(Topic ID: 324225)

Screws seller?

By Pin_Fandango

1 year ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 21 posts
  • 11 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by flynnibus
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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    #1 1 year ago

    Went to the local hardware store and the guys thought the screws from my pinball machine belonged to the Apollo 13.
    Oh! It has a washer in it, it does not come out… oh!

    Is Stern using custom made screws with star washers in them??? I thought this was standard lol

    Anyway, I will be restoring a game and want to have 6-8-10/32 in all the common lenghts at hand including the tapping #6 commonly used.

    I want to buy in bulk and save when possible. I really cant believe these are hard to find like those guy say?

    Any tips would be helpful, want to buy online.

    #2 1 year ago

    Did you try Fastenal?

    Pinball life or Marco carry them?

    #3 1 year ago

    I use boltdepot.com which was recommended by other Pinsiders.

    The older games do have some hardware that is old-school and hard to find. I think in the coin doors there are those screws with the toothed washer attached to them, those are hard to find. But easy enough to replicate with the right screw and washer.

    #4 1 year ago

    Yeah that is what they say, I need the ones with star washers in them.

    I am wondering if marco has them someone has to make them… no?

    No did not try fastenal but I will…

    #5 1 year ago

    I haven't looked for those specific ones, but my go-to source for fasteners in bulk of all sorts is McMaster-Carr: https://www.mcmaster.com/

    I'm sure the other sources mentioned above would be fine too.

    #6 1 year ago

    That got me curious, yes those screws are still a thing I guess. They are called Sems screws. The washer rotates freely but is permanently attached.

    https://www.boltdepot.com/SEMS_machine_screws_Phillips_pan_head_w__external_tooth_washer_Zinc_plated_steel.aspx

    https://www.mcmaster.com/washer-head-screws/

    #7 1 year ago

    Thanks. I guess the minimum wage employee never saw a sems a screw in the only hardware store in town called “ottawa fastener” lol
    The owner must be proud

    #8 1 year ago

    Ebay can often be a source of hardware.

    I look for North America sellers and free shipping.

    LTG : )

    #9 1 year ago

    Thanks everyone for the help!

    #10 1 year ago

    You can find some surprising stuff on Amazon. Yes try McMaster-Carr but they may not ship to Canada unless you say you are a business. And some stuff they will tell you there is a 175% anti-dumping duty and will cancel your order.

    #11 1 year ago

    Albany Fasteners co.

    #12 1 year ago

    Thank you.
    Fastenal seems to have these… I have not looked into amazon yet.

    Good stuff, thanks again!

    #13 1 year ago

    Just to add to this, I always enjoy learning new things. I was reading about how Sems screws are made and it sounds like a multi step process that is more involved than just making a screw. Then I looked at the pricing at boltdepot.com.

    A 1” 8-32 zinc plated steel Philips head Sems screw with external tooth washer (#26804) is 23 cents each, or $13.85/100 making it just under 14 cents each.

    The equivalent 1” 8-32 screw (#1555) is 8 cents each or just over 4 cents each for 100. The #8 external tooth washer (#3002) is 7 cents each or just under 3 cents for 100.

    So basically the Sems screws cost about twice as much, which makes sense given the more involved manufacturing process.

    A pinball restorer probably would not care much, as it will cost about $14 to get 100 of them vs $7. But if you are cheap and like to save money, you can achieve the same look and mechanical fit by buying them separately and putting them together yourself.

    A manufacturer buying them in large quantities would see a bigger cost effect. But I’m sure it’s well worth it to them, because the alternative during assembly is to have the worker grab a screw then a washer then fiddle with them to put them together. This will take more time and manual labor is expensive. Also, the worker can get tired or bored and make mistakes like leaving the washer off or putting on 2 washers. This will never be an issue with the Sems screws, just grab and go and it will be right every time.

    I can totally envision the pinball manufacturers making this decision to speed up and reduce the cost of construction.

    Overanalysis complete.

    #14 1 year ago
    Quoted from xsvtoys:

    Just to add to this, I always enjoy learning new things. I was reading about how Sems screws are made and it sounds like a multi step process that is more involved than just making a screw. Then I looked at the pricing at boltdepot.com.
    A 1” 8-32 zinc plated steel Philips head Sems screw with external tooth washer (#26804) is 23 cents each, or $13.85/100 making it just under 14 cents each.
    The equivalent 1” 8-32 screw (#1555) is 8 cents each or just over 4 cents each for 100. The #8 external tooth washer (#3002) is 7 cents each or just under 3 cents for 100.
    So basically the Sems screws cost about twice as much, which makes sense given the more involved manufacturing process.
    A pinball restorer probably would not care much, as it will cost about $14 to get 100 of them vs $7. But if you are cheap and like to save money, you can achieve the same look and mechanical fit by buying them separately and putting them together yourself.
    A manufacturer buying them in large quantities would see a bigger cost effect. But I’m sure it’s well worth it to them, because the alternative during assembly is to have the worker grab a screw then a washer then fiddle with them to put them together. This will take more time and manual labor is expensive. Also, the worker can get tired or bored and make mistakes like leaving the washer off or putting on 2 washers. This will never be an issue with the Sems screws, just grab and go and it will be right every time.
    I can totally envision the pinball manufacturers making this decision to speed up and reduce the cost of construction.
    Overanalysis complete.

    most of these have double washers. the star washer attached is to lock the 2nd washer underneath, so yeah, I think that it is a pain to deal with 2 washers. I rather just simplify.

    #15 1 year ago

    Thr toothed washer is used to get more bite to be resistant to vibration, etc. there is no value besides convenience to using sem screws verse toothed washers.

    I would be suspect of anything with sem screw with additional washer under it. That entirely defeats it’s purpose. The purpose of the teeth is to create extra friction between the bolt and the surface to resist rotation. A washer under that defeats it.

    You would normally see these in pins in metal brackets like coil brackets… and sometimes used with plastics to get bite.

    Just buy a box of #6, #8 star/tooth washers and call it a day.

    #16 1 year ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    Thr toothed washer is used to get more bite to be resistant to vibration, etc. there is no value besides convenience to using sem screws verse toothed washers.
    I would be suspect of anything with sem screw with additional washer under it. That entirely defeats it’s purpose. The purpose of the teeth is to create extra friction between the bolt and the surface to resist rotation. A washer under that defeats it.
    You would normally see these in pins in metal brackets like coil brackets… and sometimes used with plastics to get bite.
    Just buy a box of #6, #8 star/tooth washers and call it a day.

    A stern has these and double washers everywhere.
    You do you my man! I’ll do what Stern does.

    #17 1 year ago

    I know this doesn't help OP, but for others looking here I have found that my local ACE hardware is awesome for getting MOST of the screws I need in the pinball world. Unlike big box stores where you have to buy a whole box, Ace lets you buy them one at a time, and more importantly at least at my local ACE they are all neatly organized and you can handle them/pull them one at a time to find the right screw (or the closest).

    My only caution for you when using this is to TRIPLE CHECK the length of replacement screws put into the bottom of the playfield. I've seen too many horror stories of a screw just a little to long popping up into an otherwise perfect playfield.

    Also... luckily there is an ACE 5 minutes from my house so...

    #18 1 year ago
    Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:

    I know this doesn't help OP, but for others looking here I have found that my local ACE hardware is awesome for getting MOST of the screws I need in the pinball world. Unlike big box stores where you have to buy a whole box, Ace lets you buy them one at a time, and more importantly at least at my local ACE they are all neatly organized and you can handle them/pull them one at a time to find the right screw (or the closest).
    My only caution for you when using this is to TRIPLE CHECK the length of replacement screws put into the bottom of the playfield. I've seen too many horror stories of a screw just a little to long popping up into an otherwise perfect playfield.
    Also... luckily there is an ACE 5 minutes from my house so...

    Yes same here, ACE is 5 minutes away. I try to give them as much business as I can. Nice people own it and work there, you walk in the door and show them what you want and they take you right there, or you can browse the endless supply of various hardware, some obscure. I have about a 90% hit rate with weird stuff I have pulled off pinball machines.

    #19 1 year ago

    sadily; ACE isn't close to me. I think my closest one is like 45-1hr away.

    #20 1 year ago

    I came here wondering which seller got screwed...oh well.

    Anyways, when you're bored look up barrel nuts, sex bolts and Chicago screws. I need one for my Willys.

    Willys Jeep that is.

    #21 1 year ago
    Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

    A stern has these and double washers everywhere.

    Such as?

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