This.

The MMr is far enough along to affect MM prices, certainly. How much? Hard to say until they change hands.

All the hand-wringing about how much MMr affects prices AFTER it's released is idle speculation in need of a LOT more info. MMr *could* be enough better than MM to really hurt it. Or it could be mediocre enough to not affect it much at all. Hard to say on this one.

As for "call HEP", that's not a good answer, either. I feel VERY confident that while an MMr might be VERY nice, I still very much doubt the playfield clearcoat will be quite as good as hand done work by Chris. I also very much doubt a pin right off any assembly line will play as good, nor for as long, as a pin done by Chris. They simply don't and won't have THAT much attention to detail on an assembly line. And I wouldn't expect them to.

That said, at last check Chris says MM's are running $5-6k for him to restore for an average condition machine. But I just don't see beater MM's EVER dropping to sub-$3k to compensate for what it would take for Chris to restore one. Sub-$5k? Maybe, but MMr will definitely have to be amazing. Oh, and far more available than just the ones that get preordered...continued production will be required for a while.

But then the question starts to become "how big is this hobby?" As in "how many $8k+ machines can this hobby support being sold at one time?" Or better yet, *all* the time? I still feel like it could devalue nearly *all* high end machines...

--Donnie

The wiring harness won't be the same and won't even be close, so that's a non-starter there. Sounds like there's a chance Rick will offer his new board system and some kind of adapter to put it in old machines, but not the opposite.

--Donnie

You obviously don't know much about the route business. Or business in general.

If he's the guy that routed it and he didn't make MANY TIMES what he paid for it (if he bought it new or many years ago, even), he was doing it WAY wrong. And given that, why would he sell it for cheap just because it paid for itself? If anything, that's a great sign that it's worth more, not LESS.

Telling this guy to offer his boss under $6k for this machine is a recipe for disaster, IMHO. All the guy has to do is pull up some completed eBay auctions and he'll feel like he's being screwed (whether he knows about MMr or not!). Or look at the current TC auction. Because I don't care how far his machine is removed from being that nice, NOBODY will think it costs $6k+ to get it IN that condition (even though it might cost that much for all we know, nobody will think that about their machine).

Best advice? Make him throw out the number. If it's STUPID low (like under $5k), you have to figure out if you want to take the chance of losing your job for not educating him. If it's what you're willing to pay, negotiate a little and pay it. If it's way high, educate him on the remakes and what you think it's worth and if he doesn't want to sell for that, no sweat. *shrug*

--Donnie

Sorry, I'll actually apologize for the second sentence. Seriously. It wasn't necessary. My bad.

As for your last sentence, well, let's just say it's as big of a gaffe on your part as my assertion of your general business skills.

--Donnie