(Topic ID: 215891)

Prototyping a "Hardtop" (High Speed)


By Skypilot

1 year ago



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  • 459 posts
  • 80 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 days ago by KSUWildcatFan
  • Topic is favorited by 76 Pinsiders

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There are 459 posts in this topic. You are on page 9 of 10.
#401 54 days ago
Quoted from rufessor:

You got this- always worth remembering the following. There are probably three or more of you doing this at the same timed some with a lot more experience who willl lend advice. Also- lots of intact games around to get reference photos if needed. No worries!!! Enjoy

I think that's the only reason I was willing to start this process. As drowned as I feel right now, I'm confident there will be ample help available once I'm in the "where the hell did THIS go?!" phase.

#402 54 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

I think that's the only reason I was willing to start this process. As drowned as I feel right now, I'm confident there will be ample help available once I'm in the "where the hell did THIS go?!" phase.

High Speed definitely has a lot on the playfield. I am sure it will all work out in the end. And like everyone has said, there is a boatload of help here. I am about to strip my High Speed down for a playfield swap. It will be my first and I gotta tell ya, I am a bit nervous about it. Gonna take tons of video and pics. before/during/after.

#403 54 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

All that's left is to hammer out the bumper threaded pins and then the mylar in that area, then I'm ready to start sanding this damn thing. But I'm pretty sure you're going to catch me soon..I move very slowly!
[quoted image][quoted image]

Leave those bumper screws in man. Lay the hardtop over them.

#404 53 days ago

I can't see myself ever NEEDING to replace them (never know though, I guess--threads get stripped all the time) but I also can't see myself doing all the other crap I've done with this and NOT hammering those out. Shouldn't be too huge a deal, tbh. I just need to do it. I'm hoping I can get started sanding this weekend, so that leaves me a couple evenings to convince myself to remove the pop assemblies so I can hammer the pins out.

Not sure how much additional support those pins lend to holding the hardtop down but I certainly wouldn't want ANY waviness in the pop area for sure. Anything that helps to avoid that is probably worth doing.

#405 53 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

I can't see myself ever NEEDING to replace them (never know though, I guess--threads get stripped all the time) but I also can't see myself doing all the other crap I've done with this and NOT hammering those out. Shouldn't be too huge a deal, tbh. I just need to do it. I'm hoping I can get started sanding this weekend, so that leaves me a couple evenings to convince myself to remove the pop assemblies so I can hammer the pins out.
Not sure how much additional support those pins lend to holding the hardtop down but I certainly wouldn't want ANY waviness in the pop area for sure. Anything that helps to avoid that is probably worth doing.

I just laid a hardtop down last night. The registration for the nails would’ve made it a pain to try and put them back in AFTER the hardtop. If the nail heads are not flush then just tighten the nut underneath and pull the head down into the wood more. No need to hammer. I just screw the new ones in my hand until i get it down to the fin, line it up with the old grooves then let the nut do the rest of the work by pulling it in from underneath. If they need replaced because they are stripped then do that first. I’m telling you man, lay the hardtop over the nail heads

#406 53 days ago
Quoted from mrm_4:

I just laid a hardtop down last night. The registration for the nails would’ve made it a pain to try and put them back in AFTER the hardtop. If the nail heads are not flush then just tighten the nut underneath and pull the head down into the wood more. No need to hammer. If they need replaced because they are stripped then do that first. I’m telling you man, lay the hardtop over the nail heads

Wouldn't it make sense to, at a minimum, enlarge (VERY SLIGHTLY) the holes on the hardtop for those just in case they should ever need replaced? Seems you'd run the risk of destroying the hardtop to get them out later on down the road if you didn't and they were under the hardtop..? Granted this is purely hypothetical and not something I ever anticipate having to address... But I'm a computer programmer by trade, it's been drilled in my head to future-proof anywhere possible, any time I can!

#407 53 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

Wouldn't it make sense to, at a minimum, enlarge (VERY SLIGHTLY) the holes on the hardtop for those just in case they should ever need replaced? Seems you'd run the risk of destroying the hardtop to get them out later on down the road if you didn't and they were under the hardtop..? Granted this is purely hypothetical and not something I ever anticipate having to address... But I'm a computer programmer by trade, it's been drilled in my head to future-proof anywhere possible, any time I can!

IF thats the case you take an exacto to the hardtop above the nail head and cut out whats needed WHEN its needed, i would say leave the repair work for when its time to repair. But I do understand where you are going with it. If the registration is spot on then its a non issue.

#408 53 days ago

Maybe the hardtop guys could take this note as a future improvement. Make the pop nail holes slightly oversized to accommodate future removal if needed. The larger holes should be hidden by the skirt and would help ease owners/installers of the product.

#409 53 days ago
Quoted from mrm_4:

Leave those bumper screws in man. Lay the hardtop over them.

I left mine in. The holes line up pretty well, if hell freezes over and you need to change them out.

#410 53 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

Not sure how much additional support those pins lend to holding the hardtop down but I certainly wouldn't want ANY waviness in the pop area for sure. Anything that helps to avoid that is probably worth doing.

Mine were flush to the playfield, so opted to leave them in. As mentioned above, the holes in the Hardtop align pretty well, so technically you *could* get them out. Not sure that you ever would.

As I’ve seen skypilot warn others: Don’t overthink this

PS: I’m also a dev (OK, more Ops, but still...) so I feel you man. The perfection struggle is real, but know where the risk/reward lies.

#411 53 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

Wouldn't it make sense to, at a minimum, enlarge (VERY SLIGHTLY) the holes on the hardtop for those just in case they should ever need replaced? Seems you'd run the risk of destroying the hardtop to get them out later on down the road if you didn't and they were under the hardtop..? Granted this is purely hypothetical and not something I ever anticipate having to address... But I'm a computer programmer by trade, it's been drilled in my head to future-proof anywhere possible, any time I can!

Recomended procedure is to remove the pop bumper bracket screws, install the Hardtop,counterbore the Hardtop and replace the screws. It is recomended only due to any chance one of the screws break in the future. It does not happen very often but if it does replacement of th screw is easier. If you choose to leave the screws in its not a big deal either.You may have to use an Exacto knife to enlarge the hole for possible future removal of a broken screw.

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#412 53 days ago

I think I'll just leave em alone. I'm antsy to start sanding so I can open up an entirely new can of worms to panic over. Also I want to get this damn thing back together because I have 5 pins and it seems like only two of the four (not including HS because, duh) play worth a crap right now. Getting HS finished should--hopefully--get that count back to three, so I have a bit of variety.

Playing Eight Ball Deluxe, with as rough as it is currently, almost seems more like punishment than enjoyment. Can't wait to hardtop that one.

Appreciate the continued interest in the process and willingness to discuss concerns, ideas, etc. It's nice when people don't just disappear into the weeds once THEIR project is complete.

#413 49 days ago

Finished the reassembly looks great but I have some switch adjustments to finish to make it play right.

Not unexpected to do switch adjustments after so much stuff being removed. Pop bumpers need tweaking and some other switches are hit and miss but it should not take long to finish that...

Pictures of the completed High Speed, I redid everything so it took a while.

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#414 49 days ago

I powder coated all the rails, legs, etc. clear ramp, moved the traffic light, installed the rectifier board, Franks Battery Board on the MPU.

It turned out great but it is funny how a hardtop is easy than a whole new playfield leads itself into fixing everything else in the game. It would be a shame to not make it right when you do as much as a hardtop requires.

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#415 48 days ago

Looks outstanding man!

#416 48 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

Looks outstanding man!

I know you had a lot of questions about re-doing your game and concerns - it is just time. Take it slow. I was traveling a lot and I pushed it this weekend to get it done. I expected tweaks after the re-assembly which is common. I will get it dialed in the next week or so.

The funny thing is once it is set up right I have another pin coming in I probably won't even keep it. I wanted the Getaway and High Speed combo and now have that but I am running out of room so the restore was fun and I am proud of how it turned out.

#417 48 days ago
Quoted from wamonkey:

I know you had a lot of questions about re-doing your game and concerns - it is just time. Take it slow. I was traveling a lot and I pushed it this weekend to get it done. I expected tweaks after the re-assembly which is common. I will get it dialed in the next week or so.
The funny thing is once it is set up right I have another pin coming in I probably won't even keep it. I wanted the Getaway and High Speed combo and now have that but I am running out of room so the restore was fun and I am proud of how it turned out.

Yeah I haven't touched mine since getting the PF stripped down. I wanted to do some work this weekend but it just hasn't materialized. It is what it is.

I've been told I'll bore quickly with high speed, "because it's so simplistic" but I'm not entirely sure that's true. Between the goofy wild SFX (and the beacon) and the fact that I tend to PREFER the simplistic 80s games to newer stuff (I find them overwhelming and thus frustrating to play), I think it'll stick around in my collection for a bit. May not be a permanent fixture but definitely "for a bit".

#418 48 days ago

Love the gold flipper buttons! Looks GREAT!

#419 48 days ago
Quoted from Pin-Pilot:

Love the gold flipper buttons! Looks GREAT!

Clear buttons with yellow flex LED lights - don’t usually use yellow led bulbs because they tend to not be that bright.

#420 48 days ago

What LED's did you go with for your playfield and back cabinet?

#421 48 days ago
Quoted from Pin-Pilot:

What LED's did you go with for your playfield and back cabinet?

Regular Comet 2 SMD white LED's - only inserts got colored (underneath) and the pop bumpers got color LED's. After trying in the past to LED color coordinate I have kind of come full circle and prefer a more subdued color pallet. I did cut off all the resistors so I can put LED flashers in the game because I think that helps make it pop but otherwise super clean and bright white all around.

Sorry backbox - got red, blue, white 2 SMD comet color LED's.

I am not a purest as you can tell - powder coating the machine all black, the cabinet got a decal not a stencil, clear Freeplay40 ramp, added a cop car model on the ramp to just dress it up a little.

I think it is better than new. Still need to tweak it a little the pop bumpers are not as responsive as I like and the plunger is not hitting the ramp right or strong enough.

#422 48 days ago
Quoted from wamonkey:

and the plunger is not hitting the ramp right or strong enough.

If you didn't notice when you assembled the playfield, at the top of the shooter lane....just before the ball starts across the playfield...under the plastic just above the shooter lane exit there is an adjustment you can make in the trajectory the ball will take as it exits.

#423 47 days ago
Quoted from Freeplay40:

If you didn't notice when you assembled the playfield, at the top of the shooter lane....just before the ball starts across the playfield...under the plastic just above the shooter lane exit there is an adjustment you can make in the trajectory the ball will take as it exits.

Yeah I figure it is slotted that I can adjust that - love your ramp Mark - it is the best so much better than the original. Wish someone made a ramp decal of the road or something the car I used was a way to hide the plain white under the ramp.

#424 46 days ago

I'm so close to getting my Highspeed back together. In the process, I have to replace some plastic parts and light domes. My issue is I am confused as to what rivets to buy and what tool to use to rivet the light dome onto the new plastic. Any advice or guidance is appreciated.

#425 46 days ago
Quoted from detroitzoran:

I'm so close to getting my Highspeed back together. In the process, I have to replace some plastic parts and light domes. My issue is I am confused as to what rivets to buy and what tool to use to rivet the light dome onto the new plastic. Any advice or guidance is appreciated.

a Rivet Punch from Hanson Rivet Tools should be all you need. Most pinball rivets are 1/8"

amazon.com link »

#426 46 days ago
Quoted from frisbez:

Rivet Punch from Hanson Rivet Tools should be all you need.

I do a lot of riveting. I have both a rivet press and the hand held frisbez gave you a link to. I did a video of using this tool for one of my ramps. Very durable....I've probably rolled over 1000 with this tool.

Here's a link...

2 weeks later
#427 28 days ago

Not gonna lie, this feels like about the worst thing I've ever done

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#428 28 days ago

Done for now. Urf.

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#429 28 days ago

At least there is progress!

#430 28 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

Done for now. Urf.[quoted image]

Looks great to me, good job! I’m sure it was tough taking that irreversible step.

#431 27 days ago

I can feel one ridge near the arrows approaching the highway so I need to sand a little more there, but after that I can start working on the shooter lane, minor touch up on the ball eject hole, and then polishing the inserts before clearing.

My goal was to have all the sanding done before it got stupid cold again (Monday) although I'm pretty sure my dad's wood shop is in a heated garage, so I should be able to clear it there.

And yeah, sanding it down made me just a wee bit nauseous.

#432 27 days ago

I'm a bit confused on the shooter lane. It doesn't seem to be looking any better as I'm going along and I'm really nervous about doing... Too much.. do I just keep going?

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#433 27 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

I'm a bit confused on the shooter lane. It doesn't seem to be looking any better as I'm going along and I'm really nervous about doing... Too much.. do I just keep going?[quoted image]

I had the exact same problem. I ended up focusing on sanding out the wear from the eject hole and cleaning up the shooter lane itself, then calling it a day. Like you, I was worried I was going to over do it.

#434 27 days ago

Sanded some more, not looking any better. I'm giving up for now and taking a step back. Either my approach is wrong or..I don't know.

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#435 27 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:I'm a bit confused on the shooter lane. It doesn't seem to be looking any better as I'm going along and I'm really nervous about doing... Too much.. do I just keep going?[quoted image]

That's like what... 30 years of contaminate sitting there? You can try a magic eraser and then go over it with Novus one if needed.

#436 27 days ago

Hmm, magic eraser instead of sandpaper.. It's at least less destructive. I'll give that a shot and see if it cleans any of the gunk out. I just figured it'd come out quickly with sandpaper and.. It's not.

#437 27 days ago

Did some more, but I'm starting to get really nervous so I think it's almost to that "as good as I'm going to get it" point. Definitely not a professional job... But I'm also not a professional.

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#438 27 days ago

If you soak it with alcohol or naptha (better) does it look dirty and gray or just like there are different shades of wood tone?

#439 27 days ago

Those pictures were after a little bit of 50/50 alcohol was rubbed in. It's definitely less grungy than it was when I started, just sucks to not be able to get it all the way..I don't trust my hand.

#440 27 days ago

At that point I'd just paint that shooter lane to blend everything in, and clear it.

#441 26 days ago
Quoted from Pablito350:

At that point I'd just paint that shooter lane to blend everything in, and clear it.

Yup, I'm liking that idea more and more!

#442 21 days ago

I'm a bit unclear on how shiny/clear the inserts should be prior to clearcoating the entire thing. Any advice?

#443 21 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

I'm a bit unclear on how shiny/clear the inserts should be prior to clearcoating the entire thing. Any advice?

Per Vid, the inserts need to be sanded with 220 so the clear has “tooth” to help the clear adhere to the insert.

#444 21 days ago

Yeah, that's what I was reading. Just doesn't seem to me that 220 appears to be 'enough'. But I'm in a bit over my head so I know.. Very little.

#445 21 days ago
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:

I'm a bit unclear on how shiny/clear the inserts should be prior to clearcoating the entire thing. Any advice?

Shine a flashlight under them. If your happy with the insert than your done. its that simple. The Hardtop is clear so what you see is what you end up with.

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#446 21 days ago

I didn’t want to risk ghosting, so I hand polished all my inserts. Wet sanded with 1000, then 3000, followed by Novus 3-2-1, and finally Naptha to strip any residual Novus. Go look back in the thread for my Hardtop install thread (on the road from Houston at the moment) and you’ll see the results.

1 week later
#447 14 days ago

Finally got back to this with some new supplies in hand. I gave it a light round of 240 with my 6" DA and then switched to wetsanding with a block and 500 grit. Was feeling pretty good about progress until I looked closer at a few of the inserts. Any advice? Do I need to go back to a course grit to get this out, or is some of this just... What it is?
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#448 14 days ago
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#449 14 days ago

Wipe the inserts down with Naptha and look at them wet. That will show you what it will look like once you clear coat it.

#450 14 days ago

120->240->500 (wet)->1000 (wet)->1200 (wet)->Novus 3-2-1

Wish they all shined up like the hotdogs. We'll see how it all looks dry. I'll save wiping it all down with alcohol for right before I'm ready to clear it.
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