Grand Prix
Williams, 1976I was recently able to get a high quality scan from an original backglass for a game I'm working on (my backglass is trash... maybe 10% of the original ink intact). I vectored that scan, touched it up a bit, and had a high quality print made on "backlit poster" material.
I secured two thin pieces of glass from my local hardware store. The question I'm struggling with is how to bond it all together.
Any advice from those of you who have been down this road?
You will probably need a layer to mask the non-lit areas also. If I remember right when Gary Conway used to do this he would use silicon on the outside edges of the glass to bond it together. Some heavy tape might work also especially if cover by some channel trim.
Quoted from AlexF:You will probably need a layer to mask the non-lit areas also. If I remember right when Gary Conway used to do this he would use silicon on the outside edges of the glass to bond it together. Some heavy tape might work also especially if cover by some channel trim.
Thanks. I was thinking about trying channel trim. Didn't know if it would hold together or not. A friend has a vinyl cutter, and will be cutting a backmask for me, so I don't have to fiddle around with paint.
Quoted from yaksplat:Why not get it printed on material with adhesive on it? I've done this before while having a marquee printed.
That wasn't an option for me with my local printer. They did a fantastic job on it though-- it really looks great. It's the same material (acetate?) that backlit movie posters are printed on. I'm really impressed with it, and the cost was very modest (under $50 for two copies)
Quoted from drsfmd:That wasn't an option for me with my local printer. They did a fantastic job on it though-- it really looks great. It's the same material (acetate?) that backlit movie posters are printed on. I'm really impressed with it, and the cost was very modest (under $50 for two copies)
Is it printed on the front or back of the acetate? If on the back so you are looking through the clear at the image you might be able to treat it like a translite and just attach it to the back of one sheet of glass. No reason to bond two.
If on the front of the acetate, then you probably have to sandwich it.
In either case, what did you do about the block out (usually the silver part on the back of a normal back glass) areas? And I would suggest putting a piece of very translucent white sign vinyl behind the image. It really can pop the colors and the whites. See what I did below.
Last time I had one printed, had it put on sign vinyl in 3 different layers. The main image. A white sheet with just the score and credit windows cut, and a sheet of black for the block out areas. Then applied them to the back of a sheet of glass. Looked like factory. They also double printed the image which helped with the color saturation.
I have translites made all the time.
I cut a back masking layer with my Cameo and apply it to the translite. Then attach the whole thing to glass using translite channel from Marco.
https://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/03-8228-2
20200129_135221 (resized).jpg20200129_212605 (resized).jpg20200130_110036 (resized).jpg20200423_151659 (resized).jpgQuoted from drsfmd:I was recently able to get a high quality scan from an original backglass for a game I'm working on (my backglass is trash... maybe 10% of the original ink intact). I vectored that scan, touched it up a bit, and had a high quality print made on "backlit poster" material.
How about posting your files to IPDB and here on pinside? Click on "Submit Changes" at the top right of https://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?id=1072
https://pinside.com/pinball/machine/grand-prix-williams/gallery/upload
Quoted from DCRand:Is it printed on the front or back of the acetate? If on the back so you are looking through the clear at the image you might be able to treat it like a translite and just attach it to the back of one sheet of glass. No reason to bond two.
I have no idea. How do I determine this? Either way though, I need to sandwich it for the masked layer which would go on the second piece of glass, no? It’s a wood rail, so I don’t have to worry about score reels and credit reels... just backmasking to direct the light to the correct spots. The original had no silver or white on the back. It was screened black in the masked areas.
Your’s looks incredible BTW!
Quoted from drsfmd:I have no idea. How do I determine this? Either way though, I need to sandwich it for the masked layer which would go on the second piece of glass, no? It’s a wood rail, so I don’t have to worry about score reels and credit reels... just backmasking to direct the light to the correct spots. The original had no silver or white on the back. It was screened black in the masked areas.
Your’s looks incredible BTW!
If you have to look through the acetate to see the image, it is printed on the back, also known as second surface. If the clear acetate is behind the printed image, then it is printed on the front, ie: first surface. And see other posts, you don't need or want to put the black out behind the second piece of glass. Layer it right to the back of the acetate. Just don't glue it. Use can use tape or mild adhesive at or near the edges that would be covered by the frame of the back box. If the image is first surface, and you have self adhesive block out, then you can attach the block out right to the acetate.
If you have to do it again, it really pays to use a printer ie: small sign shop, who can print on adhesive sign vinyl. I am really surprised you have one who couldn't. My local Signs by Tomorrow, who is also a friend and fellow Rotarian, can even print directly on glass. I haven't been brave enough to let him try yet.
BTW: the one in the pic isn't mine.
these guys http://www.coos.net/bingo_e/ will print on clear lexan, with a blackout mask. just use a little soapy water to slide into place and squeegee out the excess. goes on the back side of the glass just like the silkscreen glasses. Ive got 6-7 glasses done by them so far
Quoted from pinhead52:these guys http://www.coos.net/bingo_e/ will print on clear lexan, with a blackout mask. just use a little soapy water to slide into place and squeegee out the excess. goes on the back side of the glass just like the silkscreen glasses. Ive got 6-7 glasses done by them so far
What does it cost if you don't mind me asking? I always thought it seemed like a great option.
Quoted from AlexF:What does it cost if you don't mind me asking? I always thought it seemed like a great option.
With shipping from the Netherlands ~$150. I usually get 2 or 3 done at one time and upgrade to carrier delivery
Atari_Daze. Is your black masking cut in multiple pieces or is your cutter able to cut that wide in one piece? Also, if the masking is stuck to the back side of the translite, how do you keep the masking aligned correctly? Seems like it would be easy to get misaligned while trying to stick it to the other piece.
Quoted from edednedy:Atari_Daze. Is your black masking cut in multiple pieces or is your cutter able to cut that wide in one piece? Also, if the masking is stuck to the back side of the translite, how do you keep the masking aligned correctly? Seems like it would be easy to get misaligned while trying to stick it to the other piece.
Before I made a special light box for my work, I just used a 48" lamp fixture with a piece of playfield glass on it.
Invert the translite and one can see where the mask needs to lay down.
I only have a Cameo for vinyl cutting so it can only do 12" wide, thus a translite takes two sections.
You can see the light fixture in these images.
20200424_070511 (resized).jpg20200424_070521 (resized).jpg20200429_103334 (resized).jpgQuoted from pinhead52:With shipping from the Netherlands ~$150. I usually get 2 or 3 done at one time and upgrade to carrier delivery
The quote I got was more than double that. Which is a lot more than I paid for the machine, and the reason I didn’t go that route.
I did a redraw using 'Corel' from a photo of my 'Card Whiz' backglass many years ago. The file was printed on a translight material (Solink). The block out designed on 'Corel Draw' and was cut from adhesive vinyl then adhered to a sheet of 1.5mm 'Astariglas' which is a acrylic material. A second piece of 'Astariglas' is also used. You can see below how it all came together.
Translight (resized).pngQuoted from drsfmd:The quote I got was more than double that. Which is a lot more than I paid for the machine, and the reason I didn’t go that route.
Depending on when you got the quote it could have been. the us to euro is now 1.09.
Quoted from pinhead52:I stand corrected, $250 shipped
Must be the changes in the exchange rate then-- the quote I got was even higher than that. I don't have that much in the whole machine. 
It's together and bonded with tape at the moment for fitment purposes. Once I've got the back mask, I'll figure out the where the middle layer letters for (the tilt, and some things that are only visible when lit).
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