Yeah, I just wondered what the actual dimensions were, since the DR backbox is a different shape than a Bally/Williams. Although, it's still generally square I suppose.

Its the same Width which is all that should matter in regards to a door opening.

Toy Package: Worth It?

Some of the options for the Arcade are insultingly expensive, including the "Toy Package." One question would be, how do you score the Dizzie Doodle points if the toy is missing, or is the mech still there and just the creature that sits on top is omitted? It would be helpful if DR included photos of a bone-stock RAZA on their website, so people would know what they're getting by ordering a game with zero options.

hello all, how do I know what game number I have ordered< some of you seem to already know this so I am curious how to find out. I placed a deposit today for an Extra and hope this company is a success. As a kid I loved the movie Goonies and am looking forward to the release of that game as well!!!

Some people think the order number will equal the serial number

As noted. I think most are going by the invoice number.
My invoice number and serial number from the contract are very different.

so nobody really knows?

Doubt they know. They have produced nothing. Hand built games are not production games.

I ordered an extra with the pin pod and screen protector order number 100209 I put down a deposit not paid in full.

I know its a bit of a risk but what the hell, I hope they do follow thru and the game is great.

Yeah Baby! I used my Zidware credits to pay in full for an Xtra, Pinbar protector and ship it in a Pinpod.
Hoping I'll be in shipment #1.

Yeah! (resized).png

I would think you would be since the idea was to ship to make the Zidware people whole.

lol that's great I also hope you are the first dude, if this game if successful is going to change pinball. The glass that lifts and playfield that sits in the mid of the cabinet is so great. honestly this machine has some amazing innovations that are past due. the feet!!! There are some smart changes to the game they are "going to produce" . if the order number is the game number I am 209 as of a few hours ago, I put down a 20% deposit.

Arcade addition ordered #100210

Extras
No reflective glass
Toy package
Shaker

After talking with Robert today looking forward to having Raza and Deeproot represented at Pintastic in June. Fingers crossed.

I disagree. Although I ordered an Ae without any options, all of the options are competitively priced to those that make mods or offer upgrade products and services.

The deeproot website is very clear as to what you get. The Dizzie Doozie and stationary Ned are included. The jet, motorcycle, sign, and ramp stickers are extra and are reasonably priced in my opinion. No photos are necessary as it’s quite clear as outlined under the “customize” page.

Your confirmation email has your order number and the contact you signed has your individual serial number.

Wrong. See my previous post.

I can't find the contract, I see the order number but I can't seem to find the contract I signed, I must be looking in the wrong place.

Awesome!!!

Nice!!!

Considering ordering an Xtra edition, but what's this I hear about needing to sign a contract to purchase (essentially an indemnification agreement)?

No worries....

In my view a mirror of the the Stern EULA that you will need to sign also. Basically nothing more then a CYA product waiver which is not really new to the industry.

Some people are more believing than I (paying in full - seems risky to me) but a deposit for an arcade edition ($600-700) is not something I want to lose but I won’t die if for some reason the machine is never built.

That is why I could and would not pull the trigger on the XTRA. 20% is over $2k on the XTRA and that is also a bridge too far.

I don’t think the XTRA will sell out it’s 300, maybe both editions together will be close to 300 is my guess.

We all have different risks and money levels we are comfortable with. I hope DR lives up to the orders they are getting - my guess it will be close to 300 machines by the time their order taking stops.

I am a believer the contract didn’t overly concern me, if I wanted to freak out I would read my iPhone user agreement and then I can build a cabin in Montana and live off the grid renouncing technology.

Lol. I have always been afraid to actually read that iPhone agreement.

Is the contract posted anywhere? Trying to do some research as I like RAZA and what DR is offering. I'd like to have my attorney take a look before I drop $2k on a non-refundable deposit (proof of concept vs. manufacturing are completely different).

i couldn't disagree more. Led Zeppelin is considered the greatest rock n roll band in history and somehow you think people will lose more money on that game more so than a game only 100 or fewer people want to buy? Strange! LZ LE sell out in minutes, and you think somehow RAZA a game with no connection to a legendary rock band who's sold over 200 million records will beat out LZ in the long run. You know there are hundreds of titles from the 90's that you can snag for 2k to 4k, titles with no connection to a film or band like raza. How is it that you have a crystal ball to see this RAZA game won't fall into the same boat 10 years from now? Not one single person even knows if this company will be in business for the long run no one knows. Oktoberfest has sold about 200 copies or so but do you see the value of that game flying thru the roof? Just because something is rare doesn't mean it will be valuable.

Long after every band member of LZ is gone people will continue to celebrate them, and collect everything they can get their hands on. My post doesn't mean any disrespect to RAZA but c'mon what you said is complete disrespect for a legendary rock band or TNMT with millions of fans, or Stranger Things streaming's biggest hit ever. People might forget about Stranger Things 10 years from now but LZ no way in hell!

Tell all the KISS fans who snatched up basically every single KISS LE ... those people wouldn't sell you their KISS LE for any price. All the people who snatched up LZ LE on the first day, many being hard core LZ fans those games will never be re-sold.

The long term jury is still out on titles like Black Knight Swords of Rage to TNA to yes RAZA. Time will tell but don't compare a game that hasn't even been shipped with no single connection to any IP to Led Zep c'mon man. That just isn't being real.

Just for the record I'm not some major LZ fan, I'm just calling it honestly. IF LZ went back out on tour the tickets would sell for over 1000 each and might go as high as 5000 or 10k in the after market. The fans of LZ will buy those games and keep them forever and will constantly seek them out for decades. RAZA 10 years from now who knows that is just being honest. Get excited about your new game but also try to keep it real.

Lol. LZ sold out in minutes. So did 600 Munsters LE's. How well did they do! lolol A hungry market does Not make for a guaranteed investment! The Beatles is a WAY bigger band and following then LZ how are those games selling vs list? LZ is a great band but that does Not ensure a great pinball machine. How many hours have you put into Playing LZ may I ask.......

Let me try to save you some legal fees. The contract is written by lawyers hired by deep root. Basically unless you are ok with losing your deposit, wait until they start delivering games and order then....if losing the deposit won’t keep you up at night, then go for it.

Oddly, I was told the same about my Stern LE and JJP LE deposit...... Must be a trend.

pinball isn't an investment its silly to think it is... every time you buy a game people expect to lose some money upon resale. In the rare occasions like JJP Pirates they skyrocket. We also see where Cactus Canyons got up to 20k now they're back down to the 10k range because of Chicago Gaming new machine coming soon. Big Lebowski was hitting legendary numbers now they're worth about what you paid.

You don't buy pinball hoping to hit it big like a stock no one does. That isn't the point. Furthermore its an insult to anyone's intelligence comparing a fringe 60's TV show that honestly never should have been made to a legendary Rock Band whos sold over 200 million records and are consistently ranked the greatest rock band in history. That just isn't a fair comparison.

LOL.

Led Zep is on GOD LEVEL for many people, I doubt Munsters is all that memorable for most. Universal has owned that IP and in 40 years never made a movie out of it that should tell you something. Stern shouldn't have ever made that title when they could have made Beetlejuice. Just saying.

Led Zep is on GOD LEVEL for many people, I doubt Munsters is all that memorable for most. Universal has owned that IP and in 40 years never made a movie out of it that should tell you something. Stern shouldn't have ever made that title when they could have made Beetlejuice. Just saying.

If you want my honest opinion i think Stern was thinking Adams Family when they decided on Munsters. Both are horror tv comedy from the same period I wonder if you can strike lightening twice. The difference is Adams Family was based on a movie and Munsters the TV Show that hardly anyone remembers. In the 1990's that pinball came out with the movie, this Munsters came out 50 years after a black and white TV Show.

It wouldn't keep me up at night, however I believe in making objective & informed decisions.

If I disrespected LZ not really my intent - if I offended anyone I apologize I was commenting on the market price of Stern machines not retaining value. Pinball is not like buying gold or stocks it’s a hobby some machines maintain value some do not. Seems like most titles lately from Stern have a strong initial burst of interest and then come back into reality and sell on the used market for a few hundred less in just a few months. I expect RAZA will lose a few hundred like my example and that is all I am saying, so if I lose a few hundred isn’t that most pinballs these days.

I can’t think of a new machine that has increased in value enough to consider pinball an investment. It’s a toy no matter the theme, I like RAZA as a theme, I don’t need licensed themes to like a game. I think TNMT or LZ might be cool for some people it’s just not for me.

I expect that I will lose money on RAZA, like I did on BM66 it wasn’t much and I enjoyed the game while I owned it.

If I wanted to make money in pinball I would buy older Bally Williams games from the 90’s and restore them somewhat, play them, enjoy them and sell them at a later date and I may make a little or break even.

I agree fans of LZ or TNMT have fans who will buy it but there are plenty of the games out there so after the initial pop up in price it will do what all pinball machines do, drop back into reality as the next latest and greatest pinball comes out.

Do you ever read what you wrote. I simply responded to your point that LZ LE sold out in Minutes. As if that meant Anything! Trust me I know pinball is not an investment that would be foolish. What I do know is YOU are a straight up honest opinion collector. Thats why I asked How many games have you Played on LZ? I know for a fact there have been games with Great themes you loved till you played them. Thats my primary point. LZ (TO ME) looks slim by comparison as a pinball game. Again my opinion. For the money I think Raza will be well bought. I will look for your Long term value review of LZ when you get and play one.

You know what I find strange, people have been burned so many times by fringe pinball companies, why would you pay fifty cents towards a deposit?

Its a serious question!!! You're giving this money directly to the company how many times in the past has this worked out? I've been in business a long time and I don't pay for something that isn't ready for delivery upon payment.

If Deeproot is backed by this guy with all this money why does he need a big deposit why not 100 dollars? Who wants to pay 2k then wait for 2 years to get it? Maybe it doesn't take 2 years maybe it takes 2 months, 10 months whatever... you're dealing with a company that has never delivered a single pinball game to customers and you're giving them money in advance.

The safest path to me is pay for them when you can ship them or buy them from a distributor who has them on their shelf. I do hope everyone gets their pinball games, with no issues, and loves them. With that being said seems like there has been enough burned pinball buying stories to keep people going down that rabbit hole again.

Sorry, the hyperbole theory thread is in the Other Deeproot thread. This is for the Ordered folks here. Plenty of opinions, theories, FUD, and fright in the other thread. lol I will however invite you over as soon as my games arrive though as you are awesome! lol

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/twip-is-deeproot-the-next-misadventure-or-a-pinball-revolution

Agreed - there is reason to be cautious and skeptical.

I'll bet you everything you own (LOL) that RAZA will not be worth a LZ LE 5 years from now. NO WAY JOSE! It doesn't matter if LZ is a good pinball game or not its the THEME! After 50 years they get a pinball game with their music and you think somehow LZ fans will sell those games? How often do you see Kiss LE games for sale almost NEVER because Kiss fans have them. Once those games end up in a KISS collection they never leave.

RAZA is a concept game right now because they've never manufactured a game in their life. When you spend years and millions developing a game for and never produce anything then when you finally do you're only selling 100 copies tell me how does that company stay in business? That is a serious question. There is no line out the door to buy this game the same as for Oktoberfest.

If anyone is buying the game because they think it will be rare therefore valuable you might be sadly mistaken.

At the end of the day only time will tell. So we'll have to get a lot older to find out who's right but i'll bet on the legendary rock band all day long.

This company has been saying for how many years they're just around the corner. I think its fair to say you might hear the same thing about the manufacturing. They're only producing 100 for sure manageable but that means the owner of this company will be losing tens of hundreds of thousands of dollars. Even your ego and pride at some point has to realize when it doesn't make sense.

I can only imagine how much money these people has sunk into this company and how much more to actually make these 100 machines. I just don't see how this company will stay in business no matter how much money you shovel in.

Just me... keep your deposit until they have games in the box ready to ship.

What 100 games? Last I checked they were well past double that? You need to get your hate spin updated. lol They only thing I will agree with is "time will tell".

There is no hate spin... i'm just keeping it real this game will never be worth more than LZ that just isn't going to happen. This game is for hard core pinball collectors and outside of that group the general public will never have heard of the thing. That's a fact. I think its also fair to question if this company will last, if you should pay a deposit, how long it will take them to supply the games to your door, what kind of tech support they will have , etc.

I don't hate deep root I just hate the fact that so many people have been burned countless times from fringe pinball companies. This company here hired a guy with a track record of it so sorry if you think this is hate spin its not.

What is hate spin is for you to live in some sort of fantasy world where you think RAZA will be worth more than the biggest rock n roll band's pinball game... you'd have to be living in a fantasy world to believe that. LZ fans around the World will see to it. Guns N Roses fans have already dictated the price of the CE from JJP 20k plus. You'd have to be living on planet raza to think that is going to happen. LOL I love you ... you know that but we have to get on the same planet here.

Alright already. You said the same thing multiple times already. Move on!!

Obviously, this dud has not been in business a long time.
I work for a multi-billion dollar manufacturing company and we make down payments on parts all the time that are not in stock with long lead times (sometimes 26-52 weeks).

Common man - reread what you write.....and let's get this topic back on the pre-order thread and sharing of information.

Ok - wow - you like Led Zepplini I guess.

I don’t buy games based upon what other people think their value may be 1-3-5-10-15 years from now. I buy what I think looks fun...sometimes they are keepers sometimes they are not.

If I worried what a pinball will be worth later I should put my money elsewhere because there are way better investments.

That’s what’s great about pinball we can buy what we want for any reason, I like EM’s for the art but I have none in my collection.

LZ is likely a dream theme for many. But. It’s not Amazon stock or Tesla or Apple.

agreed. buy the game because you want it not because you think it will be worth something later. btw i'm not a huge lz fan not at all... but they're more or less ranked the greatest rock band. personally i think guns n roses is better for pinball than LZ but it still works. its about the fans of the theme and there will be many.

Has anyone seen any clips on the video mods they show?

I got the opportunity to watch some game play of RAZA recently. The code and gameplay looks surprisingly very good.
If this game was being sold by Stern, I think it would sell in large numbers. The only things holding it back is the combination of a new start up company and the Jpop aura hanging around. If the game plays as good as it looks and plays reliably, those 2 things will quickly disappear.
For this reason, I’m in on RAZA and am willing to take a chance because of the CODE.

With this same logic, I’m assuming Deep Root knows that they have one chance to get this right or their reputation and their company will be toast. With the attention they seemed to have put into this game, this looks like a winner. I dig it.

Full disclosure, I’m also in on a LZ but it’s purely because it’s Zeppelin. Playfield looks sparse. But the playfield looked sparse in SW and still turned out to be a lot of fun. If it turns out to be shit code like Munsters, everybody will be dumping their LZs no matter how great Zeppelin is. (And I’m huge fan of Zeppelin.) IMHO.

no. What video mods are you talking about?

Sorry meant video Modes. In the rather awesome in depth coverage on game and code This Week in Pinball one of the later sections shows some video modes like "Attach of the Saucers" which looks similar to the one in AFM or missile command.

Pretty much Everything you would want to know about Raza gameplay:
https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/retro-atomic-zombie-adventureland-pinball-deep-dive-in-depth-overview-of-the-machine-features-rules-and-more/