(Topic ID: 283944)

RAZA Pre-order Club

By NoMonkey

5 months ago


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Topic Stats

  • 1,479 posts
  • 138 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 hours ago by gprotein
  • Topic is favorited by 63 Pinsiders

You

Topic poll

“Which Edition Did You Order”

  • Arcade 27 votes
    56%
  • Xtra 21 votes
    44%

(48 votes)

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#1 5 months ago

IMPORTANT: If you have concerns regarding the DocuSign agreement required to purchase the game, please read the Deeproot FAQ found in the yellow box at the top of this page
https://deeprootpinball.com/shop/machines

Starting a thread to allow people that have pre-ordered RAZA to discuss their purchase outside of the general Deeproot thread.

I get that there are a lot of opinions regarding Deeproot and/or the people that are purchasing RAZA however I kindly ask that you take those opinions to a different thread.

I'd be interested to hear which edition and options you have selected and if you paid in full or put down a deposit; if you're willing to share.

As for me I've put down a deposit on an Xtra edition with a screen protector only (no pinpod). I'm serial #100045.

Truly looking forward to receiving this beautiful game and supporting Deeproot in their initial launch!

FAQ

I'd like to keep track of frequently asked questions regarding RAZA. This is an effort to provide some clarity with actual responses from Deeproot themselves. If you have any questions/answers to add to this list, let me know.

Open allOrders I only put down a deposit for the game. Will the remaining payment be expected prior to building my game or after? We will contact you about 2 weeks prior to shipping for the final payment giving you time to make arrangements.

If I were to pay my full balance now, would that change anything regarding when my game would be produced? We will assign order and priority based on full over deposit orders. I would not expect a drastic change in the queue order though.

When should I realistically expect my game to ship? The first games should be leaving in mid to late Jan for US orders. There still are some supply orders we are watching closely for on time arrival.

Is there anyway to know what the serial number will be on my game? The serial number should be in the contract you signed and received.

Do you have any sort of customer loyalty program? For instance if I were to purchase another game from you in the future is there any sort of discount or credit that is applied? There is currently no loyalty program. But we expect to start one next year.

If I've already place my order, can I still opt into or out of other options? Yes once your order is made you can change options later.

Is there any discount for buying more than one game? Unfortunately we do not offer discounts on multiple games unless you are a distributor with 30 sales or more.

Will you allow me to pick the game up from your factory? If you want to come down and pick them up we’re completely fine with that. But you will not be permitted into the building.

If I were to come pick my game up, I wouldn't need pay shipping; correct? Correct. We will not charge. Those amounts are marked estimates.

When I purchased my Arcade Edition, I see that it is #100206. Does that mean there are at least 206 orders so far? No, that does not mean there are 206 machines being built.

Open allProduction Is there already an assembly line in place? If so, is it currently functioning and producing games? Yes, the quads are in place and are being used.

Are the legs bolted directly to the cabinet or is there a protective spacer to ensure the artwork is not damaged? We recommend not to attach the protective inserts because they tend to rub more than without. We will not provide spacers as that brings up additional engineering issues.

Is the playfield glass the same size as a standard body b/w pinball machine? No our glass size is not standard due to the frame.

Open allMaintenance Will individual parts be available to purchase in the event something breaks? (e.g. from Marco Specialties, etc.) We will have parts, but we cannot speak for Pinball Life or Marco on whether they will carry our parts.

Are the PCBs using through-hole components or is everything surface mount? My concern is what the maintenance will be like for owners once the warranty expires. Surface Mount

When the playfield is lifted for service, it appears that the Pinbar goes along with it. Is there anyway to access the service menu during this time or is it expected that the playfield will need to be lowered again to allow interaction with the Pinbar? Yes the pinbar is touchable if the frame is at the highest position. There is ample room if the hood is fully upright.

In the event the playfield glass were to become scratched and/or break, is it easily replaceable? You would need to remove several bolts and screws, but yes it does slide in and out.

How much will replacement glass cost? Replacement costs would be minimal for regular glass and industry standard for A/R; with shipping being the big cost.

Open allXtra™ Edition Is there any footage of the Xtra™ topper in action? The current topper is simply lights that are on or blink. The Xtra™ topper has not been shown yet and is still in development.

Does the head on the Xtra™ edition lay down the same as a traditional pinball machine? Yes the head comes down like normal on the Xtra™. It is on recessed hinges rather than on external arms.

In the images for the Xtra™ edition, the powder coating appears to be blue however in the description it is described as purple. Is what we see on your website the color I should expect to receive? The color is a purple-blue mix. It’s hue depends on the room or environment lighting.

Open allArcade Edition Will people be able to purchase Xtra™-only components (e.g. Mechanized topper & shaking Ned) and add them to their Arcade edition games? No, the Xtra™ addons are only for the Xtra™ machines.

When the optional “Neon Rings” are mentioned, is this referring to the rubber rings? If so, and these are not selected, it appears you get standard white rubbers with red flipper rubbers; correct? Yes the rubber rings are the neon rings. Correct, white and red are the standard for the Arcade.

Is the optional general illumination lighting interactive in any way (e.g. changes color, etc.) or are they just always on and provide white lighting from above? They are controlled by the code and are downward facing overhead lighting.

#3 5 months ago

I'm not a pre-order but thank you for starting this thread, especially providing the Q and A from Deeproot. Well done.
I assume the Goodwill Deeproot people will be able to contribute to this thread and I look forward to hearing from them also.

Thread bump and best wishes to all.

#4 5 months ago

In on a RAZA Arcade Edition...order #100087!

#5 5 months ago

The details about my order as the OP requested...

RAZA Ae
No options selected
10% deposit paid

I’m cautiously excited...now we all wait!!!

#6 5 months ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

The details about my order as the OP requested...
RAZA Ae
No options selected
10% deposit paid
I’m cautiously excited...now we all wait!!!

Did they charge sales tax or add on shipping?

#7 5 months ago

I didn’t get why the other thread was closed since there is a LZ LE thread... why it’s hurting for the RAZA? At « preorder » thing should be ok.

#8 5 months ago

Congrats to the owners. I think this pin deserve a try and have a great design.

#9 5 months ago
Quoted from noitbe1:

I didn’t get why the other thread was closed since there is a LZ LE thread... why it’s hurting for the RAZA. At « preorder » thing should be ok.

I have seen them do this with other games too. It should open up once games start shipping. If someone reports the LZ owners thread, they would do the same thing.

#10 5 months ago
Quoted from Tomass:

I have seen them do this with other games too. It should open up once games start shipping. If someone reports the LZ owners thread, they would do the same thing.

Yes sure i get it on one side but... why is it really an issue. Anyway, « preorder » is the fix.

#11 5 months ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

In on a RAZA Arcade Edition...order #100087!

Sweet! Deeproot almost at 100! wrb1977 - When you did you place your order?

#12 5 months ago

Sweet on the QA content. Knew most in speaking to Robert but wasn't clear on the topper for the Xtra version. Pleased to hear that one with be more animated. Win. Have 2 Xtra versions paid in full betting against the opinion odds this will be a great game.

#13 5 months ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

Sweet on the QA content. Knew most in speaking to Robert but wasn't clear on the topper for the Xtra version. Pleased to hear that one with be more animated. Win. Have 2 Xtra versions paid in full betting against the opinion odds this will be a great game.

FFC2F082-ABA0-491A-AF24-B98FC1AC9CB9.gif
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#14 5 months ago

It's kind of like the covid vaccines. I'm interested, but other people can go first.

#15 5 months ago

I have a question.

If I pay for the minimal down payment now ($1,917.80). When do I need to come up with the rest of the payment? Is it when the game is being shipped?

EDIT: I see the answer at the top of FAQ. Thanks!

#16 5 months ago

Does anyone know what is the first serial number / order number?

Might be worth listing too.

#17 5 months ago
Quoted from cpr9999:

Does anyone know what is the first serial number / order number?
Might be worth listing too.

001 might be a good guess. I am right behind that.

#18 5 months ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

001 might be a good guess. I am right behind that.

OK - cool

#19 5 months ago
Quoted from mr9865:

Did they charge sales tax or add on shipping?

Since I got an Ae without any options, my total deposit paid was $589.90. The deposit is only calculated off the game selected and any options added. There will be shipping costs due with the final payment. My understanding is there will not be any sales tax.

#20 5 months ago
Quoted from Aqua1122:

Sweet! Deeproot almost at 100! wrb1977 - When you did you place your order?

Last night as I was enjoying Leinenkugel’s Snowdrift Vanilla Porter...my seasonal beer of choice!

#21 5 months ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

Since I got an Ae without any options, my total deposit paid was $589.90. The deposit is only calculated off the game selected and any options added. There will be shipping costs due with the final payment. My understanding is there will not be any sales tax.

Tax may be on a per-state basis. I was (or will be) charged 8.25% sales tax and $450 for shipping. Not sure if shipping would be more if the Pinpod were selected.

#22 5 months ago

Not buying it. Preorders are a huge risk with unproven companies. Buyer beware.

#23 5 months ago
Quoted from hank527:

Not buying it. Preorders are a huge risk with unproven companies. Buyer beware.

Lucky for you there's already a thread for not buying it: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/twip-is-deeproot-the-next-misadventure-or-a-pinball-revolution

Enjoy!

#24 5 months ago
Quoted from hank527:

Not buying it. Preorders are a huge risk with unproven companies. Buyer beware.

Read the purpose of this forum!

#25 5 months ago
Quoted from VALIS666:

It's kind of like the covid vaccines. I'm interested, but other people can go first.

I get that...I really do. I figured the 10% deposit on an Ae was reasonable and worth the risk. I do believe RAZA will ship and I do think it will be fantastic! I also believe there is a lot more to the playfield and gameplay than can be seen in the few videos that are out there.

#26 5 months ago

I don't have the cash to put down for this one, but I hope someone within a 100 mile radius of me does so. I would love to play this game!!!

-1
#27 5 months ago
Quoted from hank527:

Not buying it. Preorders are a huge risk with unproven companies. Buyer beware.

Cool...don’t buy it then...play the 37 pins you do have.

#28 5 months ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

I get that...I really do. I figured the 10% deposit on an Ae was reasonable and worth the risk. I do believe RAZA will ship and I do think it will be fantastic! I also believe there is a lot more to the playfield and gameplay than can be seen in the few videos that are out there.

I totally get it, and wish you luck. Hope it's great, and reliable, and hope to be joining you as an owner some day! I really have a thing for the smaller companies making pinball, and think this hobby will be even more fun if the focus and hype wasn't something like 75% Stern, 15% JJP, 10% everyone else.

#29 5 months ago

I was in till the Docusign. Hope y'all read that one...

#30 5 months ago
Quoted from Nysbadmk8:

I was in till the Docusign. Hope y'all read that one...

I did...every word. If you don’t mind me asking...what specifically did you take exception with?

#31 5 months ago

Just purchased my Xtra ....can't wait!

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#32 5 months ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

I did...every word. If you don’t mind me asking...what specifically did you take exception with?

The blanket indemnity.

Signing that paper would give you zero recourse to cure any faults, whether it be monetary (the deposit) or the product.

Given the history (not discussing it, but it cannot be ignored) I have to bow out and wait.

In addition. I've purchased three NIB games in the last 6 months.

None of the resellers or manufactures needed 1. A signed contract, 2. Complete Indemnification.

#33 5 months ago

I am in on order 100025, I ordered the Arcade edition, with a topper and with the extra toys package.
The Docusign thing is way over the top, I think the influence of lawyers is a bit too much for this hobby. They probably should have just done a terms and a checkbox, like everyone else on this planet does for consumer goods. I was not really worried because its a small amount to just put 10%, I'm probably in the minority.
The serial number is not a sequential thing, It reminded me of a random hash, might have options hidden into it like car VINs have paint colors embedded.

#34 5 months ago
Quoted from Jarson:

I am in on order 100025, I ordered the Arcade edition, with a topper and with the extra toys package.
The Docusign thing is way over the top, I think the influence of lawyers is a bit too much for this hobby. They probably should have just done a terms and a checkbox, like everyone else on this planet does for consumer goods. I was not really worried because its a small amount to just put 10%, I'm probably in the minority.
The serial number is not a sequential thing, It reminded me of a random hash, might have options hidden into it like car VINs have paint colors embedded.

Agreed, I would of let it fly at that if so.

#35 5 months ago
Quoted from Jarson:

I am in on order 100025, I ordered the Arcade edition, with a topper and with the extra toys package.
The Docusign thing is way over the top, I think the influence of lawyers is a bit too much for this hobby. They probably should have just done a terms and a checkbox, like everyone else on this planet does for consumer goods. I was not really worried because its a small amount to just put 10%, I'm probably in the minority.
The serial number is not a sequential thing, It reminded me of a random hash, might have options hidden into it like car VINs have paint colors embedded.

Its not like $600 is nothing - but I have dumped more and over restored machines and lost money on them when I sold them. This of course is different where we may not get a product at all for our deposit. But, I find it a little hard to believe that a company that started out trying to "do right" for Zidware customers would be doing all this for a couple hundred people mostly laying down deposits and a handful paying in full. For me, I see them making RAZA to the pre-order amounts and maybe nothing more (they may come back to it in the future) but like they said they will move on to other games.

This forum might not have the hate postings for DR. But, I get they failed to meet self-imposed deadlines and talked in a grandiose ways. But, I think they have been humbled and I am excited to see the game.

I just think Stern has produced some pretty uninspiring games lately and people drool all over themselves for 5 minutes and pre-order... then the games almost immediately end up back on marketplace at a loss. For Deep Root this may be a different path a little bumpy but I still think RAZA looks cool, I love the theme reminds me of BBB - I hope they change the market or add to it. I think a game like RAZA could end up being like a really desired BW game from the 90's - I just don't see the same for a Stern Led Zeppelin or a Stranger Things or a TNMT. I may be wrong but JP did more with GNR and it doesn't look cheap. I don't think RAZA looks cheap. I think of games like Fish Tales, Getaway, or Indiana Jones those games people look for - RAZA could be a small run game that once it is made others may miss out on.

Ok $600 is a risk - but pinball does not "make money" for me quite the opposite some games I make a little but overall I would guess I am even. Would I pay in full - no - does that mean I have to wait, yes, but I have less skin in the game. I just can't image everyone thinks someone would do all of this intentionally to steal a few hundred dollars from a few people. I know people can bring up the investment funds and other things. People can bring up that most people who started pinball companies have good intent too....they intend on shipping machines and just fail in the end. But, people will lose $600 on a Stern Led Zeppelin after the hype is gone too. I think LZ is just a cash grab for people who like Led Zeppelin - it certainly has hit the age demographic and people who have money. I said this is one of the machines that should be sold with weed for everyone to enjoy it because that is the only way to listen to Led Zeppelin.

Sorry if I offended any Led Zeppelin fans not my intent I just think this has limited appeal. I don't think all games have to be licensed to be popular - in the 90's some of the best games were unlicensed themes.

People will lose more money on a Led Zeppelin, TMNT, or Stranger Things than a deposit on a RAZA. Stern will make another machine and the hype will be gone. Only Spooky or JJ is holding a little over release prices once games are produced.

#36 5 months ago
Quoted from Nysbadmk8:

The blanket indemnity.
Signing that paper would give you zero recourse to cure any faults, whether it be monetary (the deposit) or the product.
Given the history (not discussing it, but it cannot be ignored) I have to bow out and wait.
In addition. I've purchased three NIB games in the last 6 months.
None of the resellers or manufactures needed 1. A signed contract, 2. Complete Indemnification.

Fair enough...I appreciate the response.

#37 5 months ago
Quoted from wamonkey:

Its not like $600 is nothing - but I have dumped more and over restored machines and lost money on them when I sold them. This of course is different where we may not get a product at all for our deposit. But, I find it a little hard to believe that a company that started out trying to "do right" for Zidware customers would be doing all this for a couple hundred people mostly laying down deposits and a handful paying in full. For me, I see them making RAZA to the pre-order amounts and maybe nothing more (they may come back to it in the future) but like they said they will move on to other games.
This forum might not have the hate postings for DR. But, I get they failed to meet self-imposed deadlines and talked in a grandiose ways. But, I think they have been humbled and I am excited to see the game.
I just think Stern has produced some pretty uninspiring games lately and people drool all over themselves for 5 minutes and pre-order... then the games almost immediately end up back on marketplace at a loss. For Deep Root this may be a different path a little bumpy but I still think RAZA looks cool, I love the theme reminds me of BBB - I hope they change the market or add to it. I think a game like RAZA could end up being like a really desired BW game from the 90's - I just don't see the same for a Stern Led Zeppelin or a Stranger Things or a TNMT. I may be wrong but JP did more with GNR and it doesn't look cheap. I don't think RAZA looks cheap. I think of games like Fish Tales, Getaway, or Indiana Jones those games people look for - RAZA could be a small run game that once it is made others may miss out on.
Ok $600 is a risk - but pinball does not "make money" for me quite the opposite some games I make a little but overall I would guess I am even. Would I pay in full - no - does that mean I have to wait, yes, but I have less skin in the game. I just can't image everyone thinks someone would do all of this intentionally to steal a few hundred dollars from a few people. I know people can bring up the investment funds and other things. People can bring up that most people who started pinball companies have good intent too....they intend on shipping machines and just fail in the end. But, people will lose $600 on a Stern Led Zeppelin after the hype is gone too. I think LZ is just a cash grab for people who like Led Zeppelin - it certainly has hit the age demographic and people who have money. I said this is one of the machines that should be sold with weed for everyone to enjoy it because that is the only way to listen to Led Zeppelin.
Sorry if I offended any Led Zeppelin fans not my intent I just think this has limited appeal. I don't think all games have to be licensed to be popular - in the 90's some of the best games were unlicensed themes.
People will lose more money on a Led Zeppelin, TMNT, or Stranger Things than a deposit on a RAZA. Stern will make another machine and the hype will be gone. Only Spooky or JJ is holding a little over release prices once games are produced.

You missed a few points, the biggest one you missed... If you only lose your deposit, you lose 600 bucks. If you pay in full and get a game which is full of problems, then you definitely lost more.

#38 5 months ago
Quoted from Nysbadmk8:

You missed a few points, the biggest one you missed... If you only lose your deposit, you lose 600 bucks. If you pay in full and get a game which is full of problems, then you definitely lost more.

True and possible - just like Stranger Things it was built and has problems. Tons of hype and a screen that broadcast only in a dark room - who talks about that game now. The answer is nobody.

So like any game it could over hype and under deliver. Most of the modern machines have had issues of flaking and pooling or weak code.

All games have risks of not living up to their expectations.

Rick and morty has thousands of post on how to fix a game fresh from the factory. Is it still a good game - it appears to be (haven’t played it but it’s on my wishlist)? Would I buy one, it’s in my wishlist - would I pay over cost like many have, no.

So risks abound....

I hear GNR even has pooling and clear coat issues.

Ok DR has less of a track record (being fair - no track record) but established companies have issues too.

Either the games will be built and risks reduce or we will get a game like any other company and deal with what is produced.

So as a pre-order club it’s should be a forum of believers or the hopeful at least.

#39 5 months ago
Quoted from wamonkey:

True and possible - just like Stranger Things it was built and has problems. Tons of hype and a screen that broadcast only in a dark room - who talks about that game now. The answer is nobody.
So like any game it could over hype and under deliver. Most of the modern machines have had issues of flaking and pooling or weak code.
All games have risks of not living up to their expectations.
Rick and morty has thousands of post on how to fix a game fresh from the factory. Is it still a good game - it appears to be (haven’t played it but it’s on my wishlist)? Would I buy one, it’s in my wishlist - would I pay over cost like many have, no.
So risks abound....
I hear GNR even has pooling and clear coat issues.
Ok DR has less of a track record (being fair - no track record) but established companies have issues too.
Either the games will be built and risks reduce or we will get a game like any other company and deal with what is produced.
So as a pre-order club it’s should be a forum of believers or the hopeful at least.

I was in... I was.

I still want to be. But I gotta wait.

R&M was one of my nib. I'd say the issues are overblown, but alas it does need tweaking out of the box. So you are not wrong there.

I wish you guys luck. I hope that ten page DocuSign is all moot point.

#40 5 months ago
Quoted from wamonkey:

So as a pre-order club it’s should be a forum of believers or the hopeful at least.

Agreed. Let’s keep this thread on track with those that have preordered RAZA, those thinking about it, or at least those positive about deeproot.

#41 5 months ago
Quoted from wrb1977:

Agreed. Let’s keep this thread on track with those that have preordered RAZA, those thinking about it, or at least those positive about deeproot.

I hope I was... that is what I was trying to communicate.

12
#42 5 months ago

Robert just setup the website to deal with the credits for the Zidware claimants like me - I just confirmed my order for an Xtra, order # 100136... Looking forward to getting a game that I paid for eight years ago!!

#43 5 months ago
Quoted from ShinyNick:

Robert just setup the website to deal with the credits for the Zidware claimants like me - I just confirmed my order for an Xtra, order # 100136... Looking forward to getting a game that I paid for eight years ago!!

That’s awesome...good to hear!

#44 5 months ago
Quoted from ShinyNick:

Robert just setup the website to deal with the credits for the Zidware claimants like me - I just confirmed my order for an Xtra, order # 100136... Looking forward to getting a game that I paid for eight years ago!!

100136..... up to 136.
Things looking up?

#45 5 months ago

Weren't they hoping to get all the claimants and some preorders in a 200 RAZA run? Thats what I recall reading. Sounds like he's on track. Hope to see unboxings in Feb.

Quoted from cpr9999:

100136..... up to 136.
Things looking up?

#46 5 months ago
Quoted from luvthatapex2:

Weren't they hoping to get all the claimants and some preorders in a 200 RAZA run? Thats what I recall reading. Sounds like he's on track. Hope to see unboxings in Feb.

Still a way to go...

#47 5 months ago

I just ordered an Xtra. 153

#48 5 months ago
Quoted from Stemmy:

I just ordered an Xtra. 153

Awesome...thanks for sharing your number!

#49 5 months ago

Trouble with posting? strange...

#50 5 months ago

I am in on an Xtra, so far just used my credits from the previous deposit. Information back and forth with the company also is good and up to par. I am really looking forward to it and hope sincerely that all this negativity will fade away........in the end these are games and not weapons to use against each other. This should be a fun hobby!

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