(Topic ID: 278199)

Pop Art Pinball with Homemade Mechs

By TheSupremePapaya

1 year ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 97 posts
  • 11 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 26 days ago by stefanmader
  • Topic is favorited by 13 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic Gallery

    View topic image gallery

    CobraPin_relayJumperSmall (resized).jpeg
    FDBI5NMJRGOMX7V (resized).jpg
    PXL_20211026_031324076 (resized).jpg
    PXL_20211025_024650499 (resized).jpg
    PXL_20211025_023142897 (resized).jpg
    PXL_20211025_023745341 (resized).jpg
    PXL_20211009_195456467 (resized).jpg
    PXL_20210924_170013209 (resized).jpg
    Motor1 (resized).jpg
    Solenoid2 (resized).jpg
    Solenoid1 (resized).jpg
    BoxJoints (resized).jpg
    FinishedFrames (resized).jpg
    Unbenannt (resized).png
    PachinkoBack (resized).jpg
    PachinkoFront (resized).jpg

    There are 97 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 2.
    #51 5 months ago

    So the CobraPin has the direct switches and the matrix. Out of curiosity, how hard is it to setup a matrix myself?

    If could do an 8x8 matrix as well, I'd only need one blue pill board. Obviously not breaking bank buying another board, just think it'd be cool to get by on one.

    My requirements are;

    1-2 blue pills for,

    At most 50 serial LEDs

    28 playfield switches (including the pop bumperish device, which goes to the solenoid board, right?

    6 cabinet switches (the flippers, the drain, the shooter lane, the tilt bob, and the start button)
    Probably forgetting something there

    One solenoid board

    And a separate motor driver board (I only really need directional control on one of the motors, but dual drivers for little robots seem pretty affordable.)

    I have also been wondering if there is something in the car stereo/accessory area that would fulfill my 12v power filter needs. Going to do some digging.

    #53 5 months ago
    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    So the CobraPin has the direct switches and the matrix. Out of curiosity, how hard is it to setup a matrix myself?

    If could do an 8x8 matrix as well, I'd only need one blue pill board. Obviously not breaking bank buying another board, just think it'd be cool to get by on one.

    Not hard. However, debugging a matrix aint fun. I would run direct switches if possible. It is just easier to work with.

    #54 5 months ago
    Quoted from jabdoa:

    Not hard. However, debugging a matrix aint fun. I would run direct switches if possible. It is just easier to work with.

    Fair enough. Direct switches it is

    #55 5 months ago

    So just a few more questions.

    On the CobraPin, I could drive a motor with one of the coil outputs or on a dual relay board attached to the relay control output for directional control, correct?

    When determining needed current for the power supply, is it the sum of draw from all the solenoids, LEDs, etc.? Just the highest one?

    Added 152 days ago:

    Edit: Nevermind the second one. I think I figured it out.

    #56 5 months ago
    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    On the CobraPin, I could drive a motor with one of the coil outputs or on a dual relay board attached to the relay control output for directional control, correct?

    Yeah one way it to use a driver on the cobrapin for a one directional motor or a separate board and two outputs for two directional. There are also motor controller which you can connect to USB with MPF support. Depends a bit on the type of motor.

    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    When determining needed current for the power supply, is it the sum of draw from all the solenoids, LEDs, etc.? Just the highest one?

    For LEDs: Calculate your worst case (i.e. all LEDs at full brightness). For coils it is kind of the power of one or two solenoids. Typically 400-600W at 48V. It is important that your HV PSU is over current safe or it will shutdown in a pinball.

    #57 5 months ago

    Thank you all so much! I really appreciates the help.

    So here's the plan:

    CobraPin controller.

    Something like this for a dual relay board to control a 12v dc motor in two directions.
    amazon.com link »

    Meanwell RD-125a power supply.
    https://www.meanwell-web.com/en-gb/ac-dc-dual-output-enclosed-power-supply-output-rd--125a

    12v going to coil power input, 5v to that input. I think there should be enough 5v left to power a single board computer to be the host when the game is finalized (maybe some small speakers too?)

    Any red flags on that idea?

    1 week later
    #58 4 months ago

    Turns out, when you have free time, you can actually do things. Who knew?

    Grandparent came to visit and watch my kids, so I finally had a chance to chop up a sheet of plywood that's been sitting there for ages. I made frames for my backbox and my son's pachinko. I think the box joints came out well, considering I don't have a table saw or router.

    Game Room in ProgressBox joint Close Up

    P.S. As no one replied "NOOO!! DON'T!!! OH THE HUMANITY!..." on my last post, I think I'm going to start ordering some of those parts.

    #59 4 months ago

    Looks great! 12volt for coils sounds very weak, but i have no experience with that. I used 48 volt, and i know that there are 25 volt pinball. So i am very interested how that turns out!

    #60 4 months ago

    here is a good video explaining the board more - you might need a stronger power supply based on that video

    #61 4 months ago

    Admittedly, 12v is weak. You can see it in the video. The pop and spinning flipper could use some extra oomph.

    I didn't expect any of this to actually work early on, so I just grabbed an old 12v wall supply from the e waste bin. Things kept working though and I ended up with this playfield and mechs built around 12v.

    So given the choice between an underpowered game or changing the flow/possibly breaking some of my mechs, I'm leaning towards underpowered.

    I couldn't tell if 24v is the minimum for the cobrapin, or if it's just listed as that because 24v is the common minimum and anything under is kinda stupid. But I never claimed to be smart

    Definitely have to watch that video from Jab.

    #62 4 months ago

    You could use 24V but then dial down the power to your mechs with software control. My game is 24V and very snappy.

    #63 4 months ago
    Quoted from TreyBo69:

    You could use 24V but then dial down the power to your mechs with software control. My game is 24V and very snappy.

    That is a very good point.

    #64 4 months ago

    So the solenoids are labelled as 12v, but there are seemingly identical solenoids on ebay/ali express labeled or listed as 24v. The spinning flipper motor has no labels! Who knows what that can handle? It was listed as 12v when I bought it, but I don't have any spec sheets. The shaker motor is listed as 24v compatible, so there's that I guess.

    Motor1 (resized).jpgSolenoid1 (resized).jpgSolenoid2 (resized).jpg

    #65 4 months ago

    Oh i see now you don't have regular pinball coils, now i understand why you have that kind of volts. Ben heck made a mini pinball once and the coils worked great, but of course with a smaller ball. Your ball is regular size right?

    #66 4 months ago

    The balls are standard size. Had to do at least one thing the normal way.

    #67 4 months ago

    Got confirmation from cobra18t. 12v is an option, just an uncommon choice. Probably good info for anyone building a mini pinball.

    1 week later
    #68 4 months ago

    Look what came in the mail today! May the pinball gods be merciful and I don't break it.

    PXL_20210924_170013209 (resized).jpg
    2 weeks later
    #69 3 months ago

    Well, I was cutting and crimping all day. Connected some switches, feeling smart and... I lost my nerve when I was going to connect power.

    So the cobrapin board has 2 vin and 2 gnd for both the high voltage and 5v. The super helpful cobrapin wiring diagram (not sarcasm, love that thing!) shows two red / two black going into presumably separate channels on the PSU.

    My psu has only one channel for each voltage and com.
    PSU

    Should I run two wires into the PSU channel or can I use 1 vin and 1 gnd on the board inputs?

    #70 3 months ago
    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    Well, I was cutting and crimping all day. Connected some switches, feeling smart and... I lost my nerve when I was going to connect power.
    So the cobrapin board has 2 vin and 2 gnd for both the high voltage and 5v. The super helpful cobrapin wiring diagram (not sarcasm, love that thing!) shows two red / two black going into presumably separate channels on the PSU.
    My psu has only one channel for each voltage and com.
    [quoted image]
    Should I run two wires into the PSU channel or can I use 1 vin and 1 gnd on the board inputs?

    I'm not sure why there are two grounds for the 5v power. I haven't used cobrapin before, but on my fast pinball board you just have one ground for each voltage. One of the reasons for having two inputs for voltage is because the .156" connectors are rated for no more than 7 amps. By having two inputs you cut whatever amount of amps you are drawing in half. (i.e. if you were drawing 8 amps at 5v, you could split the output from your psu into to inputs to your board, so you only have 4 amps one each connector). You can just connect two wires to each output from your psu, which is easy, plus you don't risk making your connectors all crispy.
    I don't know how many amps you are going to be using, but I would say that if you are drawing more than 6 amps for any voltage, I would run two inputs into your board.
    Don't quote me on this because like I've said, I've never used cobrapin before. However I think this should be true for most controlling systems (p3, cobrapin, fast etc.). Hopefully this made sense, and good luck!

    #71 3 months ago

    i was unclear about that too. so i asked cobra18t about this:

    my question:
    on the wiring diagram on pinball makers, it shows that the high voltage powersupply (and the 5Volt powersupply) is connected with 2 wires which carry the current and 2 ground.
    why is that, is it necessary, or just a possibility? what is the recomended way to do that?

    cobras answer:
    The duplicated pins are for higher current capability and lower resistance. Each pin is rated for 7A, but I support fuses up to 10A. If you plan on installing fuses above 7A, I would use the duplicate pins.

    #72 3 months ago

    Thanks! Confidence restored.

    1 week later
    #73 3 months ago

    You could use dual-ferrules as well to connect two wires to one terminal on your PSU. Theoretically two dual ferrules would enable four wires .

    Jan

    1 week later
    #74 3 months ago

    Argh! Thar She Glows!!!

    default blue glowGI and Bomb lights

    LEDs are in! I'll actually have to think about an attract show now.

    Even more progress (two things in one week, crazy right?) The monitor is mounted in the backbox. You can even see a little bit of my art, the part I don't entirely suck at.

    backbox monitor

    #75 3 months ago

    Obligatory tangled mess of wires photo.

    playfield underside

    Everything but the motors are wired up. I have a few questions on that, but I'm going to test what I have first.

    2 weeks later
    #76 80 days ago

    Sorry for the junk video.

    It actually kinda works! I know this is pretty small potatoes compared to amazing work the rest of you are making, but as my first DIY electronics project, it's a pretty big deal for me.

    Obviously, without the mini flipper motor running it's missing a big piece of the gameplay, but it lights up/keeps score/flips balls. Minimum definition of Pinball achieved!

    #77 80 days ago

    This is awesome! Love your project! And it is so cool, that you make all the mechs yourself. That is impressive. Flips very nice! Keep the videos coming

    #78 80 days ago

    Nice job!

    #79 79 days ago

    Alright, motor talk.

    1. Easy question, Shaker motor. Do I need to add a flyback diode to it like I did the coils?

    2. More challenging questions, miniflip motor. I'm using a relay module and was going to wire it up like this.

    relay module wiring diagram

    Any reason I shouldn't do it that way?

    I'm assuming that I should be running power directly from the supply, not the HV on the Cobrapin board, right?

    On the software side, how do I control the relay module in MPF?

    #80 79 days ago

    well done, awesome work

    #81 79 days ago
    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    Any reason I shouldn't do it that way?

    I'm assuming that I should be running power directly from the supply, not the HV on the Cobrapin board, right?

    On the software side, how do I control the relay module in MPF?

    In MPF you can use a "motor" device. Will drive exactly this (i think its calls a H-bridge). You can drive this directly from Cobra. Either using a normal driver/FET or using the special relay output.

    #82 79 days ago
    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    Easy question, Shaker motor. Do I need to add a flyback diode to it like I did the coils?

    Not necessarily but it wont hurt either.

    #83 79 days ago
    Quoted from jabdoa:

    In MPF you can use a "motor" device. Will drive exactly this (i think its calls a H-bridge). You can drive this directly from Cobra. Either using a normal driver/FET or using the special relay output.

    I'm reading that the motor device requires position switches and a reset position. I don't have those. It just needs to spin when triggered (randomly clockwise or counterclockwise, but that's a later issue.)

    How would one configure a spinning disc like on Whirlwind, Fireball, Tron etc.? Seems like that would be similar to my needs.

    #84 78 days ago
    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    I'm reading that the motor device requires position switches and a reset position. I don't have those. It just needs to spin when triggered (randomly clockwise or counterclockwise, but that's a later issue.)

    How would one configure a spinning disc like on Whirlwind, Fireball, Tron etc.? Seems like that would be similar to my needs

    In that case you can just use "coil_player" to enable/disable coils.

    #85 78 days ago
    Quoted from jabdoa:

    In that case you can just use "coil_player" to enable/disable coils.

    Sorry if I'm not understanding the obvious. So I could use the relay numbers (rly0 and rly1) in the coil player?

    #86 76 days ago
    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    Sorry if I'm not understanding the obvious. So I could use the relay numbers (rly0 and rly1) in the coil player?

    Those map to coils. Would have to look their numbers up. You can enable and disable coils via coil_player. Also works for those two.

    #87 75 days ago
    Quoted from jabdoa:

    Those map to coils. Would have to look their numbers up. You can enable and disable coils via coil_player. Also works for those two.

    Yeah, according to the pinballmakers text:

    "Connecting the middle and upper pads gives control of the relay programmatically to MPF by using the 1-0-1 coil output."

    For some reason, I thought the relay outputs (rly0 and rly1) could only be configured as digital outputs, using them as coils in coil player would be alot easier for me.

    2 weeks later
    #88 59 days ago

    Good news is that my little shaker motor works pretty well and the family visiting for the holiday had fun with it, despite it's unfinished state.

    Bad news is that I have more questions. Sorry folks, especially jabdoa, seems like all I do is bother you.

    1. If a ball goes missing from a device and mpf adds it back to the playfield ball count, is that ball a "ball_in_play"?

    I'm trying to create a "just go straight to multiball" failsafe for the rare problem that one of the locked balls gets dislodged. Testing virtually, I'm getting some issues in multiball; extra balls added from the trough or end of ball drains when there is still one on the playfield. Logs seem to indicate a mismatch of playfield balls and balls in play.

    2. Can I change the configured eject coil on a ball device in game?

    Example, if I had Coil X as the default eject coil for the device, but an event triggers it to change to Coil Y.

    A ball device can't have multiple eject coils and has to be configured as either eject,hold, or mechanical eject, right?

    #89 59 days ago

    1. I am not sure but i think when a ball drops out from a physical lock unexpectedly, it is missing and not a ball in play. I think you would have to start a defined multiball first. That could work: start a defined multiball when the lock switch gets inactive.
    i had a lot of trouble with a physical lock before.
    when nudging the locked ball would sometimes leave the switch for just to long, and mpf said it was an unexpected ball and then i had the same problems you described.

    2.Maybe you could set to mechanical eject and use coil_player and decide in code which coil should eject.

    #90 59 days ago
    Quoted from stefanmader:

    1. I am not sure but i think when a ball drops out from a physical lock unexpectedly, it is missing and not a ball in play. I think you would have to start a defined multiball first. That could work: start a multiball when the lock switch is inactive.
    i had a lot of trouble with a physical lock before.
    when nudging the locked ball would sometimes leave the switch for just to long, and mpf said it was an unexpected ball and then i had the same problems you described.
    2.Maybe you could set to mechanical eject and use coil_player and decide in code which coil should eject.

    #91 59 days ago
    Quoted from stefanmader:

    2.Maybe you could set to mechanical eject and use coil_player and decide in code which coil should eject.

    I thought that might work too, but mpf tells me that mechanically ejected devices cannot have more than one switch (mine has 5). I suppose I could split it up into multiple ball devices.

    #92 58 days ago
    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    I thought that might work too, but mpf tells me that mechanically ejected devices cannot have more than one switch (mine has 5). I suppose I could split it up into multiple ball devices.

    yes that makes sense

    1 month later
    #93 27 days ago

    Happy new year everyone! Not alot of progress to report. I did get a chance to try out the relay output, but didn't have any luck.

    I soldered together both of the the upper and middle pads on the Cobrapin board like the pinballmakers picture says to do for control through the 1-0-1 output.

    cobrapin soldering points

    In the config, I mapped the coil to the name rly0. Mpf threw an assertion error on start up. Tried 1-0-1, program locked up when the coil was activated. Is there a name that I'm supposed to be using?

    #94 27 days ago

    I saw this on the MPF Users Google group,

    "The built in connections only allow control from the 1-0-1 coil output or control from the processor board USB receiving power. If you want two separate programmatically controlled relays, you have to wire another pin from the coil outputs."

    It seems like 1-0-1 can control only one of the relays?

    So I tried to desolder one of the pairs and... I wrecked it. Ruined the pads on one of them.

    I'm just going to settle for one direction of rotation, directly from the coil outputs.

    (Sad Trombone)

    #95 26 days ago
    Quoted from TheSupremePapaya:

    I saw this on the MPF Users Google group,
    "The built in connections only allow control from the 1-0-1 coil output or control from the processor board USB receiving power. If you want two separate programmatically controlled relays, you have to wire another pin from the coil outputs."
    It seems like 1-0-1 can control only one of the relays?
    So I tried to desolder one of the pairs and... I wrecked it. Ruined the pads on one of them.
    I'm just going to settle for one direction of rotation, directly from the coil outputs.
    (Sad Trombone)

    sounds bad..
    are you driving a motor with the relay output?

    #96 26 days ago

    It's not so bad. Everything else seems to work fine. I just can't use one of relay outputs anymore.

    CW rotation disperses the balls nicely in a wide area, whereas CCW mostly hurls them down to the left flipper. So doing just CW is fine, the random directions would have been just a little extra surprise.

    I'm kinda glad to be moving on to different problems.

    #97 26 days ago

    Ah okay, haha yes different problems are always better!

    There are 97 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 2.

    Hey there! Got a moment?

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside