(Topic ID: 190495)

Rebirth of Heighway Pinball


By HP_INVESTOR

2 years ago



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10
#501 2 years ago

Also, just as an FYI, I'm not reading any of the other Alien threads about refunds or polls or whatever else, and I don't intend to, being customer service isn't my job. If I have more updates that are helpful I'll post them here, but that's about as far as I feel like getting involved.

#502 2 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Also, just as an FYI, I'm not reading any of the other Alien threads

probably a good idea.

#503 2 years ago

Chilling out with a beer. On it

Jeff

#504 2 years ago

The incentive you get to not request a refund is a threat of a price increase. Nice!

People will be able to buy an Alien on the secondary market for the initial price or less if/when they get mass produced. What they should be doing is mentioning the price increase but also offer an incentive like free shipping to close the deal.

#505 2 years ago
Quoted from ZenTron:

The incentive you get to not request a refund is a threat of a price increase. Nice!
People will be able to buy an Alien on the secondary market for the initial price or less if/when they get mass produced. What they should be doing is mentioning the price increase but also offer an incentive like free shipping to close the deal.

What they should do is build games and refund money.

#506 2 years ago

I've asked for a refund more than a month ago, paid in full and have not received an email.

#507 2 years ago
Quoted from Astropin:

What they should do is build games and refund money.

I'd say all the prepaid money is gone. They'd be refunding money out of the same pot they're buying parts from. It makes sense to conserve as much of it as possible even if they lose money building the prepaid games.

#508 2 years ago
Quoted from ZenTron:

I'd say all the prepaid money is gone.

The latest financials show 26k in the bank. This explains the 30-60 day wait people were told on refunds.

#509 2 years ago

Its nice to see that one is now allowed to discuss public records here on this forum without repercussion.

4 owners, from 3 countries. Not one local, not one wanting to give up their current lifestyle to relocate to England. But that is what it will take. An OWNER that is present 24/7. On top of it two of the four owners are longtime friends which will lead to tension amongst all four down the road.

My experience tells me that this will not work.

And from what I heard Andrew already has his eyes set on his next business "adventure".

#510 2 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Would it be too much to ask that the whysnow show be taken to another thread?
We're all trying to figure out what's up with our time and money and it's frankly irritating as sh*t to have to scroll past tons of posts about who rates pinball machines a 1 or whatever other stupidity. No one cares. Hilton, please just stop responding, if you want to help Alien that's what you can do to help right now.
Actual update:
Legal paperwork is moving along we've been told. Let's call it next few days, anything with lawyers always takes longer than it should. Hell, call it this week. But it's moving along, and this is good. This is a very necessary process. Genuine public updates can't really happen until everything is signed.
We've been told the investors intend to try and personally reach out to everyone with money involved. It's going to take a bit to do everyone, I'm sure you all can appreciate these probably won't be 2 minute calls so only so many that can be done a day. So hang tight if you haven't been contacted yet.
Let's be honest here, they're going to try and stem the bleeding and people backing out, as they should, but it's an opportunity get straight answers direct from the source, so take advantage of it, I know I would.
I'm hearing good news about getting things organized at the factory too. Again, nothing will be instant, but I'm personally glad to hear good news about production management. That's where the rubber meets the road. Words can maybe buy a little time with me, with you, but I think we all agree games shipping is the only real answer.

Hi Aurich. Thanks so much for your efforts and input. I would ask if you could convey to The Management group that they implement some type of email/photo/video based update going forward on a regular basis. I get that they are still in process of taking over but need to show some tangible proof that changes are happening, manufacturing lines are being updated, parts ordered, and realistic timelines with customer delivery dates, etc. I'm paid in full since Feb and while I absolutely loooove the game I also feel so burned that I would need alot of confidence to get me to hold on, more than just words.

BTW - Are you aware if Morgan is still there and in charge of emails? It is also unclear who to contact by email now. Does anyone know who the point person for potential inquiring about refunds and/or status?

#511 2 years ago

Don't ask for a refund or the price could go up if you want back in!! Sales tactics right out of the shitty salesman playbook. Maybe the prices will go up in the future, but they're telling you this for a specific purpose and it's not to be courteous about price changes.

#512 2 years ago
Quoted from icust298:

Don't ask for a refund or the price could go up if you want back in!! Sales tactics right out of the shitty salesman playbook. Maybe the prices will go up in the future, but they're telling you this for a specific purpose and it's not to be courteous about price changes.

I agree, but in some ways it's also kind of stating the obvious. I mean I could be wrong, but I would think one of the very few reasons for doing a pre-order is to get locked in at a somewhat better price than if you waited until they were cranking them out.

#513 2 years ago
Quoted from jlm33:

I am talking from memory, not by checking actual records, but to my knowledge the only respectable pinsider who was permanently banned from the Heighway thread was Mr68, and that was *not* because he revealed nasty secrets. (Kim is a friend of mine... sorry Kim)
The few other accounts that were banned and their post deleted were made by duplicate or suspicious accounts created for this purpose.
Dup accounts are not allowed, period.
Someone has something to say on Pinside... use a regular account. Don't hide behind a fake ID.

Color me non-respectable.

10
#514 2 years ago

I get that people are negative now, and unhappy, etc, but if they increased prices and didn't tell people ahead of time everyone would be pissed. You can't be mad they said it's coming. Stern prices are up. JJP prices are up. Alien is frankly underpriced for the market, (if it was shipping!) Of course they're raising the price.

Of course they're trying to keep you in. If they weren't trying I'd bail right now because they would clearly be idiots with no business sense.

#515 2 years ago

Aurich, You're going to be biased because the success of Heighway will result in you obtaining the Alien LE you were promised.

The reality is that they have no production line currently. They would of been better saying they'll need another 30-60 days and start building some games. Once folks who requested a refund actually see them produce something they might want to stay in. Currently its all chat and bs.

#516 2 years ago
Quoted from ZenTron:

Aurich, You're going to be biased because the success of Heighway will result in you obtaining the Alien LE you were promised.
The reality is that they have no production line currently. They would of been better saying they'll need another 30-60 days and start building some games. Once folks who requested a refund actually see them produce something they might want to stay in. Currently its all chat and bs.

Aurich has already said, honestly, that he is on a "royalty payment" for Alien pins sold. And what you said is right Zen.

We all want the same thing, an Alien pinball machine.

I know I do.

I think its phenomenal and has GREAT potential.

If it doesn't work out then life goes on but its we are at least closer to having the pin that we all want.

We are in the same boat and on the same team.

#517 2 years ago
Quoted from PinBalt:

Hi Aurich. Thanks so much for your efforts and input. I would ask if you could convey to The Management group that they implement some type of email/photo/video based update going forward on a regular basis. I get that they are still in process of taking over but need to show some tangible proof that changes are happening, manufacturing lines are being updated, parts ordered, and realistic timelines with customer delivery dates, etc. I'm paid in full since Feb and while I absolutely loooove the game I also feel so burned that I would need alot of confidence to get me to hold on, more than just words.
BTW - Are you aware if Morgan is still there and in charge of emails? It is also unclear who to contact by email now. Does anyone know who the point person for potential inquiring about refunds and/or status?

I have expressed to them that Pinside likes updates. Beyond that they gotta run their business. I'm down to help out here, but I'm not a Heighway employee, I'm not paid to do PR or customer management, I need to let them figure it out.

Games shipping is the strongest statement they can make. I'm asking for a little patience from folks but ultimately games leaving factory is it, not video updates or whatever else.

#518 2 years ago
Quoted from ZenTron:

Aurich, You're going to be biased because the success of Heighway will result in you obtaining the Alien LE you were promised.
The reality is that they have no production line currently. They would of been better saying they'll need another 30-60 days and start building some games. Once folks who requested a refund actually see them produce something they might want to stay in. Currently its all chat and bs.

Read what I just wrote, I'm with you. Ship games or die!

But complaining that people were told a price increase is coming is silly. If you pull out you hurt their efforts, of course they don't want you to. Of course they're trying to incentivize you to stay. To do otherwise would be dumb. I would do it in their position.

#519 2 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Games shipping is the strongest statement they can make. I'm asking for a little patience from folks but ultimately games leaving factory is it, not video updates or whatever else.

Everybody needs to take it down several notches until then. Take a F ing deep breath.

Can you imagine what has gone on to this point in Andrew's life? I have compassion for what he has built. Want to hate? That's ok.

Andrew might be guilty of too much communication compared to DP. Had to lie about things. Jack built JJP on us, the CUSTOMER and then needed a bailout from a multi millionaire to survive. I still respect that, and he lied his ASS OFF.

Life goes on.

When games start shipping, that's it.

-1
#520 2 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Everybody needs to take it down several notches until then. Take a F ing deep breath.
Can you imagine what has gone on to this point in Andrew's life? I have compassion for what he has built. Want to hate? That's ok.
Andrew might be guilty of too much communication compared to DP. Had to lie about things. Jack built JJP on us, the CUSTOMER and then needed a bailout from a multi millionaire to survive. I still respect that, and he lied his ASS OFF.
Life goes on.
When games start shipping, that's it.

By that measuring stick you'd have to let SkitB, JPop and DP off the hook too.

Maybe they'll start shipping games some day too?

25
#521 2 years ago

I'd rather get a refund at $6500 and buy into it at $7500 if and when the games start shipping. There is still a significant risk of the company failing and I don't see a threat of a price increase as an incentive to stay in.

#522 2 years ago
Quoted from ZenTron:

I'd rather get a refund at $6500 and buy into it at $7500 if and when the games start shipping. There is still a significant risk of the company failing and I don't see a threat of a price increase as an incentive to stay in.

So ask for a refund. Everyone needs to make their own call. I hope prices aren't going up a grand though!

#523 2 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

So ask for a refund. Everyone needs to make their own call. I hope prices aren't going up a grand though!

The higher the prices are, the more equity in the game you're owed. Don't be silly..

#524 2 years ago

If we all had our games, I wouldn't know you characters as well as I do. Instead of playing it, I read this. Ya'll are definitely characters for sure! Mostly appreciated too. I'm paid in full since Oct '16. No plans on bailing but would like personal contact from the company. I do hope that happens this week. Last email was from Morgan over 2 months ago.

#525 2 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

So ask for a refund

Well that sounds easy.
But Refund requests are being ignored.

#526 2 years ago
Quoted from ZenTron:

The higher the prices are, the more equity in the game you're owed. Don't be silly..

Haha, I wish, but no, doesn't work like that.

Quoted from Toads:

Well that sounds easy.
But Refund requests are being ignored.

Andrew was putting people off I guess, but now the new money men are in, so I'm sure people will get their refunds. Whole thing goes to shit if they don't, they know it, we know it.

If people aren't being taken care of after a bit, after a grace period to settle in, then you won't see me defending it. I hope they reassure everyone and everyone stays in, better for me, better for everyone who wants to see this game made. But if you really want out then I damn well hope you get your money.

-1
#527 2 years ago

I would be shocked if they refund any money in the next few months...I am sure all of their investment and then some will be required to get this project off the ground.

If I were in charge, I would only give out refunds once production has started up. Then, refunds would be granted once new buyers bought in. The deposit money is gone, to refund anyone at this point is using money that could be better spent elsewhere...Yes people are going to be upset, but if that is the only way to keep the company running then its a small price to pay.....Truth be told, I am surprised they are even accepting liability for the prepaid....business is harsh and not fair...anyway, just my opinion....worth what you paid...

#528 2 years ago
Quoted from cliff_clavin:

Truth be told, I am surprised they are even accepting liability for the prepaid....business is harsh and not fair...anyway, just my opinion....worth what you paid...

They haven't accepted liability as yet.

11
#529 2 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

But complaining that people were told a price increase is coming is silly. If you pull out you hurt their efforts, of course they don't want you to. Of course they're trying to incentivize you to stay. To do otherwise would be dumb. I would do it in their position.

You don't threaten customers in order to get them to stay in, you give them an incentive to stay in: free shipping for any current pre-orders, for example. Or you get some free upgrade. We're talking about exceptionally loyal customers who have been jerked around for years and the new management chooses a stick over a carrot? Maybe a little reward for all the agony would be more appropriate.

If they can't afford to do this, as some have suggested, then they should just walk away from the deal and accept their loss.

Quoted from Aurich:

I get that people are negative now, and unhappy, etc, but if they increased prices and didn't tell people ahead of time everyone would be pissed.

This could have been easily been addressed at another time rather than within a letter to the current pre-order customers. There was really no reason to say that other than as a threat.

I've spent years doing corporate turnarounds and I've seen this issue before; the new leadership comes in like everything is starting over fresh. The problem is, that's not the way it works. They are responsible for the pain that Heighway put customers through, especially in this case because it was on their watch. They need to understand they are just as responsible as Andrew, and should come in humbled and begging forgiveness. Throwing Andrew under the bus does not absolve them of guilt.

#530 2 years ago
Quoted from guyincognito:

By that measuring stick you'd have to let SkitB, JPop and DP off the hook too.
Maybe they'll start shipping games some day too?

Draw your own conclusions.

Stupid analogy. The better one would be JJP.

Jack brags about building Woz on our $$$, good for him, then but for a fanboy multi millionaire JJP is finished.

-removed-

Now we have more millionaires coming to the rescue.

This F ing time, I would like an Alien pinball machine. Nuff said.

I'd be prepared for refunds galore if i was the "investor" but then again, haven't heard from them yet.

Dancing on the Heighway pinball grave might be a bit premature like a lot of people can't wait to do.

Wtf is wrong with people.

#531 2 years ago
Quoted from Toads:

They haven't accepted liability as yet.

That would be no bueno.

Can't write off the current customers and then sell new Alien pins.

#532 2 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Thanks. All I can do is say "hey, the team hopes everyone gives these guys a chance, after all this wait why not see how they do?"
The ball is in their court otherwise. I'll be as antsy as anyone else if after a few weeks we don't see actual measurable progress. Nothing can get fixed overnight, but words only count for so much.

Best thing we can do is offer our time & support to help them get through this hurdle and get the business up & humming.
( ( ( ((Sending positive vibes their way)) ) ) )

-1
#533 2 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

That would be no bueno.
Can't write off the current customers and then sell new Alien pins.

Once rebirthed they can.

#534 2 years ago
Quoted from Toads:

Once rebirthed they can.

They can what? Fuck us over and continue on like nothing happened? I don't think so. Not if they really want to be successful.

#535 2 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Just to follow up on this, I've seen the email and it said the following:

So there you have it, no extra money if you're in already.
Not pushing anyone to pre-order, but if you want to get ahead of whatever that price increase is I'm pretty sure deposits with Cointaker are gonna be safe regardless of the outcome, they've covered people with the Dutch Pinball mess already.

I have not seen any email. I agree with others that rather than a price threat, it would be more appropriate to issue a gratitude letter... thank you all for your support over some rough times and for your loyalty we would like to offer ____. Free shipping would be a nice perk to loyal supporters.

Rather than a price increase, they just need to sell a bunch of these games which they could/will at some point. Volume will make up for any additional costs. R&D is aready complete.

#536 2 years ago

This was posted on another thread but I don't see it here, it was sent out to those who requested a refund I believe:

Hi Pinball friend!

We are reaching out to you since you have pre-ordered an Alien Pinball from us at Heighway Pinball. Sadly we have also received your request for a refund. I don’t know if you are aware of the latest changes at Heighway Pinball? Times are a changing and to the better! There is no denial that there has been a massive struggle getting to the stage of mass production. As you might have heard there has been changes in the management at Heighway recently. The group of investors that previously was minor shareholders, and uninvolved in the daily business, is now leading the company into the next phase of the company’s development. Don’t worry, we will carry on the legacy from Andrew when it comes to making great pinball machines based on great themes, but we will also bring a completely new dimension to the management side of the company. The investment group consists of business men with a BIG heart for pinball! We simply know a lot about how to run businesses successfully at the same time as we love pinball and everything that has to do with it (whether it be collecting, restoring, competing etc.)

To further introduce us to you, please find the core team below. There are more investors involved but these guys are the main group who will be driving Heighway Pinball forward:

Roger Svanevik and Cato Paus-Skrede – Norwegians.
A little about us. We have been together as “brothers” since the 80’s. We started a business together in the fire protection field in the 90’s and built it from the ground up. We also have background in business, computers and programming. We are involved in several businesses and have been involved in building most of them from the ground up. Today we are involved in and run our own businesses in fire protection, software development, construction material production, digital printing and marketing products and game operating. Some of you might have seen us and talked to us around the world on pinball shows as we love pinball.

Daniel Janson – Swedish.
My story with pinball started in a snack bar in the early 80’s. My background is with IT, I am a computer guy who started my own business in 2001, a business that today employs quite some people at a few offices around Sweden. My base skill is software programming and I originally started programming to develop computer games. In 2012 I decided to start a pinball shop since there were none in Sweden at the time. So, I started Free Play which have grown into a business on its own for the last 5 years. We may have met at some pinball show in the past years, possibly in a competition or at the Heighway Pinball booth.

Patrik Tenn – Swedish.
If you ever visit Sweden you need to come by my place, a nice place for pinheads since my pinball collection contains around 100 machines. I started a manufacturing business in the mid-90’s that runs still. My first business was founded already back in 1988. I bring vast experience in the field of manufacturing to Heighway Pinball and knows a lot about how to run a production line efficiently.

Alexander Spohr – German.
I got my first pinball when I was eleven, an Orbit. Since then I founded three companies with different partners, employing more than 150 people. They are still in existence, one is now part of a larger one.
Pinball may be a difficult business. But I am used to tackle problems in my way and overcome them.

We would like to speak to you and ask why you have asked for a refund for Alien. We are straightforward about this and are obviously very interested to know if there is anything that could make you change your mind now that things finally start to get exciting? We do have a solid plan moving forwards which we will share with you on the phone. We sincerely hope you are willing to let us explain our thoughts for the way forward.

Due to increased production cost of Alien since the game was initially announced we want you to know there is a price increase planned in the near future – however, as a pre-order customer you are still entitled to the price you got when placing your pre-order.

We will give you a call in the next few days and are looking forward to a really nice pinball conversation!

Very Best Regards,
The new management of Heighway Pinball

Alien as it stands is £5.625k and a Stern Star Wars Pro is £6.250k so with the price increase as long as the game is cheaper than a Stern Pro then that will hopefully sway people over

#537 2 years ago

Did only full paid in folks get that email?

After skimming the last 60 or so pages, if Alien ships, I'm going to plan a vacation to Sweden, and I'll be dropping by Patrik Tenn's house to play some of those games of his. I'll bring the beer!

If it doesn't ship, well I'll just go to Jamaica I spose

#538 2 years ago

Would love to hear gameplay opinions from those who have actually flipped an Alien. Great flow? Clunky?? Somewhere in between??? I've had a deposit dwn since 11/15/15. Trying to decide if I wanna continue to keep up with this circus or just go ahead and request a refund.

#539 2 years ago

I wonder if these five investors have read the main alien thread from start till now.
If they have been in the background and wanted to know what was happening, they could just read the thread, it's all here on pinside.

29
#540 2 years ago

So there you have it, 5 investors, all extremely successful and now in full control. This company will succeed - all refunds will be given, games will ship out and communications will be reestablished. If I didn't think so, I'd quit my job with HP today and be looking for new employment.

This is the light at the end of the tunnel we've all been waiting for at HP. We could always see it, we just didn't know how long the tunnel was.

#541 2 years ago
Quoted from SLAMT1LT:

So there you have it, 5 investors, all extremely successful and now in full control. This company will succeed - all refunds will be given, games will ship out and communications will be reestablished. If I didn't think so, I'd quit my job with HP today and be looking for new employment.
This is the light at the end of the tunnel we've all been waiting for at HP. We could always see it, we just didn't know how long the tunnel was.

Thanks for posting , yours and about 2 others are basically the only ones I still view as credible in this circus

#542 2 years ago
Quoted from SLAMT1LT:

So there you have it, 5 investors, all extremely successful and now in full control.

I am NOT disagreeing with your statement, but asking if someone actually knows these folks and the qualifications they list. I get a little suspicious when people post statements like this, telling us they have "vast" experience and own a lot of different companies, yet never name any of those companies. I own a business and built it from the ground up as well, and my opinion of success might differ from yours. I have one employee, and that is me...... Just because someone writes you a letter or email doesn't make anything true....everyone needs to do their own due diligence. They may very well all have millions, but if they are going to use their business acumen to qualify them to run this company and turn things around, I would want something a bit more specific.

#543 2 years ago

Here would be my recommendation using the assumption that they are all highly successful and want to make a go of it.

Each investor ponies up a rather modest $500k resulting in a new cash infusion of $2.5mm. Immediately bring A/P current. Send a letter to everyone saying. "Hey we are the new guys we are all in and fully funding this company. Obviously, we think this is a great product and hope everyone will stay in; however, we certainly understand people's concerns and frustrations. Therefore, if you want a refund, please send a new request to xxxx@xyz.com. All refund requests will be processed within five business days. As for production, we are spending the next 60 days finalizing the current production processes, hiring additional staff and yada yada yada. After 60 days we will provide a definitive production schedule."

Send this letter to everyone. Process all refund requests in five days. If I were in on this and sitting on the fence, nothing would assuage my concerns more than this action since it basically says 1) we aren't going to jerk you around 2) we are invested in making this work 3) our pockets are deep enough so 4) your money is safe

#544 2 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Would it be too much to ask that the whysnow show be taken to another thread?

I'm with you so far. But then...

Quoted from Aurich:

and it's frankly irritating as sh*t to have to scroll past tons of posts about who rates pinball machines a 1 or whatever other stupidity. No one cares. Hilton, please just stop responding,

Saying it should be out of here and then adding to it isn't really the solution. It's just asking him to respond.

#545 2 years ago

Remember, you're considered successful only if you've had a business failure or three in your past.

#546 2 years ago
Quoted from MrBally:

Remember, you're considered successful only if you've had a business failure or three in your past.

No joke. I've boomed and busted multiple times in my life. Currently on my next boom, and hopefully have learned enough from the last ones to avoid the bust this time around.

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