I think if I followed the wire correctly the J2 switch has MA-BLK and YE-BLK wires on it. You jumpered the MA-BLK directly to the coil bypassing T2, Y and Z like the red line below?

Ya can't really do that otherwise every time the score motor runs you'll step the player unit ... which is why you can't do it when resetting.

the most you should jumper is the green line, but even that can make the player unit step incorrectly ... depends how many pulses M1A generates before M4C kicks the ball to the shooter and the Y relay unpowers. If M1A makes four pulses, then jumpering per the green line would work for a 1 player game, but it would only tell you the problem is one of the three paths that isn't the M2C one.

the problem with letting the score motor run is you can't tell which of the three paths ... all you can do is jumper the J2, J3 or J4 NC switch that is supposed to be closed one at a time and see if it makes a difference. If not, then it's probably T2, T3 or T4 and if the problem only happens in single player it should be T2.

I don't know when the switch bypassing the Z switch is closed. You have your problem on any ball in one player mode except the last one and never a problem when playing 2+ players?

fantasy_jump (resized).png

ugh ... ok.

the biggest question is what is the "on balls unit" switch that is in parallel to the Z relay switch doing ... when is it open vs. closed?

except for that switch, it seems unlikely either the Z or Y relay switch is flaky since you'd see issues when playing 2+ players also.

that leaves either that switch or a timing issue where the ball is being sent to the shooter before the player unit has completed stepping. The schem does not have a timing diagram, so you'd want to turn the score motor by hand and look at when an M4C switch with SL-WH and SL-BLK wires closes wrt to when the M1A switch with MA-BLK and SL-WH wires closes.

the M4C switch powers the ball return coil when Y is powered.

the M1A switch that advances the player unit from player 4 -> player 1 needs to close - and ideally open - BEFORE the M4C switch closes or the Y/Z relays may unpower and you lose the pulse.

I'd also try moving your jumper to jump the Y or Z switch one at a time and see if just one is the issue.

another test is stick paper between the Y relay switch blades with the SL-BLK and BK-GRN wires to disable the ball return coil before draining the ball. Then see if the player advance always works correctly.

there's a lot of "ball trough" switches. Got a hi-res pic of what they outhole/trough area looks like?

if the trough switch that powers the Z relay (SL-WH and GR-RD wires) only closes as the ball is being sent to the shooter, then you have another race condition.

Z powers Y, and a switch on Y (YE-RD and MA-SL) keeps Y powered until M2B opens. The player unit advance needs to finish before M2B opens ...

you'd want to verify M2C and M1A can generate four pulses before M2B opens.

abnormally large switch gaps on the trough switch or M1A could cause delays.

can you also post a top down pic of the score motor? Curious if you have the switch dogs that can change the score motor switch timing like gottlieb games do.

the most likely thing is Y or Z is unpowering too soon. i.e. it only works when the ball is closing the trough switches.

if you slow the ball down with your finger as it goes from the outhole to the shooter so it stays on the trough rollover longer, does it work?

do what you did in post 53, but only jumper the Z switch (blue) or the Y switch (red), not jump over both.

which one matters?

I assume the "on balls unit" switch the green arrow is pointing to is closed when the balls unit is reset, open otherwise?
new wold iss1 (resized).jpg

you may need to disable the score motor and turn the cams by hand. The schem is a little lacking on wire colors, but in the schem chunk below, if you can find the M1C switch the arrow is pointing at and stick paper between the contacts, the score motor won't run. Hold closed the outhole switch with your finger and see which of the U, Y and Z relays power.

you can then turn the score motor cams by hand and watch what happens. Once the outhole solenoid fires, let go of the outhole switch and close the other trough switches, but let go immediately. Both the Y and Z relays should power and stay powered until you turn the score motor cams enough to open the M2B switch.

how many switches are on the outhole stack? If it's just one and that powers only the U relay to count off the bonus, then I don't see from the schem how the ball kicks over to the shooter.

fantasy iss2 (resized).jpg

btw, post 26 on this topic - https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/playmatic-new-world-help-needed-#post-6602806 - is extremely long and mostly incomprehensible, but it describes how the circuit works in New World.

Fantasy looks almost the same, except according to the schem, you have an extra trough switch that is powering the Y relay to get the ball to kick over to the shooter while his game uses a U relay switch + position '0' bonus unit switch.

since your score motors are different types:
- his score motor 6C switch is your score motor M2B,
- his impulse A switch is your M1A
- his 2B is your M2C

the turntable style score motors mostly used on gottlieb games had switch dogs that could be in two positions to change timing.

sometimes the dog falls out when switch stack is removed and it needs to be back in the right slot.

gtb schems told you where the dog goes - (s)hort vs (l)ong position ... the playmatic schem doesn't seem to. If there's no paper stapled in the game, see if the other slot makes the stack timing what you need.

below is a pic from another post showing switch dogs and the slots in the switch dog brackets.

switch dog (resized).jpg

I'd guess if a switch is operating too soon you want the dog in the L position - the slot furthest from the two stack mounting holes.