(Topic ID: 208885)

SilverballMania

By hawkster1

6 years ago


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#1 6 years ago

Hi I've been having problems with my game for a very longtime and have been dealing with Quench. He told me to try going into pinside forum to possibly find someone in my local area(MA) who I could meet for a hands on repair, and that is my main reason for writing. Brief summary of problems: F5 20a general illumination fuse blew on start up, disconected the J1 connector on rectifier board fuse didn't blow leading me to beleive short is in playfield. All wiring seems original lots of bulbs and dont want to unsolder ever one. I could leave J1 off and play with no lights!!! not much of a fix there,sure wold like a step by step fix it. This is a bigger problem, when doing a selenoid test the following are not working. #s 01....04....05....07....08....09 Those are the outhole kicker. slingshots, and thumper bumpers. Seems to me with that many out a short should be real noticable , wondering if the first in series is blocking the others,and I cant play the machine like that, can somebody help. Thanks HAWK

#2 6 years ago
Quoted from hawkster1:

Hi I've been having problems with my game for a very longtime and have been dealing with Quench. He told me to try going into pinside forum to possibly find someone in my local area(MA) who I could meet for a hands on repair, and that is my main reason for writing. Brief summary of problems: F5 20a general illumination fuse blew on start up, disconected the J1 connector on rectifier board fuse didn't blow leading me to beleive short is in playfield. All wiring seems original lots of bulbs and dont want to unsolder ever one. I could leave J1 off and play with no lights!!! not much of a fix there,sure wold like a step by step fix it. This is a bigger problem, when doing a selenoid test the following are not working. #s 01....04....05....07....08....09 Those are the outhole kicker. slingshots, and thumper bumpers. Seems to me with that many out a short should be real noticable , wondering if the first in series is blocking the others,and I cant play the machine like that, can somebody help. Thanks HAWK

Those playfield solenoids probably aren't working because the fuse on the bottom of the playfield near the Flippers is blown.

#3 6 years ago

In solenoid test, are solenoids 02, 03 and 06 activating? (make sure J1 is reconnected to the rectifier board, and leave fuse F5 out for now)

If not, grab your multi-meter, and set it to DC voltage.
Put the black meter lead on a ground point and red meter lead on each side of that 1A playfield fuse. Do you measure 43V on each side of the fuse?
If you then put the red meter lead on TP5 of the rectifier board do you also measure 43V there ?

#4 6 years ago

MrBally ..Quench ..and everyone else lookimg on. Just checked out my Silverball Mania game and found the following . As far as the lighting problems , I have majority of lights on the blackboard and also playfield, some burnt out. I do not have lights on the three coin slots on door however. Found out that if I disconnect connector on coin assembly I do not blow the F5 20A fuse, thinking that is where the short lies. I dont see anything obvious, I will try to send pictures. When I do the selenoid test some work, but six do not, and I get no reaction even when manually grounding Q14..Q14 ... Q7... Q8, ect. FYI the selenoid board has been overhauled and tested ,along with the MPU board and the Rectifier board. I will recheck the voltages on fuses and TP5 as requested by Quench, and report in.

#5 6 years ago

Hello all forget what I wrote about the coin door not blowing F5 fuse ,just found it blown after all,It may a the playfield problem after all,even though most lights are lit. guess I wont need to send pics of door. I did the selenoid test again and found s 02..03...06...10 and 11 selenoids working. I have 43V on TP5 and 43V both sides of playfield 1A lower fuse 5A on lower side of upper 1A fuae and same for the upper side ,but when upper side of that one is touched, it energizes a selenoid. The saga continues.

#6 6 years ago

So the playfield does have solenoid power. The power to each solenoid (yellow wire) is daisy chained from one solenoid to the next. You will notice all except one solenoid will have two yellow wires soldered on one of the solenoid lugs. Since the two solenoids at the kicker below the flippers are working, they are most likely at the start of the solenoid power daisy chain. It is most likely a yellow wire has come off one of these solenoids leaving no power to the remaining playfield solenoids. Any chance you can post some clear pictures of the two solenoids on this kicker mechanism?

#7 6 years ago

I'm working on the picture thing,will happen, but need a little time and help. The playfield does have selenoid power to knocker,kick and downup kicker, flipper enable and I think the coin lockout door also. If the power is daisy chained and your saying the the first in line is the up kicker, and that feeds all, wouldn't that include the one I mentioned, why are they working? Will look at the selenoid world again and check yellow wires. Will get back to you hopefully with pictures. Thanks again. Hawk

#8 6 years ago

Power to the playfield goes first to the flippers and 1 amp fuse. After the playfield fuse it probably goes to the two kicker solenoids since they are closest to the fuse. From there my guess it will go to either the outhole solenoid or slingshots since they are next closest to the kicker. A yellow wire must have come off one of these solenoids breaking the daisy chain. You'll have to inspect the yellow wire on all the solenoids looking for one that's loose or broken off.

The knocker is in the bottom of the cabinet. The flipper enable relay is in the back box on the solenoid driver board. The coin lockout is on the coin door - these three are separately wired directly from the rectifier board and are not daisy chained off the playfield.

[EDIT] Actually, doesn't this game have two playfield fuses? One fuse for the kicker assembly and another fuse for the remaining playfield solenoids?

#9 6 years ago

Looking at the schematics, there are two playfield fuses. One fuse with a white wire goes to the two kicker solenoids (your working playfield solenoids), another fuse with a yellow wire coming off it feeds the remaining playfield solenoids (the ones that aren't working).
Have you checked that the second fuse with the yellow wire is good and are you getting 43 volts on both sides of it?

#10 6 years ago

I just took readings on selenoids,as follows: I have 43V on the outhole,kick and down, left flipper,right flipper and knocker. I do not have voltage on the right slingshot, left slingshot and nothing on the left,right, and center thumper bumpers either. All the yellow wires are soldered on and making good contact. The playfield fuses have different voltages the lower has 43V on both sides and the upper has 5V,on both sides ( will check again), and ativates a selenoid when tested to ground,
that seems weird to me, and wondering why only 5V and not 43V thought 5V was for lighting,shouldn't set off a selenoid.

#11 6 years ago

sounds like the brown input wire to the main playfield coils is broken. You are correct the game has 2 playfield fuses. One is for the up down kicker assembly, the other fuse is for the rest of the coils. The kicker coils are powered from one of the fuses with a white wire coming off the fuse holder. The rest of the coils which are not working are fed by a yellow wire coming off the other fuse holder. Both fuse holders share the same input brown wire. If the brown wire measures 43v at one fuse and 0 at the other the wire is broken somewhere in-between.

#12 6 years ago

Borrowed the following picture from Atari_Daze recent Silverball Mania resto thread:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/polishing-up-a-silverball-mania

The two playfield fuses are connected together with the brown solenoid power wires circled in pink below. This brown power wire then goes directly to the flipper solenoids.
If the top fuse with the yellow wire has 5 volts on both sides you have a bad connection in that circled spot where the brown wires connect to the fuses.

Click the image to zoom in:

Are your fuses hooked up like this or differently?

SilverBallMania_PF_Fuses2.jpgSilverBallMania_PF_Fuses2.jpg

#13 6 years ago

That's funny Quench I wanted to post a pic of those fuse holders for this yesterday but had already moved all my images off my phone, which is all I had access to at the time.
Glad I could help!

OP, consider replacing the fuse holders on your machine as one of mine, which was original, had broken.

#14 6 years ago
Quoted from Atari_Daze:

OP, consider replacing the fuse holders on your machine as one of mine, which was original, had broken.

Good point. I usually replace mine too because the clips on the old fuse holders get loose and tend to snap off.

#15 6 years ago

Quench, Thanks for the picture of playfield, you are way faster and better at it than me. The lastest of my adventures: placed neg lead of VOM to a grounding braid and started up the machine to test for 43V at upper playfield 1A fuse, and blew it. When checking I have 43V through lower 1A fuse and 43V on one side of blown fuse (brown wire side). Have no idea why if popped. I visually traced all the yellow leads to selenoids looking for direct short and could find nothing obvious. Is it possible a shorted selenoid cound be the culprit? I dont want to unsolder every selenoid until fuse doesn't blow.

#16 6 years ago

Did the fuse blow the moment you powered on the machine, or about 7 seconds after power-up when the game usually begins attract mode and plays the welcome melody?

Your problem could be a shorted diode on a solenoid, a diode soldered backwards on a solenoid (diodes are directional), a diode missing or leg broken off a solenoid, a shorted driver transistor on the solenoid driver board, or other.
Diodes have a silver band on one side - check every solenoid and make sure the banded side of the diodes are soldered to the solenoid lug that has the yellow power wire. See the picture below: Also found a closeup picture of the two playfield fuses for reference.

Are you using slow blow 1 amp fuses? Fast blow 1 amp fuses are not suitable for this circuit and will blow on first solenoid activation.

Remove the J5 connector from the solenoid driver board. This will disconnect most of the playfield solenoids except for the outhole solenoid. Replace the 1 amp slow blow fuse and see if it blows again on powerup - if it does, take note of when.

Both pictures courtesy of Atari_Daze recent Silverball Mania resto thread again

Show power wire connected to solenoid oriented to banded side of the diodeShow power wire connected to solenoid oriented to banded side of the diode
Closeup view of Silverball Mania playfield fusesCloseup view of Silverball Mania playfield fuses

#17 6 years ago

That yellow wire is shorted somewhere or a bad coil. Closely examine it as it runs around the playfield. If worse comes to worse narrow it down by unsoldering at each coil it stops at. Try to narrow down where the short or bad coil is.

#18 6 years ago

Thanks again for the pictures Quench. I checked all the diodes and bans were correctly l on the yellow wire side . You did tell me about that a long time ago and I had to replace two that were wrong, which stopped the ! amp fuse from blowing,only hope I didn,t apply too much heat when soldering/unsoldering them, if so I have more replacements. How do I a doide check? Also when I reversed the directions on them, the 1 amp slow blow fuse stopped blowing, thought I fixed the problem,but it's back. You told me of a place here I could purchase the 1 amp fuses at a good price,do you remember the place, and let me know ,if not I'll try searching through some of our old letters. The way things are going I may also need a supplier for the F5 20A 32 V fuses. It's possible that the fuse blew after 7 seconds, I wasn't 'looking at the fuse right away, and I only have 1 good 1amp sl blow fuse left . I have clips available and if any fuses are loose or heated,will replace.

#19 6 years ago
Quoted from hawkster1:

How do I a doide check?

To properly test diodes on a solenoid, you need to disconnect one side of the diode off the solenoid otherwise the solenoid winding will adversely affect the diode reading..
Having said that, without disconnecting the diode you can check if it has shorted.
Set your multimeter to ohm resistance mode on the lowest scale.
With the machine OFF, put your meter leads on each side of a solenoid lugs. If you measure near zero ohms, the diode is likely shorted. If you measure around 11 ohms (which is the typical solenoid resistance of the solenoids on your machine), the diodes *might* be ok. Do this on each playfield solenoid. Remember there is also the outhole solenoid hidden under the apron.

With your multimeter still on low scale ohms resistance mode and machine OFF, if you put one meter lead on the machines metal side rail (ground) and the other meter lead on the yellow wire at the fuse holder, what resistance do you read?

Quoted from hawkster1:

You told me of a place here I could purchase the 1 amp fuses at a good price,do you remember the place

It was a 100 pack on ebay from China. They are a crappy type though (good enough while you're fault find this), but they will be weeks away in transit and I want to keep momentum up here. Any chance of you find a cheap source locally? Remember they need to be slow blow type.

Alternatively you might be better off building circuit breaker fuses so you can just reset them when they trip - see here:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/push-button-resetting-circuit-breakers
You probably need 0.75 amp circuit breaker for the solenoids, and 10 or 15 amp circuit breaker for the GI lamps.

Otherwise if you can get pictures happening we might be able to spot the issue fairly quickly.

#20 6 years ago

Quench, thanks for reply on fuses, ect. I looked at circuit breaker site and checked for .75 amp breaker found one there but it was a one pole type,not sure if that is usable ,hopefully an old fuse will fit. More choices with the 10-15 range.Looked at the 15 amps and there are one and two poles available, but the voltages vary, not sure how important that is,let me know please. Will take resistance checks on selenoids and let you know.

#21 6 years ago

Try digi-key for breakers.
I have these I use for trouble shooting.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/polishing-up-a-silverball-mania/page/6#post-4171746

Screenshot_20180213-105513 (resized).pngScreenshot_20180213-105513 (resized).png

#22 6 years ago

Thanx Atari_Daze for info. Looks like it plugs into an outlet instead of a fuse clip. Will look into the site.

#23 6 years ago

Quench... here's the latest on selenoids. I checked all and found all read the same except left selenoid (slingshot) was different. I removed it replaced diode, just in case and get the same measurement. I have 15V on yellow side to ground, and 4V on the other. All the others read 15V on yellow side and 25V on the other. All read 11V across both leads, including the left slingshot selenoid.

#24 6 years ago

Circuit breakers don't come with fuse attachments - the idea is that you have to solder them to a blown fuse so you have a way to connect them to the game. Worst case you could just use alligator clips.

Quoted from hawkster1:

I have 15V on yellow side to ground, and 4V on the other. All the others read 15V on yellow side and 25V on the other. All read 11V across both leads, including the left slingshot selenoid.

When you took these measurements, how did you have your multimeter set?
I presume the reading you got on the yellow side of this left slingshot was the same reading as the yellow connection on the other solenoids? i.e. it was the other side of the solenoid (where you mention 4V) that gave you a different reading compared to other solenoids?

#25 6 years ago

If you check the link in the post, it would have taken you to this image.

c6b59bcbdbc525e57d90c8a41ff6442aef6e8495 (resized).jpgc6b59bcbdbc525e57d90c8a41ff6442aef6e8495 (resized).jpg

#26 6 years ago

Atari_Daze Your'e right I didn't check the link, makes sense now,thanks. Quench , first of all these are not votage readings,meant they were resistance readings, using the ohms scale. The readings on ALL selenoids read about 11 ohms across the two leads,yellow, and brownish,except no readings on the kick and down and also the one in the coin door had no readings,(possibly because not powered up or because one of the 1 amp slow blow fuses is blown) When I take resistance readings with black meter ground lead to a ground strap and the red lead to a selenoid lead, that's when I get 15 ohms on the yellow side and 25 on the other,EXCEPT for the left slingshot selenoid,which reads 15 ohms on yellow and 4 ohms on the other lead. I tried following the brown side wire back to where it originates, and it goes to black box . I even removed and replaced the diode,and that didn't change the readings.

#27 6 years ago
Quoted from hawkster1:

first of all these are not votage readings,meant they were resistance readings, using the ohms scale.

Great, thanks for clarifying.

Quoted from hawkster1:

The readings on ALL selenoids read about 11 ohms across the two leads,yellow

Cool, that's what they all should be measuring.

Quoted from hawkster1:

When I take resistance readings with black meter ground lead to a ground strap and the red lead to a selenoid lead, that's when I get 15 ohms on the yellow side and 25 on the other,EXCEPT for the left slingshot selenoid,which reads 15 ohms on yellow and 4 ohms on the other lead.

Ok, it could be a shorted driver transistor on the Solenoid Driver Board (SDB) or maybe somehow that lead is shorted to the lamp GI which is why the 20amp fuse is blowing.

Can you please perform the following with the machine OFF:
Set your meter to low ohms mode and hookup the black lead to the ground strap or the GND test point on the SDB.
If you put the red meter lead on the metal tabs of the following SDB driver transistors, what resistance do you measure?
Q4 (Outhole Kicker) =
Q8 (Right Pop Bumper) =
Q13 (Left Pop Bumper) =
Q14 (Center Pop Bumper) =
Q9 (Left Slingshot) =
Q10 (Right Slingshot) =

Then disconnect connector J5 from the SDB and measure the resistance of that other wire on the left slingshot again and report the reading.

BTW the "other" wire on the left slingshot should be orange with red bands. Confirm this is its color and not brown.

#28 6 years ago

Here's what I got, Quench:

Q4 = 26
Q8 = 26
Q13 = 26
Q14 = 26 ( when J5 disconnected on SDB I got 0 reading on the orange/red wire of left slingshot, and also 0 the yellow wire.)
Q 9 = 4 Q10 =25

#29 6 years ago
Quoted from hawkster1:

( when J5 disconnected on SDB I got 0 reading on the orange/red wire of left slingshot, and also 0 the yellow wire.)

So before J5 was disconnected, on the left slingshot solenoid you measured 15 ohms on the yellow wire and 4 ohms on the orange-brown wire to ground. After you disconnected J5 from the SDB you now measured 0 ohms on both those wires to ground of that left slingshot solenoid??
What do you measure on both wires of the right slingshot solenoid when SDB J5 is disconnected ?

Again with J5 disconnected, can you re-measure the resistance at transistor Q9 (black meter lead on ground, red meter lead on the metal tab of Q9)?

#30 6 years ago

Quench, on both sides of right slingshot selenoid I have 0 amps there also. I rechecked the Q9 and read 4 amps still, with J5 disconnected.

#31 6 years ago
Quoted from hawkster1:

I rechecked the Q9 and read 4 amps still, with J5 disconnected.

Sounds like Q9 is shorted. It's probably causing the left slingshot to lock on when you power on the game resulting in that 1amp playfield fuse consistently blowing.

Quoted from hawkster1:

on both sides of right slingshot selenoid I have 0 amps there also.

1) When you say 0 amps, do you mean zero reading or do you mean no reading?
2) Can you clarify how you're measuring this?
3) What meter lead are you putting where?
4) When you put the meter lead on the solenoid lugs does the meter display change? What number does it change from and go to?

I need to understand if this is a misreading of the meter of if there's a dead short we still need to track down.

#32 6 years ago

When I wrote 0 amps that means the meter did not move make a noise, or do anything. I didn't mean infinity, I get no reading.I am using the meter in the resistance setting,even with the sound on. I place the black (neg) lead on the ground strap stapled along side of cabinet, and I also used the gnd terminal and the SDB when doing the checks on the transistors. Tried using the grounding strap there also , and got same readings. I touch the red lead to any points that need testing. When I got any readings with selenoids before slingshot ie. kick and down, I get 564 or, something like that,not sure what that means,except for the fact that meter is working, and connected correctly. If you need to know what selenoids are giving that reading let me know . I also found the site for the breakers needed for testing,will order, and want to thank Atari-Daze again for that info.

#33 6 years ago
Quoted from hawkster1:

When I wrote 0 amps that means the meter did not move make a noise, or do anything.

Understood. A reading of zero and a reading of no change are polls apart with resistance

You mentioned with J5 disconnected from the SDB that the Q9 transistor metal tab resistance to ground was 4 ohms.
Do the same resistance check with some other SDB transistor metal tabs such as Q8, Q10, Q13 and Q14. You should either get very high resistance readings or the meter may not respond at all. If this is the case it confirms transistor Q9 is shorted and needs to be replaced.

#34 6 years ago

OK will check resististances on transistors Q8 thru Q14, if very high like you said, I will replace the Q9, and take another reading. I have resistors already in stock. Will let you know , thanks Quench

#35 6 years ago

I checked transistors and got no reading (no movement at all) on all the resistors EXCEPT: Q3 = 556
Q19 = 1040
Q 9 = 4

Seems to me when J5 was connected and I tried to ground selenoids I had reaction with selenoids reacting, no idea why things are the way they are now, hard to believe 16 transistors are bad. Should I still replace the Q9 anyways?

#36 6 years ago

Q3 is for the Knocker and Q19 is for the Coin Lockout coil. Both of these are in the cabinet wiring and come from connector J2 on the SDB which you've still got connected. The readings for these two are good.

Replace Q9. Your readings indicate it's shorted.

After you replace transistor Q9 (it is a TIP102 model transistor - make sure it goes in the same way as the other transistors), reconnect J5 on the SDB and measure the resistance on both lugs of the left slingshot solenoid and also the right slingshot solenoid and report the readings. Note, we are not ready to switch the machine on yet.

#37 6 years ago

Quench I replaced the transistor (TIP102) hooked up the J5 and have nothing on either the left or right slingshots, nothing whatsoever on the readout. BTW after connecting J5 I tried readings on the Q9 to ground and get nothing at any, except transistors Q3....Q15...Q19 give something.

#38 6 years ago

Cool.
BTW, transistor Q15 drives the flipper enable relay on the SDB which is hard wired so that's why you're getting a reading on that one - we've accounted for the three transistors currently giving you readings. You have no readings on the other transistors because of the blown/missing fuse on the playfield. So far so good.

Can you please install a good fuse into the playfield fuse holder but *don't* switch on the machine. Install all connectors on the SDB including J5.

With the machine off, re-measure the resistance on the metal tabs of the following transistors. What do you get for each?

Q4 (Outhole Kicker) =
Q8 (Right Pop Bumper) =
Q13 (Left Pop Bumper) =
Q14 (Center Pop Bumper) =
Q9 (Left Slingshot) =
Q10 (Right Slingshot) =
Q12 (Up Kicker Coil) =
Q11 (Kick and Down Coil) =

#39 6 years ago

Not cool.
I installed a good 1 amp slo blow fuse, on playfieldf, and also put in a new 20 amp in F5 on selenoid board (Lighting), just to be sure.

Q4 (Outhole Kicker) = 0 Q8 (Rght. Pop up ) = 0 Q13 (left Pop up) =0 Q14 (CENTER POP UP) = 0

Q9 ( Left Slingshot ) = 0 Q10 ( Rght. Slingshot ) = 0 Q 12 (Up kicker Coil ) = 558 Ohms Q11 (Kick and Down Coil ) = 547 ohms

#40 6 years ago

Ok, by "0" to mean zero ohms right? (i.e. you don't mean no reading)?

If it's zero ohms:
Remove the 1 amp slow blow fuse and remeasure just the left and right slingshots again.
Then remove the 20 amp GI fuse from the rectifier board (so both fuses are removed). Remeasure just the left and right slingshots again.
Then install the 1 amp slow blow fuse only (leave the 20 amp fuse out) and remeasure just the left and right slingshots again.

We're trying to determine if the short is on the solenoid power line is to ground or the G.I circuit.

#41 6 years ago

Hi again. I removed the 1 amp slo blow playfield ,left the 20 amp GI fuse in: left slingshot yellow side = 0 or/red side = 0 (right slingshot same reading)

I removed the 1 amp slo blow playfield fuse and 20 amo GI fuse : left slingshot yellow side = 0 or/red side = 0 (right slingshot same reading)

I the installed the 1 amp slow blow playfield fuse, and removed the 20 amp GI fuse; left slingshot yellow side= 552 ohms or/red side =562

right slingshot yellow side = 582 ohms or/red side = 595 ohms

#42 6 years ago

Hi, can I please get you to clarify what you mean by "0" again. Is it zero ohms or meter didn't respond?
If it's zero ohms, your readings are bad news and there's still short circuits to track down.
If it's no meter response, your readings are good news. In this case, please use "NR" (No Response) to indicate this reading. Stating "0" as a resistance measurement means a short circuit which is the complete opposite resistance reading to the meter not responding.

In resistance mode when you put the two meter probes together, your meter will show 0 or very close to it, indicating a short circuit.

#43 6 years ago

OK understood. When I write (0) I mean NR, my mistake ,can see why that leads to confusion. If I touch both leads then I get close to 0 and it also beeps when I set that way.

#44 6 years ago

Quench, hope this makes thing better: 20 amp GI fuse in 1 amp sl. blow fuse out Left Slingshot NR Right Slingshot NR

20 amp GI fuse out 1 amp sl. blow fuse out Left Slingshot NR Right Slingshot NR

20 amp GI fuse out 1 amp sl. blow fuse in Left Slingshot yel. lead 552 ohms org/red lead 562 ohms

Right Slingshot yel. lead 582 ohms org/red lead 595 ohms

#45 6 years ago

Yes that's much clearer, thanks

Ok, your readings are good so far.

I'd like to check some things on the Solenoid Driver Board before we power up. Just want to avoid unnecessarily blowing another fuse.

You replaced transistor Q9 on the SDB. Just above it there's a diode marked as CR9. Can you do a resistance check across this diode? i.e. red meter lead on one side of the diode, black meter lead on the other side of the diode and measure it. Then swap the leads around and measure again. Note if the diode leads are tarnished black make sure you get good contact with the meter leads otherwise you might not get a reading (i.e. just clean/scrape away some of the tarnish).

Now, if you remember how to test diodes by setting your meter to diode mode (I gave you details about doing this some time ago), test the diode in diode mode on your meter.

Post the results of the meter readings across that diode both in resistance mode and diode mode - also the readings when you swap the meter leads around.

Lastly, next to diode CR9 there is a resistor called R26. Does it look burnt in any way? Can you still see the color bands around it (the colors indicate its resistance value). Compare the way it looks against the resistors next to the other diodes along the same row of diodes/resistors.

[EDIT] The tests I've mentioned to do on diode CR9, do the same on diode CR8 and diode CR10 so you have something to compare to.

#46 6 years ago

Great! Stand by for news, thanks "Quenchman"

#47 6 years ago

I'm back. tested with 1amp fuse in and 20 amp out. Diode CR1 resistance = 482 ohms ... reverse = 482 resistor R26 color bands or,or,brn.slvr

Diode = 330 ... reverse = 331

CR8 resistance = 469 ohms ... reverse = 471 resistor R20 color bands or,or,purple,red
doide = 324 ... reverse = 324

CR10 resistance = 311 ohms...reverse = 312 resistor R28 color bands gold,br,or,or
diode = 222 ... reverse = 222 resistor R27 color bands br,red,br,blk

#48 6 years ago

You're using a Fluke meter right? The readings are in the vicinity of my Fluke meter so they're probably ok.

I know you're probably getting excited to power it up - please bear with me for the moment.

Have you sourced any spare fuses yet?

Disconnect connector J5 from the SDB.
Remove the F5 20 amp fuse that's blowing from the rectifier board.
Install a good 1 amp slow blow fuse in the playfield.
Power on the machine keeping an eye on that 1 amp fuse, if it blows (it shouldn't) tell me exactly when after powerup (immediately of after 7 seconds)

Set your multi-meter to read DC voltage.
Black meter lead on a ground point.
With the red meter lead, measure the voltage on both sides of the F5 fuse clips on the rectifier board. Report both the results.

Now this time set your multi-meter to read AC voltage.
Black meter lead on a ground point.
With the red meter lead, measure the voltage on both sides of the F5 fuse clips on the rectifier board. Report both the results.

These tests will tell me if the circuit downstream from the 20 amp fuse is shorted to some other power rail (we hope not).

#49 6 years ago

Haven't received and spare fuses yet, want to get circuit breakers also, looking for good prices on fuses .
Disconnnected J5 fro SDB and connected the 1 amp slow blow,powered up and didn't blow fuse
With my Fluke meter in the DC range , lower F5 clip = .038 VDC upper lead = .036 VDC (doesn't seem like much to me )

AC range lower F5 clip = 7 VAC upper lead = 31.4 VAC

#50 6 years ago
Quoted from hawkster1:

With my Fluke meter in the DC range , lower F5 clip = .038 VDC upper lead = .036 VDC (doesn't seem like much to me )

These DC readings are good. You should not measure any DC voltages at this particular fuse. The G.I. circuit only has AC voltage.

Quoted from hawkster1:

AC range lower F5 clip = 7 VAC upper lead = 31.4 VAC

The lower clips 7 VAC is good, but the 31.4 VAC on the upper clip is BAD. The expected reading should be near 0 VAC on the upper clip so we need to find out what the story is.

Between the time that F5 wasn't blowing and when it started bowing, what changed?

Leave F5 removed, can you remeasure the F5 upper clip again in AC voltage mode just to reconfirm that 31.4 VAC reading?

That 31.4 VAC reading kinda tells me the issue is on the rectifier board, but lets eliminate everything downstream that we can first.

Next with the machine OFF, disconnect J1 and J3 from the rectifier board - these will disconnect the playfield and backbox respectively. Leave fuse F5 removed, power ON and remeasure the AC voltages on both sides of the F5 fuse clips again and report the results.

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