It ain't fun losing thousands of dollars. Hundred+ people got roasted the last time you had "fun" and it looks like this one came awfully close to following the same path.

Protip: don't cheerlead a project unless you KNOW what you're talking about. That's what Willis is talkin

I believe you Aurich, and I can feel your passion for all of this. I wasn't referring to you when I said "I don't know them", I was actually referring to the other guy that was posting 'inside info'. I believe you want this to work in the worst way, and I believe you are being told a lot of things, and hopefully that is all true. But a lot is unknown right now, even for the guys with the suitcase full of cash. Maybe they get into this and realize Heighway owes a lot more than they know, or that the machines are going to need more development than anticipated, or a bunch of people do demand refunds, or any number of other things that has killed many other pinball companies. If any of that happens, then these guys are not going to keep throwing good money after bad, no matter how deep their pockets are or how great their intentions. I still go back to my question as to where they were when all of this was going down.....I know they were likely minority investors, but anyone who infuses cash like this into a fledgling company keeps an eye on that business at some level. If they didn't, then I question how they will ever get this turned around.

I DO hope they get these out the door, and all of my concern is for nothing! As I said, I will be right back in line if that happens, but I need to see the company is going to be healthy and around long-term. $8,000 is still a lot of cash to risk, especially with someone we don't know. I would love to see them sell by the thousands so you can at least be recognized and realize some compensation for the great work.

Your comment above about "genuine effort" says it all.....you know they are going to give it a shot, but you also are not 100% confident either. None of us can predict the future, and for me it is best to wait. The investors can risk their cash, and that gives them more incentive to make it work. I love the pinball hobby, but the one thing I hate is this pre-pay crap. I will never place another deposit on a ghost game, and I would love to see the practice outlawed somehow. It would save us all a lot of heartache and Robin a lot of disk space.

Seems strange that you basically admit that you were ready to completely give up on Heighway as a company, yet you told nobody that you felt that way or that people should ask for their money back (instead you just quietly disappear from the Alien thread), but now that people know how close Heighway actually was to going completely under, you don't understand how they could ask for their money back just because they hadn't done so before?

You being hopeful has nothing to do with how others feel, who actually have money down and may still have a chance of getting it back.

But you obviously still have a horse in this race, since you have not been paid a dime. Obviously if everyone asks for a refund, it makes it less likely that you will ever see a dime as you put it.

Some people refer to this as throwing good money after bad.

Time will tell.

You could not have picked a better image for your avatar if you would have tried.

I read all of your posts in Homers voice and it is great

It's hard to see turning this ship around anytime soon. As an earlier poster mentioned, hopefully the new investors are prepared for all the refunds that will surface in the next few weeks. In any event, good luck to the investor group, we are all hoping you can make this work.

Cheers.

Already have passes and a hotel room.

There's a lesson to be learned here......

Stick with Stern.

I am sure all of that is true, and I figured the same. But with that said, even minority investors keep an eye on their investments. No one worth their salt just hands over cash and tells the person in charge to do with it as they please and send the profit checks later. They either didn't care, or they were in it up to their necks.....either way, they are still part of the original problem. Now they are going to double-down and throw more money at this to try and turn it around, and no matter how passionate they are about pinball, they are in it first to make back their money, plain and simple. The question is...will throwing more money at this fix everything? or will it just prolong the agony. Odds are the latter, but we need to wait and see.

That's good news

Although I only have a $1500 deposit down, I'm still in it for a decent chunk of dough. Frankly the $1500 isn't worth the stress to me. My philosophy when I sent the payment was it was gone, one way or another. I either lost the money to a gamble on a start up, or I bought the right to buy the pin for $1500 less down the road. Either was was fine. So for me, while I am desperately rooting for Heighway to succeed and to have an amazing Alien pin, que sera sera.

For those paid in full, I absolutly understand and agree with those of you on the edge of your seats concerned about what will come of your hard earned cash. Just remember that while the loss of a large sum of money like $10k can really sting, your physical health and mental/emotional well being are worth so much more. Do what you need to, handle your business (ask for refunds, file lawsuits, whatever you feel is the necessary course in your situation) but let it end there and try if you can not to carry the stress of the situation over to the rest of your day.

I agree it's going take time to get things going. I well wait till end of the year and if there up in running ill ponder ordering one as the game is good.

This is going to be the big white elephant in the room. Investors come up and say 'we will address all refund requests". At this point, folks know there is supposedly cash coming back into the company, so hell yes a bunch are going to ask for refunds while they can. If it goes well, they buy right back in....if it goes bad, at least they got their cash out before it tanked. I really do hope the corner is close so they can turn this ship without losing too many folks..........

This is awesome! Can I interest you guys in a small Dutch company?

As I mentioned before when I expressed my confidence in current events and the way forward; I have sunk more time, more of my own life, and have more riding on this personally than close to anyone else on this thread, including Aurich. So if I'm feeling hopeful for the future, I hope I can carry that over to others as well.

Business costs, Cash flow, the reality of time to accomplish things are often lost when not having a job in manufacturing/wholesale/retail.

( I get nothing but a jaw drop when I go over numbers with others)

I cringe at the demand posts, or expectations, After a leak before a contract status his even concluded.

Expectations of Finished Website
All Details
Production schedules etc.

There isnt even ink yet to dry......

This seems like a good move to me.

Spot on.

They obviously have ended their due diligence process which must have been a very complex one as it goes hand in hand with a new business case how to bring this company back on track successfully. They are investing big money (I'm convinced that this is the case as this company needs a big infusion to ramp up for mass production) and doing this after weeks of due diligence for me personally is a very good sign. That they make this quick and dirty announcement before having FAQ and whatnot is a result of all this BS on this forum. They were simply forced to clear the sky and do deescalation. I find your post ashaming as you did not think about what you write or you are intentionally stirring the pot.

Imho it was important to give this information to the public though the ink is not dry though there was no chance to do it the way you'd expected it to be.
With all those raised forks and torches here it simply was a signal nothing more and nothing less.

There you go reading my mind again...but here's my spin

I want to compare him to Nordman in the sense of being the American face of legitimacy for Heighway, which i'm sure led many pinsiders to send off those pre-o's (Heck, the second I heard Nordman, my money was sent)

I feel like saying something like "You should have made it loud and clear and blew out like Nordman did with a thread and all"

But at this stage, if he blew out like Dennis did....it would have literally been that camel breaking straw...so I think he played it as best he could.

But I don't agree so much with him being full steam ahead on the hype train all of a sudden now....This company doesn't deserve our trust just because a handful of people say so. A lot of wrongs need to be righted first!

I understand all your points Rob, but you have to understand that most, if not all, HP employees (or contractors) had to sign an NDA with Andrew. This put them in an impossible situation in a public forum when things started to be tense.

Very exciting news!

This is great news if its really legit........ Other than saying that, I really have no empathy for all those sinking $$$$ into these fkn boutique pinball company's on preorders.

When is it going to sink in........... Predator, the two Popadiuk games, DP, and now this. I personally only need to get kicked in the balls once to know it hurts.

If I wanna gamble with my cash Ill head to the craps table. At least there I know where I stand at the end of the evening.

so why have they not sorted this out prior to it getting in to such a mess

Actually, Norway is usually not considered to be part of mainland Europe, at least if you ask us Norwegians.

Aurich, thank you for being so honest and forth coming, I can't believe the deal you agreed too, royalty, are you nuts! This is pinball shit never seems to ship look at JJP, you couldn't feed yourself on that shipping timeline, why would you think Alien would do better than a JJP title!?! ARStechnica checks must clear fast, which I'm happy for! Seriously the fact you have not been paid a dime makes my wonder who else has not been paid and the company has still essentially gone under. Aurich get a new contract with the reorganization and get all the cash owed, seriously, please. Guys, get your refunds, IMMEDIATELY! Why wait you can always buy later. Look at the damn crowd funded Stern book not shipping, fuck stop giving these companies money! When Aurich has been paid in full I'll buy an Alien not before. Then I'll believe the BS being quoted by the Investment Group.

Exactly, these "investors" are the same as Big Lebowski buyers saying well I'm in for $10k, well if they raise the price to $11k but I get my game it's worth it, but it has zero guarantee and is good money after bad. Good investment is you let Heighway fail and you write off what you lost. If I was an Alien LE pre order and if their website had not always been such a confusing pile of shit I guarantee you I would have been, then I would have written off my deposit long ago.

Aurich has said he is to be paid a percentage of shipped machines, not a flat fee. As machines haven't 'shipped', then he isn't due to receive money yet. I know it sounds trite, but that's the agreement they had. His reasons for going radio silent were due to the mismanagement from Andy, not the lack of payment. That's not to say others have had to wait for payment owed to them, however.

Look at the damn crowd funded Stern book not shipping, fuck stop giving these companies money!

You are really comparing apples to oranges here. A kickstarter for a book takes many magnitudes orders less work than setting up a company, getting a design team, designing a table, designing parts etc etc. Seeing as 90% of the work to get Alien into mass production is done, I don't think that the last 10% is going to be such a massive issue. You have to remember that Andy had ZERO experience with running a company that manufactured anything. The fact that he is gone is the best news Alien pre-orderers have had for a while.

[double post]

EDIT: haha you just downvoted a post with nothing in it?

We drink tea and eat scones on a Saturday. The Queen insists on it. Any non participation can result in a short stay in The Tower.

Do you KNOW they are investing big money or are you guessing ?

image (resized).jpg

Good and encouraging news for all that are involved. But this is only step 1 in a long process to make the company healthy again and gain your customer's thrust and loyalty back.

But how dual it may feel at the moment Heighway will also need the support of their current customers. I am a paid in full customer of an Alien kit with LE upgrades and I am hanging in there. I hope that if more details get known more pinheads​ will support Heighway so the company will survive the bad weather it is in right now.

I can't fathom why any investor would invest in pinball, especially after all the new companies going under the last few years.

Hope everyone gets their aliens who paid for them.

sorry to hear about your situation Aurich, you got a wonder about what happened with Dennis Nordman and a few of the other well know designers that came and went quickly. Hell I was offered work a few years ago now and something just didn't seem right then and glad I didn't move the whole family to Europe.

I hope all those people with money in get their games and I wonder when the new people take over if the business will stay put or relocate ....

Had 100% picked up on that. Welcome back Also appreciate ealadubhsidhe ( slamtilt same guy? ) and daudioguy posting too, your exposure and frustration to this project must be immense. Would love you all to come out of this with the just rewards you deserve

I've never posted about my refund . But it was obvious where things were heading and was a real battle to get my partial refund from fully in to just deposit last year

I've submitted a new refund request for my remaining balance last month. Refund request defiantly still stands but if this ship can be turned around, quality issues resolved, games shipped Aurich and crew made whole and most importantly the early adopters with unresolved unworkable games given the support they need I will revisit and come back

The previous incarnation of Heighway Pinball was the most frustrating company to deal with. New management have a daunting task on their hands. Good luck

If there was no communication last couple of weeks or month I guess it is because HP was looking for an investor to put money in the company unless that was bankruptcy. Why shooting yourself in the foot by announcing the company is in difficulty?
Everybody here would have cancelled his order but would not get his money back as it is already burnt.
I don't think it is time to know who is this investor but to get assured that each order will be completed.

Some people only believe what they can see.

Not a new investor. Current investor group had enough and forced Andy out of the company, presumably to get someone in there who knows what they are doing to start up production properly.

HP_INVESTOR

I am glad you guys have decided to keep moving this project forward. Despite the shortcomings of getting Alien into full production, I appreciate what Andrew and the team has done to bring this machine this far.

How are you going to handle chargeback claims? It is my understanding that they can be cancelled once initiated. There are several reports in the original thread of chargebacks and paypal disputes.

Saving these orders (if possible) would be in the company's best interest. IMO

Also, i would like to throw out the idea of forgetting about the ramp lighting, should that be another production headache. I'm not seeing that it really adds (and might possibly retract ) to the atmosphere of the game .

I wonder if this means that if you've preordered you'll likely be getting your pin, but they might not be producing supply beyond filling order of those already pre-ordered?

What you did there, I see it

It also has balls, can be drained, & has a rod, when working all can be played with while standing on it's legs. Most things can be fixed with a screw. Just don't forget to turn it on.

Im grateful to see a large amount of posts from Pinsiders here, not in the US.......many I simply dont recognize at all.

Much wisdom, I hope to see more from our fellow pinheads overseas, as its welcome fresh air of thoughts, on this or any thread.

Thank you....

Best wishes going forward, and a few days rest/sleep for Andrew.

SLAMT1LT is me (Russell Speak) and ealadubhsidhe is Dave Sanders, our Game Designer. Me and Dave are the old timers, longest serving members of the HP team.

I cant help it a bunch of grown men cant learn and think for themselves after being burned or seeing others burned by multiple flake companies. I'm not going to stop liking pinball and being supportive of it, just because people dont know how to be responsible on their own.

You and a few others are jerks that like to continually kick a guy over and over and over again. Yup, I was wrong about Predator and I am sure my personal hype and promotion of it, hurt others financially. I have apologized for that NUMEROUS times, I also lost thousands of dollars, and I now have more money, time , and energy into fighting for the whole thing than anyone except kiethinMI (the lawyer I originally organize and compiled the info for civil suits which are on stay while the bankruptcy proceedings continue with him as special hire by the trustee). See the thing is... I actually learned and grew from this where others did not. Hell of all those that lost out thousands (hundreds of people) ONLY 17 were even willing to sign off and join to bring more damage. i.e. they took ZERO ownership of their decision and instead wanted to just say F it (cool, then no reason to bitch or complain that I convinced them to spend $ or stay in). In other words, take all your mellodrama and shove it. From what I see ONLY 17 people even have the right anymore to be pissed at me; the 16 others that signed up to fight and myself. Pretty sure I have earned back the respect and eased any financial strain by my work in private to get it all rolling and also to pay when needed to keep things moving. If any of the other 16 ever want to be mad at me, then they should reach out. I am happy to take my poundings from those guys... the ones that took ownership and accountability of their own actions.

Everyone in the hobby and on pinside knows about the history of SkitB and Jpop (and TBL) prior to them doing anything on any other game that requires a deposit. You like to thrust blame on me and project, but the reality is that me being supportive of pinball is not the reason ANYONE put money down on Alien. I am just a fan of pinball, new pinball, and great games. I make a conscious decision to not be continually negative and pessimistic like so many of the losers on here and in life that spend more time trying to get others to fail in a hobby/life they claim to love. I will forever be the optimist and supporter and cheerleader for pinball.

If you put anything beyond the minimum required to hold your spot, then you have nobody to blame but yourself.
If you put money down on ANY game and you can not afford to light that money on fire, then you have nobody to blame but yourself.
If you were so anxious to get your game earlier that you paid in full, then you have nobody to blame but yourself.

Say it with me now... YOU have nobody to blame but YOURself. Time to grow up for some of you, take some personal accountability in your lives, and make your own choices. If you F up then own it, grow from it, and become a better YOU. If you get it right, then rejoice in your new game and have some fun. Life is WAY too short for me to go through it life some of you do... It is sad and sickening to see some of you that are passionate about pinball (I presume your favorite hobby and thing to spend your free time on based on how much time you are here) spend all that energy constantly negative and rooting for failure of it all.

Protip: Life is better with optimism and nobody likes to hang out with pessimists in real life.

last thing...

I continually told everyone I know that they should wait to buy Aliens till they are shipping in force. Stupid to pay now when you can play one on route and wait for any initial bugs to get worked out.

If they wanted to get in to hold a spot (just could not wait), I encouraged them to only pay their 1k deposit and to pay via paypal backed through credit card. Smart to protect yourself if you are dumb enough to put down a deposit on ANY new game.

Cool. Hope things pan out for you to Russell

If it were me, and I was paid in full Id see this as a chance to get out - too much of a risk at this point and its alot of money. Although our distributor is great and Im sure would take care of you.

If I were just in for the 1k deposit, I would leave it in since Im sure it would help the company and isnt a huge ammount to risk.

Either way, if there are other titles your interested it it may be best to get something else, and then get this one down the road once machines are built and actualy in stock. Especially if your in a timeline since I wouldnt expect things to get built any time soon but who knows hopefully they can.

I keep thinking we really should have suspected this sooner, kind of crossed my mind last fall when they were asking for ballance of payments and it was obvious that they were not close to shipping.

THE PLAN I'd like to hear announced began percolating this morning ....

0) HP-New should deposit $3M into the company checking account on Day 0.

1) HP-New should refund 100% of money on Day 1, including all deposits.

2) HP-New should payoff all creditors and debtors in-full. (good news for the new owners who were likewise the old debtors - they will be recouping their original investments back in full).

3) HP-New announces manufacturing will be moved to Norway. Where a factory visit includes an all-day pass to their hot springs and pinball lounge.

4) HP-New announces that a 100% percent complete production game including complete software will be revealed by Dec 1.

5) HP-New announces $1,000 non refundable deposits will ONLY THEN be accepted to reserve a LE or STD Alien at current pricing, with balance due when ready-to-ship. Updates to be provided along the way.

6) HP-New announces START of PRODUCTION will be Jan 2, 2018, bank on it.

7) HP-New announces prices will increase on Feb 1, 2018.

.8) HP-New builds sh*t l@ad of games.

I'm not sure how much deposit money is in HP hands, but we've heard that some distributors are holding money so that money is not part of that. That being safe, I'd suggest that the new owners could buy themselves a LOT of time by working out how much deposit money they need to refund and get all the innocent customers' feet out of the fire.