(Topic ID: 225496)

Stern Electronics Club (1977-1984).

By Mitch

3 years ago

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10 key posts have been marked in this topic

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Post #227 Various gate tips. Posted by cottonm4 (3 years ago)

Post #269 Hi quality thoughts from Cotton about inlanes. Posted by cottonm4 (3 years ago)

Post #279 Playfield touch up tips. Posted by klr650 (3 years ago)

Post #309 Stern inserts suggestions. Posted by cottonm4 (3 years ago)

Post #310 Seawitch gate flap solution. Posted by frunch (3 years ago)

Post #1033 Bally drop targets on the classic stern, even mix and match. Posted by cottonm4 (2 years ago)

Post #1958 Star Gazer podcast episode link. Posted by DRDAVE (2 years ago)

Post #2587 Link to 3D printed parts available from HHaase. Posted by HHaase (2 years ago)

Post #2590 Link to 3D printed parts by Swinks, available at Shapeways. Posted by swinks (2 years ago)

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#1642 2 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Firepower absolutely needs the newer Williams flipper mechs. Makes the game WAY better.

True! I did an experiment with Williams Flash...
I was able to boost the power to the old flipper mechanisms by doing the "Game Plan thing".
I have yet to try it on a Firepower... I did however add extra red voltage wiring to the playfield
to a Firepower many years ago.

#1645 2 years ago
Quoted from HHaase:

Yeah, WPC mechs on the late 6 games, and into 7, don't give you much change other than a replaceable coil stop and smoother return spring. Otherwise they're mechanically the same.

But Black Knight rebuilt with 1988's style flipper mechs are much better and more powerful than the 1st
generation style flippers...
All of Williams games in the early 1980's had 2" leg levelers not 3" as people have put on their games as today.

#1668 2 years ago
Quoted from Gott_Lieb:

Had Freefall briefly (repaired and top shopped it), and did not care for it. My two complaints were: 1) Not a direct shot to the skyway ball walker. This was tolerable, but 2 wasn't. 2) If a ball would jump off the ball walker, the game would completely lose its mind! It had no way to compensate for this happening, and would remain screwed up the rest of the game for a single or multiple players.
The guy who bought it, is into classic Sterns also, and loves it. So, take this for what it's worth. You may be able to get a better adjustment out of the ball walker to keep this from happening.
I just looked at the pic of the game on the IPDB. IIRC, the main problem with the ball walker was that there was only one switch at the entrance (top). A second and / or third switch on the walker would probably help out, or maybe you can get Mr. Charles to rework the code.

I fixed the problem with a bent clear piece of plastic that covered the top walker switch...
It would stop the ball hop and break the speed of the ball at the same time.

#1671 2 years ago
Quoted from Mitch:

I cant visualize this.

Picture a straightened-up "Z". Two truss head wood screws to hold the flat base...
Then straight up and bent over at a right angle. It's about 2" wide.

#1681 2 years ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

not too many Dragonfists are showing up

I believe that The Pinball Museum as a Stern Dragonfist on display.

1 week later
#1710 2 years ago

Should have done a mist coat first....

#1712 2 years ago
Quoted from Whridlsoncestood:

Did. Glass was ruined anyways. The bleeding on the back didn’t affect the horrendous front that much
Just thought it was interesting. All the glasses I’ve sealed I’d never seen that before.

Wow... It just did not like the OEM inks... what a severe reaction...

#1745 2 years ago
Quoted from BrianBannon:

Nice pickup. I played Cue many years ago. It really does have a lot in common with late 1940s early flipper games. I didn't find it to be much fun to play as there aren't any shots to hit. When the ball lands on the flipper you just send it back up to the top again, thats it. Only one pop bumper to create any action and that is all the way at the bottom of the playfield. I don't think it would be a good location game because the novelty wears off quick. Multi player dollar games might be the only way to go.

Yup. I played one when the game first showed up at a pinball show.
That was about 1991ish. At that time, it was believe to be one of three made.

#1755 2 years ago
Quoted from Mitch:

Any idea what goes in these holes in ali?
Is it supposed to be a metal guide?[quoted image]

W2-6A-101-H QTY (3)
You need to take one of the wire forms by the inside return lane and copy it...

1 month later
#1995 2 years ago
Quoted from Bearballs:

Anyone know how many Meteors were made with countersunk coin doors vs not or which one is more common? I have five Meteors now, three countersunk and two not. I also noticed the corners of the cabs are cut different based on coin door.[quoted image][quoted image]

Check serial numbers... I believe that the counter sink games should be the earlier design.
( leftover cabinets from the E.M. games ) Chicago Coin Dynamics.

#2002 2 years ago

Wow, that Nine Ball is very clean! Congratulations!

1 week later
#2079 2 years ago
Quoted from brandsilence:

Can anyone with a Dracula post pics of what the eject hole and posts are supposed to look like? This area on mine wasn’t populated when I bought it, but I do have the plastic for it

Three tall round white posts. The ball is supposed to be able to go between them.
Check the game flyer.

#2095 2 years ago

I think it is a Williams part.

#2125 2 years ago
Quoted from SpinnerAddict:

Anyone own a dracula? I could use a pic one the fuse under the playfield. I have 2 blue wires. One has broken off and the other is soldered to the left side of fuse. Cant seem to see where the second blue wire went. I do know i have no flippers or pop bumbers firing now.

Tie the two blue wires together.

#2126 2 years ago
Quoted from vec-tor:

Tie the two blue wires together.

Check ipdb Stern's Dracula.

2 weeks later
#2230 2 years ago
Quoted from Rondogg:

My first classic stern, Ali, is in the house. Anyone have a part # for this flipper button switch? I want to order from pblife or marco. Thanks![quoted image]

If you cant to keep the game OEM...
Just order the tungsten contacts from pinball resource.

#2245 2 years ago

I always hard jumper that Brn-Wht connector in order to make sure the board gets the +5 volts.

1 week later
#2281 2 years ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

So that's it? It sort of fell into your lap?

O.T. but similar... I did a basic repair on a pinball game.
Williams Jackbot. The lady said that she was just talking to
a local neighbor and her husband had just past away ( the original owner of the game )
and the widow did not need the game so she gave it to her, free.

1 week later
#2313 2 years ago
Quoted from Tyamry:

Anyone have a spare that they would sell me or know where I can get one? Please PM me if you can help.[quoted image][quoted image]


3 weeks later
#2371 2 years ago
Quoted from BorgDog:

Is there any way to adjust the kickout direction from the hole in Dracula? Mine is shooting the ball into the pop bumper cap adjacent to it and then into the glass. I tried bending the tip a bit, and bending the wire post sticking up, neither seemed to have much of a effect, when the ball comes to rest in the hole it is all the way to the right side and gets kicked that way no matter what. I can see where it used to hit the playfield by the wear marks, but it not longer shoots there. ideas?[quoted image]

I thought the coil stop is adjustable. I did a service call on one, and the coil stop had a
brass screw with a brass nut to adjust the throw of the plunger.

4 months later
#2838 1 year ago
Quoted from Madmax541:

Working on first classic stern restore, Seawitch.
Rebuilding pop bumpers can’t remember where brass washer go? Is it correct in picture?[quoted image]

Quoted from Whridlsoncestood:

They go below the nylon spacer you pointed out that he’s missing. They raise the whole body ever so slightly so the skirt is a little higher than the playfield for better sensitivity.

I was hoping someday, that a pinsider that had shop skills would make a "Base wafer" for
the classic Stern/Game Plan pop/thumper bumper assemblies, so as to make them more
like Bally's module thumper bumpers that are used on games like EBD and other late
1980's Bally pinballs.
The end result would hopefully be to have a pop bumper body that is firm...
that does not wobble... etc,etc,etc.

#2840 1 year ago
Quoted from HHaase:

Well speak up man! Are we basically talking a plastic spacer like thing?

Yea... I tried to do one in wood... it did not go very well... ( hacked up mess )
I did not have the skills nor a cnc machine. ( back in the 1980's )
The spacer would be like the base unit on Bally's EBD style thumper bumper.

#2853 1 year ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

Are you talking about that plastic wafer that attaches to the under side of the play field?
Like this? Sort of like a shortened version of Stern and Data East pop bumper bodies?
[quoted image]

Yea. I always hated the skirt going below the playfield when the ball pushed on the skirt
and the body would move from the jostling of the action.

#2862 1 year ago
Quoted from HHaase:

If you could whip up a quick cocktail napkin sketch for me I can start working on a 3D model and make up some test samples.

Basically it is a copy of any Bally/old Stern/CCDI wood playfield pop bumper holes
---- ( on top side ).
The trick is the bottom side, that has to fit the metal base plate and have the counter holes
---- for the bushings and screws that protrude through the metal base plate.
Finale adjustment would be the round outside Dia. of the spacer/filler and the thickness
---- of the spacer base piece... ( deferent playfield thicknesses ).
It would be interesting if someone has the time to produce the pop bumper mod and
test it on a Stern/Game Plan pinball.

#2870 1 year ago
Quoted from dothedoo:

No, it works like F2K’s ball walker, but for whatever reason it energized after the game was over and stayed that way.
I’m going to dial in the up kicker switch a little better, but I can’t trust it to make it through the weekend at TPF.

I kind of had the same problem... The gate coil would fry at any time...
Finally the walker coil fried....
The culprit is a flaky CA3081.

2 weeks later
#2920 1 year ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

Several months ago I made a post of how you could swap Bally drop targets into a Stern drop target assembly. I did that today and here are the pics.
Dragonfist is supposed to have red drop targets. You cannot buy red drop targets to fit a Stern. But you can buy red drop targets to fit a Bally. The pics that follow show this swap in action.
Here is Stern drop assembly.
[quoted image]
Here are 3 red Bally drops and one white Stern drop. The first thing you will notice is that the Bally drops are rather square up top. They do not have the small side curve as the Stern's do. This is cosmetics. I could make the sides curve like the Stern but I would have to destroy another drop target to make one drop look like a Stern. These are only $3 each. It would cost $27.00 to do this.
[quoted image]
Here is close up of the two styles of drops.
1) Bally has a half-moon land just below the target's lower edge. Also, if you look down you will see the boss where the spring attaches is little different.
2) Stern made its lands a little different than Bally. You can see the long skinny piece of plastic extend about 5/8" below the lower edge of the target. And the boss where the spring attaches has less meat around the hole for the spring,.
Keep these two different styles of target lands in mind. Operationally, both styles of lands operate the same. But Sten's style does it better. I'll get to that in a minute.
[quoted image]
The teardown.
This is where I remove a white drop target and swap with a red one.
[quoted image]
The Stern target has a piece of angle bracket that holds the targets in proper position.
[quoted image]
From the top and looking down, you can see the land of the targets landed on the angle bracket. This is Stern's way of doing it.
[quoted image]
For Bally, with the half-moon land at the bottom of the target, the bracket that holds the target place needs to be reversed.
[quoted image]
This is all you need to do to use Bally drops in a Stern assembly. The reverse also holds true. You can install Stern drops in a Bally assembly. And you reverse the bracket where the lands sit.
Here is the drop installed with red drops. As mentioned, the profile on the Bally Style drops are different than Stern; That could be fixed with a little bit of work. And while they are red, I don't know how close this red is to the original red.
[quoted image]
This is where the rubber meets the road. How do they work? The answer is: Not worth a shit. NWAS for another new acronym plagued world.
They can be knocked down---with difficulty.
So, as I fairly much thought, I will have to modify the lands. There is just too much plastic contact for the drops to release quickly. For the next time through, I will trim back the half-moon land and make a smaller land area. Perhaps with less material on the land the drops will release a little easier. If that does not work satisfactorily, then I will trash an extra drop target for material to extend the Bally land down lower like the Stern drops are.
So, they work but need improvement. Making the improvement will not be hard to accomplish. I'll be back when I make that mod.
My question is why do the Bally targets so hard to drop? I have noticed any Bally I have played to have lousy working drop targets.

Back in the day, I had to fix one of these games. I used red spray paint to make the white targets red.

#2955 1 year ago
Quoted from Madmax541:

Working a Stern PF swap.
Question installing carriage bolts
How do you install them?
Hammering in gently?
Other thoughts?

Use awl to slightly inlarge hole... put tape on playfield to help prevent chip.
tap in gently.

#2973 1 year ago

For the #6-32 carriage bolt that strips the wood... I add a small #6 hex head
sheet metal screw, screwed up against the carriage bolt head... along with
some glue.
T-nuts and new hardware, hands down give a cleaner look to any vintage Stern game.
I really like Williams' #8/32 x 5/16 hex head fastener
for posts that came out in the early 1990's.
Especially, for the posts that get hit by the main flippers.
eg. bottom sling shot posts next to the flippers.

#3009 1 year ago
Quoted from dothedoo:

V1 brackets often break at the narrow point.

Back in the day, I would add extra #8 screws to the sides of the brackets to keep
them from breaking.

1 week later
#3049 1 year ago
Quoted from WeatherbyMAG:

Has anyone used anything more powerful than a J26-1200 for their pop bumpers? Finally finishing a Seawitch that I have been restoring for a year or so, & am unhappy with the power of the pops. Everything is rebuilt, polished the plunger, new coil stop, new coil sleeve, cleaned switches, polished rods, the usual deal etc. These coils just will not hit hard... voltages etc check out normal. I'm down to either removing some windings from these coils or trying a hotter coil. All 3 are hitting at about same level, but they are just not impressive at all, I've had many sterns with harder hitting pops. All 3 have original Stern J26-1200's. Driving me nuts, as I've got everything else playing great, all 4 flippers are hitting strong, both slings are wicked, targets dropping good etc. This was a complete PF swap & have worked through a bunch of small weird issues & this is last remaining hurdle. I'm ordering a cap kit for the sound board tomorrow & am thinking about adding some coils to my order.

You could try a 25-1000 coil E.M. Bally?

#3056 1 year ago
Quoted from Methos:When does everybody replace their old flippers?
Quoted from Mitch:

When they play poorly

Reads like a why the chicken crossed the road joke.

#3066 1 year ago
Quoted from RoyGBev:

My Hot Hand SN 8381 has the slotted receiver too.

I have a Hot Hand bar receiver and it is also slotted.

#3076 1 year ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

I might have a chance at a Stars pinball machine. I have not seen it yet, but I'm told it is in nice condition with a nice back glass.
What is a Stars worth? Or what was one worth before this virus came along?

Fun game.

#3118 1 year ago


Bingo! Bingo!

I see Bally Eight Ball Spinners and D/T mini post...
Looks like somebody tried to save the D/T assembly from
direct hits from the bottom drop targets...
The bottom drop target probably got broken a lot.

#3163 1 year ago

I contacted cosmokramer too, about older cabinets.
He was more interested in the new designs. I believe
because they are less of a headache.

2 weeks later
#3272 1 year ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

My big game has these carriage bolts that are used as posts for certain areas (slings, GA targets, etc). Can we buy these anywhere? And any suggestions for getting the old ones out? The nuts holding the Star posts in are corroded to the threaded carriage bolt post and it just spins with the nut.

The Stern #6-32 carriage bolts are almost custom made. No body caries that size.
1) I would add a #6 washer head screw and some glue to the head of the carriage bolt
---that is mounted to the bottom of the playfield.
2) Add some drops of lubricant to the top nut...
3) You might have to add a little heat to the nut.
4) Carefully work the nut loose... Watch out... you do not want to strip the threads.
5) Once the nut is removed... use a 6-32 die to clean the threads to the carriage bolt.

#3310 1 year ago
Quoted from Chalkey:

Would a spot welder get a nut welded on a threaded rod solid enough or is it too thick? If one had a spot welder they'd be quick to produce.

Um, that reminds me of the guy that decided to use a torch to remove the playfield Mylar.
Not a good idea.

#3315 1 year ago
Quoted from akm:

All right, don't want to jump the gun and say my drops issue has gone away, but I went in and replaced the springs with tighter/stronger ones, and the targets seem to be locking into place much more solidly than before. No more jiggle when they reset like they used to, just a nice solid *thunk* when they go up. Just played several normal games and they are absolutely rejecting less too. Will let you guys know if they start to fall on the reset again.

Thanks for the tip! I did check this and it seems like the reset bar is touching each of the drops evenly.
By the way, that's a beautiful playfield you have there. Jealous!

#3321 1 year ago

pasted_image (resized).png

#3322 1 year ago
Quoted from Boise_D:

Looking for some info I couldn’t find in the schematics for Stingray. Anyone know what is upstream from the transistor that controls the outhole coil? The tech chart says the transistor is Q4, and I’d like to find out if there is a pre driver, and which chip and pin to test.

pasted_image (resized).png

3 weeks later
#3385 1 year ago
Quoted from embryonjohn:

all those non-pinball faker leg bolts.

IMG_0002[1] (resized).jpg
Note: All 9/16 socket head.

1 week later
#3426 1 year ago
Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

Posted this in the Seawitch club but cross posting because I find this very interesting.
Anyone know what’s up with these very different plastic posts?
[quoted image][quoted image]

Note: back in the day... Two manufactures
Made ribbed posts for the pinball companies.
1) Parts for Bally
2) parts for Williams
1a) Bally ribbed posts---- cone shaped hole in bottom of posts
2a) Williams ribbed post --- straight #6 hole through posts.
1b) Bally posts part #C-952-7 "long" #C-951-7 short.
2b)Williams post part #03-7491-9, #03-7491-10,#03-7491-11 [all 1-1/16" tall]

#3431 1 year ago
Quoted from EEE:

Have many of you experienced an apparent corrupted software glitch on any classic stern? On our recently acquired Nine Ball, I know that I have a display issue which I think is a problem with the display wiring or related connectors.
I can leave player 1 connected and it seems fine.
But what has me confused is that scoring seems to increase but then there seems to be a glitch and it drops 10,000 or 100,000.
All other functions appear normal. Also, the board is original and all 4 EPROMs appear to have been replaced at some point.
Attached is a picture of a final score, glass off. The high score to date flashes afterwards and it shows correctly with all 7 digits displayed.
[quoted image][quoted image]

Nine Ball is plagued with problems... Check out new software over at the Nine Ball club.
As far s displays, check cold solder joints, connectors, PIA, display transistors, etc,etc,etc.

#3434 1 year ago
Quoted from hisokajp:

So... i replaced the power switch on one of my Stern but the replacement one from Marcos and DigiKeyare longer than the factory one, meaning they stick out from the bottom of the cabinet and would be damaged if it was laying flat on the ground...
Any other options out there that are around the same size as the original one?
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

It is on the way you mounted the neck of the switch.
Use the nuts to screw down the neck so as to move the assembly
further up into the cabinet.
If that does not work, then grind the tip of the switch stem off and round off.

1 month later
#3642 1 year ago

For what it is worth...
Game Plan and Stern are almost exactly the same.
IMG_0001[1] (resized).jpg
A close look at the fulcrum pivot brackets.
IMG_0003[1] (resized).jpg
IMG_0002[1] (resized).jpg
Yes, the three primary holes line up....

#3648 1 year ago
Quoted from Flynnyfalcon:

Are there any flipper experts in here? I've rebuilt my Quicksilver flippers but they lack power. I've rebuilt plenty of flippers previously, so I wasn't sure if it was simply me comparing to my more modern pins, or I'd forgotten about their lower comparable power. I've been through Vid's guide and anything else on Pinside labelled "low power flippers classic stern/bally" etc but it's made no discernible improvement.
Along with the rebuild kit, I replaced the coils, sleeves, bushings and flipper bats. Switches gapped to 3.2mm give or take a mm or 2. Silicon spray on the flipper bats and plunger. All linkages appear to move freely. I added molex plugs for convenience.
Vid of gameplay below. I compared with Bowens tutorial and in his, there is definitely more power on his. [quoted image][quoted image]

I like to re-clinch the contact points, just to make sure that the points have continuity.

#3673 1 year ago
Quoted from Gott_Lieb:

The changeover was made when they went to -200 games starting with Meteor. I seem to remember someone posting on RGP years ago that the -6 transformer was created, so Stern could use 4 flippers with their games, and not have any current lag on the solenoid bus. Some of the -100 games have 3 flippers, but none have 4 flippers.
I'm pretty certain that I have a -3 in my current Flight 2000, and I do not notice any difference from my last F2K, which had the correct -6 in it.

Also in that vain, Stern playfields shifted to long-shots and wider playfields.
Then add the double playfields on top, plus flipper redesign and new flipper winding's.

#3687 1 year ago
Quoted from bluespin:

Here are pictures of my mpu200 lockdown bars.
[quoted image][quoted image]

The catalog pictures are for narrow lockdown bars and Stern's Big Game has a wide body
lockdown bar.

#3706 1 year ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

Caution: Those screws (buttons ) are not standard off the shelf screws. If they are missing then you will need to visit a machine shop to get them made.

Ball head screws.

#3716 1 year ago
Quoted from woody76:

Second ups package with destroyed product this week
[quoted image]

2 weeks later
#3750 1 year ago
Quoted from RoyGBev:

My Hot Hand's slingshot fiber link is broken. I thought a Bally plunger/link (left part in the pic) would work but it's too short and the hole in the fiber link is too small (looks like 3/16" diameter on Bally, 1/4" on Stern). Who if anyone has this part? Prefer the plunger and link as one unit but in a pinch I'll replace the roll pin and link.
[quoted image]

Did you try a Gottlieb link? Pinball Resource has them

#3756 1 year ago
Quoted from woody76:

what is everyone doing for new legs? Using Bally?
I have a spare set I can get powder coated, but just wondering what you guys are doing.

Williams 27" legs from the 1980's are a close match to vintage Stern legs.

#3765 1 year ago
Quoted from CaffeineSlug:

Quoting this from sr230cc a few pages back because I'm helping a friend set up his Galaxy, and the lane guides aren't even close to a smooth transition to the flipper, and I want to get this playing right. Is it common to make modifications for a smooth transition, like slotting the lane guide holes or something?
[quoted image]

Are the flipper assemblies OEM or new replacements?

2 weeks later
#3846 1 year ago
Quoted from RoyGBev:

All five of the stationary targets on my Hot Hand have switch stacks that look like this. Is this correct? I would think the switch blades should be arranged so that the big round contacts come together.
[quoted image]

What people forget is that points on contacts are a assembly line process.
The bottom solder lugs are to be opposite of each other... a left side and a right side...
The best and fastest way to assemble is to have one die for the contact points.
The leaf switch fits the die, one way, and clinch. Now on to the next 100,000 leaf switch contact.
You can also note that the points have no rounded head; which makes the contacts face only one way.
This is also a leftover process from the EM relays.
Bally would change contact points design implementations in the late 70's.

#3849 1 year ago
Quoted from slochar:

That web link looks promising, depending on pricing.


#3851 1 year ago
Quoted from play_pinball:

Speaking of switch contacts, anyone have a tip on replacing them on a spinner switch?

Pinball Resource is the only parts store I know of that has small gold plate contacts.
When I rebuild Gottlieb pop switches I can clinch the points using the tip end of a .156 contact clinching tool.

#3855 1 year ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

1A) You need a Dremel Tool with a sanding disc attachment.
1B) You may be able to use one of Dremel Tool's grinding stones to grind the backside of the contact away.
2) Drill a small shallow hole into a piece of wood that is just a little bigger diameter then the head of the contact and just a little deeper than the head of the contact.
3) Place the head of the contact face down in the shallow hole you drilled
3) Using the Dremel Tool sand off the back side of the contact. DO NOT sand into the blade.
4) Set the contact face down into the small hole you drilled.
5) Using an ice pick, or a small drill bit, or a center punch, lightly tap the ground off center of the contact and it should fall from the blade.
And it is out.

I have used tape to hold the blade still and used a jewelers file to file down the back side of the contact...
Remove the contact just as cottonm4 listed.

#3859 1 year ago
Quoted from Pingball:

Looking for some feedback.
When I got my Dragonfist it had 2 little pins in the circled holes that the flipper bats rested on. Same pins as under some of the plastics only shorter.
Is it an old Stern thing to have pins stay in these holes or was that just a hack?
[quoted image]

Stern playfields has the pins as flipper adjustments. When flippers are in position, you can push
the pins back down into the playfield. It was a neat way to adjust flipper alignment.
Bally/Williams used playfield dimples.
As far as playfield plastics are concerned, if under the plastics
and are about an inch above the playfield then it is used twofold.
[ penny nails ]
1) To hold up odd shaped plastic pieces.
2) To hold rubber rings in odd shapes... avoid lamp sockets, switch functions.
[ steel pins]
1a) As ball deflectors. eg.bottom arch corners.
2a) As ball baffle to key shots. eg kickout hole in a long shot.
3a) As ball deflectors to drain lanes. eg. outlanes Bally Silverball Mania.
4a) As kicker protector/anti ball stuck/ anti top plastic intrusion to slingshot kicker function.
Et cetera.

#3861 1 year ago
Quoted from Coyote:

No, they had roll-pins sunk into the wood, in which you would insert a small dowel or toothpick to align the flippers.

Yes the later models had the roll-pins... the early EM games did not...
Bally playfields would not have the roll-pins tell Williams bought them out.

3 weeks later
#3995 1 year ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

What is the most likely culprit?

What I have found, is that magnetism is the culprit.
Once the back coil stop has impurities cross the brass bushing, the hole bracket
becomes one big magnet. Eddy current happens.
1) clean coil stop.
1a) tap coil stop with a hammer to breakup impurities.
1b) test coil stop
1c) if flipper assembly still hangs... replace coil stop assembly
1d) if skilled, can fabricate a new stop to replace old stop.

#4001 1 year ago
Quoted from Flynnyfalcon:

Is anyone able to confirm what type of flipper bats these are? Looking at all options as to why my flipper power is down. Bushings I’m 99% sure are correct (W2’s I think), flipper bats not so. I do remember when I installed the (new) flipper bats they were scratching at the bushings a little.
[quoted image][quoted image]

The flipper bats you have are the same "design" that was prevalent at the time
the game was made. Same "design" that was used on Bally games.

1 week later
#4036 1 year ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

As soon as I pressed the credit button the flipper went into "locked up" position. I mean it was locked hard; I could not manually break the lock.

This is a condition as motioned above by Whridlsoncestood.
If the cabinet flipper switches are open and the flippers stay energized, then you have some kind of short to ground.

#4050 1 year ago
Quoted from bluespin:

I need a 5-bank drop target for a Cheetah build, and someone said Cheetah used a 5-bank memory style. Is a memory drop bank one that requires you to hit the drops in sequential order, like Nine Ball? IPDB lists seven classic Sterns with 5-bank drop targets.
Which of these is a memory drop target bank, like Cheetah?
Hot Hand
Split Second

I want to say non of the above.
Fight 200, Nine Ball may be Trident.
Trident has memory coils!!!!

#4063 1 year ago

Maybe someone with cnc skills can laser cut Stern drop target parts?

#4081 1 year ago
Quoted from Flynnyfalcon:

Thank you LOTR. It’s starting to look that way as I’m running out of ideas. Everything has been reflowed, new decoder chip installed, voltage at TP1 & TP2 both good. Checked C2, R53-58. I haven’t checked any transistors but would assume the problem would be elsewhere.
[quoted image]

If it glows then I think the gas is good.
I would check a crack trace... at the solder pads.

#4084 1 year ago

alltek boards have a free play dip switch setting?
Read the paperwork.

#4134 1 year ago
Quoted from emsrph:

Problem is it only has two tabs for the wires instead of three. Do I just wire the diode in line with the appropriate orientation?

I would add a solder lug to the switch stack.

#4140 1 year ago
Quoted from emsrph:

This was a great idea. Might be misunderstanding your suggestion. Tried adding to the front or back of the stack but there is continuity with one of the other lugs.

You have to take the switch apart to find a "no mans land " spot...

Usually a spot on the back of the switch stack is open territory.

#4167 1 year ago
Quoted from emsrph:

What diode is used on the switches?
The schematic for the switch matrix and solenoid circuits say “All diodes are 1N4004”. But switch diodes are tiny and not 1N4004?
[quoted image]

Older games had 1N4004 diodes; 1977 area.
Bally changed to 1N4148.
Stern kept the 1N4004.
Silicone diodes have "x" voltage drop... depends on design.

1 week later
#4186 1 year ago
Quoted from play_pinball:

I should've been clearer that I knew people ordered GTB parts as replacements but I wasn't sure which GTB part numbers were the best substitutes. Thanks for the tips, guys. And for the expectation about having to cut/bend the actuator to shape.

If for any reason, I like to dub the new leaf switches into the old switch stacks...
I would measure the over all length of the spinner switch... and give that information
to PBR.

#4191 1 year ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

That's what I was afraid of hearing.
Thank you.

I have had resistors go out of specs & drive transistors degrade over the years.

2 weeks later
#4261 1 year ago
Quoted from DrJoe:

Does anyone know a good paint match for Freefall's pinkish cabinet paint?

The color is in the rubine red category.

3 weeks later
#4372 1 year ago
Quoted from Poida:

I completed a ground up restore on a Meteor earlier this year and an issue with the feature lamps have just resurfaced. Initially this was fixed when I replaced a shorted bulb. Did spend a lot of time on this so could be a deeper issue. In attract mode all lamps that should light up do, but some are solid, other flash in and out of sequence.

When in the lamp test, some are solid some flash and some that light in attract mode don't work.

So machine has worked for 10 months with no issues, has Weebly MPU, original serviced Lamp driver board, new rectifier board, repinned connectors, new lamp PCB boards, all incandescent bulbs except 2. I have removed all bulbs, half of the machine a time but the issue remains. Do this sound familar to anyone?

Check wire continuity... cpu to lamp board a strobe line is off.

#4378 1 year ago
Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

Looking for a classic stern outhole ball kicker assembly. I should have realized I needed one of these along time ago. Any help in finding an assembly, or another alternative would be appreciated.
Bally style assembly won’t work, but would a Gottlieb? They look somewhat similar, but IDK.

What game exactly? Fight 2000 uses a Gottlieb style.
What you have pictured is a Kickout hole/Eject hole.
Other Stern's have something that matches Williams.
Is this a classic EM Stern? CDI, EM game?

#4404 1 year ago

How times have changed....
NOW, every body wants there pinball components designed for easy maintenance.

#4446 1 year ago
Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

If a Dragonfist playfield was available, I would definitely purchase & do a scratch build. If you contact the guy who did the restore thread, he probably has a scanned version of his airburshed playfield that he might be willing to share?
I love the thought of creating more of these ultrarare titles for people to see & enjoy. Dragonfist is a great title for a build because it's cool, unique & doesn't contain any super difficult-to-source mechs for a build.

Would be great if people have the resource to refabricate the 3,4,+ style drop target banks etc,
for these games.

#4458 1 year ago

A metal water jet cutter and some bending brakes and you've got it made...

#4466 1 year ago
Quoted from pinheadpierre:

Anyone know what kind of arm the head lock on a Seawitch uses? Nothing I have on hand fits right (not that I really need it since this is not on location, but it would be nice from a completeness standpoint).

Is this for the backglass lock?
Or the backbox head bolts?

#4493 1 year ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

Here is the Big Game art file that needs lots of work. Had another test print done today & the printer said it needs work! I will pick it up Monday & have a look. We do have a local donor playfield. https://drive.google.com/open?id=1vGFbm0cXq9HDgREJPaD5M-snQeMnAAE9
Pictures of latest production Seawitch & another 32 in for cnc.[quoted image][quoted image]

Need two pix to complete the big game...
1) a good pix of the right tiger leaf and claws.
2) top arch center top leaves.

1 week later
#4537 1 year ago
Quoted from HHaase:

Going nuts trying to find the original part number on the spacers.

Switch spacer 021093-01
Is it the same part? I do not know.
For 3/4 long screw.

1 week later
#4557 11 months ago
Quoted from hisokajp:

i have PBR and he said he didn't have any target in stock that worked with those replacement faces unfortunately

Stern used a rollover switch ( 10 point stand up ) switch with the Wico target on a stem assembly.
Wico had a target molded in plastic all-in-one assembly. Wico made video game joysticks...
The switches were almost the same... I would assume the pinball life would have something

#4597 11 months ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

I'll need to mic one for the diameter and correct length. But this is a start.

Bally calls the part a [ Shoulder Stud S-458-27 ]

#4613 11 months ago
Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

Speaking of drop target switches, does anyone know where to source new versions of this switch? I can’t find a part number either. I was hoping to replace these while rebuilding the 3 & 4 drop target banks in my QS. These aren’t hard to access for adjustment so I don’t mind keeping them on the back.
I know I could move the switches to the bottom, but I’m not exactly sure how to do that. I’m guessing it would be a similar setup to a Bally bank with a different switch. [quoted image]

Looks like the bottom plate is not aster correctly.

#4623 11 months ago
Quoted from Bluebeard:

Rollover button question. I have a Nugent and a Wild Fyre. Both have the rollover button on the left. Both were filthy and I wanted to replace them. All I found was the one on the right at Pinball Resource. They are shorter and won't reach to register. I've looked on Marco, Pinball Life and can't find these. I cleaned the originals and they look much better, but wanted to know if anyone has purchased replacements that are the same length. Thanks in advance. Bluebeard Don
[quoted image]

That is the problem with pinball...
Ones factory brand has to alter a part to make it their own.

1 week later
#4649 11 months ago
Quoted from Bluebeard:

I have a question regarding my Nugent. I have a picture of the coin door and the cabinet head. The coin door I believe I've read that you can use a chrome spray pain. If so, what's recommended to use? Also the cabinet is rough and I've never painted a cabinet, but wanted to now what paint to use? The original have the specks in the white. What have others used? Thanks Bluebeard Don
[quoted image][quoted image]

Make note of the length of each bolt! Some are short some are long....

3 weeks later
#4722 10 months ago
Quoted from frunch:

Make sure to file the new switch(es)! There's usually some coating or film on it that needs to be filed off for better contact. Also make sure the eos switch blades have a little tension against each other when closed.

I usually do a "tapa tapa" with the hammer on the contact nipple.
I have over the years have had loose contacts to several EOS leaf switches.

#4727 10 months ago
Quoted from lightingnut:

Here is a photo of the old coil the new coil
[quoted image][quoted image]

The old coil looks like a Penn-ray coil.

#4743 10 months ago
Quoted from EEE:

Is there a reason that classic Stern pop bumpers don’t have a capacitor on the leaf switch? It seems to me that capacitors are pretty common on rollover switches and even Bally jet bumper leaf switches.

Note: Stern's cpu boards are clocked at a different frequency than Bally's.
----- Stern's cpu software runs on a different platform organization than Bally's.
----- Stern's bumpers are a different design than Bally's.
------ In essence, the two manufactures have very similar properties and yet,
------ they very differently in others.

#4745 10 months ago
Quoted from koji:

Well, here's a overview and a gameplay video of an Ali that I managed to get going.
Incorporates the bell ringing mod, and a decent quick game I managed to catch on video. (Link in the description to skip to about 12:50 for the actualy gameplay without me blabbing about how Great Ali is )

That is really neat. What a great mod. Thank you for posting.

#4750 10 months ago
Quoted from Clytor:

Does anyone happen to have part number for the Stern chime unit grommets? The grommets for the Bally chimes appear to be too big.

From a Casino Parts manual.
3 Tone Chime Assembly
1) pg.19 item 7 [ #6095 Rubber Grommet ]

#4755 10 months ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

When I got my Sterns I observed that Stern used these sexy flat top screws for attaching plastics to the wooded side rails. Trouble was that half of them were missing and I had to find some other screw for a replacement.
This is the flat top screw I had attaching my plastics. But I have found nowhere to buy these. But I worked up a solution for making my own.
This is an original Stern screw. You can see the flat top and beveled sides.
[quoted image]
I got some #8 stainless steel screws. Then I loaded them up in a drill and hit the top and the sides on a belt sander, followed by polishing them on the buffing wheel. It does not take long to convert a screw head. Now I can have all the flat top screws I want for my plastics.
[quoted image]
It is a minor detail, but it is something I have been wanting to figure out.
[quoted image]
The screw on the left is a Stern original. The next one is a standard #8 stainless screw. The one in the middle has just had its head sanded flat. And the next one has just had its sides sanded flat. The one on the right is completed and polished and looks like a Star original.
If you have the tools, they are easy to make.

Bally/Stern/Williams used a Truss screw for the side plastic mounts...
Different suppliers have different screw-head outcomes.
Nice job on the replication.

#4764 10 months ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

That's a black phosphate drywall screw. And I am not finding any truss head screws.

not finding any truss head screws...

#4767 10 months ago
Quoted from Agent_Hero:

I'm trying to fix some strange behavior in my Catacomb. Are these disc capacitors correct for replacing those on the switches?
Also in the manual, if I read it correctly an asterisk denotes when the disc capacitor is needed on a switch, correct?

From a Nugent pinball schematics:
All DIODES ARE 1N-4004
All CAPS. ARE .05MF 100V. DISC
Service Bulletin #4
Add ceramic disc capacitor to rollover button
.05 MF 100V
Stern Part No.

3 weeks later
#4811 9 months ago
Quoted from play_pinball:

Someone had made a post (very probably in a different thread) about replacing the wires in spinners. Anyone have that bookmarked by chance? It was to recreate a Nine Ball extended arm spinner specifically.
[quoted image]

Pinball Resource sells a heavy duty spinner as a replacement for Bally/Stern/Williams.

#4814 9 months ago
Quoted from bluespin:

Someone weighed a classic Stern spinner and it was much lighter than the B/W/G equivalent, so they make more spins per hit. I’d prefer to fix a broken Stern spinner over buying a heavier spinner.

But if you have a route, the last thing you want is a broken part and the location calling and.....

#4815 9 months ago
Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

It’s from Marco & but it’s the same 2” plunger. I’ll give it a go.

Watch out! you might smack the wood edge of the playfield.
I replace only the worn out link and leave the rest alone.
But then again, I do not know what it is you are trying to accomplish.

#4858 9 months ago
Quoted from Dicky:

Hi Guys
I was wondering if someone Knows where I can buy some decals for my Star Gazer Spinners ,
The Color of these are Yellow Base Blue S and the Reverse has Red Stars, see pics below
any help would be great
Thanks [quoted image][quoted image]

Pinball Rescue...

2 months later
#5336 6 months ago
Quoted from emsrph:

I recall some good tips about replacing the long post screws with a new machine screw/t-nut.
I’d like to save and reuse the original red plastic posts but I can’t get the nut off of the existing screw since it is stripped. Any tips on that?
[quoted image]

Mount a set screw to the head of the carriage bolt that is on the underside of the playfield.

1 week later
#5367 6 months ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

I just traded emails with Kerry at Mantis Pinball about reproducing some new sling shot arms for the classic Sterns. He was trying to get them to where he could sell them for $15.00 each. And he cannot make them at that price.
It is an example of something that can be made, but not at a price anyone would want to pay.
Maybe someone can ask Terry at Pinball Life if he wants to look into possibly making these.

Did he try at $25.00 a piece ?

#5384 5 months ago

I could use two to three sets.
I have a few that have snapped and are missing the head.

#5389 5 months ago
Quoted from frunch:

Are these arms universal between earlier games like Stars and later such as Seawitch and Nine Ball?

I hope so, they should be compatible with CDI Chicago Coin.

#5431 5 months ago

1) I could use the backglass top channel for a Stern Catacomb back glass... [QTY 1]
2) I could use a backbox glass & cabinet combo for a Star Gazer/pinball project [ QTY 2 ]
Note: The IB-562 might be for double back glass style Stern backboxs. [ eg Orbitor1 ]

#5436 5 months ago
Quoted from finman48127:

I need a back glass lock strap WITHOUT the lugs for F2K and Galaxy. That makes quantity two.
IPDB has inside backbox pics of:
Stars https://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=2366&picno=78728
Dracula https://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=728&picno=27376
Lazer Lord https://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=1421&picno=70257
Iron Maiden https://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=1270&picno=15790

Thanks for the pix.
Looks like the older games back glass would have a standard top trim... [ like Bally ]
The later games back glass would have the top trim with the spot welded tabs.

#5464 5 months ago
Quoted from bigguybbr:

I figured it out. Does anyone here with eagle eyes see what dumb mistake I made?
(solution here https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/trident-2020-restoration-/page/3#post-6423422)[quoted image]

The two rods are on backwards...The trip levers are magnetized to the rod bracket.

#5491 5 months ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

Todd at Big Daddy has, or had, a stock of those flat top Stern leg bolts.

On a side note, the shop I visit like to throw all that stuff away...
Bally & classic Stern leg bolts in the trash and new 5/8" acorn nuts in place.

#5526 5 months ago
Quoted from bigguybbr:

I just swapped out all 4 of my sling arms with Bally ones. Swapped out easy, no issues. I snapped some comparison photos.
[quoted image][quoted image]
I don’t notice any difference in the play. Having done this now, I don’t know that reproduction originals would be worth $25 a piece to me when these were $4-$5 from pinball life.
I also took the opportunity to swap out the linkages while I was in there taking everything apart.[quoted image][quoted image]

I love the fact you have a bally link in the mix.

1 week later
#5553 5 months ago
Quoted from FLASHBALL:

All the balls are loaded and switches are in adjustment.
Decided to take a different approach. Installed an alltek board and booted up the game.
Still garbage on the displays.
Still no sounds from any of the coin switches.
BUT.. This time the start button started a game.
When the game starts I hear the background noise but the ball wont eject. So I checked the solenoid fuse on the power supply beneath the playfield and meter says it's got continuity.
I guess it's time to start checking for voltage with the meter.

Check the switch connectors... bad pins etc.

1 week later
#5606 4 months ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

This is the 2nd harness I have installed. And the behavior exists with both harnesses. It does not look like anything is wrong.
This the the credit display in my Big Game.
[quoted image]
This is the Big Game credit display plugged into the Star Gazer harness.
[quoted image]
And this is the Uno display in the Star Gazer.
[quoted image]
Both light up in the same way on both pins.
The 6th digit is dark. The 3rd digit is dark.
There is one difference between the Big Game back glass and the Star Gazer back glass. There is a wider divide between the ball in play window and the credit window.
[quoted image]
On Big Game, the dark 3rd digit gets to hide behind that wide gap between the 2 windows.
[quoted image]
But on Star Gazer, the gap is to narrow for the dark 3rd digit to hide.
[quoted image]
I am using the Uno displays that can slide left to right. I moved the display to the right and now I can see my ball in play window but the dark 3rd digit is just sitting in view and looking ugly.
So I slide the display even more to the right. But now I cannot see ball one. And there is still some dark 3rd digit looking ugly.
[quoted image]
What I need is for digits #1, #2, #3 and #4 to light up and I need digits #5 and #6 to be dark.
I do not have the first clue on how to swap the pinouts on the display harness to make this happen. I can repin anything. I just do not have a road map for which wires/pins to move or where to move them.
Any help here would be much appreciated.
And the dying question is this: This is not the first Star Gazer that has been built. So I do do not think I am the only one who has made this observation with the credit displays. Did the other builders just say "good enough, I am not going to worry about it." ?

The game works on 7digit displays no 6digit.
So put a 7 digit display in and see how it looks.

#5611 4 months ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

I get what you are saying Vec-tor but all of my Sterns use a 6 digit display for credit/ball in play action. But I will try it tomorrow and see what happens.

I was looking at the manual... it only listed one style of display...
and you know how manuals can be...

#5621 4 months ago
Quoted from hisokajp:

lol what spinner is this from?
[quoted image]

Looks like a Wico decal spinner.

#5623 4 months ago
Quoted from Pinball_Nate:

Where exactly are the 5101 chips on this soundboard? Someone mentioned that they should be a matched pair, if they are not 5101 they can cause problems...........Here's a photo of my board. Are there things on this board that I should test?
I have NO spinner sound, and the ladder bonus sounds are wonky. That's what I'm trying to figure out.
Also, what pins/wire colors are the spinner wires? Should I re-pin or........??.......driving me nuts.
Thanks.[quoted image]

The two 5101s, are on the CPU board.

#5655 4 months ago
Quoted from slochar:

no-ball relocking during multiball.

I would make it part of an award during multi-ball...
1) no-ball relock multi-ball. = easy
2) complete "X" = "X" ball does not lock. = med to hard.

#5658 4 months ago

"X" as in generic unknown?
Answer: yes...
Like complete a 3bank = 1 ball does not lock.
Or have an "X" set of targets flashing... "X" = 1 through 10? spot targets...
complete the set of flashing targets = 1 ball does not lock.
I know a lot has to do with what is available, ram/rom...
I have been there... squeezing the bites to free up bites.

#5662 4 months ago

On a side note:
What I find interesting is that Bally's early designing prototyping had three 6821 pia's.
What options one could have today; if the boards did use three, instead of two pia's.

3 months later
#6106 40 days ago
Quoted from FantasticPinball:

Hey all, I have an idea. Ive got a playfield with star rollovers that have broken tabs. There are ways to fix these, but I bet one of you smart guys/girls with 3D print skills could design a new sleeve that goes under the red part of the rollover, and a new star. This would be a repair part for all those broken tab rollovers. Your thoughts?

I've done the repair with small pieces of shrink tubing.

1 month later
#6214 2 days ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

I have my theories that I got to employ when I was building my Star Gazer pin.
I'll start this way. Remove your drop target assembly from the pin and place it on your workbench where you can manipulate the targets manually.
Using the lever, raise your targets into the up position. Did any one of them fall? Now, knock them down with your finger. Pretend your finger is a silverball and give them a good hard snap. Did any one of them brick? I am guessing the answer to both actions is going to be no. Keep doing this test until you are satisfied that your drop assembly is assembled correctly and that the targets are acting correctly.
Once you are 100% happy with the target action on the work bench, then reinstall the drop assembly in the play field.
You only have 2 places you need to look at. Keep in mind that Stern did NOT assemble these 40 year old pinball machines with accuracy.
First item up: You have one or more targets dropping prematurely. Keep in mind that your targets were working fine on the bench. And now they are not. Check to see how much clearance there is between the front of the drop target and the slot the targets set in.
If you have no clearance between the target and the slot then here is what is happening: When the lever raises the targets back up it sort of shoves them forward a little bit. Then the errant target will brush up against the wood in the slot and get "pushed" back down. What you want is .010" to .020" clearance between the wood in the slot and the front of the target. You want the target to be able to raise up freely and not interfere with anything, including the wood in the slot.
Here are the 3 drops in my Seawitch.
This is 3-drop on lower left of play field.
As you can see, there is lots of clearance between the target faces and the wood in the slot. This set works fantastic.
[quoted image]
Next up is the 4-drop in the middle of the play field. These drops also work well. But if you look closely, you can see that there is a larger gap between the upper target face and the slot while at the lower target there is not as much clearance ( remember, Stern was not working to high precision ). But there is enough clearance for the targets to stay up properly.
[quoted image]
Last up is the upper 4-drop in upper right side of play field. And if you look carefully, you will see that all 4 targets on this assembly are nested right up next to the slot. The top drop target does have some clearance that you can barely see. The other 3 targets are nested right up to the slot. But this target assembly also works well. These 3 targets come right up to the slot but they are not pushing against the slot. So, while they are touching the slot it is not enough to cause premature target dropping.
[quoted image]
So, how do you fix it? You have 4 options.
1) You can reset the drop assembly by filling the holes in the play field and moving the drop assembly back about .020". But that is a cumbersome process if you don't know what you are doing.
2) You can your get a wood rasp and start removing wood from the slot in front of the target to gain clearance. I will advise you that trying to file/rasp wood from the slot will take a lot longer than you think. There is also the downside that as you a moving the rasp in a downward motion that some of the lower side play field veneer might start delaminating leaving you with splinters of woods and rough edges on the lower side of the slot.
Harbor Freight wood rasps work well for me.
[quoted image]
3) You can get some heavy grit/80 grit sandpaper and a paint stir stick. Tape a strip of sandpaper to the stir stick and now you have a sandpaper rasp. It will be more gentle than the metal rasp but it will take a lot longer than you think for remove enough material to make a difference.
4) You can go nuclear and get out the Dremel Tool with the small sanding barrel. But you have to be very careful to not cut any gouges in the slot. If you are good with a Dremel this will be your fastest way to get the target clearance you need.
I have worked up a method for resetting the entire drop assembly and in most cases, filling the play field holes with dowel and moving the assembly back is my preferred approach for prematurely dropping targets.
That takes care of premature target dropping.
Now, we have to talk about bricking.
Let's go back to your bench test. I said make like your finger is a silver ball and start snapping those targets down hard. On the work bench, I bet you did not have any bricking going on, did you? But then you install the assembly back into your play field and the bricking starts happening. What has changed? Other than installing the assembly back into the play field, what has changed? Your drop assembly has not changed from the work bench to the play field. What is different? Why are the targets bricking only when the assembly is installed?
The only thing that has changed from the workbench to the play field is that there are now 3-4 posts and a rubber ring sitting behind the targets. Remember, Stern did not assemble these 40 year old pins with precision. Stern was downright sloppy.
This is not Stern, exactly. This is the repro Star Gazer play field. When I built this play field up, I ran into bricking problems with the left drop assembly.
Look carefully that this pic. What you cannot see is the back side of the target slot as it is hidden by the rubber ring. What was happening is another clearance issue just like the targets dropping prematurely. Now there is a clearance issue with the backsides of the targets and the rubber ring. What happens is when the silver ball smacks the target, the targets zings backwards right into the rubber ring, as which point the rubber ring bounces the target right back into its rest position.
Make this next check easy on yourself. Use some masking tape, or something similar, and make your self some tape handles for your targets. And mount the assembly to the play field. Now, push back on a target and see if it is making any contact with the rubber ring on the posts. The target should not touch that rubber ring. Rubber bounces and it will bounce that target right back into its rest position and you have a brick. Double check yourself and pull the target back up with the tape handle. If you see any contact with the rubber ring you need to eliminate that contact. And while you may think you are OK doing this test, consider the possibility that the target shaft might flex a bit when it gets hammered by the silver ball.
[quoted image]
I had to make an undercut in the the left rail and move the posts back by one hole dimension. That solved the bricking problem on this set of drops.
[quoted image]
Then the upper left drop assembly was giving me problems with both premature target drops and bricking. This was my experimental drop assembly where I figure out this dropping/bricking problem. I used methods #2, #3, and finally #4 listed above to correct the dropping issue. This was my drop assembly I figure this stuff out with; And if I had it to do over again, I would have filled the play field holes wire dowel and reset the drop assembly. Hidesight; You know how it is.
Anyway, after I fixed the dropping issue, I had to go after the bricking issue. And again, this involved moving the posts back by one hole dimension.
I did not get pics of moving the holes but that is not much to it. Fill a hole and then drill a new hole right behind the one that was filled.
I did what I have been telling you and all my target problems went away.
[quoted image]
Here is one thing you might try to use to isolate a bricking issue. Remove the rubber ring from behind the targets and replace it with a couple of heavy rubber bands. They are thin and will give you extra clearance and will also keep the ball in control as you are knocking down targets. I would suggest removing any GI lights before you start banging away.
[quoted image]
Good Luck

Note: on the "bricking" problem, the OEM rubber rings where smaller in diameter than today's rubber rings.

#6228 10 hours ago

Note: if you want a firmer control of Stern memory drop targets add nylon snap bushings
to the D/T link 1A-491. I did it on a F2000.

#6230 1 hour ago
Quoted from emsrph:

Source for the nylon bushing and does it work with this other type of link?
[quoted image]

Marco Specialties has some Nyliner bearing/bushings #20-8790 that should work.
Side Note:
The Fight 2000 9 bank memory D/T assembly parts were worn out at the time...
The parts to replace, at the time, did not exist anymore. So I used what Bally did
to their D/T banks and added the Nyliners to each link...
In all, once rebuilt the #1-#5 Drop targets started to work correctly in the game.
The only thing, was the action of the drop targets was very controlled... no sloppy
wobbly drop.

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