Sad

Nope, not with the numbers I got for them. Smiling

First impressions of Smaug made me think he was small, then I realised it was the scale of the coins used in the model. That really needs fixing, he looks like a baby Smaug.

It's idiotic for a company to do a reveal of a product with brochures and expect someone to dissect the fine print to determine it's not finished. It should be the first words out of Jacks mouth at the reveal. What's JJP trying to do charge another $2000 to get the finished game?

I have not finished reading this thread but I am pissed.

This is an $8000 product but it doesn't look like it (WOZ, TBL does). I don't care what the rights holders won't let you do your responsible for the finished product not them. I can speculate all day why it doesn't look finished (was many diverted to WOZ? Was WOZ too expensive a BOM).

JJP has a lot of damage control to do and a game to complete (you can forget the preorder model of financing if this is the outcome and spin).

I've been in on TH for about a year now, but I am very dissapointed in what I have seen. Over promising and under delivering is a good way to destroy good will and sales of your product. Smaug is a joke. Other than a talking head and 4 pop ups there are no toys. I'm probably going to ask JJP for a refund.

So, what is the missing feature? I'm not gonna play "find the stupidity", so can someone just say?

For the last week you have been say just wait there will be a lot of happy people.Now there are not a lot of happy people the big surprise seems to have been cabinet art woo hoo.Now once again you are saying just wait seems to me {just wait] is getting old.

I Played it at expo. Seems to be at the very beginning stages. It felt very clunky while playing. The sound track and sound effects where fantastic though. It helps that they hooked the machine up to huge speakers though.

Who knows? Just seems like one more last ditch effort to keep customers on the hook. If you have information Alex spill it cause this is just getting infuriating.

If JPop had not brought empty cabinets to expo, jjp would have been my biggest expo disappointment. They swung and missed. Period. It doesn't mean they are a bad company but this is a huge step back from the loaded Woz. Huge let down. I don't see how it can be viewed any other way.

Yep, share that opinion over and over again, goes from making some valid points to complete nonsense. The "opinion" on Smaug matches a lot of peoples, its not just this thread, its the "body of posting". That's why he gets "flamed", and if you are going to keep it up, be prepared to receive it.

It's all about him somehow feeling wronged by JJP and something personal with Alex. For someone to invest so much cheetoh bag posting time into a pin they zero desire for is just agenda driven.

I thankful I have an opinion and am not afraid to share it!

I don't get what Jpop was thinking either. What we've seen and then show nothing, in fact making it a negative. I don't think TH even comes close as a let down for me, and I'm getting both, or most likely TH, def RAZA

Yeah right, grab another bag of cheetoh's and keep posting the same stuff over and over, something you have zero interest in or intent to buy. Late night and early morning, gotta love the dedication!

I'm gonna go grab my own bag.

OK now you are just being plain silly. Put the mouse and keyboard down and stop obsessing. Maybe your lawn needs mowing or there is a nice hike you could take to clear your mind and look at fall colors?

x10 over ST, agree with you on that one, so its just the price for what you think you get that sucks.

Yeah, I agree with that one too, you'll be able to pick one up much cheaper down the road, just like every other pin. Just like a ST in freefall.

I got to play hobbit this morning with no line. Smaug is underwhelming on all levels. Game as a whole is a huge step back from Woz. For those buying hobbit thinking they are getting a similar level to Woz will be greatly disappointed. I can't tell if the empty cab on display is decals or direct print. If it is decals, then holy shit, they are gorgeous. The way all cab decals should be.

Thanks for the input, LCD looks awesome too. Yes I'd be disappointed if TH is a huge step back from Woz.

How does it compare to the pins we were buying in 2008? Because if they all suck, that may be where we are going back to.

Wow this I did not expect to hear so close to release. Sort of sad really as so many had such high hopes.

My knee-jerk observations are the Smaug is very disappointing. I keep wondering if the 'book' is interactive, which it looks like it is not, and why the PF seems to have so few 'toys' when under the PF is PACKED with things. What do all these things under the PF belong too? Maybe we are all in for a surprise since the game is not finished. It just seems to be a much lower step down from WOZ. I was reluctant to buy this one after buying my WOZECLE, and now I'm glad. I would have been upset with my own decision.

Does anything pass through Smaugs mouth? Does he fire pinballs? Looks like that how he has been designed or am I totally wrong.

All that stuff under the playfield is the drop targets and pop up targets.

Smaug doesnt interact with the ball

Were the diverters active? Lock down bar button on?

That makes me very sad...

I believe the windlance is the kickback. It would be launched from the lockdown bar button. The longer you push the button the more power gets sent to the coil hence directing your shot. My guess anyways... (Remember there used to be a variable angle kickout at the kickback exit at one point).

That was a big part of the initial reveal letdown by many then the lack of other interactive toys made it pure disappointment for a lot of us.

it's a talking head on a boulder spinning around.

definitely needs wall behind and nice plastics to hide the metals and ugly coils.

I have no skin in this game. These are just my observations.

Pros - rule set
- sound/music
- drop targets
- lcd screen
- bonus stuff, invisiglass, shaker, headphone jack

Passes - playfield/ cabinet art.
- the look of smaug/general sculpts

Fails - the interactivity of smaug.
- THE BOOK ,man it looks bad
- general area around smaug
- covered VUKs

Apart from the smaug let down ,i bet jack simply wished he said smaug was going to be animated not interactive, the other fails wont affect gameplay.

I don't think the hobbit is a disaster, just not living up to the hype.

If smaug is going to talk a lot, which surely is his only purpose now, does this not suggest custom speech of some sort? Dialogue from the movie will get old quite quickly.

2008 you could buy NIB under $4000

Great quality, pinball was really humming back then….

Raise your hand if you want a 4k Nib today! Then come back to earth

You are the one who wants to compare a $9000 to a $4000 game apples and oranges

We've bickered a lot in the past so don't misinterpret this as us picking back up where we left off.

But dude, no riddles, speculation or Easter eggs should be part of an unveiling. In the beginning of the project yeah that's cool but not at this stage.

JJP should release legit no BS info at this stage.

When Stern brings a table to expo it is what it is for the most part & no more or less. Gary also doesn't jump in the forums & tell folks to play the game first, make payments or take down hypothetical cabinet art by excited folks either (while I'm on the Stern vs JJP off topic).

People are right, the 21 almost 22 year old Jurassic T-rex absolutely destroys Smaug from a technical engineering level & the book is a fine element to add to the table but not to showcase as a feature on an $8000 game one must pay for years in advance.

When looking at TH now one could easily think WOZ ran out of money & took features off Hobbit in order to reach completion. Perhaps the state of TH is due to WOZ taking time away from hobbit development? Maybe one could think its a bit of both?

Either way the color palette looks great, the theme is cool & Keith is doing the rules so hopefully some changes are made to really put this game above TBL

Because right now TBL is (to me) more valuable in my basement than additional principal paid towards my mortgage lol. True story... Smaug makes me want to pay the house down.

I think the foundation on Hobbit looks great. If JJP addresses the gripes they will have a slam dunk!

Saying what most have been thinking, thanks pbw79.

Jack is more interested in being the first to do something then being the best.In this game it seems all Jacks energy went to his new JJP patented drop targets and Smaug was a after thought.

You just love to be the guy who knows stuff that no one else knows. and you love to get attention by flaunting your inside knowledge. that's probably why you work/worked for jack for free.

Just tell us what we all missed in the brochure and move on. i know you're obsessed with all these posts so you know i'm not in the minority criticizing your message board antics.

Its funny you say that cause I think the drops are cool but nothing truly innovative, independent drops whoopity dooo!

Patent pending drops! Get it right

There is nothing new about drops that can individually go up and down under software control. Fast Draw had it in 1975 and Star Trek in 2013 along with dozens of other games. Having eleven of them in one game is new though.

Is one of the things missing Smaug's teeth?

Yeah.. The quick draw targets in cactus canyon seem exactly the same thing.. Just less of them but more interesting as they werent in banks. I guess thats the big thing.. Individually resettable banks. I think theres a good risk they have over estimated how fun it will be

I think following the ball by Smaug can be worth more than the same by the Homer head, for Smaug wants to 'track' you. Besides he talks as well, which I think can be cool with nice audio. Announcing Smaug interacts with the ball wasn't that wise, I think, for maybe responding on where the ball is, is interacting, but it's not what people envissioned when they heard it.

I'm not writing this game off already, but I think indeed the presentation and the lack of posting beforehand by DP was smarter/better, and the game TBL itself (design, what we know about sounds, toys, etc..) looks far more 'polished' so far.
At the moment I'd sooner buy TBL than TH, or maybe a Heighway with a second playfield if that wouldn't be too expensive to add (nice to have 2 games with the space of only one! If that wouldn't be possible I'd surely buy a TBL sooner than a Heighway game), but to be honoust, we haven't seen anything of Alien yet, and I'd like to see Full Throttle being produced before really believing they'll start producing their second game in April already.

Multimorphic could be cool too: I'd have to play one before chosing! Well... that goes for all games actually.... I haven't even mentioned other new games I haven't played yet.... AMH, TWD... and upcoming games by other manufacturers like Timeshock, Predator, JPop, Pinball Circus, MMr, etc...

So...... doesn't this all feel great? Well, maybe TH was a bit of a letdown (because of too high expectations?), but fact is that there's happening more in pinball than has been for a loooooong time!

I played the game at Expo. Disappointed in many aspects but this thread is about Smaug.

Smaug is massive letdown on many levels.

-From the players perspective, it looks like a Muppet Red Snapper.

-When he's hiding, all you see is a big "rock slab". An unappealing eyesore. I was thinking about Champion Pub - when the boxer has turned around, at least the other side is the punching bag/training area. There could have been something more clever on the other side of Smaug...in the movie, Smaug is sleeping & Bilbo wakes him up...I think a sleeping Smaug that wakes (LED eye lights up) and then lifts/turns his head would have been much cooler than a spin reveal.

-Functionally, Smaug is pretty much just "Skully" from No Fear.

The JJP guys blame the licensor...but it is what it is...it feels like a real last minute rushed toy...just SOMETHING to plug into that "Smaug hole".

In my head, I imagine a Smaug to that grabs the balls with a magnetic claw - and puts them in a pile for ball lock. The balls would represent the gold he's hoarding...then when the balls release, he flips out and attacks you because you stole his gold. I can't imagine the licensor would be against that concept pitch.

Ok so alex could be talking about Thoarin Oakenshield newton ball assembly and Balin and Radagast ball poppers whatever that is.