As far as discrete pinball titles, the Ann Arbor show has more games. And they have game credits.

All i'm saying is the move to the convention center was a poor idea in my opinion. the PAPA facility is awesome, best pinball facility in the world. to abandon it for a cavernous concrete war zone that is that convention center is just silly. you have to move all the games, and that's expensive, time consuming, and then set up and level and of course repair. PAPA has a repair facility, convention center does not. i understand they wanted more room for the tourney. but i just think it took awesome and made it sub par at best. they are out of their element at the convention center. it's the worst pinball experience when you compare it to the awesomeness that is the PAPA facility. The echo and massive concrete floor, walls, ceiling, it sucks ball at the convention center, and just wears you out. I guess having video games is ok but i'm there for PINBALL, not video games. Mileage will vary, but replayfx is terrible. they took the best thing and ruined it. It's like having a perfect girlfriend with "C" cups and she decides to get fakes and make them XXX size. Now she has back pain and they're bigger than her head, and you're like, why??

look i'm sorry but i stand by my statements and my opinion. the PAPA facility is awesome. the convention center is concrete hell. this has nothing to do with any other show. this has everything to do with taking a great thing (PAPA) and turning it into a sub par event (convention center). that's just how i feel. i'm sorry if some one doesn't agree. if you want a bunch of agreeable lemmings then you can ask the moderators to censor this thread. I have an opinion. perhaps it's not the same as yours. That doesn't make it invalid. bring the show back to the PAPA facility, which frankly is the best pinball place in the world. leave the video games outs and the concrete in downtown pittsburgh.

Can't the PAPA roof be fixed? I didn't know it was leaking... that needs taken care of ASAP.
Are you suggesting that the current PAPA HQ is going to turn into a mere pinball warehouse? and that you won't fix the roof? And that everything will eventually be at the convention center?

As for PAPA parking, personally i've never found it to be an issue. sure you need to get creative once in a while, but for the most part i think there's plenty of parking. I mean it's not like parking at Walmart. but who cares if you have to walk a little after you park. no big deal.

As for the run down building in front of PAPA, that doesn't bother me. Actually i kind of like it.

If the PAPA people are well funded, can't that building in front of PAPA HQ be bought and torn down? or is that like way too much money? i have no idea what that would cost. are the current building owners not required to take that down if it is condemned?

Also that building was there before PAPA owned their HQ. It's not like that came up all a sudden. It was a known quantity. Wasn't that a factor with the original site was purchased and renovated?

I bet if you did a kickstarter to buy that building it would do great. then you could turn it into parking.

We had vfw roof problems and went with a metal roof. It went right over the old roof. Worked really well but it was expensive.

Seriously though if you did a kick starter and a smallish show with say 400 tickets/day at papa, I bet it could really help with roof finances. I'm sure you all have thought of that though. Wouldn't have to move games, low expenses...

Not trying to start a pissing match but you may not understand either.

I own the vfw and all the games. I saved and bought and paid for them. I'm there 7 days a week, in the mornings, afternoon, evenings every day till 11pm (except Thursday and Saturday eves, which I use to keep married!) I live 1/2 mile from the facility so I'm there a lot. I can walk there and often do in the summer. I do the building maintenance and game maintenance. Do I have help? Some, but for the most part it's me. We get together almost every Friday night to test the games. A few guys help me Monday and Wednesday night. But the help is low level. The hard stuff falls on me.

So trust me, I know exactly how much work this type of stuff is. I don't have an non profit set up (though looking at my empty bank account I often wish I did). So please don't patronize me with how much work you do. Because I have a clue for you, it ain't near what I do at the vfw. I'm up at 5.30am and to bed at 11pm, and it's pinball all day, and mostly at the vfw. So please don't lecture me on your work ethic.

I probably have in excess of millions of dollars invested in the vfw. And probably that many hours too. How about this nugget.... Put your money and time on the line. Sure Kevin spent money. So did john weeks. Probably Tim Arnold too. That's pretty much the list. But only Tim and myself manage day to day operation each and every day. Kevin and weeks don't get their hands dirty. Look at my hands. Look at my shoes. That should tell you everything.

Edit... This is in response to the post by papa which has been deleted.

my bad