Fixing/Reinforcing Stern Cabinets with better Leg Plates - Step By Step

(Topic ID: 216251)

Fixing/Reinforcing Stern Cabinets with better Leg Plates - Step By Step


By vireland

8 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 194 posts
  • 48 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 62 days ago by Spiderpin
  • Topic is favorited by 173 Pinsiders

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    There are 194 posts in this topic. You are on page 3 of 4.
    -2
    #101 7 months ago
    Quoted from D-Gottlieb:

    Go ahead and do them.

    Like we need your permission. Were talking about a Stern game here, not Gottlieb. You should do it for your Star Wars, and you can do the front too. No one needs to know, it can be your little secret.

    #102 7 months ago

    Is everyone thinking the better leg plates is all that is needed? I've seen some folks putting L brackets in near the top of the cab corners, also.

    #103 7 months ago
    Quoted from treborlicec:

    Is everyone thinking the better leg plates is all that is needed? I've seen some folks putting L brackets in near the top of the cab corners, also.

    It's up to you. Personally I just did the leg plates and feel they are adequate on their own. Some extra L brackets up top are cheap additional protection if you feel so inclined.

    #104 7 months ago
    Quoted from treborlicec:

    Is everyone thinking the better leg plates is all that is needed? I've seen some folks putting L brackets in near the top of the cab corners, also.

    Here is what I did on my games, I used 3/4” wood screws with washers. The brackets are available at Home Depot.
    F66BEEBB-3489-4EBA-99C2-41370D8F4B68 (resized).jpeg

    #105 7 months ago
    Quoted from treborlicec:

    Is everyone thinking the better leg plates is all that is needed? I've seen some folks putting L brackets in near the top of the cab corners, also.

    Since most of the torque that causes the split is coming up from the legs IMO, the B/W bracket is enough to arrest the problem. None of the ones I've upgraded have even a crack, let alone a split, and one of them has a divot in the cement flooring that holds the leg in place and causes extra tension when players try to nudge aggressively. Even that one has not had a problem.

    #106 7 months ago
    Quoted from Concretehardt:

    Here is what I did on my games, I used 3/4” wood screws with washers. The brackets are available at Home Depot.

    F66BEEBB-3489-4EBA-99C2-41370D8F4B68 (resized).jpeg

    Slotted screws! Wow

    #107 7 months ago
    Quoted from DNO:

    Slotted screws! Wow

    Didn’t feel like ordering screws and no one in town carried the Philip’s head in this style of screw, they actually worked really well.

    #108 7 months ago
    Quoted from Concretehardt:

    Didn’t feel like ordering screws and no one in town carried the Philip’s head in this style of screw, they actually worked really well.

    Yeah... I would've sold the game as firewood, before using slotted screws. Why those screws are even still being made, is a mystery to me.

    #109 7 months ago
    Quoted from Timerider:

    Why those screws are even still being made, is a mystery to me.

    Slotted screw = cost cutting
    ...damn Stern

    #110 7 months ago

    Slotted screws are so 1940's

    Quoted from DNO:Slotted screw = cost cutting
    ...damn Stern

    #111 7 months ago
    Quoted from treborlicec:

    Is everyone thinking the better leg plates is all that is needed? I've seen some folks putting L brackets in near the top of the cab corners, also.

    I went 3 levels of support!

    573B9290-15F5-4929-BCE6-04E279945960 (resized).png70DEE77A-5B09-4C2E-B6AA-1AEAC3EC1BB4 (resized).pngACDE94B1-3B28-4383-8608-FC62AA3BBDF1 (resized).png
    -4
    #112 7 months ago

    Step 1:
    Don't buy anything from Stern.

    #113 7 months ago
    Quoted from Pinzzz:

    I went 3 levels of support!

    You should be good for a 5.5 earthquake or a shaker gone wild.

    #114 7 months ago

    Nevermind.

    #115 7 months ago

    I also posted this on the other cab issue thread:

    I talked to Chas yesterday he told me they have several cabinet manufacturers that they buy from, one of their cab suppliers was doing something different and only cabs from that Manufacture have an intermittent issue. Stern is aware of the issue and know where the cabs were coming from. It sounds like they have taken steps to correct the issue with the MFG. one last note I was worried that if I did the Williams brackets in my games and still had a problem that it would potentially void my warranty, Chas told me he/Stern was fine with it if I wanted to install the Williams brackets. Chas says his big headache is not a random cabinet failure it’s people putting 6 and 12 way power splitters on their games and frying something then calling him to sort it out.

    #116 7 months ago

    He sounds like a reasonable kind of guy. Does he prefer people go through their distributors first before calling directly or is okay with being the contact?

    #117 7 months ago

    How would I find out what manufacture mine came from?

    #118 7 months ago

    Put the brackets on and sleep better.

    #119 7 months ago
    Quoted from D-Gottlieb:

    He sounds like a reasonable kind of guy. Does he prefer people go through their distributors first before calling directly or is okay with being the contact?

    He's always been ready to help when I've called. He has never said "You should have called your distro first."

    #120 7 months ago

    A friend and I put plates on the front legs of my IMDN, MET and GOTG. Thanks for the reminder and info Vireland.

    While we worked and played my friend and I concluded Stern makes wonky decisions sometimes but their games are awesome and paying $10 and 10 minutes a game for protection is better than spending thousands more for a pin with a more solid cab from another company.

    #121 7 months ago
    Quoted from Sinestro:

    He's always been ready to help when I've called. He has never said "You should have called your distro first."

    Chas is the BEST. A great asset to Stern.

    #122 7 months ago

    Love hearing Chas’s voice. Comforting.

    #123 6 months ago

    Thank you vireland for the motivation and the tips. Money well spent in my book. Even went a step further and replaced the plastic outer cabinet corners as they were pulling in and distorting during my upgrade.

    First removedStern stock outer cabinet corners (resized).jpg
    Then installed New steel outer cabinet corners (resized).jpg

    Removed...Stern stock inner cabinet corner (resized).jpg
    InstalledNew steel inner cabinet corner (resized).jpg

    #124 6 months ago
    Quoted from hd60609:

    Thank you vireland for the motivation and the tips. Money well spent in my book. Even went a step further and replaced the plastic outer cabinet corners as they were pulling in and distorting during my upgrade.
    First removed
    Then installed
    Removed...
    Installed

    The metal standoffs are certainly nicer and more durable than the plastic ones.

    2 weeks later
    #125 6 months ago
    Quoted from vireland:

    screw it into the leg plate.

    Thanks for taking the time to make/post this super helpful tutorial.

    Quick question: do you recommend drilling pilot holes before screwing the mounting screws into the cab' walls? It appears you did not on this IMDN. Are virtually all wood screws in pinball machines installed *without* pilot holes? And if that's true, are pilot holes contraindicated? Like, will a pilot hole actually compromise the hold of the screw? I've had screws that hold things like lamp sockets to the bottom of the PF pull their way free, as if the threads were forced to bite in sawdust rather than in true, dense wood. I figure I'm only gonna get one shot at this, so I want to do it right.

    #126 6 months ago
    Quoted from Jason_Jehosaphat:

    Thanks for taking the time to make/post this super helpful tutorial.
    Quick question: do you recommend drilling pilot holes before screwing the mounting screws into the cab' walls? It appears you did not on this IMDN. Are virtually all wood screws in pinball machines installed *without* pilot holes? And if that's true, are pilot holes contraindicated? Like, will a pilot hole actually compromise the hold of the screw? I've had screws that hold things like lamp sockets to the bottom of the PF pull their way free, as if the threads were forced to bite in sawdust rather than in true, dense wood. I figure I'm only gonna get one shot at this, so I want to do it right.

    The cabinet sides are plywood, so they have decent bite and still give (compared to pressboard or particle board). No need to pilot hole in it for smaller screws.

    Holes get enlarged with multiple cycles. For your PF screw, just put a toothpick with glue on it in the hole and remount your piece.

    #127 6 months ago
    Quoted from Jason_Jehosaphat:

    Thanks for taking the time to make/post this super helpful tutorial.
    Quick question: do you recommend drilling pilot holes before screwing the mounting screws into the cab' walls? It appears you did not on this IMDN. Are virtually all wood screws in pinball machines installed *without* pilot holes? And if that's true, are pilot holes contraindicated? Like, will a pilot hole actually compromise the hold of the screw? I've had screws that hold things like lamp sockets to the bottom of the PF pull their way free, as if the threads were forced to bite in sawdust rather than in true, dense wood. I figure I'm only gonna get one shot at this, so I want to do it right.

    No. The current Stern cabinet wood is REALLY soft (likely why splitting happens more often now). No pilot holes helps you get maximum bite. You definitely don't want to overtighten the screws and make sawdust.

    #128 6 months ago
    Quoted from Jason_Jehosaphat:

    Are virtually all wood screws in pinball machines installed *without* pilot holes?

    They just have a small dimple, then the factory workers just start the screws where the dimples line up. Not sure if the cabinet has dimples, my guess would be no.

    4 weeks later
    #129 5 months ago

    Evidence that Dead Pool pro has the better support brackets in the cabs on the line...

    36DE78B4-B7E5-456E-928F-A5793A434F70 (resized).png5AA5C5C2-17AE-41E5-B917-336FCB7D417D (resized).png
    #130 5 months ago

    As much as Stern is jacking up prices we deserve a 50 cent bracket upgrade bone tossed our way.

    #131 5 months ago
    Quoted from Pinzzz:

    Evidence that Dead Pool pro has the better support brackets in the cabs on the line...[quoted image][quoted image]

    Crappier than the B/W brackets, but WAY better than what they had before. So smallclap for progress (and boo on another price increase).

    #132 5 months ago

    The Bally/WMS brackets don't seem to fit great in my Maiden. There's gaps on both sides. Is this what others are seeing too?

    #133 5 months ago

    No issues with GOTG.

    #134 5 months ago

    Here's a picture with one side up flush against the cabinet. The other side has a large gap. If I center it the gap is on both sides.

    IMG_5130 (resized).JPG
    #135 5 months ago

    Put the legs bolts in first and get them tight. Then screw in the sides. It should draw in the brackets to the cabinet.

    #136 5 months ago

    Plus don't forget to remove the old Stern brackets first. Looks like they are still in place. Looking at picture

    #137 5 months ago
    Quoted from Spiderpin:

    Put the legs bolts in first and get them tight. Then screw in the sides. It should draw in the brackets to the cabinet.

    I will give that a try this weekend. As for the other message I removed one side and took the pic from the other side (with leg plate still in place) as I couldn't get a good pic on the side where it was removed.

    Was half thinking about trying to get the Stern part as used in Deadpool too. Anyone use these or everyone going with the Bally/WMS plates?

    #138 5 months ago

    I usually put the leg on with the new bracket.
    Tighten it as much as I normally would, then put the screws in.
    Some games have a gap, some don't.
    The gap will be almost non-existent after you put the new screws in though... Just don't overtighten, its way to easy to strip out these cabinets. I usually just start it with a impact driver and hand tighten the rest of the way.

    I like to try to keep things factory looking and use these screws,

    amazon.com link »

    pretty sure they have zinc as well. Stainless can be a pain to use because its not as magnetic, when your using a magnetic nut driver.

    #139 5 months ago

    These screws are better, plus have a Philips head and go in deeper I have also used the 3/4" ones with no problem. amazon.com link »

    #140 5 months ago
    Quoted from hocuslocus:

    I usually put the leg on with the new bracket.
    Tighten it as much as I normally would, then put the screws in.
    Some games have a gap, some don't.
    The gap will be almost non-existent after you put the new screws in though... Just don't overtighten, its way to easy to strip out these cabinets. I usually just start it with a impact driver and hand tighten the rest of the way.
    I like to try to keep things factory looking and use these screws,
    amazon.com link »
    pretty sure they have zinc as well. Stainless can be a pain to use because its not as magnetic, when your using a magnetic nut driver.

    Those are not wood screws. Don't use sheetmetal or drywall screws. A factory look with a lesser hold is a losing game. Why bother with the upgrade at all at that point?

    #141 5 months ago
    Quoted from vireland:

    Those are not wood screws. Don't use sheetmetal or drywall screws. A factory look with a lesser hold is a losing game. Why bother with the upgrade at all at that point?

    Yes I seen he posted sheet metal screws so I posted the wood screws. Ok it was 1000 count that's the way I buy (in bulk) can change to 100 count. PS thanks for starting the forum.

    #142 5 months ago
    Quoted from Spiderpin:

    Yes I seen he posted sheet metal screws so I posted the wood screws. Ok it was 1000 count that's the way I buy (in bulk) can change to 100 count. PS thanks for starting the forum.

    Yeah, I was totally down with your alternative suggestion because they were still wood screws. It's the ones he wanted to use for cosmetics (on the inside of a cabinet corner??) that were a bad idea.

    I was glad to share this improvement, and it was sorely needed with the cab wood secret downgrades at Stern that were causing more frequent splitting. Happy to see people getting some benefit from this thread.

    #143 5 months ago
    Quoted from hd60609:

    Thank you vireland for the motivation and the tips. Money well spent in my book. Even went a step further and replaced the plastic outer cabinet corners as they were pulling in and distorting during my upgrade.
    First removed[quoted image]
    Then installed [quoted image]
    Removed...[quoted image]
    Installed[quoted image]

    Wait a minute, the leg standoffs are plastic now? My TWD is the newest Stern I own, I don't remember if it had plastic or metal corners. Wow, I don't believe this shit.

    #144 5 months ago
    Quoted from kvan99:

    Wait a minute, the leg standoffs are plastic now? My TWD is the newest Stern I own, I don't remember if it had plastic or metal corners. Wow, I don't believe this shit.

    I don't think those need to be metal to do their intended job.

    #145 5 months ago
    Quoted from kvan99:

    Wait a minute, the leg standoffs are plastic now? My TWD is the newest Stern I own, I don't remember if it had plastic or metal corners. Wow, I don't believe this shit.

    They've been plastic for a while with Stern.

    #146 5 months ago
    Quoted from vireland:

    Those are not wood screws. Don't use sheetmetal or drywall screws. A factory look with a lesser hold is a losing game. Why bother with the upgrade at all at that point?

    there is usually more thread's per inch on sheet metal screws
    plus most wood screws aren't threaded all the way down.
    other then that there isn't much difference btwn the two.

    it's also the same exact screws they use all over most playfields. (except they use zinc coated sheet metal screws)

    I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure CGC used that same screw for their leg plates. I don't have any around me to check though.

    #147 5 months ago
    Quoted from hocuslocus:

    there is usually more thread's per inch on sheet metal screws
    plus most wood screws aren't threaded all the way down.
    other then that there isn't much difference btwn the two.
    it's also the same exact screws they use all over most playfields.
    I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure CGC used that same screw for their leg plates. I don't have any around me to check though.

    You don't want more threads per inch with WOOD. A wider thread gives the screw more wood to grab, especially if the wood is soft. Too dense of threads gives a worse hold in wood.

    #148 5 months ago
    Quoted from vireland:

    You don't want more threads per inch with WOOD. A wider thread gives the screw more wood to grab, especially if the wood is soft. Too dense of threads gives a worse hold in wood.

    Pretty sure they use that type of screw to mount almost everything in the game and some items in the cab.
    I have a lot of those zinc screws I ordered from marco and pinball spare parts, it's the exact same thing. They hold pretty good, and their hex.

    #149 5 months ago
    Quoted from hocuslocus:

    Pretty sure they use that type of screw to mount almost everything in the game and some items in the cab.
    I have a lot of those zinc screws I ordered from marco and pinball spare parts, it's the exact same thing. They hold pretty good, and their hex.

    ....and for a playfield application that holding power of sheet metal screws is perfectly fine, however for holding a 250+ lb cabinet together sheet metal screws do not have the same holding strength as the appropriate wood screws.

    #150 5 months ago

    Okay boys... don't make me separate you two.

    Vireland is more right here... He has valid point about soft woods and real wood screw pitches.
    hocuslocus is also right; in that Stern uses the same sheet metal screws throughout the game... that in of itself doesn't make it good practice... this about bom management and higher volumes to get better pricing for said screws... not about what is the right thing to do.

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