(Topic ID: 173382)

Rick and PPS Making Fraudulent Claims - FYI

By RetroRefurbs

7 years ago


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    #23 7 years ago
    Quoted from TFraelich:

    Mr. Bell,
    I act as outside counsel for Planetary Pinball. You are well aware that I have contacted you multiple times about your unauthorized advertisement and sale of numerous products for Williams/Bally pinball machines. I even have a signature confirmation signed by you, "Peter Bell" confirming that you received my initial letter. Unfortunately, you have steadfastly ignored these communications and continue to infringe trademarks and copyrights to which you have no rights. Several examples of such infringing products can be seen on your website.
    As most people that have ever watched a movie on Blu-Ray or DVD know who have seen the warning at the beginning of the movie, the unauthorized sale of goods which violate the trademarks and copyrights of others can subject not only the seller to legal jeopardy, but anyone trading in such goods as well. Thus, you are willfully placing your customers in legal jeopardy by selling them unlicensed products. Planetary Pinball wants to serve the pinball community and wants to maintain good relationships with those in it, but it cannot continue to countenance your actions. There really is no question that Planetary Pinball licensed its rights to the relevant Williams/Bally intellectual property for a considerable sum and you did not. I strongly suggest that you find some other way to enjoy the hobby without breaking the law and infringing the rights of others and I sincerely hope that you choose to conduct yourself appropriately in the future. Of course, if you have some legitimate explanation for your behavior, I would be pleased to receive it in response to the several communications that have already been sent to you.
    Tim Fraelich

    You might want to read a few more law books.

    #28 7 years ago

    It is NOT illegal to buy (alleged) counterfeit goods. Certainly not in the UK and I wouldn't be surprised most other places too.

    #87 7 years ago
    Quoted from PPS:

    http://www.planetarypinball.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=ABUS should answer the question about rights, scope, duration, etc.

    You might want to get your lawyer to have another look at that. You again insinuate that anyone purchasing unlicensed goods is breaking the law.

    10
    #91 7 years ago
    Quoted from Ballypinball:

    I know the PPS Lawyer and can confirm he is one of the Best Trademark and Copyright Lawyers in the USA with offices all over the World.

    Really ? Issuing threats with erroneous claims are the actions of one of the best lawyers in the USA ?

    #124 7 years ago
    Quoted from PPS:

    I guess we are all just wondering what rights you have to make and reproduce items with the Bally(tm) and Williams(tm) trademarks on them.
    Just answer the simple question. From your email, sounds like you are reselling someone elses decals ...
    Hi Rick,
    Thanks for your recent order for pinball cabinet decals with Retro Refurbs.
    I regret to inform you that we cannot fulfil your order on this occasion. You will need to contact our boss and supplier Enrico Gadda to see if you are permitted to buy. You can contact him directly on Facebook at his page: https://www.facebook.com/decalspinball
    Once again I apologise for the inconvenience caused and wish you a lovely day
    Kind regards,
    Pete Bell
    Service & Repairs Technician

    Whilst we are seeking explanations, would you care to explain why your lawyer is posting threats based on an erroneous legal position ?

    #139 7 years ago
    Quoted from PPS:

    well, they certainly want to talk on pinside to me ... but that must be it, which is great as it gives me more time to make parts!

    Care to answer my question in post #124 ?

    #149 7 years ago
    Quoted from robotron911:

    I've dealt with licensing before on products that involved dealing with someone who held a license from another party ... I have never had a situation where both parties - content originator and the party they licensed the content to - (in this case, WMS/SGI and PPS) BOTH asked for royalties. I paid royalties to the party that held the purchased the licensing rights and they had to figure out what, if any, compensation was owed to the licensor.
    I completely understand the need to consistently and conscientiously enforce copyright/patent rights. What seems a bit, well janky, is your "lawyer" posting on the forum and then you making multiple posts defending your stance/rights. I don't know of an attorney worth a damn that wouldn't tell his client be quiet and have any communication made through him/her. In matters where legality are weighed, your comments are both admissible and relevant in any court proceeding. All your comments can do is erode any legal advantage you have and erode any goodwill you may (or may not) have with your customer base. Frankly, your own posts are just perpetuating your reputation as a "dick". I've never met you or dealt with you, but I know your reputation well. You might want to consider all of this before you post again.

    Well said. But I would like him to answer my question about threatening purchasers of 'counterfeit' goods before he shuts up.

    #158 7 years ago
    Quoted from jchiu:

    I assume the logic is:
    They must have a heck of a time enforcing this against the OP because I assume he's somewhere in England. So how much money are you going to spend going after a mom and pop shop in Great Britain? Are you going to contact British outside council and wrestle with the British justice system- you think US attorneys are expensive? How much money is this going to cost you even if you do stop him.
    Since the OP posted on Pinside (which I assume is where his customers are), why not write a cease and desist letter and put everyone on notice. If you cant stop the OP from selling, make the customers stop buying.
    Cease and desist letters are meant to scare people. The actual cost of litigation and enforcement are enormous, especially against foreign entities. Posting here is the most efficient way to convey a message and hope people comply voluntarily.
    Again, this is just my complete guess.

    I'm not sure what you mean by 'put everyone on notice'.

    #196 7 years ago
    Quoted from NeilMcRae:

    If you knowingly are buying counterfeit goods then yes it is (conspiracy) and it's definitely illegal to sell, make or trade them.

    Only two countries in the world where it is illegal to buy 'unlicensed' goods are France and Italy. If you can prove to me otherwise I would happily change my view and withdraw my question.

    #209 7 years ago

    Why thank you good Sir !

    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png

    #258 7 years ago
    Quoted from Ericpinballfan:

    I thought PPS and BAA were both Rick's operations? Both in Sparks NV? If not who owns BAA?
    I own both trademarks and copyright on a certain item belonging to a dead Surrealist. When a chap in England started to reproduce those images on canvas, I couldn't get my lawyer to send C&D fast enough. I also got eBay to ban him from doing it there to. Such a time involving project and waste of money. My property not his, it's about the effort i put into this project and money in Hamburg Germany buying the product. It's mine....not someone else's to profit from. The stores that buy from me to sell in there book shops don't want to see low quality reproductions and fakes hurting there sales.
    Rick is 100% right here.
    OP does not make these. There made in another country, he buys them, and sells out of his bussiness in England. He's actually breaking the law even thou he didn't make them. He is selling a licensed product that belongs to some one else. Also, making to distribute in England is a second crime.
    Google it. Moderators should step in regardless of there position for rule #1.
    Don't bad mouth other members. This isn't the forum for that.
    Besides ever seen these decals?, there Shit. Don't waste your money no matter how desperate you are. It's only pinball, relax. Someone legal will make your decals soon enough here in states and buy American too!

    How do you know the decals are 'shit' ?

    #270 7 years ago
    Quoted from Ericpinballfan:

    Seen 3 sets in person, touched ,unrolled, promptly rerolled and told the guy no Thank you. Came from same guy in Italy that sells to OP. There Shit!
    Colors were off by some color spectrum especially in the blues. Back to the Future colors were muted, printing of letters was blurry small double image. The vinyl used was easily wrinkled and scuffs during application, even with soft clothes.
    My poor friend was dupped into a set buying a Mousin Around buying banged up mouse and charged $200 foe the Shit set. When he showed them to me , my first question was, machine was sitting right there, you didn't hold it up to side and compare???
    These decal sets are cheap crappy reproductions...Fact!

    Are you sure they are the same ? Because I have heard from people who have bought from the OP and said the quality was excellent.

    Now I haven't purchased any decals from Retro Refurbs or from Italy so I cannot compare them.

    #327 7 years ago

    Is it possible in the US to obtain the details of a license agreement ?

    #379 7 years ago

    Would be much more straightforward if it was that the copyright is valid if the writer (music, literature) is still alive or the original company is still producing a product.

    #418 7 years ago
    Quoted from Bryan_Kelly:

    I've seen documents. Rick definitely holds the Bally/Williams rights. No idea on the others.

    How far back in time ?
    When Williams and Bally merged, did Williams get the rights to Bally's back catalogue or just every thing from date of purchase going forwards ?

    So do PPS own the rights to EVERYTHING Bally and EVERYTHING Williams ?

    #424 7 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    You will never get a straight, non evasive answer.
    Just like the Capcom question has been asked 1000 times without a straight answer.

    Well it's about bloody time they were brought to task about exactly what they own the rights to. They may well be insinuating that they own the rights to stuff that they don't and in doing so preventing people getting much needed parts for games.

    The whole parts business has been far too cloak and dagger ever since Williams shut up their pinball shop.

    #427 7 years ago
    Quoted from Bryan_Kelly:

    I did not read the fine print.

    Sadly the fine print seems to be the crux of the matter.

    #471 7 years ago
    Quoted from Wizcat:

    Largely agree with your point, though I think you must mean for more people to be involved as suppliers to PPS? I think that's the only way it could work. The alternative would be PPS saying 'ok everyone, make whatever you want, but you got to pinky promise to pay us per part sold' which would be a huge trust issue.

    If the parts were only sold via approved sellers (in various countries) the revenue could be controlled.

    #505 7 years ago
    Quoted from Ericpinballfan:

    This topic isn't dead yet?
    This is a great scam by the OP.
    Wondering how many sets of decals he sold this week?

    Where were the BTTF decals bought from ?

    #530 7 years ago
    Quoted from Philk:

    This isn't the courts, they just need to prove/convince having the license to the IP to the point of contact at paypal. If PPS has anything, its going to be better than what RR has to stand on. Further, when paypal looks at what is being sold, its obvious what is going on, lots of brands, lots of hard to acquire licenses. Paypal likes to freeze accounts and sit on your funds. If you have a PP account frozen from selling copyrighted goods, your balance funds are frozen indefinitely, your funding/withdrawl sources & SS blacklisted indefinitely.
    Then PPS would go to instagram, facebook, etc again register as the owner/sole licensee of the infringed IP, have those accounts suspended. Then they would just have to track it from there, if a new website popped up, they would just have to find out which merchant account & hosting account and do the same.
    There's a big difference in PPS' ability to punish & seek damages versus their ability to stop/limit.

    What if it turns out PPS put a block on RR's PayPal account only for it to be established that PPS does NOT in fact own any rights to a lot of the IP under discussion ? The repercussions for PPS would be catastrophic I should imagine.

    #532 7 years ago
    Quoted from Homepin:

    Not really - PayPus don't give a toss about anything or anyone except their bottom line!

    Agreed but my point was about blocking somebody's account on a fraudulent IP claim.

    #534 7 years ago
    Quoted from Grizlyrig:

    I would think the repercussions would be enough that you would make sure you have all your ducks in a row next time.
    Mike

    I'd also wish to employ a lawyer that didn't make threats based on a false legal position.

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