(Topic ID: 221457)

Recel Underwater (Arduino conversion)

By Frogger1108

5 years ago


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  • Latest reply 5 years ago by legtod2
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There are 55 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.
#1 5 years ago

Hi,
Since I finally have some time to spare I decided to start my pinball restoration project and share my progress. I aquired an "Underwater" playfield from Recel and decided to bring it back to life. However, as you can see, there is not much left from the original machine. All EM parts were gone and somebody even took all the lamp sockets off. Without the rest of the machine there is not much choice (if you don't want to use it for spare parts) but use some sort of microcontroller to revive it. Since all the coils and mechanims are still there, it should be possible to bring it back to life.

Step 1 will be the cleaning of the playfield and all components.
Once this is done I will reassemble the playfield, buy new rubbers and missing parts and design a wiring sheme for all sensors and coils.
After the wiring is done, I will design a solenoid driver board for all coils that will be controlled by the Arduino (which is every coil except for the flipper and slingshot coils)
Next step will be the actual wiring and connecting it all to the Arduino. Playtesting and programming will take some time, especially since I'd like to replicate the orignial rules as close as possible.
Since the lights are missing anyway I will probably do them last. I also need a switch matrix since I want to use only 3 pins on the Arduino....so this will take some time too.

My estimate is around 4-5 months if nothing goes wrong.....

This is the playfield as I found it:

front_recel (resized).jpgfront_recel (resized).jpg

And the backside

recel_back_ (resized).jpgrecel_back_ (resized).jpg

The front looks really good, however I have noticed a few areas where the "mylar" that Recel used to protect the entire playfield has delaminated. I will leave it as is since I don't expect that the removal of the mylar film will be an easy task. I will post some close ups once I cleaned the playfield.

#2 5 years ago

I recommend trying to drive the flippers via the arduino too. I had problems in my conversation every time I had a contact switching high voltages. The arcing would mess up signals, etc.

#3 5 years ago

Thank you for your feedback zacaj. I noticed this too during one of my earlier restoration projects. In my case, the induced current from the coils once you released the flipper caused some problems. I solved it by using more diodes since I wasn't sure how big the delay would be if I used an arduino for the flippers.

#4 5 years ago
Quoted from Frogger1108:

Thank you for your feedback zacaj. I noticed this too during one of my earlier restoration projects. In my case, the induced current from the coils once you released the flipper caused some problems. I solved it by using more diodes since I wasn't sure how big the delay would be if I used an arduino for the flippers.

Delay shouldn't be noticeable. Wpc games have up to a 4ms delay and no one complains. Even if you don't want to use the arduino, I'd recommend driving them via a transistor directly from the button instead of having the button switch the high voltage.

#5 5 years ago

Awesome another Arduino conversion. Resurrecting a parts machine is always fun and you get to add your special touches and game rules. I will be watching your progress.

Here is the one I did...
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/close-encounters-arduino-conversion

Looks like your machine was headless and missing more things than mine was.

What are you plans to resurrect this machine?

#6 5 years ago

It was not only head- but also bodyless , the picture you see is all I got. I bought an empty body and will use that to house the game, but at the moment I'm occupied with cleaning and wiring all the parts. I'm using crimp wire terminals so I can do all the cable work in advance and then connect it all to the Arduino. Yesterday I found out that some of the old solders are bad, so these connections will have to be resoldered too....
My first Arduino conversion was "ok", but I learned a lot on the way and took a lot of shortcuts which I would like to avoid this time. It turned out fine (for a first attempt) but this time I want to take a more "modular" approach and make an actual solenoid and lamp driver board. You can take a look at if you like, once I finish "Underwater" I might rewire the Aztec pinball and clean up the mess underneath the board
Your project looks quite nice, you put more thought into everything on your first attempt than I did !

https://create.arduino.cc/projecthub/Frogger1108/homemade-arduino-pinball-machine-4a3314?ref=user&ref_id=309269&offset=0

#7 5 years ago

I do have another thread on building your own Lamp driver which consist of Shift registers (595's), some transistors (BS170's for now), and it only take 3 pins on the arduino to drive it. All the lamp pins are on the lamp driver board instead of the arduino mega.
The mega drives it with the data, latch and clock pins.

The arduino code is really easy consisting of an attract mode rtn and game play lamp routine.

The sound delay issues might be mitigated by not having sound events associated with the pop bumpers or spinners.
My game has 22 different sound events associated. The arduino triggers a sound event to the raspberry pi and it plays the sound.
It can play multiple channels of sound simultaneously. Examples background theme, knock down target, etc.
The key I found was the sound clips needs to be short.

As far as the solenoid driver board was concerned I ordered a board from Zebasion boards because I was too lazy to build one myself.
His has worked perfectly for the last year or so with no issues.

To cut down on wiring to the mega, I used a switch matrix for play field inputs. It is an 5 x 8 matrix.

One big thing I learned was delay() can cause strange behavior in you game. For example in my reading of the switch matrix use of the delay was a no - no.
This could cause missing of other events when your reading 43 switches at a pass and debouncing them.
The only spot I used delay was on the fire of my solenoids. I am working on some logic now to detect stuck on fire solenoid routine so they don't get burnt out and melt solenoid's.

Another thing I did was have a diagnostic button that exercises every thing to detect bad logic, sound events, solenoid events, switches, burnt out playfield bulbs.

I have always thought about using the mainstream OPP or PRoc and MPF solutions for building my pinball machines but then I never would have learned as much as I did so far.

Really love how you buttoned up your machine, wires are tidy and has a more finished look then my current frankenstien.

Perhaps we can share lessons learned from our arduino creations.

#8 5 years ago

I read you lamp driver thread. Very nice work and a lot of research, this will surely come in handy once I built my own lamp driver board. Since I don't have lamps yet, I decided to give the solenoid driver board a try and this is the result oft the last hour of soldering:

It's not pretty but it looks very cute, must be close to the smallest solendoid driver board you can build by hand
solenoid_driver2 (resized).jpgsolenoid_driver2 (resized).jpg
I only need 4 for the Underwater, but I wanted to use all the available space and a fifth might come in handy...

#9 5 years ago

Frogger, what did you user for your transistors/mosfets ?
I am assuminging your machine is using 24 vdc for you solenoids ?

#10 5 years ago
Quoted from legtod2:

Frogger, what did you user for your transistors/mosfets ?
I am assuminging your machine is using 24 vdc for you solenoids ?

IRL540n. Same as most 2000s games use

#11 5 years ago

Yes, it's the IRL540n (at least the cheap chinese knockoff version). I used it in my other projects with 12-36 Volts and it works fine. In addition, you can't beat the price of these things, I ordered some yesterday and they are 15 cents a piece with shipping. Including all the other components, you can build the complete driver board for 5 solenoids for less than 2 bucks.

#12 5 years ago
Quoted from Frogger1108:

In addition, you can't beat the price of these things, I ordered some yesterday and they are 15 cents a piece with shipping.

Wow, that's real low. I think I'm paying $1+ a piece for them. Never thought of ordering from china.

#13 5 years ago

My restoration efforts just came to an abrupt stop as I tried to rebuild the flippers...and noticed for the first time that they had only 2 lugs...
flipper_coils (resized).jpgflipper_coils (resized).jpg I read the manual and the shematics, and I think they added some sort of resistor in parallel to the EOS switch but I have no idea what they used and what I could use to get similar results.
flipper_coils2 (resized).jpgflipper_coils2 (resized).jpg
Could anybody with a Recel EM machine check what they used and how they wired it up? At the moment I'm a little lost.

#14 5 years ago

might be better to just replace with regular coils? Weird that they don't label the resistors

#15 5 years ago

I see from that schematic, Recel did things the El Cheapo way in regards to the flipper coils. I would use a Gottlieb A-5141 flipper coil instead of what is already there.

If you choose to maintain the original Recel coils, wire a 20 ohm @ 25 watts resistor in series with one of the coil lugs on each flipper coil. Watch where you mount the resistor as it will get very hot during game play. You'd need two of those resistors (one for each flipper coil).

#16 5 years ago

Ok, thanks for your help. I wonder if "regular" flipper coils were so much more expensive back then or why they did it that way. I went through my spare parts bin and found a couple of A-5141s from 1966....I hope they still work . I will give them a try and report back.

#17 5 years ago

Remember, if you run the flipper coils on DC power, you'll need diodes on the coils.

#18 5 years ago

So, after a few evenings of cleaning, wiring and soldering I'm done with the "dirty" part of the restoration. I took the playfield apart, cleaned all components and the playfield and assembled everything again with new rubbers and springs. I rebuild the flippers with new coils and crimped every component with connectors. Every coil has a diode soldered on.

After that I started the wiring process....which took quite a while since I wanted to avoid the mess of wires I ended up in my last project. This time I used color coded wires and I tried to keep the wires together as much as possible.

This is the result, I tested all connections with a multimeter and they seem to be ok. Notice the Vari-Target...This target alone gives 6 outputs depending on the position hit, add a ground, a solenoid and a power line and you end up with 9 wires for this target alone. I decided against using a matrix since I'm using an Arduino Mega and I've got enough Pins to spare (at the moment I'm using 30 pins which leaves me 20 pins for the lights, start buttons etc.)
wiring_back (resized).jpgwiring_back (resized).jpg

I also tried to keep the wire ends tidy. I grouped them as much as possible (Rollovers, Targets, etc.) using Dupont connectors. This makes it easier to work with and you can connect them very easily to any microcomputer.
wiring2 (resized).jpgwiring2 (resized).jpg

This is the wiring for the Mosfets controlling the solenoids.
mosfetwiring (resized).jpgmosfetwiring (resized).jpg

And last but not least this if the front, cleaned and equipped with new rubbers. With a few exceptions where the Mylar is coming off slightly the playfield looks pretty good for its age.
front_new (resized).jpgfront_new (resized).jpg

As you can see, the lights are still missing. I'm not sure yet which approach I will take and will try a few things, but my priority will be the playtesting and the programming with the Arduino.

2 weeks later
#19 5 years ago

Looking good

1 month later
#20 5 years ago

After nearly a month I can say it's 95% done. I'm going to do a complete write-up in the next days, there are still a few little things to do but all major things are done and working.
I made a little playtest video to give you a first impression

1 week later
#22 5 years ago

I'm so impressed with your conversion and can't believe what you've done at this kind of budget. I purchased a Recel Mr Doom Playfield last week in much the same condition as yours (mine has all of the coils wires bulbs etc). I was going to use it as a display thinking it had gone to far but now I'm thinking of some kind of restoration, much like yours. What would you do? can I use the existing lights connections and plug it up to an Arduino? or do I need a new lighting loom, I was thinking of placing a new LEDs strip under the existing lights to help keeping them in place, much like you've done but preserving the original loom without destroying it and also using your script and changing it to fit mine (think the rules are similar).

I've never done anything like this before and think the scripting might beyond my ability, I'm also worried about the coils and making a solenoid driver board. What do you think? could a novice achieve something like yours?

Cheers PK

playfield back (resized).jpgplayfield back (resized).jpgplayfield top (resized).jpgplayfield top (resized).jpg
#23 5 years ago

Thank you.

That playfield looks pretty good, that one flipper coil might be burned but the rest seems to be in working condition. I'm confident you could get it back to working condition, just be prepared to be frustrated at times I'm looking back at my first restoration and I'm thinking about doing it all over again since I learned so much in the meantime.
If you want to start this project, I would advise you to do it very methodically and don't rush anything like I did with my first attempt.

A good start would be to get the playfield ready, this includes disassembling and cleaning everything, then populate the playfield with new rubbers and posts. After that you start working on the actual mechanisms, a good start are the ones working independently of the Arduino like the flippers and the slingshots. Then concentrate on the different inputs like rollovers, rubberbands and targets. Connecting these to the Arduino is pretty straigthforward and a script for simply testing the inputs is easily written. This allows you to "testplay" the machine and get the basic stuff working before worrying about the code or the solenoids.

In regard to your other questions:
A solenoid driver board is the best solution, but you don't need to start with it. A simple breadbord layout works just as well, allows you to test everything on the bench and work out any flaws. For my first conversion I simply soldered wires on each MOSFET and screwed them on a piece of wood....which is pretty stupid but it worked...

In regard to the lamps I would use WS2812 LEDs for every insert. They work amazingly well, are very bright and easy to work with. For the general illumination I would keep the original bulbs. You could buy 12V WS2812 LEDs and use the same power supply for them and the original lights, I think they used 12V DC for those (better check that though!)

#24 5 years ago

Thanks for that, i'll keep you posted on my progress.

Just to make sure I can connect the flippers and slingshots to a 24v power supply? then attach the slingshot pick up to the Arduino for the points information?

#25 5 years ago

If you are interested in considering alternatives, you might want to consider OPP stuff (http://pinballmakers.com/wiki/index.php/OPP). It is not Arduino based, but based off the PSOC4200. (Arduino processors could not match the price and processing at the time). Basically if you order three solenoid wing boards from MezelMods (each wing supports 4 solenoids and I can see 9 solenoids in your pictures) and get $20 in parts from your favorite parts supplier such as Mouser, you will have enough to drive everything on that playfield. Added bonus is the interface to Mission Pinball Framework is already done to control rules, scoring, etc.

If you are interested in learning about Arduinos, how to program them, and how to breadboard stuff, that is also a great way to go.

Just understand there are options. Have fun. These types of projects are great to learn a ton of things for basically no cost, and just have a great time. Good luck.

#26 5 years ago

I also thought about OPP initially. It's like openpinballpro said, if you're generally interested in learning about microcomputers and what you can do with them, go with the Arduino. It's a lot of fun and you can use it for a lot of other things as well. If not, OPP might be worth a look.

In regards to the driver board, I made a second version and took a picture for you. It looks a lot less complicated if you use a larger PCB

solenoid_driver2a (resized).jpgsolenoid_driver2a (resized).jpg
#27 5 years ago

very cool project. I hope the methods get standardized and people can use these boards to bring back EM machines if parts are not available.

#28 5 years ago
Quoted from lint:

very cool project. I hope the methods get standardized and people can use these boards to bring back EM machines if parts are not available.

It wouldn't be too hard to even make a modular board set designed to be dropped into everything from EMs straight up to many solid states just by selecting the right peripheral board for the type of setup they have. All solenoid drivers work the same, there's only two real ways to drive lights, etc. I worked on one for a while but I'm not really an electrical engineer

#29 5 years ago

There basically are three standards at this point. (These are simply my opinions, so they may not be correct guesses on prices and such). I'll go from cheapest to most expensive.

OPP (Open pinball project): Hobbyist sort of thing that you have to solder the boards yourself. Everything is through-hole so it is easy to hand solder. To convert an old Dolly Parton (mid to late 80s) machine it cost approximately $60 to drive everything. To fully convert an EM style machine it can run $80 because you have to drive the score reels. (Jeremy has done this, although he eventually switched to PROC). Supported by MPF (Mission Pinball Framework) which has many helper functions to make things like driving score reels, roto-targets, etc much easier. OPP has it own very simple pinball framework if only interested in displaying static images, or no graphics at all. (The Dolly/Van Halen machine was driven by essentially a Pi zero which is too under-powered for MPF in my opinion).

Fast: Slightly less expensive than PROC (or it used to be). It was approximately $450 to convert a machine last time I looked. MPF is the only choice for a pinball framework. Nightmare Before Christmas and a bunch of other homebrews use Fast.

PROC: Used in TNA. I believe it continues to be more expensive than Fast, and it is now approximately $500 to convert a machine. Supported by MPF (script based programming or python code), and also Skeleton framework (c++ based code).

This link has the information from the 2018 MPF survey of who is using what. Since it is the only framework that I know that supports multiple platforms, it gives an interesting comparison (the second message in the thread has the charts about platforms):
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/mpf-users/omWVIaroykQ

2 weeks later
#30 5 years ago

Hey there, I'm starting to make progress with my Mr Doom conversion but I'm having problems with the solenoid board. When I connect the ground from the solenoid board the mains 24v power supply stops putting out voltage. I tried unplugging the grounds, which give me voltage but still the switch doesn't trigger the solenoid. I'm using a basic code that I used to turn the lights on and have swapped a led for a solenoid. I get the feeling it's my solenoid board. Some how I think there's a short somewhere. In your diagram your lower 10k resistor looks like its connected to a positive power source but from your description its connected to the ground. Have I got this right? I've put power straight to the solenoids and they all work fine. I'm going straight from solenoids to board (solenoids not connect to the loom).

sorry bother but I'm using you as my guide! this is just a test board, hopefully when I get it right it will be better.

cheers PK

back of board (resized).jpgback of board (resized).jpgtop of board (resized).jpgtop of board (resized).jpg
1 week later
#31 5 years ago

Sorry for the late response. It's a little hard to see from your picture, what is the other end of the 10k connected to? If it's connected to the gate of the MOSFET it will probably cause a problem and ground the gate forever, no idea what this would do to the power supply.
You should do it the following way (which works for me, there are probably better ways to do it
Connect the Gate (Pin 1 in your drawing) to the 470 ohm resistor. Connect the 470 ohm resistor to your outgoing pin header to the Arduino. Connect the 10k to the outgoing pin header and then to ground, no direct connection to the Gate. The Drain is only connected to the negative side of the coil. The Source is only connected to ground of your power supply.

This way it should work (in theory!)

#32 5 years ago

Still no joy!! made a new board but nothing. I think I understand how the mosfit works with the arduino, opening the gate so the power pass back to the coil and enable it but I loose power from the power supply when the GND is attached to the power supply.

Is my Power Supply up to it? I've tested all the coils by putting 24v pos and neg to the terminals and all work fine. I'm quite lost I can't see whats wrong, I think I might be going mad.

Could I use relays instead? I've seen some on Amazon. Are their any issue with using them? delay or something! why did you go down the mosfit route?

Once I get the solenoids working I think I can start coding! all the switches, lights (LEDs now) are now working, replaced the the burn coil and the end EOS switches on the flippers, new rubbers. I'm excited but going around in circles with the solenoids.
I've also been trying to use the multiplex board as well but no joy there ether.

this is the code I used

int solenoidPin = 4; //This is the output valve on the Arduino

void setup() {
// put your setup code here, to run once:
pinMode(solenoidPin, OUTPUT); //Sets the valve as an output
}

void loop() {
// put your main code here, to run repeatedly:
digitalWrite(solenoidPin, HIGH); //Switch Solenoid ON
delay(2000); //Wait 2 sec
digitalWrite(solenoidPin, LOW); //Switch Solenoid OFF
delay(5000); //Wait 5 sec
}

PK

20181024_205358 (resized).jpg20181024_205358 (resized).jpg20181024_205612 (resized).jpg20181024_205612 (resized).jpgfront (resized).jpgfront (resized).jpgfront_LI (resized).jpgfront_LI (resized).jpgnew back (resized).jpgnew back (resized).jpg
#33 5 years ago

Can you draw it up as a schematic somehow? It's hard to follow your pictures

Do you lose power as soon as you hook it up, or only once the arduino fires it? What if you arduino is left unplugged from everything?

#34 5 years ago

There is no ground between the arduino and the breadboard. Your arduino's ground is at a different voltage than your power supply's (24V) ground. You must tie those two grounds together. Try reading this blog post and see if it makes sense:
https://openpinballproject.wordpress.com/2016/11/16/111521-why-is-it-so-hard-to-explain-grounding/

#35 5 years ago

I have tried putting a pin from the GND on the board back to the arduino gnd with no luck. Quick question, there's 3 GNDs on the arduino, are they all the same?

Here's a really bad example of my board but I think it's about right

bread (resized).jpgbread (resized).jpg
#36 5 years ago

The arduino, breadboard, and the 24V grounds all need to be connected

#37 5 years ago

I'm think I tried connecting the ground back to the arduino as well as the power supply. I'll try again tomorrow and in the meantime I'll read that grounding post.

Thanks for the help I'm sure I'll get my head around it sooner or later. when I do i'll maybe start my own blog and not hijack this, sorry Frogger!

Cheers PK

#38 5 years ago

when the arduino has been disconnected from the usb power I get power to the coil! it doesnt activate but power is going through, I've just run the GND from the board to the arduino and also tried arduino back to the power supply GND. Still no joy. I might try a pre built relay. I dont think my bread board making is up to scratch or my power supply is not up to it.

new board 2 (resized).jpgnew board 2 (resized).jpg
#39 5 years ago

I don't think it has anything to do with the power supply, running a coil will only "stress" the supply if there is no diode or if the draw is way too high, 14 amps should be ok. A simple depiction I made a while ago is this:

Mosfet_540_Arduino_Steckplatine (resized).jpgMosfet_540_Arduino_Steckplatine (resized).jpg

If there is no hardware fault, this setup will work. I also included the common ground so you can replicate this setup as is.

Just use a breadbord and do a quick test with a mosfet and your solendoid, it will take 10 minutes to set it up and you will have clarity what is wrong.

#40 5 years ago
Quoted from davrol:

I'm think I tried connecting the ground back to the arduino as well as the power supply. I'll try again tomorrow and in the meantime I'll read that grounding post.
Thanks for the help I'm sure I'll get my head around it sooner or later. when I do i'll maybe start my own blog and not hijack this, sorry Frogger!
Cheers PK

All good. Getting MOSFETS to work is difficult at first, once you have a working setup it's easy to add more

I blew a lot of MOSFETS once since the connecting ground had come loose and I didn't notice it at first...
Do yourself a favor and check the grounds on all devices with a multimeter before activating the MOSFETS.

#41 5 years ago

the lower resistor in your diagram looks like it goes to the positive side of the coil and not to ground is that right?

#42 5 years ago
Quoted from davrol:

the lower resistor in your diagram looks like it goes to the positive side of the coil and not to ground is that right?

Just when you think you checked everything....thx for noticing, I fixed the diagram.

#43 5 years ago
Quoted from davrol:

when the arduino has been disconnected from the usb power I get power to the coil! it doesnt activate but power is going through, I've just run the GND from the board to the arduino and also tried arduino back to the power supply GND. Still no joy. I might try a pre built relay. I dont think my bread board making is up to scratch or my power supply is not up to it.
[quoted image]

I've driven whole machines off breadboards, no problem. And if your supply can power it when you fire it manually it should work fine with the mosfet

#44 5 years ago

Do I need to connect the negative side of the power supply to anything (probably a very stupid question)?

#45 5 years ago
Quoted from davrol:

Do I need to connect the negative side of the power supply to anything (probably a very stupid question)?

Take a look at the diagram. You can see that the negative side of the power supply and the ground of the arduino are connected and form one common ground. You can then connect anything else (the 10k resistor and the source pin of the Mosfet) to this common ground.

Mosfet_540_Arduino_Steckplatine (resized).jpgMosfet_540_Arduino_Steckplatine (resized).jpg

#46 5 years ago

Tie all grounds together. At one point would be good. I would solder a ground wire onto the ground pin solder pad on the Arduino board. Using the header sockets for ground is not very solid and will cause issues. The grounds on the Arduino are all the same.

#47 5 years ago

Hey Frogger1108 I worked up a set of arduino mini dmds for a Nugent upgrade I am working on. I'm more than happy to share2018-03-28 17.05.00 (resized).jpg2018-03-28 17.05.00 (resized).jpg

#48 5 years ago
Quoted from Cheddar:

Hey frogger1108 I worked up a set of arduino mini dmds for a Nugent upgrade I am working on. I'm more than happy to share[quoted image]

You got a part number for those grids? I've been looking for some...

#49 5 years ago

Finally it's working!!!!!!! Ahhhhhhhhhhh Sorry for being such a zombie!! Mr Doom is slowly coming back to life. Thanks for all the help

#50 5 years ago
Quoted from zacaj:

You got a part number for those grids? I've been looking for some...

MAX7219. They are SPI but I found that I can't run more than 12 8X8 from a pair of pins on the mini and have enough power to run the 13th display.

Here's a set on ebay slightly more expensive than I paid. ebay.com link: Dot LED Matrix MAX7219 MCU Control LED 4 In 1 Display Module for Arduino 5x

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