(Topic ID: 97450)

Skit B newest machine. "Experts of Dangerous"


By newtoit

4 years ago



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  • Latest reply 4 years ago by GravitaR
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    #194 4 years ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    You can have a legitimate opinion on bad art without having to "put up or shut up". If the art is bad, there's nothing wrong with someone saying it's bad.

    Pinside really is like the Roman Coliseum. Half the crowd want to see the person enter the arena live, and half want to see them get torn to pieces.

    #195 4 years ago

    Looks like they made the video private now.... here's something I pulled from the cache...
    experts of dangerous.jpg

    I don't know why people are complaining about the artwork. It looks like classic hand-drawn pinball art. In this case a homage to comic-book-style. Whoever did it was obviously talented. It's a zillion times better than the airbrushed-looking stuff that Bally/Williams did on a lot of movie themes.

    I think the art is actually pretty decent. It may be a tad busy.. The contrast could be addressed a bit, and the game logo doesn't stand out because it's too complex, but it's still quite good IMO.

    #300 4 years ago
    Quoted from krupa:

    Yep. Aurich and others have been pretty specific about the whys.

    I agree the logo is not very prominent, but there are other celebrated games like "Whitewater" that don't even have the logo and game name on the backglass. It's not a deal-killer IMO.

    Quoted from CraZ4Pin:

    I would tend to agree with most all of the constructive criticism. The individual hand-drawn elements are pretty cool! Awesome that they even did custom hand-drawn artwork. However, taken together in this arrangement (the various sizes of the elements, their positioning, and the coloring) it looks terrible as a whole. The title of the game seems to be camouflaged right into the backglass (you barely even notice it's there). The most important characters (Jamie and Adam) are much less prominent than the crash-test dummies. The theme of the game is "Experts of Dangerous" and not "Crash Test Dummies Revenge", right? Overall, the colors in general make everything seem to run together. Again, definitely some talent in there and the individual elements are cool .. but taken as a whole ... not so good.

    I think the backglass represents a certain artistic style. You guys are critiquing this game as if it's going to be a billboard people see on I-95 and has to be instantaneously recognized and fully-appreciated zipping past it at 60mph.

    I think had they put the Myth Busters even larger on the backglass, just as many, if not more people would have complained... it's not like in this testosterone-driven industry, pinball enthusiasts want a bunch of nerdy guys' image hovering over them on the pinball machine.

    #302 4 years ago
    Quoted from Haymaker:

    A person is entitled to their opinion about the art without having to be an artist themselves. I'm not a cook, but is it ok for me to say a certain restaurant sucks? I'm certainly no musician, but I could write you a list a mile long of songs that suck too.

    Absolutely. You are entitled to your opinion, but there's a difference between, "I don't like this." and "That sucks!" The former is a personal opinion, and the latter is a somewhat aggressive judgement, often used to influence others.

    Say you're sitting at a table eating with people. They serve broccoli. You could say, "I don't like broccoli" and people would think, "Ok, he doesn't like broccoli", but instead you say, "Broccoli sucks!" Now everybody at the table who likes broccoli has to feel weird because you've taken a provocative position and questioned not just your own taste, but theirs as well.

    And yes, you can have an opinion on food and music, but depending upon the nature of your criticism, whether you have any experience with food or music will make your opinion more or less credible to others.

    For example, if you aren't a musician and you think the Beatles suck, it's easier to dismiss than, than if you are an accomplished musician and share that same opinion. It's very hard to find any successful musician who has respect in the industry who doesn't respect the Beatles' contribution. Not all opinions are of equal weight. But yes everybody is entitled to an opinion. The degree to which those opinions should be respected is not unconditional - it's based on where that opinion is coming from.

    -3
    #304 4 years ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    lol, come on now. It's in huge, clearly readable letters on top of every single game with an eye catching and unique light show, you literally cannot miss the name of the game. Try selling a White Water without the topper and see what kind of value you get for it too. That a silly example, and I would invite you to please name another "celebrated game" let alone another at all that doesn't have the name, since you made it sound like there are more.
    The name of the game is important. I'm cool with the grammar on Experts of Dangerous, I think it's funny, it's not a bad name. Make it so people can see it. That's just design 101, you don't hide it.

    I agree with you. I think the logo is not prominent enough. But suggesting it totally sucks seems a little over the top... in the annals of bad pinball art, that is quite good in comparison.

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    #322 4 years ago

    I know Python is beloved, and I am a big fan of his, but really, if y'all didn't know that was Python's work, people would say someone's 8 year old kid drew it. He was idiosyncratic, and certainly not representative of the kind of "professional standards" you're demanding Experts of Dangerous adhere to.

    -4
    #338 4 years ago
    Quoted from navajas:

    I'm an anti-theist, but one of the strongest arguments for the existence of an existential and transcendent force in the universe is the malevolent evil that is Bad Cats. Mere humans could not have conspired alone to contrive such an insidious and diabolical device.
    As a side note, knowing full well the blasphemy I harbor, I think Python is a bit over rated, even excepting Bad Cats. I dig the Where's Waldo aspect, and the depth of theme, but I just don't care for the style at all. Lots of fun games, I just don't think any of them are necessarily lookers.

    I love the game. I love his irreverence. I agree with you. I'm just saying, they won't be using that backglass in Marketing 101 classes if you know what I mean.

    Quoted from Rarehero:

    ...but at least it IS a style! It's consistent and cohesive. The Adventures of Beret-Man & Leatherjacket-Dude Vs. The Crash Test Dummies in the Land of Unreadable Logos is style free. There's no professional design or color theory applied at all.

    Duuude.. really? You're lecturing people about "professional design" and color theory? FG is a funny show. And it has its moments, but it's tremendously derivative and boilerplate, to a fault IMO. Obviously you'll disagree, as will your cadre of up-voting fanboys. I will have to learn to live with that, but I'll go on record expressing in my most Stewie-like sarcastic tone... "Really? Really?"

    #341 4 years ago
    Quoted from benheck:

    In reference to PinballHelp's "bad backglass" examples:
    Flash: Yes, truly awful. Still sold 18k.
    Genesis: Title is legible, nice kerning on the font. Color is consistent, photography is well done. Your eye is drawn vertically up towards the title. People hate the context of that backglass, but as a composition it's fine.
    Hardbody: Pretty bad. No style, form or function. Neon color scheme is at least relevant to time it was made.
    Bad Cats: Squint your eyes. Squint REALLY hard (I call this the Squint Test) Can you still read the title? Of course you can. And it's hand-drawn by The Python.
    Rolling Stones: Perfectly acceptable layout. The band forms an arc, drawing your eye down to the title which is clearly legible in contrast with the background. The spotlights also direct attention inward. The blue background and mostly yellow accents on the band compliment each other.
    Photoshop doesn't make art bad. Poor design makes art bad.
    Angus Young face on AC/DC Pro truly terrifying, I agree with that!

    It's really easy to make the logo more prominent though... Assuming that graphic is a layered PSD file, you simply take the logo layer and add a drop shadow or glowing outline, feather the contrast around it and it could be made to stand out prominently.

    What I find neat about the design is that it does appear almost 3D-like. I think if the backglass was done in some kind of layering, it would look really, really neat. Making the logo stand out more is really easy to do, and yes it does need to be done. I think people are giving those guys too hard a time when apparently that content wasn't even supposed to be made public yet.

    -10
    #362 4 years ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    This thread is about Skit-B's game...you wanna get personal & make it about me, Mike? OK...but my Emmy disagrees with you.

    Congrats on your Emmy in 2009. Also congrats to Charlie Sheen for his Emmy for Best Actor in "Two and a half men", and Matt LeBlanc for his Emmy as "outstanding lead actor" in Friends.

    Sorry bro, I could not resist. Too tempting.

    Quoted from Rarehero:

    Find one of my episodes. Break down the visual faults for me. Find instances where I have poorly composed a shot, did something visually incorrect that detracted from a joke, filled a frame with tangents, or find me a scene where the color looks terrible. I didn't create the show, I didn't design characters or the look...but I know how to work with the elements available to me to make it professional & functional. Now - I know some of my eps have screw-ups - that's the nature of a TV production schedule...but I stand by my work. If you care to give me specific constructive criticism on my work - go ahead. If you're just going to insult me to insult me, in service of defending this game's clearly awful art package, then F off.

    Look who's making it personal? I just don't think FG is a standard by which creativity and graphic design should be judged. That's all I'm saying. I'm not saying you don't have nice colors. I'm just saying, the series is boilerplate.

    By the way, you know I don't dislike FG. I really enjoy a lot of the show. Again, you seem to have lost the ability to recognize shades of gray and not look at things as black/white, love/hate. FG is well done for what it is.

    It's a shame Greg, that you are becoming like the people you used to loathe. You now become incredibly hostile when someone has the nerve to not agree with you. Just deal with it. Two people disagree. I'm not insulted that you don't agree with me, and you shouldn't be insulted that I don't agree with you (or feel that FG is a standard to which I would compare as the pinnacle of acceptable graphic design). We disagree.

    Actually, it's not that we even disagree on the topic at hand. I have said I think some of the criticism is valid. I just think it's a bit harsh and premature in terms of declaring the artwork a complete failure.

    Simple as that. Nothing personal.

    I recognize there's a big contingent of people who seem to think pinball "has to be a certain way." Playfields have to be laid out a certain way. Displays have to be a certain way. Backglasses have to be a certain way, or else it's crap or "not pinball." That's fine. Me, however, I like to see different stuff. I like to see designers try something new, and I'd prefer to not grab my pitchfork and torch and run after them until they're at least been given a chance to try and fail.

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