(Topic ID: 315654)

Sad to see yet another incident at the PHOF

By Kevin_LHeureux

82 days ago


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  • Latest reply 78 days ago by jeffro01
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    Post #131 Response from Tim Posted by timarnold (81 days ago)

    Post #144 PHOF rules sign Posted by PismoArcade (80 days ago)


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    There are 176 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 4.
    78
    #2 82 days ago

    I'm with the PHOF on this one.

    32
    #3 82 days ago

    Agreed, don't need kids spinning around on a concrete floor around other people and machines getting dizzy. Take the kid to a playground to spin, not an arcade.

    #4 82 days ago

    "He tells 8 News Now he is looking into legal action regarding Thursday’s incident".

    45
    #5 82 days ago

    Take your son outside and let him spin himself silly. When he's done bring him back in.

    What if he spun around and bonked his head on the corner of a table or machine? He would sue the establishment no doubt.

    There's a victim everywhere these days. Either looking for a handout or their 15 minutes of virtuous fame.

    62
    #6 82 days ago

    ... this is going to sound insensitive, but what are they supposed to do when someone says "he has autism" as a reason for ill behaviour. Is that a free ride to do anything? Where is it okay to say, "tough shit" to such an excuse? He's kicking the machines? Is that okay? He's harming others? Does that get a pass? Like, there has to be a line to take the kid elsewhere that's deemed "acceptable."

    #7 82 days ago

    Waiting for the PHoF legal defense fund GoFundMe. I think it would do well.

    15
    #8 82 days ago
    Quoted from jorant:

    ... this is going to sound insensitive, but what are they supposed to do when someone says "he has autism" as a reason for ill behaviour. Is that a free ride to do anything? Where is it okay to say, "tough shit" to such an excuse? He's kicking the machines? Is that okay? He's harming others? Does that get a pass? Like, there has to be a line to take the kid elsewhere that's deemed "acceptable."

    I have a niece that's special needs and growing up, she was extremely violent towards other children.

    My brother would get angry when other parents would complain to him when she would hit their child. He couldn't understand why they wouldn't give her a pass because of her circumstances.

    She pushed my daughter off of a trampoline once causing an injury and that led to a falling out between he and I that lasted almost a year.

    Not sure why I'm sharing this story except to say that while I realize what a tough road parents of special needs children have, when it affects others the parents should step in and alleviate the situation.

    #9 82 days ago

    Redacted.

    11
    #11 82 days ago
    Quoted from beelzeboob:

    I've never seen Robert Gagno do that. I'd love to hear his opinion on this...

    There is different degrees of autism.

    32
    #12 82 days ago

    Sounds like the parent is upset because someone *dared* tell his little angel "no", and then called it discrimination after the fact.

    There's usually a range of expected/acceptable behaviors depending on the establishment, and disability or not, you can't go into an establishment and let your child run wild and not expect someone to say something about it.

    If I saw a kid spinning around on a concrete floor, I would absolutely be concerned about him getting hurt and bouncing his head off the concrete. If the parent can't control the kid's behavior, then it's time for them to leave, and then possibly go somewhere else where that behavior is actually acceptable.

    #13 82 days ago

    Redacted.

    20
    #14 82 days ago

    Tim Arnold on this one. Its probably not the first time this parent has tried cashing in . Some do this for a living and settle out of court.
    In Mn we had a group that would go around small buainesses and find faults with ada compliance. They would threaten a lawsuit because the doorway was too small etc and settle out of court.

    16
    #15 82 days ago
    Quoted from beelzeboob:

    Yes...but he's in the best position to opine, I think. That's all I was saying.

    My eldest son had serious ADD before that slapped that name on every boy!Teachers rode us hard about his behavior and we did our best to not let him use this as an excuse for everything.He now has a Masters degree from Washington University Business college.We made him responsible as much as we could.The world was not designed to fit our needs.

    -32
    #16 82 days ago

    Nice empathy gang. Given the minimal detail in the article I’d hesitate to cast judgement on either side. But people’s willingness here to pile on a family with an autistic kid is pretty remarkable.

    -64
    #17 82 days ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    Sounds like the parent is upset because someone *dared* tell his little angel "no", and then called it discrimination after the fact.

    What a jerky comment. PHOF is open to the public or they are not. If they want to kick out special needs kids on a case by case basis then they had better be prepared to deal with the negative PR and repercussions of those decisions.

    -2
    #18 82 days ago

    Is there more footage than shown or did the reporter cherry pick? I think I know the answer. They only showed the kid spinning in place standing up slowly. My oldest son has always done that and even sometimes does and he's in middle school (never outgrew it). He's not autistic but is ADHD. When he twirls it's controlled and in no danger. There had to be more, otherwise it was an over reaction.

    That woman that works there also appeared really wound up. She was probably getting teamed up on because it said another family jumped in.

    34
    #19 82 days ago

    They didn't kick out a special needs kid. They kicked out an unruly kid.

    -33
    #20 82 days ago

    Oh I see, so he's clinically unruly?

    29
    #21 82 days ago
    Quoted from Pinstein:

    What a jerky comment. PHOF is open to the public or they are not. If they want to kick out special needs kids on a case by case basis then they had better be prepared to deal with the negative PR and repercussions of those decisions.

    This was about the kid's behavior and a safety issue for that kid. It had nothing to do with accommodating a special need. The parent had no situational awareness and then doubled down by inserting it into the news.

    #22 82 days ago

    More armchair judgement in this thread than Archie Bunker’s living room.

    #23 82 days ago

    I use this kind of logic with my wife.

    We take our shoes off when we come in the house. It helps keep it clean, especially in the winter. My stepson (27 years old), however, regardless of years of asking/threatening/pleading, still wears his in the house. "There's no place to sit and take them off/put them on", so we put a chair next to each door. He still doesnt do it. My wife and i fight over it on occasion still - I told her I dont want to get a soaker because he doesnt take his shoes off when it's snowing, so she says I should wear my slippers so my socks dont get wet.

    I tell her, well, using that same logic, from now on I'm gonna go around punching people in the head, so everyone needs to start wearing a football helmet.

    27
    #24 82 days ago
    Quoted from Pinstein:

    Oh I see, so he's clinically unruly?

    Nobody said that.

    Sometimes a kid's behavior at a certain time in a certain place is fine, sometimes it isn't.

    Playing with a ball in the yard and running around? Perfectly fine. Playing with a ball in the middle of the street? Probably unsafe.

    A kid crying or throwing a fit in a church during mass? Probably a good idea to take him outside until he calms down.

    #25 82 days ago

    So easy to recognize who isn’t a parent in this thread.

    #26 82 days ago

    Redacted.

    #27 82 days ago

    Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

    49
    #28 82 days ago
    Quoted from RandomGuyOffCL:

    So easy to recognize who isn’t a parent in this thread.

    I'm a parent, several times over. Kids are annoying, autism or no autism. If I had a kid who's coping mechanism was "spinning" I'd take outside and let him go crazy instead of bothering others in a business, especially if I was asked to do so. But you can't even suggest something like that to a entitled parent in today's sensitive world. Lawsuit!

    Is this reason #12882344 not to have an arcade? Poor Tim.

    #29 82 days ago
    Quoted from RandomGuyOffCL:

    So easy to recognize who isn’t a parent in this thread.

    I’m not sure which way you mean.

    Both of my kids had a problem with biting other kids. Many kids do it, but this was excessive. We did everything to control it but no luck. We were constantly called in to talk about it with the teachers and they nearly kicked my kids out of the pre-school.

    Putting myself in the shoes of other parents, the school did the right thing by coming down hard on us.

    If this parent sues, I’d say let it go to trial. Juries are smart about these things and wouldn’t give that parent much credit.

    -16
    #30 82 days ago

    It's a private business that's open to the public..... PHOF isn't comfortable with something going on, they have every right to kick anyone out.

    People are sooooo entitled these days.
    In the old days, your kid was making a fuss: the PARENT would remove the child immediately and discipline them with a spanking and then take them home.
    These days we should be taking the parents outside and give THEM a spanking. They're worse than the little horrors they spawn.

    Spare the rod and spoil the child. A lot of "Autism" would end immediately with a good dose of corporal punishment. You didn't see this nonsense when I was growing up, and now it's magically everywhere. Must be the gluten in food right?

    41
    #31 82 days ago

    Anyone that frequents PHOF knows that Tim has a zero tolerance policy for unruly behavior from anyone. Signs are also posted everywhere regarding children running through the place, use of profanity, abusing the machines, etc.

    Tim is an equal opportunity enforcer of the rules in his establishment. To somehow suggest that he discriminated against the family and that they should be exempt from the rules because of their child's autism is disingenuous.

    47
    #32 82 days ago
    Quoted from PinStalker:

    A lot of "Autism" would end immediately with a good dose of corporal punishment. You didn't see this nonsense when I was growing up, and now it's magically everywhere.

    Possibly the most ignorant thing I’ve read in an extremely long time.

    #33 82 days ago
    Quoted from beelzeboob:

    As a teacher, I've never found ADD to be a handicap. I think those kids are some of the most gifted ones around and I view it as a challenge to keep their attention and keep them engaged. Since I'm ADD myself, I usually don't find that to be much of a challenge...they find it tough keeping up with me.

    Glad your the way you are with this! But years ago teachers didn’t want to make exceptions.Many times my wife would come home fro parent teacher meetings either wanting to cry or fucking scream.
    Anyway we got the last word he is a hugely successful business man and a great father of three boys

    125
    #34 82 days ago

    My youngest is severely autistic.
    None of this Asperger’s syndrome,mild or things like that. I mean full on you have a child for life autism.
    The problem with the label is it’s so broad these days and way too inclusive. Terms have been changed and it doesn’t give a very good description of one’s true condition.
    When I was growing up a person like my son would be labeled mildly to moderately retarded.
    I know that sounds harsh but it was how they labeled people like him and it did a much better job of stating one’s true condition and helped set expectations for his needs or what he might be like.
    Since the Rainman movie,the political correctness and a few other things it has really made it difficult to both understand and absorb what true autism is.
    As far as the incident goes. It is absolutely the parents fault.
    They know better than anyone else what the challenges might be and it’s not the publics job to placate them.
    If the kid can’t handle it then don’t take him in there.
    My son is 22 he’s never been invited to a birthday party,he has never had a true friend,he never had a girlfriend,he will never drive nor live independently.
    That sucks! But it’s not the publics problem other than just to hopefully be kind to him whenever and however possible.

    46
    #35 82 days ago

    DISCRIMINATION - I don't allow autistic children into my establishment.

    SAFETY - I don't allow children to spin around on the floor or anywhere else in my establishment.

    ENTITLED WHINER - My kid has autism and if you don't let him do whatever he wants in your establishment, you're the problem.

    #36 82 days ago
    Quoted from PinStalker:

    Spare the rod and spoil the child. A lot of "Autism" would end immediately with a good dose of corporal punishment. You didn't see this nonsense when I was growing up, and now it's magically everywhere. Must be the gluten in food right?

    I’m not sure that would cure autism….
    However when I see kids in general acting up I have flash backs of me acting the same way and getting home and my dad beating the piss out of me with his belt or my mom tanning my ass with a wooden spoon or a twin twig off of a bush in front of our house. And this was in the mid 80s to mid 90s.
    Kept me on the straight and narrow and I was terrified to act up in public until was like 13 or 14. Pretty sure if that happened today I would’ve been in protective services and my parents sent to prison.

    17
    #37 82 days ago

    The part that gets me the most here is the news deciding this is a story. They should know better. We very very rarely have to ask people to leave our arcade. Usually when this happens we get pushback from the person or people we have asked to leave. Why wouldn’t we, they obviously feel entitled to display what ever behavior they want which is how it all started. And usually the reason we ask them to leave is they can’t control their kid or won’t surpervise them appropriately. In one instance this involved a 10 yo smearing their feces on the bathroom wall to spell out an expletive ! Bad behavior is bad behavior whether it is volitional or neurologic. In either event in an establishment with up to 100 other people in there you can’t allow it. Tim is absolutely in the right on this one. In all instances where we do this we refund the customers money. And as far as suing this seems to be a common refrain from the aggrieved customer. We tell them go right ahead. Idle threat as no lawyer worth their salt would ever take this on. Stand strong Tim.

    #38 82 days ago
    Quoted from High_End_Pins:

    My youngest is severely autistic.
    Non of this Asperger’s syndrome,mild or things like that. I mean full on you have a child for life autism.
    The problem with the label is it’s so broad these days and way too inclusive. Terms have been changed and it doesn’t give a very good description of one’s true condition.
    When I was growing up a person like my son would be labeled mildly to moderately retarded.
    I know that sounds harsh but it was how they labeled people like him and it did a much better job of stating one’s true condition and helped set expectations for his needs or what he might be like.
    Since the Rainman movie,the political correctness and a few other things it has really made it difficult to both understand and absorb what true autism is.
    As far as the incident goes. It is absolutely the parents fault.
    They know better than anyone else what the challenges might be and it’s not the publics fault to placate them.
    If the kid can’t handle it then don’t take him in there.
    My son is 22 he’s never been invited to a birthday party,he has never had a true friend,he never had a girlfriend,he will never drive nor live independently.
    That’s sucks! But it’s not the publics problem other than just to hopefully be kind to him whenever and however possible.

    I don’t have an autistic child, but I have friends who do and understand at least peripherally some of the challenges. We have in more than one instance scheduled a private event for a single family with an autistic child at a significant discount so that they can enjoy a public space they wouldn’t otherwise get to go to or feel comfortable going to in a crowd.

    The attempt to vilify Tim here is just mortifying. The public shaming was meant to accomplish what exactly ? Make Tim give everyone that can’t control their behavior a free pass ? I think not.

    #39 82 days ago

    Last time I checked, business owners have the right to deny service and turn away customers when necessary.

    I don't see this as a “discrimination issue” but a safety issue.

    If the child falls and hurts himself to whom will the blame rest?

    I'm with the PHOF on this one.

    I've been there only once before the pandemic started but I would love to check out the new location.

    #40 82 days ago
    Quoted from McDoom:

    I've been there only once before the pandemic started but I would love to check out the new location.

    You'll love it.

    I live an hour and a half away and try to go every other month. My favorite location of the three.

    #41 82 days ago
    Quoted from McDoom:

    Last time I checked, business owners have the right to deny service and turn away customers when necessary.
    I don't see this as a “discrimination issue” but a safety issue.
    If the child falls and hurts himself to whom will the blame rest?
    I'm with the PHOF on this one.
    I've been there only once before the pandemic started but I would love to check out the new location.

    Any arcade has to have liability coverage. We have (knock on wood) not had any injury claims thus far. But even if you do everything right the potential is always there. If someone injures themselves you can be guaranteed the business will be blamed. And in the instances I have seen it almost happen at my facility it is usually a child or teenager being somewhere they aren’t supposed to be getting into something they shouldn’t to try to “have fun” or impress their friends. And in all instances no parent is watching.

    #42 82 days ago

    What if Tim Arnold was aware of the spinning kids behavior and did nothing, and then the kid spun into a lady holding a baby who then drops the baby on the concrete floor? Tim gets his ass sued off. He had to tell the kid to stop. The blame here lies squarely on the parents. No disability allows people or their kids to act however they want in public to the possible danger of others.

    18
    #43 82 days ago

    "We must go forward, not backward. Upward, not forward. And always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom."

    ezgif-4-2154363109.gif
    #44 82 days ago
    Quoted from Sinistarrett:

    No disability allows people or their kids to act however they want in public to the possible danger of others.

    Bingo

    #45 82 days ago
    Quoted from pookycade:

    I don’t have an autistic child, but I have friends who do and understand at least peripherally some of the challenges. We have in more than one instance scheduled a private event for a single family with an autistic child at a significant discount so that they can enjoy a public space they wouldn’t otherwise get to go to or feel comfortable going to in a crowd.
    The attempt to vilify Tim here is just mortifying. The public shaming was meant to accomplish what exactly ? Make Tim give everyone that can’t control their behavior a free pass ? I think not.

    It’s just an unfortunate sign of the times and world we live in.
    There is a growing segment of society that thinks if you do not fully accommodate them despite whatever your good reason is for not then you are in turn discriminating against them.
    Honestly from the heart. Half the children I have seen first hand labeled as autistic were nothing more than little monsters.
    My own son has had to be in classrooms with them and they can be uncontrollable and extremely mean spirited.
    That’s a situation you can’t do a lot about as a parent you have to send your kid to school but taking them in public is a choice. If you have such a child then it is your responsibility to protect everyone else not the other way around.

    14
    #46 82 days ago
    Quoted from Pinstein:

    Oh I see, so he's clinically unruly?

    As a parent I'm responsible for my kid, the parent should have taken the kid outside.

    If they can't control them to some degree in public, they should not be there.

    Full stop.

    -22
    #47 82 days ago
    Quoted from ImNotNorm:

    "We must go forward, not backward. Upward, not forward. And always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom."[quoted image]

    And now you're openly mocking a child with a disability and getting upvoted for it. Shameless.

    31
    #48 82 days ago
    Quoted from Pinstein:

    And now you're openly mocking a child with a disability and getting upvoted for it. Shameless.

    You should do some stretching before you do all that reaching.

    #49 82 days ago

    Stay classy pinside.

    #50 82 days ago

    A parent "should" know what their child is capable of in what ever situation the parent chooses to bring their child into. There are probably a ton of places that the parent would love their child to experience..the question is how well that parent knows their child. The parent has to sometimes make the exception and not bring the child to a event, not expect the event to make a exception for their child.

    Can a parent guess wrong at times? yes. But, then they take their child out of the environment, and hope in time their child progresses as time goes on.

    There are 176 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 4.

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