(Topic ID: 158082)

Road Kings (SYS 11) Switch not registering during Gameplay

By Chet

8 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 30 posts
  • 8 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by pindude80
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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#1 8 years ago

I am helping out a good friend get a Road Kings he recently acquired up and running. The right inlane switch and the right ramp left loop switch are registering ok in the Diagnostics Switch edges test but neither is registering during game play. It does not matter if you use a ball or depress the switches by hand. We unplugged the column and row connectors on the MPU Switch matrix inputs and used my Pinitech 64- switch matrix tester to test all switches and they are registering correctly when activated with the switch matrix tester. We checked the switch adjustments and tested for continuity for all wires from each of the switches back to the IDC connectors on the MPU switch matrix and we have continuity as expected.

Would appreciate any thoughts, comments or ideas on what we should check next for this situation when the switches register in switch diagnostics test but do not register during a game. Thanks,

#2 8 years ago

Micro mini switches or leaf blade ?

If micro mini I'd replace them, they have crap inside and work in test but are slow and fail in game play.

LTG : )

#3 8 years ago

Thanks LTG. The right in lane is a leaf blade switch. The ramp loop switch is a rollover micro switch with actuator arm. The leaf switch on the in-lane was cleaned and adjusted to make sure it was making good contact. We used a DMM meter in diode test to check the diode on the leaf switch and it was reading correctly (game powered off of course). We tested continuity of the leaf contacts and the wiring to make sure there was continuity thru the switch contacts also. I think the micro switch probably needs to be replaced and perhaps the leaf blade switch needs that as well. I can see how a switch might work in diagnostic mode, but not in dynamic game situation if the contact is weak or too slow.

#4 8 years ago

This is my game that is Chet is helping me fix. I thought the problem with the switches not registering might have been a bug in the ROMs since mine had revison 2 in it. I had a set of L-4 ROMs burned and it acts the same way.

We will more than likely go ahead and replace the micro switch on the upper ramp, but does anyone know why the leaf switch is registering in switch test, but not in game play? We're not sure what to look at next and could use some guidance.

Any help is appreciated, thanks!

#5 8 years ago
Quoted from pindude80:

why the leaf switch is registering in switch test, but not in game play?

Have you cleaned the contacts?

#6 8 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

Have you cleaned the contacts?

Yes, cleaned and adjusted. Verified with DMM they are making an open/close circuit when it's supposed to.

#7 8 years ago

Switches be crazy....

Side note. Join the Road Kings fan club.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/youll-be-back-jackroad-kings-fan-club

#8 8 years ago

Bump for the evening tech crowd.

#9 8 years ago

Its going to be a poor connection some where, molex connector or header pins and IDC connector.

#10 8 years ago

My best guess.. And it is a guess is that it's maybe a weak signal.

When you test are you rolling the ball as in game play or depressing it with a ball hard?

Might be OK when held in but not enough when a quick roll.

At the very least I'll bump it for you so someone more knowledgeable can help

#12 8 years ago
Quoted from agodfrey:

My best guess.. And it is a guess is that it's maybe a weak signal.
When you test are you rolling the ball as in game play or depressing it with a ball hard?
Might be OK when held in but not enough when a quick roll.
At the very least I'll bump it for you so someone more knowledgeable can help

Thanks for the response. I know for a fact we rolled a ball over the inlane switch at ball speed and pretty sure the top ramp switch also and neither registered.

3 weeks later
#13 8 years ago

So Chet checked the board out, cleaned a few things and I think may have re-flowed some solder. Last night I made a new rollover leaf switch, put the board back in the game last night and it's doing the same thing.

Today, I pulled the board out of my Grand Lizard, swapped the game ROMs and it's still doing the exact same thing. I'm guessing the next thing to do would be to replace the connector. Anyone think I should like at anything else first?

#14 8 years ago

Man.....real stumper......yeah work your way up the chain I guess

#15 8 years ago

I really think the next thing is going to be replace the connector since the other board did the exact same thing, it safe to say it's not a board or header pin issue. I'm thinking the connector at the board or possibly the main playfield connector that is in the bottom of the cabinet that i guess you would disconnect if you want to pull the PF. Hopefully we are getting very close. I will keep updating this thread as we go.

2 weeks later
#16 8 years ago

Update: Chet and I replaced the connector for the switch matrix that we are having problems with. No change, does the exact same thing where it registers in switch test, but not in game mode. I guess next thing would be to re-pin the playfield disconnect harness down in the cabinet unless someone has any other ideas.

#17 8 years ago

On the rollover switch check to see if someone might have used a file to clean it at some point. That will make them rather unreliable.

#18 8 years ago
Quoted from pinwiz_pa:

On the rollover switch check to see if someone might have used a file to clean it at some point. That will make them rather unreliable.

I can, but I don't think that would explain it working in test mode and the leaf switch working in test mode, but not game mode.

1 week later
#19 8 years ago

Update: My friend Chet and I repinned the male and female side of the playfield connector in the cabinet for the two corresponding wires for the rollover lane we are having trouble with. This didn't change anything- exact same results. We then alligator clipped a wire to one lead on the switch and I added a trifurcon connector to the other end, popped out the factor wire, inserted the new wire in the molex connector that we previously swapped for the factory IDC connector, no change. We next moved the alligator clip over to the other wire on the switch, same thing.

Does anyone know what to look at next? I think it's safe to say we pretty much ruled out a connection problem with running the new wire from the switch in question to it corresponding pin on the board connector.

Something else I stumbled on that I felt was a little odd is we were playing a friend's Road Kings last weekend and their's was having an intermittent problem on the same switch I'm having problems with where sometimes the switch would register and sometimes it wouldn't, but every other switch on the game seemed to work fine. They said they have cleaned and adjusted the switch, but it continues to act the same way. Could it be there is some kind of design flaw with this switch registering?

#20 8 years ago

Reread everything and missed it works in test. Need more caffeine!

#21 8 years ago
Quoted from pinwiz_pa:

Reread everything and missed it works in test. Need more caffeine!

When you get more caffeine and you can figure it out let me know because we can't get this stupid thing figured out.

2 weeks later
#23 8 years ago

Bump, thinking of trying a new diode on the leaf switch even though it tested ok. Anyone have any other ideas on what to try?

#24 8 years ago

anyone in the morning crowd have any suggestions?

1 year later
#25 6 years ago

Ok, so I finally felt like working on Road Kings again the other day. I was trying to figure out the detour value and how it worked, someone explained to me what it took to get the detour value, I can get on the left side, but not the right. https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/youll-be-back-jackroad-kings-fan-club/page/4#post-4210822

Anyone have any ideas what in the heck might be going on with this thing?

2 years later
#26 3 years ago

Have to revive that old thread as I have a similar issue on my ES:
One leave switch (Top ball popper-sw37) sometimes is not registering during gameplay but works fine if I immediately check afterwards in the switch test.
Contacts of switch are cleaned (business card), diode was replaced and pins repushed in headers on the PCB board side

any idea what could be the issue? Why is it working in switch test but not during gameplay?

@Chet: did you ever solve the mystery described here?

#27 3 years ago
Quoted from harig:

Have to revive that old thread as I have a similar issue on my ES:
One leave switch (Top ball popper-sw37) sometimes is not registering during gameplay but works fine if I immediately check afterwards in the switch test.
Contacts of switch are cleaned (business card), diode was replaced and pins repushed in headers on the PCB board side
any idea what could be the issue? Why is it working in switch test but not during gameplay?
Chet: did you ever solve the mystery described here?

How are you “checking” it after game play?

During game, the ball is entering the saucer and may intermittently be triggering the switch.

But then when you test it in switch test mode, if using your finger, it’s always working because your finger is pressing the switch down further than the ball would be during game.

If this is the case, it’s a switch adjustment that’s needed.

#28 3 years ago

Duplicate

#29 3 years ago

I´m checking the switch with the ball in the saucer-not with the hand.
If the switch is not registering during gameplay I immediately go to the switch test (without touching the ball or anything else) and the switch is registered there....

1 year later
#30 2 years ago

I finally figured out and fixed my switch issue. Inlane number 3, which is the bottom right, and the right exit for the detour ramp were incorrectly. I swapped both sets of wires from one switch to the other and now it registers properly during gameplay. I am guessing it was wired incorrectly at the factory but I can't say that for sure.

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