(Topic ID: 285066)

Sad day for our UK customers --


By G-P-E

23 days ago



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  • Latest reply 8 days ago by Lostcause
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    #1 23 days ago

    Unfortunately, the UK government is driving international sellers away from the UK marketplace.
    It is bad enough that I have to collect sales taxes for local sales but to collect sales taxes for foreign countries is a bit over the top.

    I do not have the means or time to keep track of foreign VAT taxes.
    As a result of their enforcing foreign sellers to collect VAT and send money to the UK - I will have to either enforce a $190 minimum buy or suspend sales to the UK.

    For our UK customers - I apologize in advance, I will not be able to sell to you for the time being.

    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-and-overseas-goods-sold-directly-to-customers-in-the-uk

    Ed Krzycki
    Great Plains Electronics
    www.GreatPlainsElectronics.com

    #2 23 days ago

    Trade tariffs just don't work. Harley-Davidson had to move some production to the UK to avoid retaliatory tariffs.

    #3 23 days ago

    Yeah, but this one has nothing to do with Tariffs. This is just the UK government trying to get their hands on VAT money from foreign sources by pushing the collection/payment process off onto foreign sellers. Previously, it has been up to their customs/postal system to collect VAT on imports as declared on customs forms. They now don't want to do that anymore and want the foreign sellers to do their job for them.
    This will cause a lot of sellers to either remove UK from their approved countries list or charge UK customers higher fees for doing the Royal Mail's job.

    They make it more difficult than taxes in our own country. I have to register for multiple VAT accounts, submit VAT invoices and payments to the UK gov on a monthly basis, I must keep copies of all invoices for 6 years (OK, US requires 7 years so I'm OK here), use customized invoices to show VAT per item, make payments in pounds (I pay for conversion for the privilege of paying for VAT) and on and on...

    For now, I am going to wait until things settle down before I finalize on what I have to do for this one.

    #4 23 days ago

    Ed what if the UK customer established a freight forwarding address here in the US? Then you’d be shipping to a US address. I know that zitt established a freight forwarding address in Europe because a German company (Best of Pinball?) won’t ship to US addresses.

    -1
    #5 23 days ago
    Quoted from G-P-E:

    Yeah, but this one has nothing to do with Tariffs. This is just the UK government trying to get their hands on VAT money from foreign sources by pushing the collection/payment process off onto foreign sellers. Previously, it has been up to their customs/postal system to collect VAT on imports as declared on customs forms. They now don't want to do that anymore and want the foreign sellers to do their job for them.
    This will cause a lot of sellers to either remove UK from their approved countries list or charge UK customers higher fees for doing the Royal Mail's job.
    They make it more difficult than taxes in our own country. I have to register for multiple VAT accounts, submit VAT invoices and payments to the UK gov on a monthly basis, I must keep copies of all invoices for 6 years (OK, US requires 7 years so I'm OK here), use customized invoices to show VAT per item, make payments in pounds (I pay for conversion for the privilege of paying for VAT) and on and on...
    For now, I am going to wait until things settle down before I finalize on what I have to do for this one.

    Ok. I see. Sounds like more privation going on.

    To use a well worn cliche: What have Bruce Johnson and the UK Govies been smoking?

    #6 23 days ago
    Quoted from G-P-E:

    Unfortunately, the UK government is driving international sellers away from the UK marketplace.
    It is bad enough that I have to collect sales taxes for local sales but to collect sales taxes for foreign countries is a bit over the top.
    I do not have the means or time to keep track of foreign VAT taxes.
    As a result of their enforcing foreign sellers to collect VAT and send money to the UK - I will have to either enforce a $190 minimum buy or suspend sales to the UK.
    For our UK customers - I apologize in advance, I will not be able to sell to you for the time being.
    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-and-overseas-goods-sold-directly-to-customers-in-the-uk
    Ed Krzycki
    Great Plains Electronics
    www.GreatPlainsElectronics.com

    Australia has done a similar thing 2 (??) years ago however only companies doing more than a certain revenue turnover need to collect the tax. It's to protect local retailers because if I purchase from them I have to pay a 10% Goods and Services Tax (GST), but previously if I went direct to the US supplier I could bring it in without the tax and it'd be cheaper for me. So by taxing anybody bringing in parcels means that the price I pay for goods whether from overseas or local will be similar and the local guys will be able to fulfill the order quicker. Oh and the government picks up more tax revenue

    Given the horrendous shipping costs to Australia, I use a shipping forwarder (as per bluespin post) that can consolidate multiple items and ship me a single parcel saving on shipping multiple items. I have to declare all the goods and value to the shipping forwarder and they collect the tax on behalf of the Australian Government. So if I were to purchase via ebay.com or even Marco (I think) and put in an Australia delivery address they automatically add the Aust tax. Smaller foreign companies don't collect the tax but those items are typically picked up coming into Australia and we are contacted locally to pay the tax.

    #7 23 days ago

    This is over-reach from HMRC (UK tax authorities) IMO. Only applies to sale value < £135 though. Issue is that VAT (sales tax) is now being collected at the point of sale rather than at the point of importation, which every other country in the world does. Many retailers are understandably upset by this, it's the first UK consumers have heard of it, so I suspect it will be reversed soon. Dumb-ass politicians, and greedy tax authorities who had to 'have a go'. Looks like UK residents will be paying a helluva lot more VAT in the future...

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55530721

    Interestingly, ebay and Amazon.com have been 'pre-collecting' VAT for some time for UK orders, but I didn't know it was 'the law', and it didn't always happen.

    #8 23 days ago
    Quoted from Pinballs:

    ...Issue is that VAT (sales tax) is now being collected at the point of sale rather than at the point of importation, which every other country in the world does...

    Actually, as a seller, I have never been required to pre-collect taxes for any country. I cannot name any other country in the world that does VAT collection at the point of sale rather than the point of importation; the point of tax collection has always been at the point of importation. There has been lots of rumbling about what non-UK sellers are going to do - many are dropping UK as destination addresses. As far as Amazon, they just sent message to sellers mid-December that this collection from seller was to begin on Jan 1st.

    To Manny in post #6 -- Australia is like everybody else and collects VAT at time of entry, not time of sale. In 20 years, I have never once pre-collected VAT for Australian orders and there has been no change during past couple years.

    Does make me wonder about using freight forwarding. That address, as far as we would be concerned, would be to a US destination. It would be the freight forwarder to handle VAT.

    #9 23 days ago

    Doh thought we had escaped all this bullshit by leaving the EU but looks like our GOV has fecked us here. Pinball parts are hard enough to get hold of over hear and always with a markup to cover importing fees and now we can’t even get them??

    #10 23 days ago

    this is really unreasonable and I don't get the point of it. the tax burden should be paid by the buyer at the point of entry. We haven't had a sale to the UK yet this year, but will be interesting to see what happens when we do. Bad enough sales to the EU have slowed, now they will stop to the UK.

    #11 23 days ago

    This whole trade war / import tax crap is getting beyond a joke, literally gonna be pinball smuggling rings soon.

    #12 22 days ago
    Quoted from G-P-E:

    To Manny in post #6 -- Australia is like everybody else and collects VAT at time of entry, not time of sale. In 20 years, I have never once pre-collected VAT for Australian orders and there has been no change during past couple years.

    As I understand it, it only applies to those foreign traders doing more than a certain revenue turnover. Here's an example of the tax Marco would collect

    Marco (resized).JPG
    #13 22 days ago
    Quoted from G-P-E:

    I will have to either enforce a $190 minimum buy or suspend sales to the UK.

    Please do whatever you need to do in order to continue servicing our friends in the UK!

    #14 22 days ago
    Quoted from Manny65:

    As I understand it, it only applies to those foreign traders doing more than a certain revenue turnover.

    I have shipped $2K orders like that to Australia and the customs information is entered a bit differently. Instead of the simple, all collective on one line type customs form, you have to list the items line by line. But I did not have to prepay any VAT so I had to look this one up.
    As a foreign seller to Australia, you only have to worry about Australian taxes if you sell $75K-AU per year. I have some pretty good customers in Australia but collectively, I don't do $58K-US to Australia per year.

    The weird thing about UK is they expect foreign sellers to only collect on values *less* than £135 which seems backwards.
    Any sale over that - the VAT is collected in the usual manner - "as item is received".
    So - they seem to make a bigger fuss over the small sales than the large sales?
    For me - my typical UK sale is in the $100 / £80 range (excluding awful shipping costs) so I would get hit on most orders.

    My inventory/accounting software will handle VAT with no problems. The problem is with my website. The website can handle a sales tax/VAT properly but it cannot handle the £135 cut off - it will happily continue to charge the VAT on all orders including those above the threshold. Checked with the developer - they already know the issue and "are working on it". As a British developed website, I'm rather surprised they were caught off-guard with this one.

    #15 22 days ago

    That sucks. I have a few customers in UK and I sent stuff today as a first class international package via USPS. I am just going to go business as usual until there is a problem. Something tells me stuff sent with USPS is not going to be a problem. I don't live in the UK so I am not going to collect fees on their behalf. I got enough crap to keep track of for business. If it becomes a problem (seems doubtful) i guess I will drop shipping to UK or come up with a way to make the customer pay for it.

    #16 22 days ago

    I’m sure no one cares lol but both supreme and StockX collect duties at the point of sale for a Canadian customer. They are both American based.

    #17 22 days ago
    Quoted from G-P-E:

    As a foreign seller to Australia, you only have to worry about Australian taxes if you sell $75K-AU per year. I have some pretty good customers in Australia but collectively, I don't do $58K-US to Australia per year.

    Yep that's what I meant by "it only applies to those foreign traders doing more than a certain revenue turnover"

    Quoted from G-P-E:

    The weird thing about UK is they expect foreign sellers to only collect on values *less* than £135 which seems backwards.

    This is weird, it's like they don't want to deal with all the low value imports so they'll put the onus onto the foreign seller

    #18 21 days ago

    I would say- continue as is, and ignore the UK's requirements. Put the value on the customs form as normal, as all countries in the world bar one require, and see what happens. There will be a transition period, if nothing else. The UK has no jurisdiction over other countries (well mostly none nowadays, hoho), so ignore it.

    IMO this will be reversed soon anyway, as it's dumb ass, not supported by consumers, and there is a consumer revolt about it going on currently. I even wrote to my MP. You have to question what incompetent civil servant twit let this arrogant tax imperialism through. Do they think it's 1773? Boston Tea Party, dudes. You'd think the US side of the US-UK trade negotiations would be all over this unilateral nonsense. Give it a few weeks. The UK is desperate for a trade deal with the US, after all, and was hoping for a 'mini-deal' before Trump leaves. So I'm optimistic. Also waiting for the import tariffs to be cancelled (on both sides).

    #19 21 days ago

    How would the UK police this anyway? I mean, you didn't collect tax on a transaction, do they tattle to the US IRS and send them after you?

    #20 21 days ago
    Quoted from G-P-E:

    I have shipped $2K orders like that to Australia and the customs information is entered a bit differently. Instead of the simple, all collective on one line type customs form, you have to list the items line by line. But I did not have to prepay any VAT so I had to look this one up.
    As a foreign seller to Australia, you only have to worry about Australian taxes if you sell $75K-AU per year. I have some pretty good customers in Australia but collectively, I don't do $58K-US to Australia per year.
    The weird thing about UK is they expect foreign sellers to only collect on values *less* than £135 which seems backwards.
    Any sale over that - the VAT is collected in the usual manner - "as item is received".
    So - they seem to make a bigger fuss over the small sales than the large sales?
    For me - my typical UK sale is in the $100 / £80 range (excluding awful shipping costs) so I would get hit on most orders.
    My inventory/accounting software will handle VAT with no problems. The problem is with my website. The website can handle a sales tax/VAT properly but it cannot handle the £135 cut off - it will happily continue to charge the VAT on all orders including those above the threshold. Checked with the developer - they already know the issue and "are working on it". As a British developed website, I'm rather surprised they were caught off-guard with this one.

    Everyone in Britain was caught off-guard with this one Ed

    #21 21 days ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    How would the UK police this anyway? I mean, you didn't collect tax on a transaction, do they tattle to the US IRS and send them after you?

    They send this guy to your house.

    pasted_image (resized).png
    #22 21 days ago

    there is no legal requirement for you or anyone else outside the UK to do this. so take the orders, send the boxes and be done with it.

    #23 21 days ago
    Quoted from barakandl:

    That sucks. I have a few customers in UK and I sent stuff today as a first class international package via USPS. I am just going to go business as usual until there is a problem. Something tells me stuff sent with USPS is not going to be a problem. I don't live in the UK so I am not going to collect fees on their behalf. I got enough crap to keep track of for business. If it becomes a problem (seems doubtful) i guess I will drop shipping to UK or come up with a way to make the customer pay for it.

    This, and I'm happy to risk it with a test order as I want some more stuff from you The nine ball rom in your board has transformed the game - many thanks.

    #24 21 days ago
    Quoted from G-P-E:

    I have shipped $2K orders like that to Australia and the customs information is entered a bit differently. Instead of the simple, all collective on one line type customs form, you have to list the items line by line. But I did not have to prepay any VAT so I had to look this one up.
    As a foreign seller to Australia, you only have to worry about Australian taxes if you sell $75K-AU per year. I have some pretty good customers in Australia but collectively, I don't do $58K-US to Australia per year.
    The weird thing about UK is they expect foreign sellers to only collect on values *less* than £135 which seems backwards.
    Any sale over that - the VAT is collected in the usual manner - "as item is received".
    So - they seem to make a bigger fuss over the small sales than the large sales?
    For me - my typical UK sale is in the $100 / £80 range (excluding awful shipping costs) so I would get hit on most orders.
    My inventory/accounting software will handle VAT with no problems. The problem is with my website. The website can handle a sales tax/VAT properly but it cannot handle the £135 cut off - it will happily continue to charge the VAT on all orders including those above the threshold. Checked with the developer - they already know the issue and "are working on it". As a British developed website, I'm rather surprised they were caught off-guard with this one.

    they shouldn't have been caught off hand with it as this was known for some time - I have it running in a few sites for sometime.

    Its a stupid policy (aren't all tax policies) but to give you a heads up is also coming to the EU soon. which is where the genesis of this came from (which I'm sure but can't directly recall was planned for this year but put off because of Brexit in the EU).

    It's more aimed at China than the US, and in reality aimed at two websites: eBay and Aliexpress where huge tax evasion was going on. What I'm not sure is how the HMRC is going to collect and audit the VAT that you collect.

    The UK needed a new VAT policy as part Brexit and they had planned this and I think decided to bring it in but I first was aware of something like this coming over a year and a half ago. But how you in the US were supposed to be aware of the tax policies of over 140 countries is freaking beyond me.

    Cheers,
    Neil.

    #25 21 days ago

    Oh lord. I didn't know about this one at all until just yesterday. This is a pile of awful that I can't possibly comply with. I really hate to say it, but unless something changes, I'm going to have to do the same.

    If it hits the EU too..... that's going to hurt even more, and I'm going to have to probably find an alternate system for the website. I don't do a huge amount of sales into the UK and the EU, but I do make some sales.

    Ugh.

    -Hans

    #26 21 days ago

    its is/was 2022 for the EU but clearly lots of things in flux.

    #27 21 days ago

    The closest analog to this in the US was a few years back, when various states were trying to collect "use taxes" from ecommerce buyers. Same concept: stateside ebay and Amazon (to cite the two biggest e-commerce sites of the time) buyers were supposed to remit sales taxes to their state of residence, but obviously nobody did. Remember when one of the biggest "unspoken advantages" of buying from Amazon and ebay was never paying sales tax?

    Meanwhile states were desperate to get online sellers to collect and remit those taxes at point-of-sale. Amazon, they rightly argued, was big enough to implement this. But how in the world was joes-online-garage-sale supposed to know and keep track of the policies for 50 different states??!?!

    It was a huge controversy for a long time for similar reasons (why should a 1-man business with a website do a distant state government's work? Should a buyer pay sales tax in his own state of residence, or (and?!) from the state where the seller lives? Where exactly does a large retailer "live" in relation to the brick & mortar stocking and/or shipment of goods? In which state(s) does an electronic sale take place, versus mail order? Etc...) but inevitably here we are: electronic "no sales tax" loopholes are all closed, and ecommerce sites large and small all collect tax based on your mailing address at time of sale (in the US).

    So I doubt the EU and UK are going to relent on collecting taxes from resellers at time of sale: the concept has been argued, proven, and implemented in the US, it just needs to be tweaked and scaled a bit differently. It will obviously take ecommerce platforms, and Point-of-Sale/"cart api" software providers time to develop and implement. And obviously few of them want to. But again, these concepts have already been implemented into law for a huge (arguably larger and more complex) jurisdiction.

    #28 21 days ago
    Quoted from G-P-E:

    Unfortunately, the UK government is driving international sellers away from the UK marketplace.
    It is bad enough that I have to collect sales taxes for local sales but to collect sales taxes for foreign countries is a bit over the top.
    I do not have the means or time to keep track of foreign VAT taxes.
    As a result of their enforcing foreign sellers to collect VAT and send money to the UK - I will have to either enforce a $190 minimum buy or suspend sales to the UK.
    For our UK customers - I apologize in advance, I will not be able to sell to you for the time being.
    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-and-overseas-goods-sold-directly-to-customers-in-the-uk
    Ed Krzycki
    Great Plains Electronics
    www.GreatPlainsElectronics.com

    I have no experience in consumer sales, so apologies for maybe a dumb question.

    Is there Pont of Sale software that would also pay the the proper country/amount based on the destination? Ideally the software would xfer the VAT at the time of sale, making the process seamless? Granted, if you would need to change your software to a different vendor, or if you need to upgrade the current software for a fee - that's a hit to the wallet and disruption on your end.

    Not involved in sales, so no clue on my end.

    #29 21 days ago
    Quoted from goingincirclez:

    The closest analog to this in the US was a few years back, when various states were trying to collect "use taxes" from ecommerce buyers. Same concept: stateside ebay and Amazon (to cite the two biggest e-commerce sites of the time) buyers were supposed to remit sales taxes to their state of residence, but obviously nobody did. Remember when one of the biggest "unspoken advantages" of buying from Amazon and ebay was never paying sales tax?
    Meanwhile states were desperate to get online sellers to collect and remit those taxes at point-of-sale. Amazon, they rightly argued, was big enough to implement this. But how in the world was joes-ebay-garage-sale supposed to know and keep track of the policies for 50 different states??!?!
    It was a huge controversy for a long time for similar reasons (why should a small retailer with a website do a distant state government's work? Should a buyer pay sales tax in his own state, or/and from where the seller "lives"? Where exactly does a seller "live" in relation to the shipment of goods? Etc....) but inevitably here we are: the "no sales tax" loopholes all closed and ecommerce sites large and small all collect the tax based on your mailing address at time of sale.
    So I doubt the EU and UK are going to relent on collecting the tax from resellers at time of sale: the concept has been argued, proven, and implemented in the US, it just needs to be tweaked and scaled a bit differently. It will obviously take ecommerce platforms and "cart api" providers time to implement. And obviously few of them want to. But again, conceptually, this has already been implemented into law for a huge (arguably larger and more complex) jurisdiction.

    Some of what you are describing sounds like people selling a used car around here. I pay you $1500.00 for your car but tell the state that I only paid $450.00 to save on vehicle sales tax Kansas changed its tax policies to try to resolve this problem; The state's remedy was to make you pay your sales tax on retail Blue Book value.

    Right about this time I bought a Lincoln Mark VIII on Ebay for $3200.00. Kelly Blue Book valued it at $5500.00 and I had to pay sales tax on $5500.00. It was an unpopular tax and and was rescinded in one year and I was able to send in for a refund on the difference.

    #30 21 days ago

    You wont be selling much to Americans pretty soon.

    #31 21 days ago
    Quoted from cottonm4:

    Some of what you are describing sounds like people selling a used car around here. I pay you $1500.00 for your car but tell the state that I only paid $450.00 to save on vehicle sales tax Kansas changed its tax policies to try to resolve this problem; The state's remedy was to make you pay your sales tax on retail Blue Book value.
    Right about this time I bought a Lincoln Mark VIII on Ebay for $3200.00. Kelly Blue Book valued it at $5500.00 and I had to pay sales tax on $5500.00. It was an unpopular tax and and was rescinded in one year and I was able to send in for a refund on the difference.

    Go to a car lot like me and get them to fill out a form saying saying what the value of the car is.

    #32 21 days ago
    Quoted from zr11990:

    Go to a car lot like me and get them to fill out a form saying saying what the value of the car is.

    Too many lower-end dealers were doing cash deals and doing a little under pricing on sales price reporting to help make their sales. So the state said Blue Book was the only value maker.

    I imagine two individuals still cheat on how much the transaction was for, but the state got out of the tax-grab biz.

    #33 21 days ago
    Quoted from cottonm4:

    Too many lower-end dealers were doing cash deals and doing a little under pricing on sales price reporting to help make their sales. So the state said Blue Book was the only value maker.
    I imagine two individuals still cheat on how much the transaction was for, but the state got out of the tax-grab biz.

    It was individuals saying they paid nothing for their cars so they wouldnt have to pay tax. I dont even have a problem with that. I had a acquaintance buy a junk jeep to rebuild and the book said it was worth a shitton of money. I filled out the form saying the car was shit and it was worth a couple thousand and he didnt have to pay all that tax. Ill be happy to do it. SCREW the government

    #34 20 days ago

    What work is now involved states side? The store has to detect U.K. buyers and automatically charge the 20% vat? Then you have to sign up for a VAT number and do some sort or yearly VAT return to HMRC directly? (like a VAT registered company in the U.K. would do)

    #35 20 days ago
    Quoted from russdx:

    What work is now involved states side? The store has to detect U.K. buyers and automatically charge the 20% vat? Then you have to sign up for a VAT number and do some sort or yearly VAT return to HMRC directly? (like a VAT registered company in the U.K. would do)

    Pretty accurate summary from what I’ve been able to determine

    #36 20 days ago
    Quoted from russdx:

    What work is now involved states side? The store has to detect U.K. buyers and automatically charge the 20% vat? Then you have to sign up for a VAT number and do some sort or yearly VAT return to HMRC directly? (like a VAT registered company in the U.K. would do)

    HMRC requires quarterly VAT returns. They also use an etax system that requires a subscription ('Making Tax Digital'), rather than allowing simple (free) web-based submission- I kid you not. I really would recommend ignore and continue as is! The modern UK is Gilliam's Brazil, frankly. Quite the joke.

    Ironically, as Neil alludes, this all derives from the bureaucratic dying nightmare that is the EU. I had hoped the UK would ditch this shit along with the EU (isn't that the upside of leaving?), but apparently not. If the UK was a democracy this would be ditched soon enough. We shall see, as we hide in our homes from Covid and get told who we can meet by The Man. We're like Red China but without the economic growth.

    #37 20 days ago
    Quoted from HHaase:

    Pretty accurate summary from what I’ve been able to determine

    Ignore and carry on as is. It will be ditched by the pen pushers soon enough. I have several orders from US, Germany and Italy awaited, so will find out shortly if this VAT law has fucked commerce. I doubt it has, and life goes on and we need to survive, yes? Government is little more than a parasite, which is becoming increasingly clear with unenforceable 'laws' such as this. I despise them (principally meaning the opportunistic business-destroying vulture HMRC). At a moment when our economies and businesses are on our knees dying (Covid, Brexit, IR35), this is just what we need. Fuck me I guess these bastards don't have to live in the real world, funded by our money as they are. As I say, the pure definition of parasite.

    #38 20 days ago

    The VAT adding is fairly easy based on country. My website, like most others, cannot handle the fact that the VAT goes to zero at the £135 mark.
    You do have to sign up for a VAT account. VAT is paid depending on how you sign up -- signup says they are either paid at time of sale or pay them once per month. If i have to pay for subscription service just for the privilege of making payments for VAT - that won't work.
    Then they also require copies of invoices at time of VAT payment plus a lot of extra book-keeping for 6 years.

    The one thing they make abundantly clear -- all orders placed (order placed, not shipped) after 23:00 on December 31st of 2020 and are below the £135 mark must have VAT accounted for. If not, item will be refused and sent back to sender. As many of us know - shipping between US and UK (or US and anybody else) is sky high right now. Would be a shame paying all that money just so your box can gain frequent flyer mileage.

    #39 20 days ago

    Mark value as zero? The Chinese do this for everything and are doing just fine. Alternatively, the majority of UK-US trade just died. RIP. Maybe the bureaucrat 'geniuses' negotiating the US-UK trade deal might notice?

    More seriously, ebay have auto-VAT set up so sell via them? Ditto Amazon. As usual, corporations do fine, it's small business that is raped.

    #40 20 days ago
    Quoted from Pinballs:

    ebay have auto-VAT set up so sell via them? Ditto Amazon. As usual, corporations do fine, it's small business that is raped.

    Yep. As a business you can pay the VAT account "subscription" to handle it on your own as Ed (GPE) describes.... or pay Ebay and Amazon, etc to do it for you as they gladly take their cut for services provided. It's probably more expensive going the service-provider route. Speaking of ebay, they're about to strong-arm all sellers into letting ebay be its own default payment processor, and you now have to link your bank account to your ebay account (instead of / in addtion to paypal, etc) Ebay says it'll cost less than PayPal but either way, they want their slice.

    Same racket either way. The government and middlemen will always get theirs; ain't nobody rides for free.

    #41 20 days ago

    How do they differentiate parcels coming into the UK between gifts (eg birthday presents etc) and goods being purchased?

    #42 20 days ago
    Quoted from Manny65:

    How do they differentiate parcels coming into the UK between gifts (eg birthday presents etc) and goods being purchased?

    In the PAST, you would mark it as a 'gift' on the customs form. Nowadays, though, no idea if it's the same.

    #43 20 days ago

    g-p-e Ed if you go the EBay route, what you can do is require a minimum order before s@h for UK customers, lets say $10. They email you an order with part numbers, quantities and their EBay Id. You create a listing that only they can see. You build the EBay fees into the sales price.

    #44 20 days ago

    I'll ask the real question here.

    What jurisdiction does a foreign nation have to force you to collect VAT for them.

    None.

    #45 20 days ago
    Quoted from Nysbadmk8:

    I'll ask the real question here.
    What jurisdiction does a foreign nation have to force you to collect VAT for them.
    None.

    The jurisdiction of their borders... and their right to reject your goods unless it meets their requirements.

    They can't come after you here on any criminal terms.. but they can certainly refuse doing business with you.

    #46 20 days ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    They send this guy to your house. [quoted image]

    That guy coming to collect taxes in America is seriously outgunned...

    #47 20 days ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    The jurisdiction of their borders... and their right to reject your goods unless it meets their requirements.
    They can't come after you here on any criminal terms.. but they can certainly refuse doing business with you.

    And in the meantime, the buyer has his money tied up in a product that authorities are just going to sit on or return. Since most sellers take payment up front all of the risk will be borne by the buyer.

    #48 20 days ago
    Quoted from cottonm4:

    And in the meantime, the buyer has his money tied up in a product that authorities are just going to sit on or return. Since most sellers take payment up front all of the risk will be borne by the buyer.

    and all the pay places support the buyers.

    I'm still wondering how something coming into customs the guy checking it is going to know if the tax was collected...

    #49 20 days ago
    Quoted from cottonm4:

    Since most sellers take payment up front all of the risk will be borne by the buyer.

    Until the buyer demands a refund.... and the way many platforms default in favor of a buyer, the seller will be screwed later. Maybe months later.

    Just a mess all around. I don't blame sellers for saying "no, thanks".

    #50 20 days ago

    You are correct. I forgot the PayPal angle.

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