the same as keeping the wallet (addresses, and keys) offline yourself.
    As usual, convenience will erode security and promote lax behaviors that will create liabilities. It just comes with the turf of dealing with the general population.

    Save the world in another thread please.

    Thank you.

    #792 2 years ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    Do you seriously not grasp the difference between understanding and articulating something vs describing your own feelings?
    Do you think every psychiatrist is really inflicted by the things they are able to describe?
    ... This kind of retort is just what people do when they have no real response. Just attack the messenger...

    Wrong answer. Fear mongering is not a message.

    If you have nothing to contribute to a thread entitled "Somebody explain Bitcoin to me", then I invite you to leave.

    Again, shit in another thread.

    #793 2 years ago
    Quoted from Reality_Studio:

    That's pretty much why I'm staying out of it. Not that I doubt cryptocurrency, the concept is interesting. But I just feel that bitcoin's chances have been ruined by speculators. It's basically gambling at this point with everyone trying to get all their friends and family on board to keep the momentum going, and like most such things those left holding the bag will ultimately lose out. I don't doubt some will make money, it's just more risk than I'm willing to take. I figure the current coins will eventually implode, taking many people out in the process and possibly scare away future speculators. Then cryptocurrency can make another run at it but in a less manipulated fashion.

    And I "predict the future" differently. I'm already up $91k, so I'm personally funding the accounts of friends and family with the caveat that they NEVER invest their own money. Further, although not requested, if they would like, they can "reimburse" me my original investment if the account ever exceeds more than 100% return (3 months from now). They keep the profit and future growth if they decide not to cash out. And the only money being risked is mine, while I stand nothing to gain.

    I just see things differently.

    As I've said before... I don't recommend anybody try to emulate anything that I do. I'm just an idiot who, currently, has too much time & money, along with a VERY HIGH risk tolerance.

    Both may vanish sooner than planned.

    -1
    #795 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Not to mention for every pumper that is out there, there's also someone screaming TULIPS.

    Recheck your math.

    I count 0 pumpers and at least 6 Tulip screamers in this thread.

    When that ratio reverses.... that's the top.

    1 week later
    #840 2 years ago
    Quoted from toyotaboy:

    side question: many are speculating cryptocurrency could harm money when it becomes more valuable and people realize its not only cheaper to transfer funds (no third party) but its instant..
    do you think itll ever start replacing the stock market? not as an investment, but as a replacement to venture capitalists? say i start a business, rather than finding an angel investor i simply start my own currency. investors buy my currency with no fees, and if my business worth goes up, so does my currency. or is this happening already?

    Every. Single. Day.

    Google: ICO

    #870 2 years ago
    Quoted from pezpunk:

    ugh trend analysis is 1000% bullshit. drawing lines and assigning fancy names to dips and peaks is no more predictive than reading tea leaves. pseudo-scientific pseudo-logic.

    In this market, I agree.

    However, trend analysis/candlestick charting has served me well when trading options contracts.

    #871 2 years ago
    Quoted from ExtremePinball:

    In this market, I agree.
    However, trend analysis/candlestick charting has served me well when trading options contracts.

    Sorry, forgot the rules....

    "Scoreboard"

    #875 2 years ago
    Quoted from mcluvin:

    Some of you guys are overly sensitive about this. It's not well regulated and thus prone to abuse. Give me an f'n break.

    Pot... Kettle, Kettle.... Pot.

    For somebody not involved in the buying/selling/trading of crypto currencies, you sure seem pretty sensitive.

    Quoted from mcluvin:

    And what is the preferred currency for ransomware payment? Bitcoin....

    And what is the preferred currency for drug dealers and terrorists around the globe? Why YES, it's U.S. Currency.

    So be sure to immediately rid yourself of this vile, evil paper by sending your remaining U.S. currency to me, and I'll convert it into harmless ashes for you.

    Together, we can save the world.

    #879 2 years ago
    Quoted from mcluvin:

    I'm just bored and this is somewhat interesting. If my bank is robbed, my money is insured by the FDIC, although admittedly losing value slowly decade by decade. If your bitcoin exchange is robbed, yer f'd, not to mention the crazy price fluctuations.

    I too was bored.... Until I bought some BTC, ETC, & LTC. Now my life is an exciting rollercoaster full of ups & downs, leaving my head spinning, and my stomach turning... all the while, my "speculation" continues its vertical ascent.

    But admittedly, it's not for emotional or the faint of heart.

    #889 2 years ago
    Quoted from guyincognito:

    There is definitely some shady sh!t going on with coinbase.
    'Commoners' are having trouble getting money in or out.

    I put in a withdrawal request for $9,000 last night. It was in my checking account when I woke up this morning.

    Perhaps the problems are isolated.

    #897 2 years ago
    Quoted from bkbirge:

    Haha, had me laughing and I am a fan of btc, but he nailed so many personalities I've met in crypto perfectly. "the veganism of the financial world" lol.

    Obviously a tongue in cheek video.

    However, the vast majority of people in the world have never even heard of Bitcoin, much less crypto currencies. I personally ask every business that I enter if I can pay with Bitcoin. I tried to pay my dentist last week, and my oral surgeon just this morning. 100% of the time, I'm met with "What's Bitcoin?" Then I smile, very happily.

    Since this, and every internet forum is made up of "the vast majority of people", I expect there to be far more people against Bitcoin, and crypto currencies in general, based on the consensus that.... It's a scam, it's a bubble, and it's a tulip.

    Since I've been searching for a tulip bubble scam, I'm currently happier than a pig in shit. Hence the number of red arrows I receive on a regular basis.

    And I'm good with that because all those down votes are primarily from those who simply don't understand math, or the concepts of calculated risk and exponential ROI. So down vote away. If it makes YOU feel good, it makes ME feel good.

    If you want to be the guy who clung to $200 (or any number) in 2017, carry on. I absolutely GUARANTEE that the $200 you saved, will be worth less than $200 in a year from now. That falls under the concept of inflation. Sure you can put $200 into savings, and it will be worth $200.50 in a year. But you still lost money due to 3% inflation. No risk, no return. You could put $200 into stocks for your 10% annual return (involves some risk of loss). You're not guaranteed any return, and could still lose money.

    But, if you're the type of person who understands that a $200 speculation into crypto currencies (not necessarily Bitcoin) could net hundreds of thousands of dollars in just a few short years, then you understand the concept of risk/reward. Your risk of loss can never exceed $200, but the upside potential (reward) is unlimited. Think about that. No, seriously think about that.

    I obviously have a different mindset than most. That's partly because I neither worship money, nor do I fear money. I see money as nothing more than a tool to be used to make more money. I understand that this differs from the average American, because I'm self employed.

    Now allow me to toss some actual numerical facts into this ridiculous diatribe.

    On my current $89,137 investment, er, speculation into crypto currencies, I'm sitting on a $148,610 portfolio. That's down from the peak of $194,000 due to the recent crypto correction. This return took 6 months to accomplish, all the while I lost an additional $50k or so on some REALLY bad trades.

    There are some 7 Billion people on the planet. Bitcoin's market cap is in the TRILLIONS $$$$$. So in all reality, whether buying or selling, the 1,000 people that frequent Pinside, will not affect the overall crypto currency market in any way. Hell, I do instantaneous $50,000 trades on a regular basis, and I can't even affect the LTC market @ $275 per coin.

    Bottom line: The guys on the Bitcoin forum tell me I'm a moron for investing $250,000+ into pinball machines, while the guys on the Pinball forum are telling me that I'm an idiot for investing (currently) $89,137 into magical coins.

    P.S. I didn't save $200 this year.

    P.P.S. Fremont Arcade is down to 1 pinball machine.

    P.P.S A lot of really nice pins are about to be sent to auction.

    Risk/reward.

    #900 2 years ago
    Quoted from cdnpinballer:

    Serious question:
    Are you a) Drunk b) High c) Both? LoL

    Serious answer: I don't drink.

    I'm a self made millionaire who started with nothing. I've worked since I was 12 years old, speculating on various business ideas. I now own multiple businesses, a rapidly growing "speculative" crypto currency portfolio, and a rapidly growing "speculative" stock portfolio. I currently have more money than I need, and I'm adding to that total on a daily basis.

    But by all means, if it makes you feel better about yourself, then please continue mocking me. I'm really ok with that. The difference between me, and most people, is that I will not only explain my successes, but I'm also always going to report and explain my losses, just as I have above. I'm not pushing Bitcoin, and I'm not advising against it. I'm merely illustrating my personal experience with this entire crypto currency market, and my beliefs on risk/reward. I apologize in advance for all of the financial success that I may endure while reporting on my experience.

    Bottom line: If I make millions of dollars in cryptos, you'll read about it right here. If I lose my $89,137 speculative investment (substantially more as I'll be adding to my positions), I will announce it loud and proud right here also. What you will always get from me is the truth, based in reality.

    Now, a serious question for you...

    Are you a) Afraid of risk? b) Afraid of losing money? c) Afraid of making money? d) Generally afraid of everything?

    e) All of the above so I'll just wait for my next paycheck and hope it gets me through the month. And if I'm really lucky, my boss made money and might give me a 3% raise next year, Not that there's anything wrong with that lifestyle choice. But it's a choice nonetheless.

    Anyway, I'll put you down for one of those who successfully saved $200.

    #904 2 years ago
    Quoted from mcluvin:

    How did you become a millionaire? Not trying to be a dick. I'm genuinely interested.

    Working normal jobs while speculating in businesses. When I was in high school, I speculated on the firecracker selling business. lol Made money, but got into a little trouble. But I was always interested in trying to make money for myself, not money for somebody else. So from shoveling snow in winter, to cutting lawns in summer, there was always an opportunity for ME to make money.

    I was an independent forensic automotive expert for a few years after working both as an ASE certified master automotive technician, and an automotive extended warranty adjuster. As a forensic automotive expert I was paid $65 per job. A job generally consisted of an hour of my time. Occasionally I could do 10 jobs in a day. However, I soon learned that this was not a path to wealth, it was a path to an early grave. So I took some of the money I was making, began researching Numismatics (rare coins), and then "speculating" on "unsearched" bags of coins I would buy off of eBay... and search through them looking for the more valuable dates/mint marks. I started with a goal of making at least $5 per coin auction, with at least 20 auctions per day to cover my living expenses. All profits were re-invested into more research to further educate myself, and better inventory. I started with wheat cents, moved into buffalo nickels, then walking liberty silver halves, all the while taking profits and buying more research material, and buying more coins. I eventually reached a point where I was regularly making thousands per coin sale. This is the business in which I made real money. It came at a price, in that I invested many years teaching myself the business, putting every penny (pun intended) I could muster up to invest, and eventually focusing on my specialty areas.

    In one of my posts earlier in this thread, I explained in great detail one of my riskier "speculations" into a coin that was valued at $275, but I paid $7,500 for it, and then sold it for a 33% profit. Knowledge is king.

    With the economic shit hitting the fan in 2008 or so, I decided to get into the arcade business as I had already created an opportunity to enter the business. Also because Numismatics required me to travel to coin shows around the country, and I really, really, don't like to travel.

    The family entertainment business started as a similiar story to numismatics... self taught, started at the bottom being a hard worker, reinvested profits, grow both the business, and its reputation, and work my way up the "street account" levels of D, C, B, A. Most of my few remaining accounts are A accounts now. I also own my own arcade and I'm in the process of expanding/moving.

    Again, I'm not like everybody else, I'll take on as much debt as my math dictates. I have no fear of being $1million in debt at 7% if the use of that debt is providing me with a 20% (random number) return. As I've said many times, I'm not afraid of losing money because the vast majority of decisions that I make result in profit, not loss. So I just keep making decisions (pot stocks & crypto currencies).

    This is one of the reasons I abandoned professional poker. Yes, I was gambling for a living at a point in there somewhere. Anyway, one can make the correct mathematical decision based on the current information (cards, player, etc.), but wind up losing the pot anyway. That doesn't sit well in my brain and creates a level of internal conflict that I'm unable to overcome. I just believe that if I make a correct mathematical/financial decision, I full fucking well expect to be paid. Luck should not be a primary factor. So no more poker, but I do like to play around at the Baccarat tables.

    In the end, spending one's profits on vacations and luxuries will defer, if not cease, any real success. Reinvesting both time and money is the path to growth. Both in business, and in finance. Sure, eventually one wants to treat one's self for all the hard work and sacrifice. When I decided to do so, the only thing that I desired was a Lamborghini. So I bought one this year.

    Remember, I'm not offering financial advice of any kind, I'm merely providing my experience and my opinions. And I will always tell the truth.

    #905 2 years ago
    Quoted from Medisinyl:

    Really? I was there Christmas Eve and saw 5 (played 2). If so, which one stayed? Was nice to see multiple premium games there and in good shape.

    I have two games on my truck right now that were supposed to replace 4 pins. Metallica is staying as it has the highest earnings of the five. I had oral surgery this morning so the move won't happen until tomorrow.

    The lineup at the NYNY Arcade will remain, and constantly improve, until they kick me out.

    Edit: Already planning on moving Kiss LE & GOT LE from Fremont to NYNY, replacing Kiss pro and another, yet to be determined, pin.

    -11
    #907 2 years ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    remember when some people said there aren't people pumping bitcoin here... well what do you call this? When you think bitcoin is all UP UP UP - why on earth would you want to pay in bitcoin today? This is all about trying to create buzz to keep the speculation pump full...

    You do understand that your opinion in this matter means less than nothing to me, right?

    I ask if I can pay because I am trying to gauge the current depth and exposure to the general public. This is called due diligence. Nothing more.

    You are too small minded to understand that this cannot be pumped, by one man asking a question, with no further information being exchanged.

    Finally, your constant accusations of pumping are beginning to create a legal liability for yourself. I'll have the moderators take note of this legal liability as well.

    I'd pleasantly entertain the idea of spending the next few years suing you for defamation, slander or whatever the VERY high price attorney I hire decides is best.

    So either cease and desist, or we can begin to play the "who's willing to spend more money on attorneys, flynnibus, or ExtremePinball".

    I trust you understand the true severity of this situation, and do not take my statements lightly.

    #912 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    Whoa, bad ass! Which one did you buy? I'm a Ferrari guy myself, not that I have the money to buy one, but I like to drool over them.

    I started my search with an $80k budget. I was hoping to get into a rebuilt title, pre-LP Gallardo that had minimal previous damage.

    After doing extensive research, I realized this was not a great idea. So I reversed my search in the other direction and bought the newest, most expensive, non-superleggera (too raw for me) Gallardo I could find. So I eventually settled on a 2014 LP560-4 Spyder with 6,000 miles, at more than $170k. In less than 10 months, I've added 10,000 miles to the odometer.

    Interestingly enough, up until the last few months, I had been in the market to either add a Ferrari 430 Spyder to the stable, or upgrade the Lambo to a Huracan LP610-4 Spyder. I scrapped both plans and dumped the money into cryptos.

    #913 2 years ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    Then what does getting an uninformed response cause you to smile?

    Puhahaha
    As for suing... buy a dictionary first.

    It causes me to smile because it clearly shows me that the Bitcoin market is not YET saturated. And as I've previously noted, I end the conversation right then and there. I simply dismiss any additional questions with the statement "I don't really know what Bitcoin is, I just saw it on a sign somewhere. Can I pay with my credit card?"

    It's been said that when the shoe shine boy is giving stock tips, it's time to get out of said stock. I'm attempting to use this method based on my metrics to gauge market saturation. Simply meaning that I'm not limiting my analysis to shoe shine boys.

    Allow me to include some additional facts about my positions in this market.

    First, I have investments into no less that 27 different crypto currencies. That number escalates on a weekly basis. It's the shotgun approach to speculating.

    Second, while I do hold Bitcoin, it's not even my largest crypto currency investment. That honor belongs to Litecoin. I further added to my position just this morning when it went on sale. My second largest investment is into Ethereum.

    Third, while I still believe there is a great deal of money to be made in the Bitcoin market, I also believe that even greater percentage gains can be realized with alternative cryptos, which have more advanced blockchain technology than Bitcoin.

    So the majority of my speculative dollars are NOT in Bitcoin, and are NOT going into Bitcoin, but rather into all of the other lesser known coins.

    These are some of the reasons that your constant accusations of pumping Bitcoin are completely unfounded, and seem to be a vendetta against me personally, for reasons I cannot fathom.

    Perhaps you could take a moment and explain the underlying basis for your hatred towards me.

    #918 2 years ago
    Quoted from extraballingtmc:

    What do you think coinbase is going to add next? Ripple obviously, anything else in near future?
    Whats your opinion on tron?

    I truly have no idea what coinbase may add in the future, Might be ripple, might be monero. So in an effort to immediately expand my speculative investments, I buy & trade on the Bittrex exchange as well. That's where most of the other cryptos can be purchased including tron & ripple. However, this exchange uses Bitcoin as the defacto reserve currency, so the vast majority of coins are traded against Bitcoin, not the U.S. dollar. This can seriously fuck with one's understanding of crypto currency movements, since the reserve currency can move faster than the coin being purchased or sold against it.

    When it comes to low dollar speculative coins, I don't do any research, I just shotgun it. I haven't bought tron yet, but I do own 1,231 ripple coins. I've created a lifestyle that affords me the unique ability to throw money at speculative coins, and never miss the money if it just vanishes. While I fully understand that the majority of people cannot do this, I don't want anybody to think I'm some sort of crypto guru with more knowledge.

    In my opinion, my money is more likely to grow exponentially in these speculative coins, than to decline to zero. As I've said before, I believe we are in the zygote stage of crypto currencies. And it's anybody's guess as to which coins come out on top in the coming years. Therefore, based on previously observed gains in Bitcoin, Ethereum, Litecoin, and others, I'll just buy as much as I can, with the expectation that most of those coins will gain a little in value, with one or more of those coins potentially creating millions of dollars in profit.

    Real world example: I own 10,000 Dogecoin. I have no idea what that is. What I do know is that I paid about a half a cent per coin for a total investment of $59.36. So for less than the cost of lunch, I'm willing to take the risk in the hope and expectation that this coin rises.... exponentially over the coming years.

    Wash, rinse, repeat.

    In my opinion there's far more potential upside, than downside, so I don't sweat the small stuff. I just keep speculating.

    I'm currently far enough ahead of the game that any loses that I incur, are short term loses of profit, not losses of original investment capital.

    #919 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    That's a beautiful car. The oil change probably costs half of what my car is worth.

    It's not that bad! An oil change runs about $600. There are 7 (seven) different drain plugs on the dry sump engine.

    However, being a supercar, one is required to regularly service more than just the oil. So my first maintenance service at 13,000 miles set me back $2,600. This included the oil change, cabin as well as engine filters, clutch snap test, new spark plugs, brake fluid flush & refill and overall inspection of the vehicle. They did provide me with an Audi loaner while my car was there. And of course my car was detailed when I picked it up.

    #927 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Lunch costs more than $60?
    I make a decent living but I'm not eating prime rib for lunch most days. PB&J at home is far more likely to happen than a $60 lunch.
    I don't think lunch would cost me $60 even if I was a billionaire. Of course if I was a billionaire I'd still be wearing blue jeans (in my Aston Martin )

    Lol.

    My business partner and I eat out for lunch 4 days per week. Yes, occasionally I'll opt for the filet mignon. Yesterday I had the salmon. The total bill usually comes out to $50-70 with a generous tip depending on the restaurant we choose. In the Fremont Street area, there is one decent restaurant open for lunch, Triple George Grill. It's a popular weekday dining location with judges, attorneys, and other downtown business owners M-F. Our arcade being a block away makes this a frequent dining location.

    Today wasn't one of those days. I just went to Jimmy John's and spent $11.

    Personally, I place no value in clothing. If one is impressed by my ability to purchase expensive fabrics, then one is obviously materialistic and/or easily manipulated by appearance alone. I've met far too many well dressed people in my life who neither had 2 nickels to rub together, nor the intelligence to sum up the total. But they sure looked nice.

    I wear carpenter jeans, a t-shirt, and sneakers everyday.

    #929 2 years ago
    Quoted from PinballNewb:

    11 bucks at JJ's?! Fatass! Please don't sue me

    I know, right? I get two loafs of the day old bread along with a #10 and a diet coke. Normally I spring for the cookie, but as you already noted my Fatass needs to drop a couple more pounds. So I skipped the cookie today.

    #960 2 years ago
    Quoted from TRAMD:

    I assume you mean "potential market cap". Regardless, this little non sequitur makes me question how much you understand math or more importantly, economics.
    Signed,
    -- a self-made multi-millionaire with a degree in math, millions invested in stable things returning 5%-20%, and zero invested in cryptocurrencies.

    Ah yes, another poster with no skin in the game felt the need to express himself not to contribute to this subject matter, but solely to criticize me personally, and/or my experience in this.

    Thank you!!!!! You're awesome!!! I truly appreciate your input as it has provided me with a great deal of clarity resulting in the following observation....

    Participating in this thread has been a complete waste of my time, and I simply have nothing to gain by contributing any further.

    So I'll just wish everybody a Happy and Prosperous New Year.

    1 week later
    #1202 2 years ago
    Quoted from vicjw66:

    I'm curious what makes you so qualified where you think actual professionals are idiots and you are so smart?

    I'll tell you why, because the first thing a so called financial professional is ever going to say to you is "past performance is not indicative of future results." They're saying future results can't be based on the past. You got it???

    Now mention crypto currencies and the same professional will tell you it's tulips, bubbles, pyramid scams & Ponzi schemes and you are guaran-fuckin-teed to lose all of your money.... you know, based on the past.

    Rather ironic.

    If you're happy in very low risk investments, that's great. Be happy. If you're happy with 10% annual stock returns and 1% annual savings accounts. That's great. I'm happy that you're happy. Stay happy. Don't come on this thread and be a douche with all of your negativity because other people are doing something you don't like. Just continue being happy. And maybe let others live their own lives, their own way. Thank you.
    .
    .
    .
    Now for an update:

    I'm still up $75k+ on my original $100k wager into the big 3 cryptos on GDAX, even after the massive fall this week.

    I took my profit and put it into some moderate risk wagers, but most of it went into even riskier scammier pyramid type Ponzi schemes and other ultra-high risk crypto currency gambling wagers. Totally insane shit that pays back at 1-3% per day.

    I still have $61k in coin, but my other crypto currency related investments are now making me $1,100 per day, every day, paid to me daily. If the crypto markets go down, I get paid. If the crypto markets go up, even more bank.

    .
    .
    .

    I'm sure that my CURRENT (might not last) success in this market is going to piss off a lot of people around here who are unable to say "HA, I told you so. You're a sucker and you lost all of your money." They'll just have to continue being angry over their own FOMO.

    It's entirely possible that I may lose SOME of my money, but probably not ALL of it. So the $38k that I have in these super high risk wagers will need to print about $500 per day, at today's coin prices, for 76 days before I'm risk free. Assuming I don't add to my positions. Which I will. And assuming that the markets continue dropping. Which they won't. That's a gamble I'll take all day, every day. Which I do, literally.

    Between cryptos & marijuana stocks, 2018 is going to be a crazy year in the financial markets.
    .
    .

    If anybody is interested in learning about my experience in the crypto currency wagers that I've made, e-mail me with your name, telephone number. gyrral66@yahoo.com

    I'm not going to provide any financial advice, suggestions, or inferences. I'll only tell you what I've done, where I've done it, how I've done it, and why I do it.

    You'll need to do your own homework and research the information yourself.

    BTC Donations:

    1HsawxarPcePWsaYJNLiF7RF2ErVuqp7ma

    Happy mining.

    #1208 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    Which pot stocks? I have SING, CANN, MJNA & SRNA.

    Honestly, I don't know. I don't research the pot stuff, my business partner does. I just blindly buy what he suggests.

    Right now I'm in the following:

    ACBFF
    CBIS
    GWPH
    HEMP
    INSY
    SING
    SRNA
    PRMCF
    POTN
    MYHI
    MCIG

    I don't really pay attention to these as they are a longer term investment for me.

    #1213 2 years ago
    Quoted from guyincognito:

    Dogecoin’s valuation is the result of market mania that has resulted in inexperienced investors buying up low-priced assets on a whim, hoping that they will follow Bitcoin’s meteoric trajectory.

    Works for me.

    Quoted from guyincognito:

    This irrational enthusiasm, coupled with large players manipulating largely unregulated markets, has resulted in a weekly cycle of rallies and crashes across just about every crypto asset.

    In other words, there's a ton of volatility. Works for me.

    Quoted from guyincognito:

    It’s great to see mainstream excitement about cryptocurrency, but the continued focus on price and potential to “get rich quick” distracts from the laudable goals that projects like Bitcoin set out with.

    Disagree. The people working behind the scenes are still working on those laudable goals, while other people focus on price and potentional. It's not an either/or scenario. Both are happening simultaneously.

    Funny story: Kodak, a NYSE listed company, jumped in value over 400% in two days because Kodak is coming out with a coin of their own for photographers. Yet nobody is complaining that a 400% jump is unrealistic. Nope, "investors" just take it in stride like it's any other day. Nothing unusual about it. No need to be alarmed. Nothing to see here. After all, it's the NYSE, not the wild west of cryptos. So it's ok.

    Oh, and ignore the fact that the company doesn't even turn a profit (EPS -.78). "After all, this is THE NYSE, it's worth what we say it's worth."

    Summary: NYSE Kodak moves up 400% in 48 hrs, not a blink from "investors". Bitcoin moves up 30%, it's a friggin tulip, Ponzi, MLM, pyramid, cash grab scam and we're all going to die if it isn't stopped immediately.

    I understand. So I think I'll keep playing in the less manipulated markets.... Crypto currencies.

    That's just my opinion, and nobody else's matters.

    #1224 2 years ago
    Quoted from Reality_Studio:

    No but they were pushed out of markets they used to own.

    Incorrect. They LOST the markets they used to own. If you're not always moving forward with a business, somebody is going to pass you by.

    They got passed.

    #1237 2 years ago
    Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

    Right here. I’m one of the morons.

    Ditto. I've been waiting on an EFT to GDAX since the 6th. Still hasn't hit.

    Bought $5k BTC on Coinbase last night. Made more than 4% with it since.

    #1238 2 years ago
    Quoted from ninjabones:

    In my opinion, the time to buy is when there's blood in the streets and everyone thinks you're nuts... the time to sell its when there's a 25-page investment thread on a pinball forum with folks essentially buying on margin).

    Agree on blood in the streets, disagree on time to sell. Determining a time to sell based on a single thread in a pinball forum is less than ignorant.

    Try this: Call your accountant and ask if they're up on current crypto tax laws and how many clients are requesting that service. Then ask how many clients requested it last year.

    I did just that about an hour ago as I was booking a consultation on the subject. Answers: Yes, about 15. 1.

    If your selling, I'm your buyer.

    #1241 2 years ago
    Quoted from ninjabones:

    In my post, I said that I sold half my bitcoin. If a 5,000% return in two and a half years is "less than ignorant", then I'm guilty as charged.
    I'm letting the other half ride (just in case I'm wrong about it eventually going to zero).

    I did not even suggest that selling half a coin is ignorant. I did however state that selling half a coin based solely on the posts in this thread IS indeed less than ignorant.

    I highly doubt you sold your BTC based only on the posts in this thread. That's the point.

    Further, this is simply not even close to the top of the crypto currency craze. Until Wall street gets their greedy fat paws fully enveloped into this market, there's still plenty of time to make a great deal of money.There are entire industries currently being created around blockchain technology and crypto currency mining. I myself am building a mining farm, among other investments.

    And as far as BTC goes, it isn't disappearing any time soon. Just like the U.S. dollar in the physical world is the reserve currency, BTC is the reserve currency of the crypto world. Yes, there are better coins in the crypto world, just like there is gold & silver in the physical world.

    Jan 1, 2018 I decided to turn investing into the crypto currency industry a full time business. I have more than $100k invested in the crypto world now and that investment grows multiple times daily.

    Like I said, This is only the beginning. Well, at least for me it is.

    #1269 2 years ago
    Quoted from guyincognito:

    10K by ???
    ExtremePinball how you holding in there buddy?

    Glad you asked.

    I had removed the majority of my investment into to the 4 coins on GDAX over to "extreme"ly high-risk alternative crypto related investments in cloud mining contracts and trade lending that pays upwards of 3% or more per day. The more one risks, the more one is rewarded. Extreme risk requires extreme reward. And I'm all about extreme.

    As of last night, I only held $6k worth of the top 4, instead of the $194k I had at my peak. I also still have about $25k spread out into 124 alt coins, but those obviously got hit hard today also. These coins are just long term keepers so it really doesn't matter. When they double up, I sell half my position and free roll the remainder for a few months/years.

    I ordered a $10k mining rig couple days ago. Should have that set up as soon as it arrives. No internet at the warehouse yet, so we'll run it in the back office at the arcade until warehouse is ready. We will start building our own rigs after this one and get a mining farm started.

    The combination of all of my high risk investments is currently yielding a return of about 1.97% daily, or roughly $2,331 per day. Hoping to reach $3,000 per day, at which point I will start removing my original capital.

    Of course with today's fire sale, it's a HUGE buying opportunity in the coins. Most of my capital is already tied up, but I was able to snag 25 LTC at $156 today. A sweet 65% off of its high of $420. Get it? High of 420. I crack myself up.

    I figured a bottom of $9965 in BTC, $161 in LTC, and $742 in ETH. BTC is getting frighteningly low. If it breaks through this strong support level, who knows how low it goes. LTC fell a bit more than I estimated, but I picked it up anyway.

    Governments all over the world are panicking at the thought of the peasants making big money before the politicians and stock market exchanges have had a chance to secure their monopoly. When a government entity outlaws something, it's generally to protect THEM and THEIR interests, not you.

    That's just my opinion, and nobody else's matters.

    #1273 2 years ago
    Quoted from Frax:

    And yet people still live on the streets in this country, while people get rich playing with pixels. Jesus. Christ.
    (Just a general comment, not against you at all. Keep on keepin' on.)
    Meanwhile, the idiots like me believed the hype and bought tiny amounts of currency as it was exploding, and now I'm watching this today going "Nope. Nope. Nope." gonna trick me again lol.. I know it's a logical fallacy but I don't give a damn until I at least get my original amount back, haha.

    You'll be fine. It was a forced pullback that's already recovering. The volatility in the crypto currency markets are insane.

    Coinbase/GDAX are down.

    #1274 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Here is what I read on Reddit to explain further:
    On December 10, BTC futures trading went live. The first set of those contracts is set to expire tomorrow, January 17.
    For those who don't know, futures contracts are agreements to buy/sell an asset (like BTC) at a specified future date and price. As the price of BTC was ~$15,000 on Dec. 10 , the first BTC futures contracts, which expire tomorrow, were fixed at about that same price. In a simplified form, this means that tomorrow:
    the "short" side of those contracts must give the "long" side a BTC (which, if they don't already have, could simply be bought at tomorrow's market price); and
    the "long" side of those contracts must pay the "short" side $15,000 in return.
    Now imagine you are a large hedge fund evaluating these contracts, and the crypto market as a whole, on Dec. 10. Obviously, making a large bet on either the "long" or "short" side is extremely risky, since the price of BTC when the contracts expire (January 17) could very easily be $50,000 or $500. This makes large bets on either side a bad option for a large institutional investor like yourself.
    However, you also know that crypto is still an emerging market with a large amount of new investors and "dumb money." And because you are a large hedge fund, futures contracts opens the door to a third option: use large bets on both sides to manufacture market chaos and make money on the ripple effects with little to no risk. Here is how:
    Bet big on the "short" side of the futures contracts on Dec. 10. Let's say you do this for 10,000 BTCs. This means that on January 17 you will owe 10,000 BTCs to the "long" side of those contracts, receiving $15k per ($150,000,000) in return.
    Buy an equally large amount of BTC on Dec. 10 at the market price ($15k/BTC). This cancels out your risk/reward for the futures contracts, making you essentially immune to changes in BTC's price while you hold both the contracts and BTCs. This also allows you to accumulate and hold an extremely large portion of the BTC market while taking little if any risk .
    Shortly before your futures contracts expire, dump all of your 10,000 BTC on the market at once. Like clockwork, this will trigger stop-losses and panic sells from the consumer BTC market, virtually guaranteeing that the BTC price will continue to dip well below whatever price you just sold those 10,000 BTC for.
    Ride that dip you just created to buy back the 10,000 BTC for much less than the price you just sold them for. This is particularly easy, since the funds you need are already liquid and ready to get back in the market.
    Use the re-purchased 10,000 BTC for the expiring futures contracts, which get swapped for your initial investment ($15k/BTC). The difference in the price that you sold the 10,000 BTCs to start the dip from the price that you bought the BTCs back during the dip becomes your net profit.
    For funds with access to enough capital to move the crypto market, this play should be easy money. It would also explain the series of huge dips (seemingly out of nowhere) that we are dealing with today.

    ... resulting in the demise of a so called "free" market. Wall street will do anything to separate one from one's money.... all with the blessings of the government.

    #1298 2 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    What a friggin rollercoaster! Talk about shaking out the loose hands. BTC is currently back above 11k , ETH above 1k and LTC is nearing $200.
    Downsides:
    I barely blinked during this whole thing...which is a little disconcerting.
    If it keeps crashing and recovering (in hours/days no less) how will we ever know if it's really crashing for good?
    Is it bad that I have skin in the game but I still find the insane volatility entertaining?
    I guess I'm treating it like poker chips. It wasn't money anymore after I "bought in". I shoved my chips in on BTC, ETH & LTC and I'm just waiting for the hand to play out. Either win a big pot or lose my chips. Only time will tell.

    I was able to squeeze in a few buys while everything was on sale. 25 LTC @ $156, 0.1 BTC @ $10,122, 3 Etherereum @871.45 and 300 XRP @ $1.05.

    I'm still spreading my poker chips around into the alt coins too. Opened an account on hitbtc exchange yesterday. Fairly large exchange with more alt coins than bittrex.

    Quoted from iceman44:

    Big flush rush to the exits is coming

    Agreed!!! The stock market is so severely overbought that when it corrects, lookout below.

    Of course I could be wrong, and a 9 year bull run of 400% gains is the "new normal". But I'm thinking there's nothing different about wall street's greed today, as compared to 1 year ago, 5 years ago, 10 years ago.

    So they'll soon be pulling the rug out from underneath all the good people who were artificially forced into the market when faced with .1% savings rates and 3% inflation, all while being told there is no inflation.

    Couple that with 4 trillion dollars in free money handed off to the banks and.... ah, what bad could possibly come of that?

    Nope, just ignore those "micro-aggression" facts. Nothing to see here. Profits schmofits. Who need think of such trivial things? ALL stocks go up in a bull market. The stock market is at all time highs and can ONLY go higher. Get your money in now, folks.

    That's just my opinion and nobody else's matters.

    #1314 2 years ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    Haha yep. Stock market will correct. Just a matter of time.
    I know you understand the differences between it and the Crypto crap table Extreme!
    Every dummy with a quarter in his pocket thinks he’s a crypto expert and will make a fortune
    My daughter’s friends say they are “heavily invested” in crypto. So no worries

    Ok, so if you know the stock market is going to correct, correct big and correct soon, and you know Bitcoin has already corrected more than 50% from its high and bounced off of major support, where would you put your money? Where would a non-professional, non-conformist put his/her money? Sure I'll keep my pot & crypto stocks. But my money is going into BTC, LTC, ETC and at last count, at least 131 other coins. I'm also investing heavily in crypto mining.

    The crypto currency markets are a giant blow to the status quo of the financial markets. This shit is pissing off a lot of politicians and hedge fund billionaires. So they'll send they're government wolves to start shutting crypto related investments down like they did to Bitconnect. You know, to protect the innocent investors. End result, a paper loss of 95%. Boy do I feel protected. Yessir, they done protected me good. I was earning well on my investment until they decided I needed to be protected. NO, in reality they are protecting the status quo. The peasants can't be allowed to make easy money. .

    I trust we'll revert back to this thread when the DOW is 15k.

    BTC to the moon, baby.

    #1319 2 years ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    But tax reform, deregulation, Corp earnings, GDP growth, the US dollar lower, consumer and business sentiment extremely high VERSUS higher oil prices, a rising 10 yr treasury, geo political events and Fed uncertainly
    Right now, the forces of good are Trumping (get it?) the forces of evil
    The regulatory crunch is underway

    Oh absolutely agree. Business is going to thrive in this country for the next few years.

    The regulatory crunch on cryptos is coming due to the threat to the status quo. Governments all over the world are going to ban it. In fact I hear the U.S. gov is creating a crypto czar to oversee the new "war on crypto currencies".
    I trust that it will be as much of a success as the war on poverty, the war on hunger, the war on drugs, and the war on terror.

    Quoted from iceman44:

    As someone else pointed out, wait until you see the manipulation around options expiration! It’s always designed to deliver max pain
    It’s fun to watch! I hope you guys are careful. The shorts will use the option market to crush people on the way back down
    When? Who knows, but crypto mania will run its course.

    I think we just saw the first round. I bought multiple coins while they were on sale. But now that big money bought in low, they need to drive the price up to sell out. Wash, rinse, repeat. I'm in on that ride. As BTC rises, I'll move it into other investments while it's strong.

    I play with stock options too. High risk.

    Let's be real, nobody is actually careful when putting money in stupidly high risk investments. I took a $54k hit yesterday on paper. I'm now DCA my way out of the coin while things are down. I've never lost that much money, that quickly in my life. And yet all I think is "well, that's gonna put a dent into the profit". It wasn't my money. That particular investment was paying just over 1% per day, every day. High risk.

    I have another one that claims to pay 3% per day for life. Every day they put 3% into my account. That money is withdrawn every day. I know to take those daily payments out at least until day 34. Every day that I receive interest after that is essentially free money. It's completely insane, absolutely unsustainable, and I just hope my wager lasts at least another 26 days. If it goes another 122 days I'll cover the recent loss too.

    Quoted from iceman44:

    Who knows, but crypto mania will run its course.

    That's funny. Run it's course. It hasn't even started. This is the first year the IRS even has rules. You have no idea how big this can get, nobody does. You know, just like you can't time the market, nobody can.

    #1339 2 years ago
    Quoted from guyincognito:

    I might feel bad about it but you've done nothing but wag your dick on here about how successful of an "investor" you are.

    Wag my dick? What are you a fucking idiot? Try reading all of the threads, and not just the one's with pictures. I NEVER once claimed to be a successful investor.

    Perhaps a course in reading comprehension might settle you down a bit.

    #1350 2 years ago
    Quoted from nwpinball:

    I'm a crypto newb, please bear with me. I bought $200 of Ethereum via Coinbase recently just to play around with it and learn the ropes before putting more cash in. So far I haven't touched it yet. Can you day trade it in Coinbase selling on the highs and buying the dips? It seems to widely go up and down during the day. I'd imagine there are limits on those types of transactions.
    Then for other coins, is the most simple thing to transfer some Ethereum to Binance and trade there? Is having your money sitting there safe? Or are you pulling it out of there and saving the smaller coins somewhere else?

    NO!!! You do not want to trade on Coinbase.

    What you want to do is open an account on Coinbase's exchange, GDAX. On GDAX you can trade the market directly with market & limit trades. No fees on market makers. Ultimately, yes you can day trade the cryptos, just not on Coinbase due to their fees. Binance, GDAX, Bittrex, HitBTC, Kraken, there are a number of exchanges available. Not all exchanges trade the same coins.

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