lol to little to late. R&L has botched so many games over the years.

Wow. The power of a strong Pinball Collector Community on full display.

Hopefully, this will bring about change and maybe, some better customer service.

Marcus

Either that or internet hilarity if they vehemently try to defend themselves!

Mine was documented at R&L transfer station with my camera and theirs.
It still took more than six months for them to pay my claim. I have shipped about eight pins only two were damaged the first NAVL paid the claim in bout 3 weeks very acceptable. R&L over six months to pay and many many calls and emails from me to get it done. It won’t happen again because I won’t use them again.

I hope you have better luck.

To the people that have switched carriers, who have you used that you've been pleased with?

Myself.
I won't buy a pin that has to be shipped and I won't ship a pin unless the buyer makes the arrangements.
Your shipper, your problem.
AZP bought a pin from me and I will be delivering it personally next weekend.
I just don't trust shippers and would rather make the 13 hour round trip myself, not about to let some idiot destroy this game.

On the east coast these guys are great http://www.bentonexpress.com/
For NIB estes-express.com did a great job and came highly recommended.

That does suck ass, especially being a LE.

I'm going to Vegas this Sunday for almost that exact same reason, tracelifter. I'm picking up a pin and it's so short of a distance to me and the flight there and rental car back are so cheap, I feel better not spending the money to ship it when doing it my way will only take half a day start to finish. Where, if I had it shipped with a national carrier I'd be hoping it gets to me in two weeks and doesn't get damaged en route, while paying twice the price.

I always try to do in person delivery and pickup I just went from VA to MI to get two awesome pins, ACDC and IM and if it had VA to AZ was closer I would have done the same thing. I like the meeting and seeing of another persons pin collection too, always nice to meet another Pinsider face to face but when it coast to coast just not practical. I am lucky in that VA is located in the center of the North and South and I can cover half of the US population in an 8 hour drive. I wish I could have met Greg in person and dropped these off and picked up mine but I made the mistake of driving to Vegas once and 33 hours and 4 days total round trip is just way to much of a trip to make alone. Its easier to get wife to go along with you for Vegas but not pin trading.

Let's face facts:

EVERY trucking company on the face of the earth has damaged shipments. Every one.

The HiLo drivers are not gentle spine surgeons, they are...you know what's coming...HiLo drivers.

When the truck is at your curb, hop inside. If there is damage, refuse the shipment.

Don't let them drop it off with "damage noted" on the bill of lading .

I agree with this so it how they handle the claim when there is an issue that is important.
The next NIB damage in shipping will be refused by me. That is good advice for NIB.

R&L smashed an arcade machine for me a few years ago. Wouldn't pay the claim of the seller but offered sending the replacement for free. Replacement arrived damaged just as bad. Have never been able to find the game again. They've been on my Blacklist for awhile. Have never had any problems with NAVL though they do use independent shippers. I'll stick with them. Conway and R&L have both botched multiples for me so I warn people away... Once is a mistake.... twice is a trend....

This is obviously good satire

I hope this is a joke. LOL

I must admit that this makes me apprehensive about my pending WOZ shipment even though it will be with different shipper. However, I personally just can't justify giving R&L another chance; after my earlier experiences, if I were to use them on my next pin and it was also damaged, I would be more pissed at myself for trying them again.

It does seem that refusing the shipment is probably the way to go with any shipper if there is damage. I haven't heard of many happy endings of pin owners getting claims paid out after accepting a shipment even if they documented the damage...

I had damaged legs on my Avengers but I think it was more Sterns fault for the way they packed it. There is also a gouge on the payfield that the tried to touch up.

RL delivered my Tron Pro with a puncture on the side of the carton, thankfully no damage. I was worried as it was for xmas, so didn't open it for 2 months.

I have had nothing but bad luck with shippers/movers - My job has moved me cross country 3 times. Every single time they have buggered up my car (along with furniture furniture). The last time they paid me $3k in damages for my car after going to arbitration. I was so pissed. I had no choice in the mover, as the company paid, but before the 3rd move I was repeatedly assured they were not going to screw up my 1980 vette. They picked it up with a brand new paint job straight from the body shop. It arrived with a fiberglass chip the diameter of an apple with spider veins running from it on the front fender.

To this day, I still have no idea how they managed to do that. It's as if someone looked at, said, "This paint job and car just looks too good", and took a ball-pen hammer to it!

Ahh the memories...

Please enlighten us all on how Stern ruins legs in a NIB purchase. PLEASE explain.

I call BS on your post.

I didn't say the legs were ruined. I said they were damaged. The top edges of the legs were smashed a little causing the blue power coat to come off. Stern is replacing them free of charge. The box and the palette had no damage.

I could see it happening, they put 2 legs in a box on top of each other with only a plastic bag separating them and the powder coat could totally chip or get rubbed. My friends had a small chip on the rails on his hulk and there wasnt really anything close to that in the package.

Of course it can happen it happens all the time. I know another person who had the same problem with his red legs on his ACDC that he just took delivery of. I don't know why I have to explain this to eggbert52 but I'm sure he will create another one of his poll posts on the subject.

If you have time to respond to me twice then you certainly have time to take a couple of pictures no?

It didn't happen because...no pics!

Here you go.

IMG2031.JPG

Ouch, that sucks.

Here is a good post for you. Stern sent out a NIB Tron with a frog under a ramp on the playfield.

https://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.pinball/browse_thread/thread/3883cbfa5d9d10b7/053bbdd3c0f1704c?hl=en&lnk=gst&q=frog#

AND, Stern has done touch ups on games with blemishes from the factory, so it is possible for them to chip, the poster didn't say ruin, a pair of legs. Here is a post detailing touch ups from Stern.

https://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.pinball/browse_thread/thread/c624199adc379826/f354f91dc8f6faee?hl=en&lnk=gst&q=stern+sharpie#

Doesn't happen often, and Stern is great with customer service as exflexer is getting a new set, but it does happen and people shouldn't be shocked. People forget for a long time, these were meant to go out on route, and not the home market which is a more finicky clientele.

That's CRAZY! OK...I get it.

Man that just takes all the wind out of the sails .Jealousy or just poor motor skills by the delivery guys?

Absolutely right. I work for a LTL carrier..We actually delivered Scooters SM. We had no problems but it was just dumb luck. Seen a Elvis machine come through that was packed like crap that I am assured got damaged...Freight gets handled so much through the system that damages happen. At my terminal we have a couple of guys that hate thier job,are to lazy to get off the lift,and tear up anything fagile. You need to protect yourself when shipping a pin by making it a little more bulletproof. We it comes to NIB I want a little more protection than cardboard, perhaps a little white glove service...Would I ship a pin through my company or any other LTL carrier (less than a load)...HELL NO.

His point may be to contact executive management. Ill tell you what, when you have a legit beef and go through the proper channels without satisfaction, writing a letter to the CEO or upper management will get you attention. And service.

You can also contact your local/state US government representative and their staff will, in the name of the representative, contact the firm and ask for resolution. I guarantee you that either of these avenues will get you a response and more often than not resolution to your problems sooner than later.

AND, Stern has done touch ups on games with blemishes from the factory, so it is possible for them to chip, the poster didn't say ruin, a pair of legs. Here is a post detailing touch ups from Stern.

https://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.pinball/browse_thread/thread/c624199adc379826/f354f91dc8f6faee?hl=en&lnk=gst&q=stern+sharpie#
...

My HULK came with touch ups on the inside of the cab..side boards where you would put the mirror blades on...

2 nice fat gouges touched up black, and 4 others "scrapes" from the PF being lifted up and down, not touched up...

Am i happy, NOPE...am i gonna send it back NOPE... does it suck YEP !

my hulk arrived in great condition from r&l. the driver was really cool and used the forklift to bring the game uphill on my driveway to my garage for me and didnt have to. i gave him a tip but he didnt ask for one and seemed very thankful for it. there was a small chip of paint missing on one of my legs but im 99.9% that was the way it came from the factory.

as soon as mine came off the truck i did a thurough inspection of the entire box as i know that once you accept delivery your chances of winning a damage claim is very low.

anything weighing 300 lbs and that size has a decent chance to get damaged from any kind of bulk shipper as the guys who load and unload all day dont give a fuck about what they are transporting.

stern could do a better job with packaging. the corners are protected good but the rest of the game just has a layer of heavy cardboard protecting it. if they would use more of that heavy foam i think it would definatly lead to less damages, happier customers and prob would be cheaper for them in the long run. when someone spends 7k on a nib game they shouldnt have to worry about it getting damaged before they open it.

does anyone know if stern will send replacement leg(s) for ones that have powdercoat damage that wasnt caused by the shipper?? mine wasnt damaged nearly as bad as the one pictured above but still an eyesore.

R&L, I will never ever use you because of this forum. Customers matter. Improve or die.

I will never use R & L even if there's a fire

When I bought my first NIB game (LOTR) from Jack they used R&L and everything went perfect. From what has been said on this thread however I definately would never use them again. Damage happens, and it can happen at numerous places enroute to your home. But when the management of the shipping company drags your nuts over broken glass before making things right thats total BS. Especially when there is an issue here of replacing the game in a timely manner while it is still available at the price you paid for it.
Big "thumbs down" to R&L. They will learn to respect to power of the internet. Hopefully they will clamp down on their employees and get rid of the bums that are giving them a bad name. And hopefully replace the worthless managers who have allowed this to go on beneath their noses without correcting it.

If that is really RL and carriers show your bosses this thread, dont expect a single soul in this thread to take the time writing a company that seems most dispise and will try and tell all pinball shippers not to use you under any circumstances. This quite a bit of freight for you to lose. I won't use you unless there is new management or ownership.

I've talked with the drivers.., and they all are very careful with the items.

However the dock hands and hub monkeys go out of their way to destroy things.

I've asked what I can do. Labels, more packaging etc. his response was that they take it as a challenge.

Then on top if it all, the claim process has specific procedures to follow that are obviously intended for you to get so frustrated that you give up.

I'm sure R and L isn't much different than any LTL, but they are the big one that services most my area.

I'll either drive my own delivery up to 400 miles or ill use a moving company

Lawyer... awesome.

Pain and suffering, loss of consortium I can see this going way over the 20K figure.

Go get em!

I actually bought a Jackbot from Greg and it came through NAVL. Zero issues. I've shipped through NAVL many times and never an issue that way either. I'm sure R&L will make it right quickly given the situation and who it is they are dealing with

Pain and suffering? please

I'm all for "make it right" but this is one of the problems in our society today.

Really? O dear. Pain and suffering. First world problems galore.

If they would "Make it right" without the pickle dance designed to wear you down and give up then there would be no need for litigation.
This is the problem with society, they screw you and expect you to just lie down and take it because the cost to litigate is more than it is worth.
This is why you keep hearing about these horror stories with shippers, they know they can get away with this crap unabated.
I have a corporate attorney on retainer to deal with idiots that want to sue because we didn't disclose that they will owe property taxes on property they bought, airplanes fly over the house or you can hurt yourself shoveling snow.
I won't pay their extortion, I will litigate and win every time.
Once the word gets out you will just pay to avoid litigation that just opens the floodgates for more frivolous lawsuits.
We used to be able to store escrow files 12 to 14 to a file box, now it is 1 per box sometimes 2 boxes.
Most of it is pages and pages of disclosure, did you know there are bears and coyotes in the woods?
Better disclose it or some idiot will sue.
Snowplows leave berms, better disclose that or some idiot will sue.
The list is endless.

You'll get whatever you need to make yourself whole again. I wouldn't count on getting a free pinball machine and free shipping for life.