Hello everyone!

I'm new to pinball and am now the owner of my first machine.

And I have the bug!

Of course, growing up in the late 70's / early 80's pinball was such a huge part of our recreation that I always thought and dreamed of owning my own machine.

Fast forward about 40 years and I have one!

This is a cool forum as it's been great to see all the other stories, machines, projects and LEARN a lot about how these machines work.

And, of course, how to fix me up!

And that's where my little post here comes in.

So I wasn't even really looking for a pinball machine and really had no idea about what kind of machine I would want or what to look for when purchasing.

So basically a dumb newbie!

Anyway, an email I get from a local auction house that usually has restaurant or industrial equipment featured actually had an auction a few months back with some arcade equipment. I thought this could be interesting so I browsed the listings. Most of the items were non working driving games from the past couple decades, but there was one pinball machine! A Sinbad from Gottlieb!

The description on it said "lights up, needs work" and that's it. The photos were a couple exterior shots and it looked pretty clean. Of course knowing what I know now I would have asked or wanted to see in the backbox, the cabinet and playfield close ups, but I didn't know what I was doing! LOL!

All I knew was that there was a pinball machine that looked cool at a local auction. So I checked in with the boss and mentioned to her that "hey I got a birthday coming up and you want to know what to get me, so.....". Well she took one look at the photos and told me to go for it!

I mean, these old pins look amazing! What color! What graphics! So with her support I submitted a bid.

I ended up winning at $425.

At the time I thought I did well. Well, here's where I think the learning process begins!

Once we got there to load it up I first saw why it "needs work": an absolutely empty backbox! No power supply board, no display board...nothing! Fortunately everything else is there, but it looks like I'll be learning a lot about how these machines work (and spending a lot of time reading about Gottlieb System 1's!).

Of course once I got the machine home and could spend some time looking it over the list of things to fix started to grow.

I'll mainly focuse in the playfield as that's the most time consuming, but I also had to de-rust the legs, get new bolts for the legs (only had 1 bolt for each leg), rebuild all flippers, rebuild pop-bumpers, remove some creatures nest from the drop-target box on the underside, order new rubber, fuses and LEDs.

Oh yeah, and while the flaking on the backglass wasn't terrible, I did find an almost perfect back glass from Johns Jukes that will replace the original.

And I can't forget...ordered a P1-4x from Pascal for when it's all ready to go back together.

But that day is still in the future. Marco specialties and others have been getting a lot of orders from me and my little $425 "deal" is now at least twice that.
For a Sinbad? That's probably a terrible investment, but it's more a personal pride thing now and must be seen through.

Before I go, I'll mention the obvious that vid1900 's extended mega post on playfield Restoration has been like nightly reading for the past two months! I only hope that in the end what I create is at least of passing quality!

Okay, so here's the playfield situation for Sinbad:

The worst is this very large, very noticeable roughly two inch area where the paint has been worn down to the wood::

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The other playfield issues aren't as bad and are mainly wear at the top of the playfield where it's not as noticeable, but when combined with the REALLY noticeable worn area in the main playfield, I knew it would bother me and it would need to be fixed.

And I also knew that continuing to operate this game with those exposed paint areas it would only get worse, so it was up to me to try and resolve this problem and prevent Sinbad from going to the trash heap before his time!

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I briefly considered not bothering with attempting a restoration and looked into a playfield swap of some sort. But nothing was popping up when I searched and from what I can tell they are a pretty price!

My biggest concern was not merely the repainting, but the idea of removing the playfield parts and the whole issue of how to clearcoat was another thing I really didn't want to deal with.

But I read some posts where people built frames to protect the playfield bottom while removing all the top side parts.

Okay, I can do that! As long as I don't have to get into removing all the stuff attached to the bottom, I think I can handle it!

But there was still the clear coat question. Hauling around a playfield attached to a frame to an auto paint shop seemed really annoying.

And the more I read, the more I realized that with the sort of repair I would need (adding decals, repainting multiple adjacent colors) it wasn't really just ONE trip to get clear-coated, but many! Argh!!!

I researched some other solutions like the Varathane option. Yeah, I could do that. But the more I read, it seemed like the 2k automotive clear coats offer the best long term strength and appearance.

I felt stuck!

Then I came across a post discussing something called Spraymax 2k.

Hmmmm..... dangerous. Toxic. Difficult to use. But....it might just be what I'm looking for.

But still... it would be expensive and dangerous to use this stuff repeatedly between my touch ups.

Of course then I read about Spraymax's 1k product AND that it is perfectly suitable for putting the 2k on top!

Viola! I had a plan!
So, I removed (with great terror) everything from the top, built my frame, plugged all the holes and time to get to work!

Playfield removal...scary. Removing the stars from the star rollovers was probably the worst. Mentally the thought of pulling out the wood side rails or lane guides was a mental barrier, but it went okay.

As others have advised, I took a lot of photos (up to 300 now! Yikes!) so I can have some chance of putting it back together correctly some day!

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With everything removed I could really see what needed to be repaired. The yellow was the worst, but also orange, and the aqua blue.

I will also repaint the white. About the only color that won't need repainting is the magenta.

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To protect all the stuff underneath the playfield from paint and clear coat and other debris, I used blue painters tape and some foam material for holes.

One trick for the rollover switches was to cut the fingers off of rubber gloves, and gen wrap the finger portion over the rollover. The material fills most of the hole, and with the rollover protected a little tape holds the switch down inside the playfield so I can sand/paint over it.

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Cool! I might need your help too! It's only been a few weeks since I removed the playfield parts and in already worried I won't remember where they go!

Luckily I took a million photos, but still.

One thing I discovered about Sinbad is that it was probably one of the largest production games out there during this era. That means they are not too rare, but that's probably a GOOD THING on a first attempt at restoration!

Kind of like the VW bug of pinball machines!

Yes! I tend to be verbose too. When I write I think of what sounds best if I was telling a story to you directly. It comes from years of writing ad copy I think.

Unless the clear coat gets in through a gap I missed, I should be fine. The entire area is sealed off: topside holes, all four sides and the bottom.

My playfield resembles a large casket right now!

But I appreciate your warning! I had to weigh the risk of screwing up the wiring harness and coils by removing them versus the chance of some spray fouling a switch or socket or worse.

Eventually I'll post the results right here!

Here's a photo of my playfield "casket".

I'm also fortunate that I can do all this spraying in a ventilated but enclosed shed. Not sure I would even attempt this if I didn't have this place to work on my playfield!

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Nothing special but here are the "tools" I've been using so far:

Spraymax 1k
Createx paints
Paasche air brush (I've had this for years so the idea of air brushing wasn't too scary for me)
And sandpapers, naphtha, etc...

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LOL! Yeah I've seen others building these frames. I didn't want to, but it was that or mess with the scary harness underneath! Note that some parts are removed (I already removed and rebuilt all four flippers, so they are not attached until this is all done).

What might be my first mistake was putting some bondo in a few of the worst gouges or depressions.

Have you ever read so many posts or tips that you THINK you know what the right thing is to do only to go back and read another post that says DON'T do that thing? That's how I feel with bondo!

Man it is scary putting this on a playfield!

Anyway, I now have a fear that in a few years the wood and bondo will separate and I'll have another mess to deal with.

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I won't go into all the different steps for sanding. Basically I followed the procedure laid out in Vid1800's post.

So after getting the original playfield as clean as possible (many, many Naptha wipes) and sanding the bondo and the entire playfield lightly but thoroughly to give it tooth and make it as "clean" as possible, it was "do or die" time!

I've read a couple of nightmarish posts about the first coats of clear creating a nightmarish wreck of playfield so I also waited for a decently warm, and relatively low humidity day to apply my first coat of the Spraymax 1k (which can be trying here in the Seattle area!).

Please note that I used a automotive spraying mask, goggles and gloves even for 1k. This stuff is NOT your standard Krylon and should be taken very seriously!

Standard approach: first coat: light coat with 50%; second coat: same (opposite direction); and a thicker third coat. Between each adding tooth and starting to level out low spots with 400 grit sanding black, wipe with a tack cloth, then naphtha.

I didn't get any photos of the first coats before sanding, but in addition to "locking in the paint" on the playfield I was also trying to address some pretty serious planking issues which can be see in this photo of the magenta area to the right of the "add bonus" burst. This was after a couple of coats of clear that was given an initial sanding:

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My Restoration is obviously going to require replacing text, graphics and so forth. That would be impossible by hand, so I'll be using laser printed water slide decals that I'm working on creating. I should be able to share these here once they are done if any other Sinbad restorers need or want them.

Getting a good, perfectly scaled image of the playfield is a must to create perfect decals. My first attempt was to see if it was possible to get these with my camera. Nope. Just impossible to do!

So I broke down and made yet another purchase (it never ends!) and got one of these handheld scanners:

VuPoint Magic Wand Portable Scanner PDS-ST415-VPS-CR (Certified Refurbished) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01L0EPIMO/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_J4dnzbF58EQ2Q

It's not perfect as it does rely on a steady, smooth handheld motion to get a decent playfield scan that is proportionally accurate, but I think it's the only way. I'll post some of these scans next (they're on another computer).

These photos are just from my camera.

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Here's an example of the scan that I was able to get for the 'hilt' section of Sinbad's sword with the Vupoint hand-held scanner. As I am repainting the entire sword below the hilt (scimitar?) I needed to get these details scanned in to create new decals later on. I am also not going to repaint ALL the yellow, but just any contiguous areas of yellow - relying on a close paint match so it's not too noticeable.

I also need these scans to be accurate to create the decals for the keylines of the flames and inserts that have been worn away and now filled with bondo (and later to be repainted).

The scanner does show the rough spots in high clarify now. Of course, this is also after a few hits with the sandpaper so some of the loose paint that wasn't visibly an issue before is not longer there. All the more reason I needed to repaint this playfield.

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I have some decent skills with photoshop - mostly because of my various hobbies and job I've need to learn how to use it, but I'm still no expert and need to Google to figure out a lot of stuff, but my basic plan is to convert all the above scans to clean, original-looking line-art graphics of the playfield areas I need to restore. I'm trying to create a 1 sized version of the entire playfield, but that is pretty resource heavy and overkill for what I need so I may not do that. Anyway, here's an early version of what my art looks like after having been scanned and cleaned up, but before replacing the text, inserts and keylines (which will be added in as separate layers in Photoshop).

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Time to paint! Wait, not yet! We need to color match!

Yellow would be first. Its both the largest and potentially the most difficult. So if I'm going to screw it up, it will probably be with yellow.

So let's get it over with first.

I was able to color-match my yellow after many attempts at trial and error. For this a heat gun is necessary (or a hair dryer would work too). Createx paints are definitely a different color when dry - I believe they are darker, but your mileage may vary. So another purchase (Harbor Freight) was in order.

My yellow turned out to be pretty easy: It basically worked out to about 15 parts of Createx Opaque Yellow to 1 part Wicked Colors (transparent) Orange. They only had transparent Orange at Hobby Lobby, but it seemed to work. Its funny how a tiny drop was all I really needed to get the yellow color to 'warm up' just a bit to match the playfield.

I used some pieces of mylar (used for storing comic books) cut into small rectangles where I would test different paint combinations and concentrations of colors; dry them with the heat gun, and then place on the playfield using a variety of lights to find the best match.

Next...on to masking.

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Masking. Cutting the frisket on the playfield is another stressful task. As Vid1800 warns biggest concern is that you cut more than the frisket and pierce through your clear coat and end up damaging the playfield.

As I have no fine motor skills or finesse, I thought this would be hard for me to do, so I came up with a 'brilliant' (sarcasm alert!) idea to get around this potential problem.

I thought I would be "smart" and trace the keylines on the playfield onto the frisket, then I would cut out the frisket away from the playfield, and then peel off the adhesive layer and apply the pre-cut frisket to the playfield. Disaster. What a mess. Fail.

The frisket is just too 'tacky' and tracing and then cutting introduces too many slight errors so that your pre-cut frisket is both impossible to lay down precisely on all the keylines. Maybe for a small or simple area, but not for the a large area like the scimitar flames or the 'add bonus' explosion'.

So I ended up adding more fisket and cutting it along the keylines the way that Vid describes. And it wasn't that bad after all (I had several coats of clear on at this point, so I was probably overly cautious). Again, just be careful not to press hard, and change blades frequently, it seemed to work.

I also used some 6mm Tamiya masking tape to fill in some of the gaps from my (already attached and still somewhat usable) pre-cut frisket fiasco. Obviously, using a type of masking tape on a playfield that has not been mentioned before is cause for concern, but since this is design for models (and not house painting) and I've used it for years, I had good faith in the Tamiya tape to be a safe bet.

Here's my 'frankenstein' masking job for the yellow spray paint (note that the blue household masking tape is only on top of frisket - NOT on playfield. Maybe it would be okay, but I'm not taking chances!).

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First coat: My goal with the first coat was to keep it light. Let it cure, then come back with another coat (or more) to cover it all up.

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After several more light coats, I was finally able to cover up the original paint and get a solid yellow....

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Moment of truth. After giving the Createx some time to cure, peeling back the frisket and masking tape seemed to go okay except for two things:

1: Createx, even after curing, is still an acrylic-based paint, which can have a rubbery component. When peeling some of the sharp angles, the paint would not always want to separate at the frisket, so I went very slow and methodical not to pull up the createx with the frisket. This does make me wonder if my playfield had enough tooth for the Createx? I did sand the area with some 320 and 420 grit, so it might be that I need to let it cure or heat cure even longer.
2. As others have noticed, the Createx CAN leave a glue residue. I cleaned this with Naptha. And then I cleaned everything again and again. Once I saw that residue from the frisket I got super paranoid about getting it off for the next coat of clear/paint!

Overall, the color looks good; I missed masking a small area (which was easily cleaned with water and cottons swabs), the new yellow layer is noticeably higher than the rest of the playfield. This will require some sanding of the edges and will hopefully become more moderated with future coats of clear, sanding, etc...

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Yes. Anyone who doesn't take this stuff extremely seriously should not be doing it. Even Spraymax 1k is dangerous! This is NOT Krylon!

Unfortunately an earlier post I wrote explained the ventilator mask, goggles, Tyvek suit, gloves and full on protection for this stuff (EVEN for the SprayMax 1k, but absolutely for the 2k) was one of several lost when my phone lost connection, so that important caveat was left out.

So everything up to this point has been in the past. I've just put my first clear over the painted yellow and am now preparing to paint the orange and white areas. Then another clear, then the aqua blue. I may also have to do some magenta touch ups, but I think those are minor.

Right now the focus is on color matching for orange.

First, start with the obvious: Red and Yellow:

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Yuck, More of a peach than the orange, I'm looking for. Note that when I first start mixing colors its a a guessing game. I try to do as much of a gradient mix between two colors to see what proportion of each is the closest. My feeling on the above is that the combination of these two wasn't going to cut it.

Next, I tried some Wicked Colors Orange. This actually starts to look a lot better I think we're getting close.

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The Wicked Colors orange looks way too bright when wet, but gets much darker when dry.

So starting with a new set of colors to mix together I try Wicked Colors Orange, with a touch of Createx Yellow and a touch of black.

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Matching colors when wet...

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And then after being blasted with a heat gun...things darken up. But I think I'm getting close. The mix on the far right looked REALLY good when wet (see above post), but after drying got too dark. The center color, with just a tiny touch of yellow was too bright above, but is pretty close when dry. The spot on the left is the Wicked Colors Orange without any other colors.

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So I think the right solution is about 20 parts Wicked Colors Orange; 1 part yellow; and .5 part black. That's not based on any measurement, just a rough estimate of what I mixed on my little pallette. The black may even bo too much at .5:20 - just a tiny bit has a noticeable impact!

Anyway, my desire to start sanding down the clear and then cutting frisket's for the orange and white has escaped me for the moment, so I think I'll grab some lunch and come back to this later.

Cold feet! "Lunch" has been extended.

I think that the ease with which I matched the yellow was a ploy to suck me into this orange! Its soooo close, but not perfect.

I'm waiting a bit and will come back with some fresh ideas on color mixing.

Luck! Seriously. Of course, a lot of help trying to follow the best practices of people like Vid1800 and others!

But there's a long way to go with this restoration and I have a lot more chance to make a mess of it!

It's funny I've actually considered creating a "process diagram" or flow chart of all the steps, preparation, supplies and parts that are needed! I do have a list I follow to make sure I am doing things in the right order. Which is my best insurance to keep me from making a terrible mistake!

Cool. I'll try and make one up. It's basically trying to follow Vids restoration post, but since that topic is like 800 posts long I need something shorter to refer to while planning my restoration!

It is kinda strange that there is so little resto info on Sinbad, especially since a ton were made and they seem to be pretty common (at least for that era).

Question for you...you've got some cool pins, what is it about Sinbad? I haven't been doing this long but seems like most people who have modern games don't care too much for older pins?

Good info! And I can relate on the whole orange issue!

Yeah, I'm excited to get the Pascal board installed! My only concern is whether or not I'll have to repin any of the connectors (crossing fingers!). I know it will suck to have to do that because it will be near the end of the resto and I know I'm going to be impatient!

I had to laugh about your comment on cupped inserts. . I dont know if mine are terrible or barely acceptable. I want to pretend that I don't have to address that issue, but I think I'm going to have to. I'll be doing the 'clear coat drip method' I think one I get the paint and clear coat complete.

EDITED: Note that my original plan to use Spaymax 1k does not work as planned with Createx paints (you'll see why if you keep reading this thread!) so please DO NOT use SprayMax 1k if you plan to do touch ups like am. Thanks!

Okay, I was up waaaayyy too early this morning and I thought I would take a stab at translating my notes that I've been creating to help me through this process. While this is mostly based off Vid's excellent post, it is not a subsitute. I have many of those posts (as well as other websites such as Pinrepair for other parts of the resto) bookmarket to go back to and refer to. This attempt at a flow chart is really to help me see where each step is, what supplies or equipment I need to have available for the next step, and other notes to myself.

If this is useful great! If you have some ideas on things I should change or add, let me know! This is my first time so I'm probably missing several important things (I plan to update this if possible as I learn more).

Sinbad Project Plan.pdf

Man, orange is a nightmare. It also made my next move very cautions. But its done.

I attempted to be very methodical about matching the orange. I primarily used Wicked Orange as my base as this seems to most closely match the orange on the playfield, although it is a lot 'brighter' and deeper than the playfield orange.

As you might have seen above, I made several combinations of colors, Createx Orange, Wicked Orange, Createx Yellow, Wicked Yellow, Red, White, etc.... I did these little test on small sheets of clear mylar. This is how I arrived at Wicked Orange as my base.

Knowing that Wicked Orange was my base, and that Createx Yellow seems to get it close to the playfield orange, I filled a small jar halfway with Wicked Orange, and then slowly started adding drops of Createx Yellow.

What is really challenging is that the colors dry a lot darker. So every time I get close, after a minute under the heat gun, I still had far to go.

I ended up getting to 40 drops of Createx where I felt the color was a good match.

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I'll repeat something I said earlier....since I wasn't entirely sure that i would ever get a 'perfect' match, I had two plans: Just spray paint the areas that needed it (mostly the long 'flame line' on the left side of the playfield, and the large 'center flame' and the two pop bumpers) but if the orange match wasn't close enough, go ahead and paint all the orange areas.

After my first coat or two of the color that I think matched, I will pull back some temporary coverings over the other orange areas and see if they were close enough.

After my first two coats (very light) I could see that I was likely going to have a REALLY heavy coat of orange to ensure I could cover up the black lettering and the bondo patch. This seems to confirm what everyone probably knows that Wicked paints are more translucent than Createx.

I decided to basically add a primer coat using some Createx Red, Yellow and White. I wasn't trying to recreate the Orange, but was trying to get a very opaque base down to act as a sort of a primer. So in the below photo you see a very incorrect peach color instead of orange!

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Of course, I had to face the reality that my orange was just not close enough to the existing orange on the playfield. So the 'temporary' protection for the good orange areas was removed and the majority of all orange areas were repainted in this slight darker orange color.

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The good news is that it's close enough. It looks redder in the photos than it does in real life. I might even assume that this is the orange that was originally on the playfield before 40 years of UV light and fading took its toll! I'm generally pleased with how it turned out, but there are some things that bother me a bit which I'll comment on below.

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The finished orange coat. Again, it looks more red in these photos than it does in person. I am really happy with how this covered up the scars, nicks, and general damage. Finally the playfield is starting to look like it should!

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So, a couple of comments on air-brushing Createx paint and frisket. Some of this is a repeat of what Vid and others have stated, but some of this I don't know or remember if I've read. In any case, these are some things that I need to keep in mind as they are pretty critical for my experience so far!

1. Make sure you have a coat of clear on the playfield before cutting any frisket (this is what Vid advises so do it!). Make absolutely sure you sand it before add frisket. The Createx acrylics absolutely need good 'tooth' (as Vid would say) to grab onto the playfield. If not, your carefully airbrushed coat may pull up WITH the frisket later!
2. Cutting frisket is delicate work, but its not as hard as you might think. If you have sharp exacto blades the wight of the knife is almost enough add your cut lines.
3. Carefully check that you have cut out all the areas where you want paint to go - and make sure areas you don't want paint are covered. Try to look at the playfield with a light reflection on it so you can see the different reflectivity of areas where the frisket is applied versus where you've removed it.
4. Keep your black lines! Make sure you cut the outside of any black outlines!
5. Make extra sure that the frisket is cut cleanly at all 'angled' areas (e.g. tips of arrows)
6. Using naptha after you've added your frisket (prior to paint) is fine. No problems. Just be careful and use it with caution.
7. Make sure you gently press the frisket edges to ensure it has a good seal.
8. Although I've done airbrushing before, Createx does need high pressure compared to other paints. I had my compressor set to 60 psi (I think I got that from Vid)
9. Start with thin coats, hit with a heat gun to set it, hit again. If using Wicked and not Createx, you might want to put down a 'primer coat' of the more opaque Createx.
10. Once its all done and your ready to remove frisket, don't rush this part! The paint is very 'rubbery' and if you don't carefully remove the frisket you may pull up some paint! What I've found works best is to pull frisket in the opposite direction of the edge you are pulling against. Also keep the angle you are pulling the frisket as low to the playfield as possible. If you are holding the frisket at a 90 degree angle to the playfield when removing, that could pull the paint up. Where you have little circular shapes, or narrow triangular shares (the insides of arrow points) you want to be very careful. I found that going to the tiniest tip of arrow or edge and with a pair of tweezers pull the frisket up from this narrow end I get better, cleaner pulls and didn't have any issues of paint getting pulled from the playfield.

Okay, did some minor black keyline touchups today, but the main project was to fill/level the cupped inserts.

I originally hoped that my cupped inserts were good enough that I could avoid the drip method of filling in the insert and then sanding it down to level.

However, as I'll be putting laser, water-slide decals over the black insert circles, I know they need to be level and flush. So before any more painting or clear coating, time to deal with the inserts...

The process didn't go too badly. I am using the SprayMax 1k for this. It is less toxic than 2k (although not as durable or strong) so i sprayed into a paper bowl, used an eyedropper and dripped in the inserts.

This is a practice that Vid and others discuss. Ensuring the playfield was absoutely level I filled the inserts so that the clear liquid would touch/kiss the the paint and area surrounding the insert ring.

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And....I may have a major problem. As I was doing I was mentally trying to remember all the tips and cautions that Vid and others have provided on this. I don't know if it was explicit, but its probably a good idea to do this step FIRST - not AFTER applying spray paint!

So...here's what is going on. I'm waiting for the Spraymax 1k to dry, and I started to notice that the 1k liquid is having a fairly violent reaction to the yellow paint. Notice in the photos how its wrinkling? Yikes! What have I done!?

So...this may mean another coat of yellow after a lot of sanding. If that's the worst of it, that's okay. Darn!

I'll be gone most of this week for work, so I'll come back later this week after this 1k has completely cured and see what sort of disaster is in store for me....

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Heh. Well, I think this resto got a bit more interesting. But it would be boring without some drama!

Hah! No worries! I didn't take it that way at all!!! Heck, I've been waiting for something to go wrong! I mean don't you think that this whole restoration process is really just "pushing your luck!"? With the exception of Vid, it seems EVERYONE runs into some unexpected issue or something!

Okay, it's been a few days...and I had to leave town right after noticing the "bubbling" under of the Createx in contact with the 1k, so I spent a few days just wondering what tragedy would I find when I got back home?

Well, it's not as bad as I thought it might be, but not great. I'll still have repaint some of the yellow and some orange.

Now I wish I had mixed EXTRA so I don't have to go through mixing a new batch!

So two things might have happened: I think I missed a "rule" about applying the clear coat BEFORE applying any acrylic paints (I.e. Createx). I think the large volume in contact with the acrylic paint (even though it was cured) in the cupped inserts over a longer period of curing time (compared to a much faster cure of thin coats that are sprayed on) allowed for enough time for a reaction to take place.

The other option is that Spraymax 1k has some real issues with acrylic/Createx paints.

What makes me wonder about the 1k is that even some areas that should not have reacted (the inner orange arrows) at all because it was a thin coat, still resulted in a sort of "spider-web" sort of reaction. This did not happen with the yellow coat I might add. The good news about the orange arrows is that after I sanded them they look okay.

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So sandpaper to the rescue! Not quite, but at least it gets me to the point to see what I need to do next.

Here's some close up photos. These were taken after being sanded, so you can kind of see little "bleeds" where the yellow paint reacted to the 1k that was filled into the inserts.

The areas requiring touch ups are about half the insert area on the yellow, and a few random areas in the orange. The worst is the yellow insert near the yellow flame.

But I noticed that I have a couple of inserts that I didn't quite fill, so I may have to take care of that before doing any touch ups.

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Wow. I think I'm almost done masking the blue/turquoise areas for air-brushing. I think I have almost 5 hours of frisket cutting! I started last weekend and finished today.

The reason it took so long was attempting to mask as much of the fine black lines and black circles on the blue areas to minimize either decals or hand touch ups, but I suspect it will be wasted effort. Ahhh, this is fun! ?

Going to spray the blue now. With a four day weekend and no work travel planned for maybe two weeks I'm hoping to make some serious progress.

Of course, I sort of expect "progress" as it relates to a playfield Restoration to be two steps forward on step backwards as my reading has informed me and my own experience has validated!

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Blue is down! And I have to say, the color match was pretty perfect. Easiest color so far. And the coverage of the Createx was really good. Whereas with the yellow and orange several coats were needed to cover the lettering or the bondo fill, the blue covered it nicely. I think this might have to do with the fact that I had to use the somewhat more transparent "Wicked Colors" for orange and yellow - which I didn't have to use for the blue/turquoise.

Here's the first pass....

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Second pass (both were light layers)

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In this photo, down at the lower left corner, you can see the area that had the worst damage and the bondo fill. The colors don't look as identical in the photo, but to the naken eye, you can hardly tell the difference.

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This photo is actually a combination of areas that were painted and others that were left original. I'm happy with how this turned out. I'm going to let it set for a bit longer, then go in and clean it up more aggressively and then possible spray the white and do the magenta touch-ups (by hand? They are pretty minor, so I don't know if I need full on airbrush, but it might be good anyway).

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A little off topic..although I have a decent laser printer, there are some decals I need that have white lettering. I found a company on the web called Bedlam Creations that can make custom decals (with white, gold, silver, etc..).

Here's the 'proof' for the upcoming decal (still in the process of being created). This is at actual size, so if you need the white letters for these two areas, feel free to try using this to make decals! (the 'blue area' will be transparent).

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Two steps forward; 5 steps back. Hey! This looks like where I started!!

So my plans to make all sorts of progress this weekend were destroyed. I was able to do some decent brush based touch ups to the yellow, orange, blue and even took care of the magenta. In a perfect world that would mean a shot of the Spraymax 1k, spray the white then the final Spraymax 2k clear coat. Yay!

But this is playfield Restoration and I'm an idiot so the above did not happen.

Instead, the Spraymax once again wrinkled some paint. Last time it was just a small strip of orange high up the playfield and it sanded out okay. This time it was the blue and it was in a very noticeable spot on the playfield, so this needed to be fixed.

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As you can tell from the above photo, that had to be fixed. It's also right next to the orange flames. So with some sanding and a bit of Naptha I started taking off the blue. However, some of the orange started to come off! This was a bit surprising as I tried to be careful and the orange was under a thic coat of clear.

Guess it was too thin.

So.... the big orange flame AND the blue will need to be repainted.

As I was cleaning off as much of the orange paint as made sense, i was wondering what happened to my paint in the first place tha caused it to wrinkle? And why was my orange, frankly, not really that well adhered to the playfield anyway?

My theory is that the areas of Createx that are wrinkling when sprayed were sprayed too think and/or were not properly heat set.

I thought heat setting would be straight forward, but as I told you above, I'm an idiot.

I may have been too concerned with over-heating the Createx or the frisket so I was probably not getting it set. And if it's too thick, that's just even more of a problem.

Anyway, I don't really want to paint anymore until I figure out what's up with my airbrushing and the Spraymax.

So I decided I might as well fix the inserts on the yellow scimitar correctly so sanded most of the yellow back. Most of the inserts turned out okay, but a couple still had some cupping and one must have had a bubble or something as it did not look good.

So... like I said...I'm kind of back where I started! At least the top portion of the playfield is okay and I have a better idea of what to color match correctly.

Wow, these restorations are a pain in the butt!

"Why do we fall down Bruce? To learn how to get back up."

I think this Restoration is teaching me resilience and tenacity. I will not give up. It will be awesome.

I will sand down and re clean these inserts until they are bubble free and amazing.

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Inserts sanded down flat with all gaps sealed. Finally. It actually required three different stages of filling inserts with the 1k with an eye-dropper, letting it cure, sanding, sanding, sanding, more filling, etc... The bubble seen above eventually came out (except for a couple of microsropic ones, which I am frankly going to ignore at this point).

More updates to follow....

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My decals form Bedlam creations arrived! They look good! Somewhat painfully, the step when I can apply them seems to be getting further away! I think I paid about $40 for a 9x12 decal sheet. Pretty much the only option when you need white letters. I went with a larger sheet to have multiple versions of the decals I need in anticipation of errors!

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I tried some tests of various Createx/Wicked paints with the Spraymax 1k. The results are inconclusive. The below images are the before and after of various splotches of Createx and Wicked paints both heat set and not heat set. To attempt to get dramatic results, I actually sprayed the Spraymax 1k on while much of the non-heat set paints were still wet/un-cured. The goal of this was to try and determine whether or not thickness/heat-setting and spraymax have negative interactions.

The comparison of the below 'before' and 'afters' are not very conclusive. There is some 'wrinkling' and minor reactions on the very thick splotches, but I did not see wrinkling on the thinner layers like I expected. These thicker areas are basically just drops of paint, while the others are paints smeared at various thicknesses.

Here's "before":

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Here's "After":
Please note this is not scientific. Clearly. Yes, some of the tests showed reactions, but they were actually fairly minor given the thickness. What I think this tells me is that Spraymax 1k SHOULD be fine when coated on top of Createx stuff. And yet, I'm still having some issues with my Createx on the playfield wrinkling in reaction (especially with my latest coats, not my first coats).

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My current theory:

What I think makes the most sense isn't the Spraymax on TOP of the Createx. This seems to be fine. The above test really did not indicate anything really problematic between the two.

However, I am still having wrinking....mainly on my latest coats.

And I think that's the key.

Because I've been sealing each airbrush coat with Spraymax 1k, the layer or thickness of the Spraymax clear UNDERNEATH each progressive layer of sprayed Createx is getting slightly thicker.

What I think is happening is the 'sandwiched' Createx paints is caught between the bottom layer of Spraymax 1k and the top - as the top layer begins to interact with the bottom layer, the bottom layer expands with the 'heat' creating wrinkles. This is why I did not see it on my first few coats and now seems common as thicker layers of clear are underneath the Createx.

Here's my results (keep in mind that the standard process of sanding with 400 and wiping with naptha occurs between each of the below, but some of my attempts at heat-setting may have been too little):

1. CLEAR: Playfield lightly cleared with Spraymax 1k
2. YELLOW Createx/Wicked color-matched mix airbrushed. Multiple coats applied to cover black letters (yellow over black is a PAIN)
3. CLEAR: Light sealing coat of Spraymax 1k applied.
4, NO REACTIONS on Yellow. No wrinkles, lifting, etc... Perfect.
5. ORANGE Createx/Wicked color-matched mix airbrushed. Perhaps three thin coats to establish coverage.
6. CLEAR: Sealing coat of Spraymax 1k applied. I may have put it on a bit more heavier in some spots.
7. MINOR REACTION: First tiny wrinkles noticed in one of the thin orange arrows in upper playfield. Otherwise, everything is good. I proceed thinking this was due to too much clear.
8. INSERT FILLING: This should have been done in step 2, but I thought I could avoid it, and do it now. The dripped Spraymax 1k pulls up the yellow paint around two of the 10 inserts. Not great. Will need to fix. What happened?
9. BLUE: Createx-only color-matched paint air-brushed. Once dry, sanding and naptha wipe. Strangely...notice that naptha is actually pulling some of the blue paint off playfield! Huh? Poor adhesion for some reason. This is where my limited heat set time might have been an issue.
10. CLEAR: A coat of clear will lock it down and all will be okay.
11. REACTION: Significant wrinkling! Particularly in the blue areas on lower playfield (not so much at top). I spray from top to bottom (lengthwise) so the application amounts should be pretty close, but I may have given the lower playfield area with the worst adhesion some extra clear to 'lock it in'.
12. Starting over...blue mostly removed, yellow removed, and most orange on lower playfield removed (fixed cupped inserts, etc....)
13. WHITE: While I'm also taking this opportunity to properly fix the inserts (since reactions damage to the yellow are now irrelevant as I need to respray) I decide to shoot the white areas since I have little to loose and I want to test a disciplined application of thin coats, then heat set, then thin coat, then heat set. The white seems to go on nicely and adheres to the playfield well (Perhaps addressing my issue with the Blue in step 9?)
14. CLEAR: After 4 days (plenty of time to cure) and having gotten my inserts nice and flat, time for a coat of clear to seal some of the now exposed bare wood near the inserts and the white paint.
15. REACTION: The white wrinkles after just a few seconds of application. Once cured, the wrinkles do subside a bit, but are still somewhat noticeable.

The most logical answer for the wrinkling seems to me to be related to the increasingly thick layers of the bottom layers of clear reacting to the new top clear, causing the new Createx layer to wrinkle. I may try and test this out (do a better job than above)!

So...is my theory about thicker 'under' layers of Spraymax 1k reacting with a new topcoat and 'sandwiching' of the Creatext the problem? Any theories?

Because if this is the case and is what is happening, I have a lot more work and some choices to make:

- Take off most or all of the paint/Spraymax 1k clear coats and start fresh. Abandon SprayMax 1k technique for touch up sequence.
- Stop applying clear coats after spraying Createx to 'lock in' colors. Instead, get a good layer of Createx to apply itself (thin coats and absolutely ensure it is heat set). Then (carefully!) apply new frisket for next color without clear. Ugh. This scares me.

The big question looking in my mind is how how of the SprayMax 1k should I remove? How much CAN I remove? Heck, I just filled/flatted those damn inserts with SprayMax 1k (ah ha! I don't have to put any createx on them however!).

Although I read in one post that putting SprayMax 2k on top of SprayMax 1k is perfectly fine, I recently read a comment from another pinner that this resulted in a disaster!

OMG..what am I into!!!!???

One more idea. This restoration did not go bad until I started posting! LOL. Maybe posting a restoration in progress angers the pinball gods and they cause the pain and misfortune.

Ok. I need a drink.

Oh, and here's the 'white' wrinkles I referred to above....

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Thanks Vid! I appreciate your time to look at my thread. I thought there might be an easy way around this, but I really don't want to repeat airbrushing and have to remove it once again. I am considering taking it to a local shop and having them do the 2PAC. Although it will cost more in the short term, in the long run I expect I will save a lot more time and frustration!

I'm changing my profile pic. Sinbad started off full of courage and optimism. This better reflects how he feels now.

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When Vid (the Obi-Wan or Yoda of playfield restorations) tells you to do something, it's probably wise to listen.

However, my little list of theories of what has been happening has made me curious. There are others who have had some similar issues, but I've yet to find anyone (meaning: read a port or resto) who is using Spraymax 1k and Createx in the manner that I am.

So while I am at the point where spending money on a pro 2Pac job makes more sense than continuing with the madness that I am in. I am curious. I've stopped working on the playfield until I know whether I need to strip it down, leave it as is and touch up, or....I don't know.

So I'm going to do a test. I will be testing Createx airbrushed on various thicknesses of Spraymax 1k, and with both thick and light top coats. I cut about 10 sections of 1/4" plywood, primed them with some exterior white paint (enamel) and will give each of them various coatings of Spraymax 1k (light, medium and heavy base coats, both heat set and non-heat set). I hope to replicate the wrinkling issue and discover what's going on so that others can see that this solution (my approach) does not work this way and don't also repeat my mistakes/impractical choice.

The other reason for this - when I'm all done - is to overcoat all of these test pieces with the Spraymax 2k I already have and see what reactions a 2k on 1k will have.

Here's my 'test pieces'...stay tuned for the future coatings on these...

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So the test has been under-way. Results may be interesting, or mundane. I'm not completely sure.

Anyway, I decided to also test the strength of Createx when cutting frisket on it (without a protective clear). Remember, one of the issues I think I am having is that putting even light coats on after the yellow, then the orange, and then the blue is creating a thicker base coat. I am clearing between each air-brush color because of a fear that frisket will pull up un-cleared Createx on the playfield.

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Spraying...yellow letters

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The test sections after createx/clear. Can't tell if there's been any reaction from this distance....

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And...bingo. on the heavy base coat sections I noticed a very obvious wrinkling while the Spraymax 1k was wet. It subsided as the paint cured. You can see the 'wrinkling' pattern below forming.

So, does this confirm my suspicion that sandwiching createx between layers of SprayMax 1k will cause the Createx to wrinkle? I think it does. The results are conclusive, so I'm ordering another can of SprayMax 1k (Just to test - I'm hard headed) and will apply another layer of Createx on top of this one.

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Something I noticed while I was spraying the Creatext this time. I have two bottles of Createx yellow. I don't know which one is the more contemporary version or not. However something jumped out at me:

"For use on hard surfaces, plastic, and vinyl, mix with 4030 Mix Additive 10-30% per vol."

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While the testing of my wrinkling problem is all fine and good, it still did not answer my question about WHY my experience with Createx was not great. The paint seemed 'rubbery' when dry and would peel off in places. I assumed this was due to improper heat-setting.

The image above shows the same information, but the bottle designs are different (notice that I've used up most of the one on the left).

The bottle with the 4030 advice for hard surfaces (on the left) has a logo that is horizontal, the other one (no mention of 4030) has an angled logo. Looking at the Createx website, the products they show have the label shown on the left - with the 4030 guidance.

Did they change? Just an update? Why would the new labels have the 4030 notification, and old ones don't? Is it possible that newer Createx paints have a different formula and need the 4030?

I have no idea.

But I will next be spraying with some of that 4030 added to see if that gets me a good, hard adhesion from Createx rather than the rubbery acrylic that I've gotten so far.

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Wow. After another coat of SprayMax 1k (this time a very good 'medium' coat) which is already on top of several layers of various thicknesses, this air-brushed combination of Createx White, Red and Wicked Aquamarine wrinkled LIKE MAD! With the previous green coat, wrinking was pretty minor, this time? Nope, not minor at all.

Heat set/Not heat set...it made NO difference. Now unless something was BAD with the pink paint, this is bad sign (but a good sign as it may confirm my theory).

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Hi Rufessor! Thanks for dropping by my own little topic of hell!

One thing I should point out is that this is not happening with a 2PAC. It's the SprayMax 1k (not 2k). Nevertheless I think you are exactly right.

I'm actually doing multiple layers (top, bottom, with acrylic in between) just to test this stuff out. It's interesting and a decent learning experience!

Okay, final test. When I did the pink above-which all but confirmed one of the theories about was happening- I did not have a 'control' with the Createx on a non-Spraymax surface (otherwise I could not be sure if the paint was the issue instead of the sandwiching of the 1k).

So here's the latest test with before and after photos.

In the 'after' photo you can see the same repetition of the wrinkling. Except for the test piece that did not have any clear coat base. That section had no Spraymax 1k underneath the blue paint; just plain old white valspar.

This is what I expected to see and I think definitively confirms what Rufessor stated above and what I hypothesized might be the issue: You can't put Createx (and probably other acrylics) on a layer of Spraymax 1k and then put a coat of Spraymax 1k on top of that without experiencing wrinkling of the Createx.

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Having proven that Spraymax 1k is not compatible as both an underlayer AND a top coat, I have to decide what to do. Since my playfield already has several light coats of the Spraymax 1k, I need to know what the Spraymax 2k will do when sprayed over Createx acrylic paints.

This test involved another two more airbrushed layers of Createx - one straight from bottles and the other mixed with Createx 4030 hardener.

Then on top of this Createx, I applied frisket and cut some shapes (letters) on both of these (neither with any topcoat) to see how well the first layer of Createx would adhere when frisked is applied and shapes are cut.

The purpose here is to see if I can avoid spraying a top or sealing coat on EVERY color to protect the previous sprayed layer for the frisked cutting for the next color. In other words, can I Fraser and spray ALL my colors without putting a clear on top?

The photos here show the different steps prior to shooting the 2k on the 1k/Createx layers already applied.

The smaller light green rectangle has no 4030 Hardener, the slightly darker green small rectangle does have the Hardener
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On top of the two green rectangles, I also applied frisket and cut letter shapes to see how the 4030 hardened vs un-hardener Createx would perform
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Surprisingly, both the 4030 hardened and unhardened did not have any issues with pulling off the paint when the frisket was removed. BOTH were heat set however.
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Sorry for the focus on this one, but this is the end product. My letter shapes also indicate which paint had hardener in it so after the 2k is applied noting variances will be easy.
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And after applying the 2k (remember, there are several light/medium coats of 1k on several of these sections, as well as the Createx, the only Createx without any top coat are the two rectangles with letter shapes) I finally had some good news.

The SprayMax 2k did NOT react with the 1k and create the 'wrinkling' that I've not only seen on these test pieces, but also on my playfield! This means that NO MORE SprayMax 1k will be used. From here on out its just 2k. AND...I can finally get on with the restoration!

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That's easy, since the Spraymax 1k is not a 2 part clear it's far less toxic so it seemed far more convenient for intermediate coats during touch ups. I was inspired when I read that the 2k can be placed over the 1k so it seemed like I could wait until my touch ups were done and than do the final with 2k.

Unfortunately none of that will work with acrylic paint!

Im satisfied that I've found the problem and can move on with the restoration!

Yes! Thanks for pointing me in the right direction!

It was fate. A lot of work to do on this playfield now. But I'm optimistic. And then...a non-working Sinbad appears on my local CraigsList, and the playfield looks like it might be a few grades better than mine. He wants $300.

So I bite.

And now I have two non-working Sinbads.

I'm an idiot.

Okay, so a lot has been happening! First I got another Sinbad. And rather than posting about it, here is what it looked like.

Honestly, while I only paid $300, the guy who put it on Craig's List posted photos of another Sinbad.

Yeah. Not HIS.

Anyway, I drove 2+ hours and it looked okay, but I had serious buyers remorse during the drive home.

What am I doing!!!? What the he** is wrong with me?

Anyway. It was freakin filthy...

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After I got the playfield stripped, I could finally see what I had underneath all that filth.

Before and about halfway through with Magic Eraser and Alcohol.

Here's "before":
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Here's after first cleaning:
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The playfield has some similar issues to my first one, mostly planking and some ground in ball swirl that really takes a lot of the color out of the art.

On the other hand, this "new" playfield has no major paint loss and I feel a lot more confident in touching up and airbrushing this one starting with a more conventional approach (fill inserts first! No Spraymax 1k! Use hardener for Createx! Pound down high points in wood! Remove ALL stuff from playfield top AND bottom).

The harness and hardware on the first playfield seems to be better, so that will be moved to playfield 2 when this is all done.

What about Playfield 1? I need to replace some of the inserts on that one, so it's going to be a longer project. More details later.

To be clear, yes, I have two non-working Sinbads.

Both Solid State, etc...

But... there's also a mystery and I didn't realize until I had two of them sitting side by side.

They are different!

Actually, it's just the cabinets. Look at these photos of the front and see if you can spot the difference:

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More photos...can you see the difference yet?

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My first Sinbad has a metal cabinet. Nothing mysterious about that, it's actually mentioned on the Internet Pinball Database that Gottlieb was testing metal cabinets with some System 1 games.

But I only really realized that the metal front to my cabinet is painted black! Is that normal for these metal cabinets for Sinbad?

I don't know! A Google image search didn't reveal any obvious metal cabinets.

Other System 1 games with the metal front are apparently painted like a wood cabinet front would be (at least of the few responses to this question that has been the consensus), and it almost appears that the photos at IPBDB website showing a metal cabinet Sinbad are painted similar to wood versions.

So you might speculate that mine was repainted at some point.

But why? Why would anythone go this much effort?

Up close, the black front is identical to other black metal areas, such as the back of the cabinet and backbox stand (including on the inside!) and appears to be "factory"!

But, it's a mystery. Is mine repainted? Did Sinbads get a black metal front? Did only a few get a black metal front?

Whatever the case, I like it. The metal cabinet is lighter and a lot sturdier than the wood one. I miss the color on the front, but the black looks good too.

I've been working on the new playfield, and taking some extra steps I did not take in my first playfield.

First, I completely stripped the entire thing. I said to myself "suck it up buttercup and do it right" so with the likely result being I will ultimately reassemble it wrong, I stripped it down. Took a thousand photos as a help.

We'll see.

I also have sanded it down and will repaint it as well.

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I also bought a rock tumbler from Harbor Freight. The expenses never end.

But my screws and metal were gross. And I can't imagine putting dull hardware back on my restored playfield.

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This is really important, and I skipped this last time. First, I am epoxying the inserts on the backside, and then I will add the 2 part clear to fill in the cupped inserts.

I'm also making sure the inserts are nice and clean on the bottom as well as checking other things I sort of skipped on my last attempt, like cleaning the crud in the star rollover inserts!

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I also flattenened out the raised wood that appears under every playfield post. Vid and others stress the importance of getting the playfield flat. There seems to be two ways to do this: sand the lumps or flatten with a punch. I decided to use the punch method. I don't know if Vid mentions this method but I read it elsewhere. It's faster, but I kind of suspect that using a punch is to level these lumps is only temporary? Well, I flattened then a week ago and with some mild humidity here this week they stayed flat, so I think I'm okay.

I'm glad I did this as it will make sanding a lot easier.

The one thing that will happen is that the ink that was on the raised post lumps will flake off. But since I'm doing a ton of repainting, this isn't a problem.

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The shooter lane got a lot of extra sanding too. I still might take it down a bit more before I put down my first "lock down" coat of clear, but it already looks 10 times better:

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You can see the lighter wood areas in the above photo in the shooter lane.

I had to really sand the ball tracks down here as it was filthy and deep. I will either have to add a bit of stain (don't really want to do that) or sand down more of the wood around the ball track (more likely) to get the wood sanded areas to blend better.

As a reference, this is what the ball tracks used to look like:

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Thanks! Honestly, I feel like this Sinbad restoration is something of an obsession now!

Yes, the sides of the cabinet are plywood, the front, back and bottom are all metal.

Your idea on painting the front is greatl! I hadn't thought of it, but you're right that a cool paint job on that black front would be cool!

Now you got me thinking.....

Updated 'Project Plan'. Having learned a lot and getting a duplicate machine, I thought I would revise my original plan. No more Spraymax 1k. Also, I had too many coats of clear planned for in my original plan. Again, I don' think I need to clear between each coat of Createx/Airbrush touchups. I've also removed the parts underneath the playfield, making the restoration a lot simpler.

Sinbad Project Plan Revised.pdf

Attempting to fill my cupped inserts with SprayMax 1k resulted in a bubble-filled disaster, and was the reason I desperately sought a replacement playfield (I will ultimately replace the inserts in the first one, but that will take several months to do and probably not able to clear coat until next summer when it gets warm enough!).

Yesterday I bit the bullet and bought REAL 2PAC from an auto shop. Using an eyedropper I filled the cupped inserts with the new 2PAC. What a difference, right?

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In preparing for my first 'sealing coat' of Spraymax 2k last weekend, I started to do a bit more cleaning with alcohol and q-tips. I thought that I had done as much as I could to get this new 'replacement' playfield clean (as you can see from the photos above, it was filthy). I started to notice that I was getting even more dirt out that I thought was too far ingrained. So I kept going.

Frankly, this new playfield is in much better shape than I thought - it was just REALLY REALLY dirty! So I did some touch up tests with a brush on the hard to paint yellow scimitar. The good news is that I don't think I'll need to airbrush the yellow at all! Yayy!! Below is my color-matching. I think it turned out pretty good as its only possible to see it from an angle with the light glare - compare the middle with the bottom (I'm really excited because even the digital camera emphasizes differences that the naked eye doesn't). The top photo is what I started with on this replacement.

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