Red Baron ... not resetting completely

0

#1 8 years ago

OP

DCS

Pinside member

Fort Wayne, IN

8y 33,400 12 5

I'm working on my 2nd EM repair, a chicago coin red baron, I have an issue that should be easy but I've racked my brain and not getting there. When I hit the start button and the game tries to reset score reels, it only resets 3 positions on each reel (I get one "click, click, click"). If I turn off the power and back on again then hit start I get 3 more and so on until eventually I can get reset all the way.

I have pretty well determined that the problem is that the reset relay engages and stays engaged. I took a screw driver and stuck it in between the reset relay coil and armature to prevent it from engaging like it "wanted" to, and this allowed the scores to reset correctly, and the score reset relay continued clicking away until I removed the screwdriver and allowed the reset relay to engage stopping the process.

I know that the reset relay is powered by the E-1 switch on the bottom cam of the score motor thingy and it is a normally closed switch that opens with each 1/3 turn (I think) of the score motor, but I'm missing something since that isn't causing the reset relay to disengage plus it seems like something else should keep the reset on throughout a game to prevent resetting every time you score...???

I could just play by turning on/off 3 times for every game but sure would appreciate some advice on how to just get it right

0

#2 8 years ago

???

pinballdaveh

Pinside member

Unknown

10y 38,800 1,970

on CC games they dont use switch stacks on the score reels, they use a circuit board to control zero position, 9th position for carry over, score reel coil pulsing, and 0-9 positions for replay scores and match. old lube on boards and wiper fingers need to be cleaned. sometimes burn marks can happen on boards. re-assemble with proper wiper finger tension.

0

#3 8 years ago

OP

DCS

Pinside member

Fort Wayne, IN

8y 33,400 12 5

Quoted from pinballdaveh:
on CC games they dont use switch stacks on the score reels, they use a circuit board to control zero position, 9th position for carry over, score reel coil pulsing, and 0-9 positions for replay scores and match. old lube on boards and wiper fingers need to be cleaned. sometimes burn marks can happen on boards. re-assemble with proper wiper finger tension.

I've already cleaned all score reels, cleaned off all their circuit boards, lubed lightly with teflon super lube and checked tension. Wouldn't this only be an issue if the machine was getting a "false positive" response on zero position? So maybe if the part of the board indicating a zero was getting hit? And I think it has happened even when multiple reels (like 4-6) aren't at zero so would have to be something that is wrong with ALL of them. I will certainly take a look at them but it doesn't feel like that would be the issue.

0

#4 8 years ago

RM

rolf_martin_062

Inactive member

Aarau

9y 59,550 4,150 14 8

Hi DCS
I do not know Chicago-Coin Pins - I am surprised about Your description "Reset-Relay" (Williams-pins: Reset-Relay pulls -> No-1-2-Reset-Relay and No-3-4-Reset-Relay are pulsed by the Score-Motor (and by that the Counters are reset) - ALL Counters on Zero -> Reset-Relay gets no longer current and stops pulling).

Well, I looked in ipdb.org - to "Chicago Coin Olympics" thay have a schema -> schema-H-15:
Score-Reset-Relay is pulsed by Score-Motor-C-5 - IF THE SWITCH ON START-RELAY IS CLOSED.
Your description "does reset - but only 3 steps" -> my question: does the Start-Relay "QUITS PULLING" TOO EARLY ? -> looking at the "Start-Relay" -> -> where is it drawn (Olympics ?) ?????

DCS, do You have a schema "Red Baron" ?
Look for Relays involved in the Start-Sequence -> look for "Self-Hold-Switch-on-Relay***" - is this switch "faulty-always-open" so the Relay quits pulling too early ? Write if you have a schema and want to "look together". Greetings Rolf

P.S.: "Self-Hold-Switch-on-Relay***" - In the pin You see at first glance if a relay has such a switch: If a wire runs from one "Lug-on-coil-of-relay" to a Normally-Open-Switch (mounted on the relay) -> this is a Self-Hold-Switch.
The meaning is: ABCD-Relay gets (a kick) initial current -> relay starts pulling -> also closes is Self-Hold-Switch (establishing "current forever") -> no longer initial current BUT CURRENT FOREVER -> after a long time: another relay pulls and OPENS a switch - opens the "Self-Hold-Circuitry of ABCD-Relay" -> ABCD-Relay stops pulling and by that opens its "Self-Hold-Switch" -> "Everything is done completely, hurray, ready for next action ...