(Topic ID: 299129)

Should Pinside put a warning on new manufactures

By BigT

57 days ago


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  • 39 posts
  • 28 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 56 days ago by acedanger
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    Topic poll

    “Should Pinside put a warning message on new manufacturers ”

    • Yes 17 votes
      19%
    • No 56 votes
      62%
    • Only on Jpop 17 votes
      19%

    (90 votes)

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    -4
    #1 57 days ago

    So we have a shit show with another manufacturer that cost members of this hobby money. Should Pinside put a warning on manufacturer’s that have announced but not shipped? A warning on the front page might make new members think twice before sending money. Also I am aware that the warning would have been lifted on Heighway and Dutch.

    #3 57 days ago

    I guess the question is whom would this be protecting? Any rational person knewm Deeproot was never going to happen, it was more obvious than Skit-B. One more warning isn't going to "un-crazy" people.

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    #4 57 days ago

    Why? We are all adults and can spend money however we want. If someone wants to gamble on an unknown pinball company, that's on them. Do your homework and take risk into consideration. It's not up to pinside to babysit spending

    #5 57 days ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    I guess the question is whom would this be protecting? Any rational person knewm Deeproot was never going to happen, it was more obvious than Skit-B. One more warning isn't going to "un-crazy" people.

    I have always enjoyed playing pinball, but my first purchase was WOZ and Hobbit. I thought that pinball manufacturers were stable and my commitment of 17k meant that I would have the games. I also found Pinside around the same time and if there was a warning on the front page, I would have reconsidered my deposit.

    So to answer your question, if someone is new to this hobby, shouldn’t we warn them about the risks with a new manufacturer.

    #6 57 days ago
    Quoted from BigT:

    I have always enjoyed playing pinball, but my first purchase was WOZ and Hobbit. I thought that pinball manufacturers were stable and my commitment of 17k meant that I would have the games. I also found Pinside around the same time and if there was a warning on the front page, I would have reconsidered my deposit.
    So to answer your question, if someone is new to this hobby, shouldn’t we warn them about the risks with a new manufacturer.

    Okay so you put down 17k before you did any research...? Not sure how Pinside could help with that. The struggle is the nature of the schemes being incredible tight lipped and secretive. The “exclusivity” breeds FOMO. It’s hard to get through that to people who need to hear the truth.
    It’s also hard to believe someone spent nearly 60 million and still COULDN’T produce a pinball machine.

    21
    #7 57 days ago

    No, because there's liability for Pinside to specifically tell people who is safe to purchase from and who isn't. Sellers could get upset and retaliate. Customers could get upset and retaliate. Or, what if a former "bad" seller turns good, or a former "good" seller turns bad, and then someone retaliates?

    Anyone who wants to make a purchase should do their own research. There is plenty of info, opinions, and feedback out there to base your decision on.

    Besides, are you really going to trust some random person or website on the internet as the sole deciding factor for making a big purchase?

    I don't think anyone connected with Pinside knew any more than anyone else when it came to any of the big pinball company failures. I certainly didn't. I'm just another random pinball enthusiast on the internet.

    As another random pinball enthusiast in the internet, I've always recommended caution with any new endeavors or companies. But, some people are comfortable to take the risk. And that's perfectly fine, as long as you're aware of what you could potentially lose if things go sideways.

    #8 57 days ago
    Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

    Okay so you put down 17k before you did any research...? Not sure how Pinside could help with that. The struggle is the nature of the schemes being incredible tight lipped and secretive. The “exclusivity” breeds FOMO. It’s hard to get through that to people who need to hear the truth.
    It’s also hard to believe someone spent nearly 60 million and still COULDN’T produce a pinball machine.

    NooB’s sometimes don’t do research. I agreed to a payment plan not knowing the risks. It worked out for me, I received my games. If someone is new to this hobby, they should know the risk with new manufacturers. I was enamored with JJP being new, I never thought that they might be in trouble.

    It is easy to put the onus on the individual. As a community, we need to help those new to the hobby, that all manufacturers are not created equal.

    #9 57 days ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    No, because there's liability for Pinside to specifically tell people who is safe to purchase from and who isn't. Sellers could get upset and retaliate. Customers could get upset and retaliate. Or, what if a former "bad" seller turns good, or a former "good" seller turns bad, and then someone retaliates?
    Anyone who wants to make a purchase should do their own research. There is plenty of info, opinions, and feedback out there to base your decision on.
    Besides, are you really going to trust some random person or website on the internet as the sole deciding factor for making a big purchase?
    I don't think anyone connected with Pinside knew any more than anyone else when it came to any of the big pinball company failures. I certainly didn't. I'm just another random pinball enthusiast on the internet.
    As another random pinball enthusiast in the internet, I've always recommended caution with any new endeavors or companies. But, some people are comfortable to take the risk. And that's perfectly fine, as long as you're aware of what you could potentially lose if things go sideways.

    Ok.. as both you and Isochronic_Frost have made extremely good reasons why not to have this, can you close this thread. I appreciate both of your contributions.

    #10 57 days ago
    Quoted from BigT:

    NooB’s sometimes don’t do research. I agreed to a payment plan not knowing the risks. It worked out for me, I received my games. If someone is new to this hobby, they should know the risk with new manufacturers. I was enamored with JJP being new, I never thought that they might be in trouble.
    It is easy to put the onus on the individual. As a community, we need to help those new to the hobby, that all manufacturers are not created equal.

    It could just as easily have NOT worked out for you - you happened to strike it lucky.

    It isn't possible to know what each companies circumstances or finances are and (just one example) even if we knew 100% that deeproot had $58M - so what? It didn't seem to matter.

    Another company might just as easily start with a far more modest sum and be entirely successful - look at Spooky as just one other example. Started with MUCH less than deeproot but are very obviously FAR more successful.

    Your suggestion has no merit.

    #11 57 days ago

    Everything you buy comes with a risk. Just like every fart you squeeze out comes with a risk

    #12 57 days ago
    Quoted from BigT:

    NooB’s sometimes don’t do research.

    if you‘re really a noob, won‘t you visit a distributor and select an existing game in the showroom and in stock?

    #13 57 days ago

    No, Pinside does not promote itself as a place that analyzes the financial viability of new start-up companies

    Should pinside also check the financials of the people selling mods?

    #14 57 days ago

    I suppose NOOBS would benefit from all the knowledge and experience offered by members of this site. Read the comments and wise up would be my advice.

    But there are some monumentally stupid people here, who have now had their fingers burned for the third time, after blindly chucking money at Predator, Alien and now RAZA. I weep for these people, there truly is no hope for them.

    #15 57 days ago

    No, what would be the point? No newbies got burned by Deeproot. The sad part is, the people who got burned are Pinside veterans. You could have posted a 4000 page warning (and we did) and it wouldn’t have changed their minds. You cannot warn against “delusion”.

    #16 57 days ago
    Quoted from thedarkknight77:

    No, what would be the point? No newbies got burned by Deeproot. The sad part is, the people who got burned are Pinside veterans. You could have posted a 4000 page warning (and we did) and it wouldn’t have changed their minds. You cannot warn against “delusion”.

    Agree 100%. Plus the DR thread had so much uncertainly on every page it was impossible not to notice. Some things you just deserve if you ignore all the warning signs.

    That said, close this thread

    #17 57 days ago

    if anyone, noob or veteran, is relying on Pinside to hold their hand during common sense decision making, their problems go well beyond just pinball.

    #18 57 days ago
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    #19 57 days ago

    silly post ....

    #20 57 days ago

    A bunch of noobs - and a few vets - were cajoled, bullied, begged, ordered, plead with, and every variation of all to NOT buy into Deep Root, and they still couldn't resist the charms of marketing genius Robert Mueller and the allure of a proposed pinball game that looked about as fun as being forced to listen to a Yoko Ono box set.

    It's pointless. If the last year or so has proven beyond a reasonable doubt, people are more than willing - eager even! - to "do their own research" and ignore the advice of experts whether it means getting rooked on a pinball machine scam or landed in the hospital.

    #21 57 days ago

    Good way loose newbie luster make some mistakes .

    Should consider going into any luxury purchase . Money placed at risk for amusement value should be something you can afford to lose . Risk assessment something you do for yourself or blow off at your peril .

    No to pinside warning .

    Shane

    #22 57 days ago

    Nope!

    #23 57 days ago

    Please print and stick this on your checkbook.

    WARNING (resized).jpg

    #24 57 days ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    Please print and stick this on your checkbook.
    [quoted image]

    Or at the very least unless it’s a dream theme they say they have the license for without offering any proof. Also the game that will never be made needs to be promised to include “groundbreaking mechs.”

    #25 57 days ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    Please print and stick this on your checkbook.
    [quoted image]

    Fixed it for you:

    pasted_image (resized).png
    #26 57 days ago

    How about a general warning to never buy a pinball machine ever. All machines will have issues at some point. Old games always need more work than expected. Even established game manufactures have their risks where customers hope they get "a good one". Costs are always too expensive with the bubble bursting apocalypse right around the corner.

    #27 57 days ago

    Let's not do any more to keep people from critical thinking and having all their "opinions" spoon-fed to them.

    #28 57 days ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    Fixed it for you:
    [quoted image]

    Fixed 2.0

    3AE92C07-42EB-44B1-A2BB-46CCD7029115 (resized).jpeg
    #29 57 days ago

    Andrew called me directly and texted a picture of my Alien ready to be shipped. Learned a good lesson and it will never happen again.

    #30 57 days ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni:

    Fixed 2.0
    [quoted image]

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    #31 57 days ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni:

    Everything you buy comes with a risk. Just like every fart you squeeze out comes with a risk

    This man is wise.

    P.S. stop prepaying stuff you dopes.

    #32 57 days ago
    Quoted from BigT:

    It is easy to put the onus on the individual. As a community, we need to help those new to the hobby, that all manufacturers are not created equal.

    Owning a game is not a requirement of the hobby. Pinball machines in the home are luxury items, not necessities. If a person is doing well enough to drop $6k+ on a new machine, they should be intelligent enough to do the research first. I have zero sympathy for people who've lost money on shenanigans over the years. Their mortgage is still getting paid and their kids aren't going hungry. Nobody is getting hurt, other than their bank account slightly dropping. You're trying to help people that shouldn't need help. Worst case, they learn an expensive lesson. I'll advise friends about new manufacturers, but don't care about the rest.

    #33 57 days ago

    No, but perhaps Pinside should run a spelling and grammar course! "Manufacturers"

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    #34 56 days ago

    We could use a warning on stupid threads

    #35 56 days ago
    Quoted from Lhyrgoif:

    We could use a warning on stupid threads

    It's not a stupid thread.

    It's actually a question that has surfaced a few times, which is why I took the time to respond to it.

    #36 56 days ago

    I do not get this thing these days that the internet is to blame and also responsible to solve that people are stupid.

    #37 56 days ago

    It's like buying a stock of a start up company vs. one that's been in business a long time. You want to try to get something new and fresh then you have to accept the risk the product may never materialize.

    Same goes with people going for the too good to be true used games deals and end up getting burned.

    Buy from established companies with a track record (Stern, JJP, AP & CGC) and established Pinsiders with good reviews and you will most likely have no issues like losing your $.

    I also don't feel sorry for those that go for the start up companies with no track record or buy from Pinsiders with no longevity or reviews. I am happy to pay a few extra bucks for the safety of a good established company/Pinsider.

    #38 56 days ago

    Pinside should always make sure your shoelaces are tied too...

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