(Topic ID: 179619)

Rebuilding sound for DataEast & WPC using a pi

By steve45

7 years ago


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  • 2,044 posts
  • 124 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 days ago by SlapDrain
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#2001 5 months ago
Quoted from Joost996me:

Thank you for the support, i see a tiltaudio logo on the pi that boots. The raspi3 doenst even get to the point were a display is showed, so i am not sure how to implement the text in the link.

You probably have to mount the SD card in your computer and edit the file there before putting it back into the pi.

#2002 5 months ago
Quoted from Zigzagzag:

You probably have to mount the SD card in your computer and edit the file there before putting it back into the pi.

I did alter the file. Still no boot on the 3. Also cant SSH in the pi. SSH answers with: Permission denied, please try again using user:"pi";password:"raspberry". When booted on the raspi2 I am stuck on the logo screen using HDMI, so no CLI and thus no option to login...

#2003 5 months ago

It was a software problem, the image needed an update.

First: SSH user is "pi", Password is "pi", not raspberry as stated in the manual.

Get it running in an old pi. Then update using sudo:

dietpi-backup 1
sed -i 's/stretch/buster/g' /etc/apt/sources.list{,.d/*.list}
rm -f /etc/apt/sources.list.d/dietpi-php.list
rm -f /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/dietpi-php.gpg
rm -f /etc/apt/preferences.d/dietpi-{php,openssl,xrdp}
rm -f /etc/mysql/mariadb.conf.d/97-dietpi.cnf
/boot/dietpi/func/dietpi-set_software apt-cache clean
apt update
apt upgrade
apt full-upgrade
apt autopurge
/boot/dietpi/func/dietpi-obtain_hw_model
. /boot/dietpi/func/dietpi-globals

Then transferred the SD to the raspi3 and they all worked!

(Maybe you see a notification/error concerning some old certificates, but that can also be fixed..) See also https://stackoverflow.com/questions/24611640/curl-60-ssl-certificate-problem-unable-to-get-local-issuer-certificate

#2004 5 months ago

Thanks for posting what worked for you. It will help others.

#2005 5 months ago
Quoted from Joost996me:

It was a software problem, the image needed an update.
First: SSH user is "pi", Password is "pi", not raspberry as stated in the manual.
Get it running in an old pi. Then update using sudo:
dietpi-backup 1
sed -i 's/stretch/buster/g' /etc/apt/sources.list{,.d/*.list}
rm -f /etc/apt/sources.list.d/dietpi-php.list
rm -f /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/dietpi-php.gpg
rm -f /etc/apt/preferences.d/dietpi-{php,openssl,xrdp}
rm -f /etc/mysql/mariadb.conf.d/97-dietpi.cnf
/boot/dietpi/func/dietpi-set_software apt-cache clean
apt update
apt upgrade
apt full-upgrade
apt autopurge
/boot/dietpi/func/dietpi-obtain_hw_model
. /boot/dietpi/func/dietpi-globals
Then transferred the SD to the raspi3 and they all worked! (Maybe some old certificates, but that can also be fixed..) https://stackoverflow.com/questions/24611640/curl-60-ssl-certificate-problem-unable-to-get-local-issuer-certificate

steve45 Is an updated image something you can provide? Unfortunately I do not have an old Pi (or the software skills) so this solution will not work for me.

Karl

#2006 5 months ago
Quoted from texasbulldog:

steve45 Is an updated image something you can provide? Unfortunately I do not have an old Pi (or the software skills) so this solution will not work for me.
Karl

Sadly he hasnt been on the site in about a year let alone posting in here when he was on this site back then.

#2007 5 months ago

When you need additional advice regarding the nonworking image on newer pi's you may send me a PM/DM.

#2008 5 months ago
Quoted from Joost996me:

When you need additional advice regarding the nonworking image on newer pi's you may send me a PM/DM.

Many, many thanks to @joost996me. My RPi now boots up and I see the TA logo on the screen. Also have the WebUI working. Now on to getting sound out it!!!!

Karl

#2009 5 months ago

I got boards made and parts to make a TiltAudio like 18 months ago but the price for Raspberry Pis was crazy because of the shortage so I held off. Now Pis are back to reasonable prices, you can now get a Raspberry Pi Zero 2 W w/ a header for $23 shipped. I assembled a board, purchased a license and made the discovery that TiltAudio only supports altsound files and not PinSound files which is a real bummer. Besides sound quality the best part of an aftermarket sound solution is alternative sound packages.

Quoted from lucky1:

Pinsound considers the folder structure and ALL the sound packs using it as THEIR intellectual property. That is why steve implemented the altsound structure into tiltsound which was introduced into pinmame (virtual pinball) when Pinsound started scrambling "their" soundsets. From the vpin community there
is a altsound soundset for almost every machine supported by pinmame (and tiltaudio). Just google for altsound and use that format for your new projects.

Reading through the entire thread I see at some point there where downloadable files to descramble some sound sets and then those files got baked into the base image at some point and removed from the website. Is descrambling still included in the code? If so what games are supported? I assume not but it would be good to know for sure.

Is there anyway to manually descrabmle a community sound file? I have the permission of the person who made the sound file but I do not know how to go about it. It would greatly improve the value of my TiltAudios.

#2010 5 months ago

Thanks for posting what worked for you. It will help others.

Quoted from radix:

I got boards made and parts to make a TiltAudio like 18 months ago but the price for Raspberry Pis was crazy because of the shortage so I held off. Now Pis are back to reasonable prices, you can now get a Raspberry Pi Zero 2 W w/ a header for $23 shipped. I assembled a board, purchased a license and made the discovery that TiltAudio only supports altsound files and not PinSound files which is a real bummer. Besides sound quality the best part of an aftermarket sound solution is alternative sound packages.

Reading through the entire thread I see at some point there where downloadable files to descramble some sound sets and then those files got baked into the base image at some point and removed from the website. Is descrambling still included in the code? If so what games are supported? I assume not but it would be good to know for sure.
Is there anyway to manually descrabmle a community sound file? I have the permission of the person who made the sound file but I do not know how to go about it. It would greatly improve the value of my TiltAudios.

If you are referring to any code that enables the use of Pinsound sound sets then I believe the answer is going to be no. You need to use the Altsound sets that are often used on the Virtual pins. You should be able to get base packages for a lot of pins. If there are alternative versions then you can try those. Or use the base packages and customize from there.

If there is a particular sound set done for Pinsound that the author has given permission to use then they need to send you the raw assets like WAV files, etc which you'd have to use to make a altsound version of it.

#2011 5 months ago
Quoted from radix:

Is there anyway to manually descrabmle a community sound file? I have the permission of the person who made the sound file but I do not know how to go about it. It would greatly improve the value of my TiltAudios.

I sent you a PM.

#2012 5 months ago
Quoted from Zigzagzag:

I sent you a PM.

I am in the same situation. I have a T2 with the Tilt!Audio board in it that I would like to use a Pinsound Pack on. https://www.pinsound-community.org/index.php?/files/file/397-t2_enhanced_profanity_averell_v23zip/ I guess I need to figure out how to make the altsound version. Zigzagzag any advice?

1 week later
#2013 4 months ago
Quoted from Dovey79:

Also sorted the WiFi connections now so multiple boards working on a network.
Steve is a legend

How in the world did you sort this out?

#2014 4 months ago

Well, I built my first of two. I am going to be honest and say the instructions feel lacking. I built mine based off the pictures. The 5v power supply supplied had been shrunk from what the board expects. I have it mounted on 2 holes and then ran jumpers to the other 2. I mounted the plug for the pi flush with the board, but its too short and the headers on the pi can't fully insert because the usb ports prevent it from going flush.

I have pi zero 2's on order which should negate that. For testing I have used the extra plug from the second board I ordered to raise the pi so I can continue testing.

Testing in a Jurassic Park. Game works and I have the original sound board working.

I can access the web ui, but it seems unstable. I get no sound even when I try test tones. I have adjusted the pots. I get a lot of something went wrong pop ups, but live logs are not giving me much indication.

On some boots, it cannot find the pi dac and I get no options from the drop downs. I also sometimes get the jurassic park files I loaded under sounds, but sometimes I don't.

12v and 5v test good. I am using joost996me's updated image.

I am going to try reflowing the header pins for the board connection to the pi. The fact that it can't see the dac half the time would suggest its before the black pill or the amps.

#2015 4 months ago

Reflowed the header pins, and had to change to the non bluetooth version of the dac in software. Got sound.

I only got backbox speakers, no cab speaker. Pressing on the pot I didn't get a hum so I suspected the amp was bad after trying to reflow the pins.

Swapped with my second kit and have cabinet speaker.

Problem is, I need a new amp to replace the one I used for my second kit.

For anyone that runs across this with a similar issue pam8610 is the part to look for.

#2016 4 months ago

Continuing to move through my issues.

I bought a DE kit, but the cabinet control pot does not seem to do anything. I checked the logs and nothing is happening when I spin it. Supposedly it works per documentation, but I see posts from other people that it doesn't.

Using an alt sound pack for jp, but I get the roar file when starting a game and every time you try to move through adjustments or diagnostics. *Looked in the logs and the code for it to play is being triggered. I reflowed the pins for the black pill and the header pins for the ribbon cable, still happens. Bad Black Pill maybe?*

Sound will cut out completely from time to time. Usually when starting particular modes. Its like there is an issue with loading speeds, perhaps my sd card is too slow? Team brand 500X 64GB XC1

I was going to look for the fastest 16 GB I could find to replace this one anyway.

Outside of that it seems like I just need a license and to adjust the sounds. Things like the background music fade out way too much during call outs and some call outs being obnoxiously loud compared to others.

#2017 4 months ago
Quoted from dung:

Using an alt sound pack for jp, but I get the roar file when starting a game and every time you try to move through adjustments or diagnostics.
Sound will cut out completely from time to time. Usually when starting particular modes.
Things like the background music fade out way too much during call outs and some call outs being obnoxiously loud compared to others.

This sounds more like the altsound package needs adjustments. Not all sound packages seem to be tuned perfectly and you might have to do it yourself.

#2018 4 months ago
Quoted from dung:

Reflowed the header pins, and had to change to the non bluetooth version of the dac in software. Got sound.
I only got backbox speakers, no cab speaker. Pressing on the pot I didn't get a hum so I suspected the amp was bad after trying to reflow the pins.
Swapped with my second kit and have cabinet speaker.
Problem is, I need a new amp to replace the one I used for my second kit.
For anyone that runs across this with a similar issue pam8610 is the part to look for.

Easily available for just more then a dollar in China...

https://nl.aliexpress.com/item/1005004092013359.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.order_list_main.65.21ef79d2uioTWo&gatewayAdapt=glo2nld

2 weeks later
#2019 4 months ago

Build a new board. Working with headphones playing sounds using the UI. But it seems to have a problem with the blackpill. Only red light is on (no blue) and it doens't show in the UI website.

Already rebooted and renamed the flashfile on the SD card; removed the ".done" part to see if it was a STM flash issue. But that did not resolve the problem. Also reflowed the solder and that all looks fine.

Might suspect the blackpill (new ons is on its way) but hate to remove it (not on socket...) any suggestions?

thx

#2020 4 months ago
Quoted from Joost996me:

Build a new board. Working with headphones playing sounds using the UI. But it seems to have a problem with the blackpill. Only red light is on (no blue) and it doens't show in the UI website.
Already rebooted and renamed the flashfile on the SD card; removed the ".done" part to see if it was a STM flash issue. But that did not resolve the problem. Also reflowed the solder and that all looks fine.
Might suspect the blackpill (new ons is on its way) but hate to remove it (not on socket...) any suggestions?
thx

The black pill does not show in the Web UI. It’s the decoder for the incoming command messages from the CPU.

#2021 4 months ago
Quoted from chillme:

The black pill does not show in the Web UI. It’s the decoder for the incoming command messages from the CPU.

I know, i mean it it is not listed with the version MCU. Also the blue led remains on, thats not a good sign in my opinion...

Added 128 days ago:

correction: the blue led remains off. Also tried to "reflash the pill" with new image and other pi. In version 1.38 it says that the MCU is detected with software version 0.00

Help a apreciated

1 week later
#2022 4 months ago

It was a faulty blackpill, it works after replacing the module (and it was some work…)

Now i got all wrong timed sounds using the alt sound. Not able to select the configuration in the software, it used to let me choose WPC/DE etc. Maybe this has some relation with my sound problem. Ill reinstall the software.. Pfff..

Super exclusive ad from the Pinside Marketplace!
#2023 3 months ago

For anyone after me thinking about building this. Don't. I have wasted time and effort to build and diagnose 2 kits, with little to show.

I have built a lot of different lisy boards, wolfpac displays, pin2dmds, various weebly kits, and a number of other kits over the years. I am not new to building boards or working on them.

The instructions are, ok. A couple of pictures you follow without any real explanation. They do not keep up with changes steve has made. They explain nothing. Not that big a deal for building the board, outside of knowing to add the extra headers to the black pill, but have fun with the software. For example the software picks the wrong dac on first boot. There are a dozen to chose from and no information as to what does what is given.

The boards do not love taking solder. Thought I was losing my mind, went back to building a few lisy boards and a set of wolfpacs and have 0 issues. Worse, go ahead and right off removing things without damaging them. I have two black pills missing pads now because they are known to have issues, but they refuse to desolder. I have a hakko, correct tips, several different types of fluxes, and no dice getting all the solder off the underside. Worse it relies on cheap components that are failure prone. Black pills which are proving very unreliable, personally have had one that would not take power except by usb. I also have the backbox volume pot on one board, failing when I have only used the board for testing.

Supposed features don't work, and have no explanation. Data East's volume pot should work with the current board design. It doesn't. No documentation on how to get it working. Digging through posts on here and a few comments about not getting it working.

Steve is too lazy to update the software so if you try to build with a new raspberry pi, it won't work. You have to find another kind pinsider to supply you an updated image.

The number of alt sound sets is low. They need to be converted to wav format when most are in ogg. Failure to do that and the sounds cut out constantly.

On BOTH of my boards the JP roar triggers with specific sounds. Checking the logs it shows that the board believes the sound is being sent from my mpu. Sound works fine on the original board. I have the issue on two separate boards. I have tested other ribbon cables, pi's, replaced the black pill more than once. My bet is the software has a bug, but since I can't back date to an older version, which I was told by another JP owner due to it crashing on his game with newer images. Problem is older images do not run on newer Pi's so I am shit out of luck.

Unless you pay for a license there is a 10 minute limit, which seems fair except it takes several minutes to get the wifi to start and connect to it and test. Not paying for a license on a board displaying issues, but can't diagnose because I might get 6 minutes before the sound turns off. Have fun cycling power, waiting for the wifi, reconnecting, and getting back to whatever logs or feature you were focused on before it inevitably kills the sound after a few minutes.

Steve is non-responsive. He seems to have abandoned pinside. Its been a month since I emailed him off of his site, but no response. I have heard from others he doesn't respond.

In theory this is a great product, in practice it is a buggy mess sold by a guy who doesn't stand behind his work. Stick with your stock board or spend the money for pinsound. By all means avoid this dumpster fire filled with broken promises.

#2024 3 months ago

I tend to agree. This is abandonware. Built one for a lw3 I had and it never really worked the way it was intended. Run away sounds and timing was off.

#2025 3 months ago
Quoted from SlapDrain:

I tend to agree. This is abandonware. Built one for a lw3 I had and it never really worked the way it was intended. Run away sounds and timing was off.

Agreed. Right now I have one board up and running in a CFTBL. One board that starts up, but has major compatibility /timing problems with my IJ. And I ruined one desoldering stuff that was broken on arrival. The software also took me a lot of time to get it running…

I like a little project and like to assemble things myself but I tend to agree that this option is not a good alternative for the PinSound (more expensive) alternative…

#2026 3 months ago

I wasted 2 years on this, from V2.5 I think, back then I found the BUS ICs had no 0v connection so was never going to work, even after that fix it never worked on My Getaway so bought a Pinsound. I was thinking I would get one for my Funhouse surely after all these years and the addition of the black pill its going to work but obviously not. Its a great concept perhaps someone else will take it on one day.

#2027 3 months ago

Anyone reading this thread has experience on the DSP implementation in TiltAudio ?

#2028 3 months ago

Agreed, although I had mine working fairly well in my Getaway for a few years. Occasionally it would stop playing music mid game, but it worked 90% of the time. It recently stopped booting and the oled doesn't turn on. I'm not sure why and I don't think it's worth trying to debug anymore. At the time I didn't want to spend the extra money on a pin sound, but it looks like I'm going to go that route after all.

Good project idea, but it still feels like an alpha product after all these years, unfortunately.

#2029 3 months ago

Well for me I had a perfectly working unit in my Indy, which I transferred for testing in a Dr Who, all fine was working.

Built a second board, installed in Dr Who, bunch of issues (sounds playing back at wrong time, even when adjusting volume, etc). Checked decoder mode, all was fine. Reinstalled previously working board.... Failure, same symptoms.

Reflashed blackpills, reimage sd card, still not working....

#2030 3 months ago
Quoted from Geteos:

Agreed, although I had mine working fairly well in my Getaway for a few years. Occasionally it would stop playing music mid game, but it worked 90% of the time. It recently stopped booting and the oled doesn't turn on. I'm not sure why and I don't think it's worth trying to debug anymore. At the time I didn't want to spend the extra money on a pin sound, but it looks like I'm going to go that route after all.
Good project idea, but it still feels like an alpha product after all these years, unfortunately.

It is disappointing after 7 years the project has reached this point. I also have been able to (finally) get it working in my Getaway! That said, if it hadn't been for an image patch created by Joost996me (See post #2003/2007), I would have ended up with a box of useless parts. The journey was not easy and the lack of support was very frustrating. Even now, the Joost996me image patch still has not been uploaded to the TA website(s).

For me, my issues were several freezes each time a change was made. Rather than being able to correct or reversing the change, I had to completely re-image the SD card. This was on multiple occasions. As others have stated, I also have noted missing sounds. But is this an altsound short coming, rather than a TA deficiency?? BTW, the logs identify the missing sounds as ID #32, 96 & 126 so if Geteos or any other Getaway owners know what sounds those are (I'm using the original soundset), please let me know.

On the positive side, I had no problem with assembly of the TA card (My 2nd card I plan to socket all the daughterboards). Also, I don't have sound gaps, but I converted all the files to WAV format as dung mentioned, which looks to have fixed that issue. As far as sound output, I'm playing the full version of LaGrange as my attract sound. With upgraded speakers it does sound fantastic!!

Karl

#2031 3 months ago

Ordered (and installed) a Pinsound Plus (and shaker ). Plug and play and works flawlessly.

Should have done that long time ago....

#2032 3 months ago
Quoted from Ashram56:

Well for me I had a perfectly working unit in my Indy, which I transferred for testing in a Dr Who, all fine was working.
Built a second board, installed in Dr Who, bunch of issues (sounds playing back at wrong time, even when adjusting volume, etc). Checked decoder mode, all was fine. Reinstalled previously working board.... Failure, same symptoms.
Reflashed blackpills, reimage sd card, still not working....

If this could be of any help.
We sorted out this issue with Ashram56. This issue came probably from a faulty STM32 that was sending 5VDC voltage to the Pi and has damaged two of the GPIOs (Pi GPIOs tested with gpiotest).
Some advises below, so as to avoid burning Pis, steps to be followed prior to plug the Pi:
- Ensure proper PCB grounding with the machine ground
- Ensure/tune proper voltages at regulators prior to plug any of the devices on sockets.
- Plug the STM32 and ensure it delivers 3.3V at its 3V3 pin. In the present case it was delivering 5VDC
- Bring the machine in sound/music test mode, and read voltage at few GPIO pins on the board. Readings should be of 0 / 3.3V alternatively (depending on sound played).
- Once OK, plug the Pi

#2033 89 days ago

Just an update, since some might have tried to update the TiltAudio image, the above steps needed some adjustments to work

SSH into your RPI, login/password are pi/pi, then type the following commands, one by one (the date need to be adjusted for the sync to work correctly, does not have to be accurate to the minute though)

From a working RPI with TA SD card:

sudo bash
date -s '22 Feb 2024 18:11'
apt-get update --allow-releaseinfo-change
dietpi-backup 1
sed -i 's/stretch/buster/g' /etc/apt/sources.list{,.d/*.list}
rm -f /etc/apt/sources.list.d/dietpi-php.list
rm -f /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/dietpi-php.gpg
rm -f /etc/apt/preferences.d/dietpi-{php,openssl,xrdp}
rm -f /etc/mysql/mariadb.conf.d/97-dietpi.cnf
/boot/dietpi/func/dietpi-set_software apt-cache clean
apt update
apt upgrade
apt full-upgrade
apt autopurge
/boot/dietpi/func/dietpi-obtain_hw_model
. /boot/dietpi/func/dietpi-globals

We will post a complete SD card image

3 weeks later
#2034 68 days ago

Here is the 1.38 TiltAudio image updated to suit recent RPIs
https://mega.nz/file/gm0gzLJC#ilQ4-_BZTiHXoHqPwMF9YDrqxNyUfMpDfglZbJzVAIk

#2035 68 days ago

Check with @joost996me. He has created an image that includes the 1.41 update.

Karl

#2036 68 days ago
Quoted from texasbulldog:

Check with @joost996me. He has created an image that includes the 1.41 update.
Karl

Right. I did not spent that time in updating it to 1.41 since that is a quick fix over wifi once TA is booted. May upload a 1.41 updated image. Purpose is to have an image available for all instead of annoying joot996me everytime someone's facing this issue with recent PIs.

#2037 67 days ago
Quoted from texasbulldog:

Check with @joost996me. He has created an image that includes the 1.41 update.
Karl

Some people might want to try the older image. I have been told of issues on the current. Havent tried to back date, but the current image seems to be bugged on data east machines to play a specific sound over and over again. For jp it is the trex roar.

#2038 67 days ago

One question, I was planning to add one in my Addams Family, but I seem to recall there's an issue with TiltAudio and TAF ?

Regards

#2039 67 days ago
Quoted from Ashram56:

One question, I was planning to add one in my Addams Family, but I seem to recall there's an issue with TiltAudio and TAF ?
Regards

The sequence at the end of a ball where the flippers flip in time with the music doesn't work.
The Tilt board does not communicate back to the CPU, so the flippers stay put.

This also makes the animation rhythm not match the end music as far as I can remember.

#2040 67 days ago

and that works with a Pinsound ?

#2042 64 days ago

Thanks, I'll check it out

That said, I do wonder if there's a good mix for TAF anyway

1 month later
#2043 11 days ago

Hi everyone.
I'd like to make sound changes with the Web UI because my micro card went blank, I had to put another micro card, but now the sounds are not to my likings, like they were with my other micro card.
what are the steps to make the changes?
Thanks.

Edit: Never mind, I don't want to mess with it and risk having problems, it works great as it is so I'll just crank up the volume and enjoy.
Thanks anyway.

1 week later
#2044 3 days ago

Selling a fully assembled TiltAudio Board if anyone is interested:

SOLD!
Parts - For Sale
Used, good condition - “Hand assembled and fully working. Had it installed in my LW3 but removed it before selling. Works with a number of games so do your research before buying. Some games require a bit...”
2024-05-17
La Grange Park, IL
75
Archived after: 0 days
Viewed: 41 times
Status: Sold (amount private)

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