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Stern Electronics, 1980
Big Game
Stern Electronics, 1980
Catacomb
Stern Electronics, 1981
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Stern Electronics, 1980
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Stern Electronics, 1979
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Stern Electronics, 1979
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Stern Electronics, 1981
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Stern Electronics, 1980You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider hoakypoaky.
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So I’m in the middle of my Quicksilver scratch build & im having some general classic stern questions as I go. I figured this is the best place to ask.
For those that have restored the coin doors, which spray paint is frequently used to match the grey color & hammer tone finish of the original game? I assume some Rustoleum product.
I just want my legs & door to look as close to original as possible. I’ve never used the hammer tone paints before. I assume you have to prime first?
Thanks!
I ended up picking up this paint/primer stuff, they were out of the other kind. I’ll have to test it out first. Just not sure if it requires a final clearcoat.
Someone recommended this JB weld to fill in some of the door scratches.
22F26A21-733C-4DD7-8EFF-E4A3C635E28B (resized).jpegE08C4C93-EAF1-492E-AB43-50BA031CC6D3 (resized).jpegSo I’m inspecting the 16B-6 transformer on my scratch QS conversion, getting ready to solder in the new weebly rectifier board, and now I’m a little confused. My electric knowledge is pretty lacking, so I have a basic question.
The transformer can be wired for 115v or 120v. Mine is wired for 115v with the yellow wire going to lug 9, and lugs 9 & 11 bridged.
I tested my wall outlet with my multimeter & I’m getting 120.9v.
So should I change the transformer setup to 120v? What would I need to do to change it? What’s the effect of using the 115v setup in a 120v wall outlet? cottonm4 seems to be the transformer expert
Just want to have this build setup properly. All my other lugs appear to have the correct colored wires connected. Thanks!
B8633033-34BF-47C7-9073-5BE6D39A484F (resized).jpegA645DB0D-DE46-46E6-B0A2-6C05ABAAF2EF (resized).jpegEA6FDB81-6699-4DAF-8D59-1D2847F63341 (resized).jpegA03780A1-8CEE-4F21-8462-432468ECB070 (resized).jpegDE045BD4-D316-4C8E-B9AF-ACC852FF9BD3 (resized).jpeg
Quoted from emsrph:If you feed 120V into the 115V input the resultant output voltages will be above spec.
What would the effect of that scenario be upon the game? I’m just curious. If it’s splitting hairs, I’ll probably just leave it as is.
But are most of these classic Stern transformers wired for 115v, because that was the standard when they were manufactured?
Quoted from greatwichjohn:Looking for my 3rd classic Stern playfield to make in 2021. More Star Gazers coming along with production Seawitch. I retired from my 6 day a week City job, & now working on pinball everyday. So if someone has art ready to go let me know.
[quoted image][quoted image]
9 Ball 
Does anyone sell or reproduce classic stern coinboxes? Or is there a suitable replacement most people use instead? Seems like an odd smaller size than the Bally boxes of the era.
That's outstanding news. So many 9 Ball playfields are blown out. Just need to find these games to restore them
Looking for a classic stern outhole ball kicker assembly. I should have realized I needed one of these along time ago. Any help in finding an assembly, or another alternative would be appreciated.
Bally style assembly won’t work, but would a Gottlieb? They look somewhat similar, but IDK.
Quoted from play_pinball:Since hoakypoaky linked it to the Quicksilver he’s building, I’m assuming he needs the playfield saucer mech and not the outhole mech since QS used ball trough mech that mounts under the apron and not the saucer style. Added confusion from the mech in that drawing being the old style saucer mech used on games like Wild Fyre, not the style used on QS.
Am I on the right track, hoakypoaky ? Is this the one?
[quoted image]
Yes I believe so. It’s been confusing for me because I don’t have a close up photo of the original saucer mech on a Quicksilver. But that pic of yours is probably correct.
The 1980 parts catalog only shows the old style saucer kicker mech (the diagram I posted). That style mech was used on Stingray I think? So now I’m thinking the mech on QS is similar style as the one on Flight2K?
I think your photo there is correct. That’s the style I need. I just need to find the entire complete mech, because I don’t have a diagram or part numbers to go off of.
But yes, this is for my Quicksilver build. Need the complete mech that kicks the ball out of the saucer. Mainly the bracket, the arm, the coil stop brackets, the plunger & linkage, the pivot bracket, etc etc. I can source the switch, coil & even the plastic cup with the slit later.
Thanks everyone. I was able to source the part I was looking for
My next dilemma is sourcing some specific parts for building B-695 Thumper Bumpers. I'm sure I'm not the first guy to attempt to recreate these, so I'm curious how others have tackled this issue. Has anyone found suitable replacements for...
The Coil Mounting Plate - B-695-9
The Plunger - B-695-11
The front coil support - B-695-10
The Coil Stop - A-186-1
I'm pretty sure I can source the coil stops & the mounting plates. I have the rest of the parts. I suppose it would have been easier to use another pop bumper drop-in assembly, but I want to keep as original as possible, considering I already dropped the cash on the 3D printed ring & yokes.
I've reached out to Steve Young at PBR, but he doesn't stock these parts I mentioned above. So any suggestions appreciated on the plunger & front coil support. I have to build 3 of these assemblies.
I can't find the diagram right now. I can post later tonight with the items circled...
EDIT: Parts I’m missing in diagram
9AF15C86-2D0A-4F1E-A6B4-0959565C9F3E (resized).jpegQuoted from cottonm4:Screw that. Take the easy road, man. Order these Pinball Life pops in black with the AE-26-1200 coil, add a diode that will not be there and get it put together. $50.00 bucks a pop and you are done. Just don't forget to add the diode. If you don't like the black color then paint them off-white.
I love these pop assemblies with the switches as part of the assembly. Install with molex connectors and you can remove them from the play field and make accurate adjustments to the switch and spoon out in the open.
But I think you can buy all of the other parts on Pinball Life except for the coil mounting plate. You will have to make that.
https://www.pinballlife.com/desega-pop-bumper-assembly.html
[quoted image]
Hmmm. Well I already purchased the black housings from pinball life already. And I also purchased the 3D printed ring & yokes from shapeways. They fit that housing already. I guess I can just buy the rest of the parts separately from PL.
Question: about that DE assembly, what type of fixture is used for the LED bulb, and how is it connected to the GI string if the entire assembly is able to be removed? I know I have to use a molex connecteor to connect to my third coast harness.
I’m going to have to contact them directly. Might be easier to return the 3 housings I bought & just buy 3 assemblies.
Wish I could see a better photo. Are the pop bases & caps similar to the old stern design? Or does it look like a 90s pop thrown into a classic stern?
So I found the saucer kickout mech , but now I’m trying to find a replacement for the saucer switch. Old part number is SW-467.
Would this work as a replacement? It doesn’t have the adjustment bar though.
https://www.pinballlife.com/bally-secondary-end-of-stroke-switch-normally-open.html
And does anyone know the replacement switch used in the drop target assemblies....the switches that mount on the back of the assembly, not on the bottom.
If a Dragonfist playfield was available, I would definitely purchase & do a scratch build. If you contact the guy who did the restore thread, he probably has a scanned version of his airburshed playfield that he might be willing to share?
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/dragonfist-restore-and-facelift
I love the thought of creating more of these ultrarare titles for people to see & enjoy. Dragonfist is a great title for a build because it's cool, unique & doesn't contain any super difficult-to-source mechs for a build.
Quoted from cottonm4:You are welcome.
Wow this is incredible news! Between this news, 9-Ball & upcoming rumored Alien Star, Mirco is really coming through.
Quoted from play_pinball:Did you get your answer on this hoakypoaky? A regular old 3-lug switch is what I used but you do need a spacer to have it sit right on the saucer: https://www.pinballlife.com/williamsbally-slingshot-score-switch.html?Category_Code=
The spacers are NLA but could very easily be 3D printed. Same spacers used on spinner switches.[quoted image]
I did not get an answer, so thank you for this. I guess it will make more sense to put together when I have the parts in hand.
Any idea for drop target switch replacements?
Quoted from swinks:I do a bunch of reproduction parts and happy to recreate these and make it a free file so you have the option to make it yourself.
If someone can give me the accurate dimensions of the block and hole locations / size I can make available today.
here is my other reproduction gear
https://www.shapeways.com/marketplace?q=swinksreproduction&sort=newest
Thanks for doing this! I love the rod rings/yokes I ordered from you
Quoted from play_pinball:Hans made a dead-on perfect match for these, for you guys needing these important spacers. They’re the same on saucer and spinner switches.
Reproduction on the left in each pic.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
Awesome. Is it a 3D file available? Or where can I order? I don't see them in his pinside shop.
Really dumb question.
Installing some new SW-10A-48 switches for the flipper bottons. They are a little different from the original switches. I have longer screws for these longer stacks.
But does it matter which contact lug the blue/orange wires get soldered to?
2796A6CB-FD1C-4EB5-904D-5C6DFF5D1164 (resized).jpegFC38449F-A449-465B-95AD-6FC32756A081 (resized).jpegQuoted from BorgDog:Shouldn't matter which one goes where, but your screws should go the other way.
Awesome, thanks for the help
Speaking of drop target switches, does anyone know where to source new versions of this switch? I can’t find a part number either. I was hoping to replace these while rebuilding the 3 & 4 drop target banks in my QS. These aren’t hard to access for adjustment so I don’t mind keeping them on the back.
I know I could move the switches to the bottom, but I’m not exactly sure how to do that. I’m guessing it would be a similar setup to a Bally bank with a different switch.
831D34CA-B26C-4733-9AE1-3D4AF5A3290D (resized).jpegAm I overthinking this? I think I am.
EDIT: Found the solution. If you want to use the correct 1-1/4 inch posts, then countersink the t-nuts slightly by using a 1/2inch forstner bit. The standard post screws will thread more deeply into the t-nut, making the post more durable.
Quoted from cottonm4:Interesting you brought that up. I forgot I put that up.
I just got finished with setting up the 3 spinners on my Star Gazer build yesterday. I followed the lead of what some others have said and went the machine screw and T-nut route. It takes a little more work than just using a manufactured post stud, but the cost advantage make this an easy decision for me.
Screw............... = 15 cents*
T-nuts............... = 20 cents*
Star lock washer = 4 cents*
* This is buying onsey-twosie. Buying a box of 100 will be cheaper.
Benefit: You do not need to use a Forstner bit to undercut your play field.
1) The hole in the play field needs to be drilled large enough that the diameter of the T-nut will fit into the hole. Using some masking tape as drill stop so you don't drill through your play field, drill only deep enough to allow the T-nut to sink fully into the play field.
[quoted image]
I was having problems with pulling the t-nut down to the play field as the 3 barbs would keep twisting and not lock into the play field.
So, I did this:
2) Using a small ball peen hammer, I lightly tapped the T-nut into the play field a little bit. And then removed it. The barbs made 3 small marks in the play field.
[quoted image]
[quoted image]
3) Using some masking tap as a drill stop I opened up the 3 barb holes with a 1/16" drill bit.
[quoted image]
Once you have the holes opened to accept the barbs, you can proceed to install the T-nut.
4) Prepare your screw with a star lock washer.
5) You will need a small block of wood to help pull the T-nut through the hole and get it seated to the play field.
[quoted image]
6) When you are finished you are looking at this. When you get to this point, you need to apply some torque to help lock the screw in tightly. You do not need to use any Loctite or any other thread locker. However, you may have to use your screwdriver to keep the stud from spinning out when you proceed to install the locking nut.
[quoted image]
That is it for installing the T-nut and 6-32 machine screw.
But you also need to prep the screw by cutting it to proper length before you start working with the T-nut.
After some experimenting, I decided I wanted my machine screws to be protruding .500" beyond the height of the post. .500" left me enough screw length that I could lock the post down by using a locking nut. And then I can place a nylon beauty nut on top of the locker nut.
[quoted image]
It is a solid post lockdown and it looks pretty. You can even use the rubber post caps if you prefer.
[quoted image]
To prepare the machine screw, you need to pair of those cheap wire crimp tools to cut the screw to proper length.
NOTE: Cutting screws to length with a pair of these cheap crimpers mangles the screw threads. You will need to clean them up with a file.
[quoted image]
===========================================
The above is for fabricating a 6-32 machine screw to make a locking style post for sling shots and spinners. For those posts that do not provide mounting points for plastics and are locked down with screws, do all of the above only reverse the screw and load it from the top of the post and screw in down into the t-nut.
===========================
So, you can do the above for this for 40 cents.
Screw............... = 15 cents*
T-nuts............... = 20 cents*
Star lock washer = 4 cents*
* This is buying onsey-twosie. Buying a box of 100 will be cheaper.
Or you can buy a manufactured post stud, that is too short, for a $1.35 plus shipping.
EDIT: Some posts dod not get much action so for those I will still use the type that screw into the wood. But for high impact posts, this will be the way I am going in the future.
I read your previous post & found your take very interesting. Since I already had the standard post screws on hand, I figured countersinking the t-nuts would just be easier in my case.
With this much attention to detail, I’d be very curious to hear your technique for adjusting & dialing in your Stargazer spinners to perfection.
I have a question about the drop-in pop assemblies used on Quicksilver, Cheetah, etc......as I'm sure someone has done this modification before:
I want to use molex connectors on each pop assembly for easy install & removal for maintenance in the future. The molex connectors would have to provide connection points for the GI light wires, the switch, coils, etc. I haven't fully wrapped by head around the exact type of molex connector I would need to make this work.
I'm thinking that an all-in-one 12 pin housing would be large enough, along with 0.093 round connector pins for the wires. Both male & female components for the housings & pins. That should work right? Perhaps I only need a 9 pin housing? Perhaps this is overkill, but my new QS harness came with molext connectors for the drop assemblies, so I just figured it would be nice to do for the pops as well.
If anyone has done his before I'd appreciate the input. Thanks!
Quoted from slochar:You need to connect/disconnect 2 wires for the bulb, 3 wires for the solenoid (2 of which will go into the same connector pin... the power feed loop), 4 that goes into the switch, of which 2 are shared.
So the minimum connector would be 6. 093 is fine. There's absolutely no reason to separate out the connectors that are doubled up, this way you can still test stuff with the connector removed because no required chained connections are broken.
Also, be aware that adding a connection adds another potential failure point. Yes, easy to pull the part out, but how often does that really happen anyway? Nice for a playfield swap, but overkill in normal usage. (Unless you have a lot of issues working on the playfield with it up, ie. you're short, your back hurts, etc.)
Thanks for the info. But what is the correct way to crimp 2 wires to the same pin? Just crimp two wires into a single pin? It's ok to do that? My initial thought was to separate the wires that are doubled up to their each pin & use a 9-pin housing.
I agree it's another potential failure point, but I have a good crimping tool that I used on my Mata Hari build, and after replacing every single pin on that game without issue I'm pretty sure I can handle getting these QS pops right.
Anyone have an opinion on this? My old meteor sling parts were pretty beat up. So I purchased some similar replacement parts to make them new again.
The new plunger is about an 1/8 inch shorter than the original plunger. I’ll use the wrong terminology here, but the shorter plunger should mean more movement distance in the arm’s action. Hence livelier slings?
Just wondering if I should use the new plungers or not. An 1/8 inch is quite a bit shorter.
11856DA7-072A-457B-B45C-05E470F728FA (resized).jpeg5D462C30-198E-46C6-A42B-184C973B382B (resized).jpegQuoted from play_pinball:Looks like you bought these: https://www.pinballlife.com/slingshotballshooter-plunger-and-link-2-plunger.html
These are what I used and can confirm they work great: https://www.pinballlife.com/slingshotballshooter-plunger-and-link-2-18-plunger.html
It’s from Marco & but it’s the same 2” plunger. I’ll give it a go.
Quoted from JLay:Anyone know which stern sticker would be more appropriate for Stars?
[quoted image]
They started using the decal with the blue border in 1981, starting with Freefall & then every game after that.
Quoted from hisokajp:closed forever? oh man that sucks-
Yeah I placed an order last week as soon as I heard they were going out of business. Missed out on a blue Nine Ball apron decal. Hopefully someone else will step up & produce these, because to my knowledge, Pinball Rescue is the only person who produces the Stern apron decals.
Anyone know where I can find a standard classic Stern apron? I don’t think anyone reproduces these.
The one I took out of my Meteor is in nice shape. It has the tournament sticker too. It would be a sin to take a grinder to it just so I can repaint it green. I’d also like to reuse it for another project someday.
So if you have one in your parts pile, let me know
Found one
Getting close to installing my spinners on my QS, and I've been reading some bookmarked posts about spinner adjustments to get them dialed in. I'm using all new parts, including the spinners themselves from PBR. I know this is covered quite extensively here, but I'm curious for everyone's most important suggestion?
I also would like to know:
1) I bought a bunch of long length rods with extras to spare. So I'll have to cut/bend it to the correct length. I also understand that you want some tension from spinner to switch, but not too much & not too little. So how do I determine this "Goldilocks" zone & determine the correct rod length? I suppose it's game dependent.
2) What does everyone use for lube at each pivot point. I bought some Bicycle Chain Teflon lube. I was just going to apply a very small amount to the pivot points using a q-tip.
3) I've also read the screws securing the bracket should not be over tightened, or it may make the spinner spin less. Is that true? I would think that getting the spinner arm wire adjusted in the forward/back & up/down axis is the most important thing.
Obviously I will spend as much time as possible to get these spinners perfect. I will not settle for anything less than THIS!!!
Thanks for the spinner tips everyone. Now I know why I bought a digital caliper months ago! I’ll report back
It's so hard to go back & find old posts. So quick question:
When cutting your own screws for t-nut posts, how much length of the screws do you leave ABOVE...
1) a standard 1-1/4 inch post?
2) a standard 1-1/4 inch post at the spinners bracket?
The spinner posts get a nylon locking nut, as well as a plastic acorn, so I assume that has to be longer. Guessing 0.5 inch?
And the regular posts are about 0.25 inch? Enough for a thin washer & an acorn
Do I have that right? I'm putting plastic acorns everywhere.
Quoted from cottonm4:Each play field is different. You will have to set your t-nut and install the screw and then set everything in position to measure what you need cut. How do you do that? Measure how much exposed screw is showing below the acorn nut. That exposure is what you are going to cut away.
Be prepared to scrap a few screws as you try to get your measurements dialed in.
So, T-nut, long screw, the post and acorn nut, washers, and your plastic. Then screw on your acorn nut and measure the gap that you do not want to see. Take it apart and cut the screw to length. Reinstall for a trial fit. Make sure you leave enough room on the screw so you can tighten the acorn nut without clamping your plastics down hard. Try to leave your plastics loose so they will have room to move. If you screw your plastics down tight, then they are going to warp with the bulb heat.
I try to cut them so that there will be 1/16" to 1/8" gap between the acorn nut and the plastics.
At the spinners posts/brackets, you need enough length that you can screw everything down tight. And then you can add an acorn nut to the top of the screw to make it look finished.
Also, your plastics will most likely need to be fitted. You will need a Dremel Tool and a rotary file to open up the holes in your plastics so that they do not bind on the post screws. When I say "open up the holes" I don't mean to drill oversize holes in them. You will probable need to make some holes oblong so your plastics can slide around a little.
Thanks for explaining all this. I just want to be sure I assemble correctly though & I'm confused on the terminology. So I think the arrangement from bottom to top should be...
POST WITH A PLASTIC:
6-32 Screw---Star Lock Washer---T-Nut---Post---Nylon Lock Nut---washer---the plastic---1/8 gap---Nylon Acorn Cap
POST FOR SPINNER
6-32 Screw---Star Lock Washer---T-Nut---Post---Spinner gate bracket mount----Nylock Lock Nut---Nylon Acorn Cap
Do I have that right?
Quoted from cottonm4:It sounds like you have it. For your slings, you may wish to add some of those clear plastic washers to sit below your sling plastics so the flipper does break them with a ball kick.
Yes I have a bunch of those. They will go on there as well.
Quoted from cottonm4:The proper way to install those washers is under the lock nut so that they will take the impact. If you place the washer directly under the plastic, an errant ball can still take out your plastic.
Put the clear washer between the post & the nylon lock nut? I always put the clear washer above the lock nut, under the plastic itself, and then secure with the nylon acorn cap.
Yeah with Pinball Rescue closing down, I'm hoping someone else in the states fills this need & starts producing the Stern apron decals. Regular & widebody, all color options, etc. There is a real demand for this, especially if it says Stern Electronics INC.
This is the only guy in the states that I've found making Stern stuff, but he only produces foil credit buttons & one of the door decals. Maybe someone could reach out to him.
Quoted from WeatherbyMAG:Classic arcades makes the old school Stern ones in blue & red & black & red for like a Dracula. I heavily modify them & make them work with a lot of effort to clean them up. Biggest problem is he does not make a Stern shooter gauge decal to match.....
Stern Apron decals is definitely a market someone needs to get into here in the States.
[quoted image][quoted image]
It looks like the background on that decal isn't transparent. It looks white to me. That's why I like the Pinball Rescue decals. With the transparent decal you can paint the apron whatever color you like.
Hey this was a valuable lesson for me as well. I really need to be patient before I throw my QS playfield into the cabinet for the first time. Put on my inspection cap & triple check everything.
I'm glad you were able to get it figured out
Quoted from nogoodnames222:Hey guys, bought a Galaxy recently which is my first early solid state (and I really haven't worked on pins much), so sorry if this is a dumb question:
My game worked great when I first got it, and then after a few days I had it restart mid-game. I thought it odd, but didn't have an issue for another couple days. The restarts started becoming more and more frequent (but very inconsistent), so I tried reseating all the connections I had undone when moving the machine and that got things noticeably better (may have just been a coincidence though). After a few days the issue had returned; currently the machine will power up and restarts itself every ~10-30 seconds on average.
-I tired reseating all connectors again and didn't have any improvement.
-Wiggling on wires/plugs does not have repeatable results.
-The GI lights do NOT flicker when the game resets.
My uneducated guess would be a power supply issue, or do you think it's still a connection (and if so, which board should I suspect)? Anyone want to point me in the right direction?
Thanks, appreciate any help.
This tech chart should help you.
Stern_Galaxy_Tech_Chart.pdfQuoted from msarac:I assume you used the tape to make it easier to remove lamp sockets? If so, here is an alternative to consider:
https://www.alliedelec.com/product/keystone-electronics/7312/70923083/?keyword=7312
Mounting all the sockets with one of these underneath first, then soldering on the braid, makes it very easy to run exactly where you need and keep short opportunities to a minimum. Plus they are a lot easier to solder on compared to the socket tabs.[quoted image]
Boy where was this tip when I was doing my build? I had a hell of a time getting solder to stick to some of my sockets. I'll use these next time for sure.
Quoted from play_pinball:Happens occasionally on my QS. The ball hits the rail and bounces back into the trough; it’s not a weak coil issue.
I have noticed a couple times on my quicksilver as well, even after installing a couple small washers under the top tang of the guide fork. It happens on my friends Seawitch as well. I may try additional washers under the fork, or bending the other guide back. It's hard to comprehend out it gets stuck there after launching fast & bouncing back.
I just wanted to give a quick heads up to those of you who were following my Quicksilver scratch build thread for the last year or so.
It took awhile to organize, but we will finally be streaming my restored game tonight July 9th on Twitch at 7pm PST. Hopefully it plays like it should or I'll be really embarrassed. No issues yet, so fingers crossed!
More importantly, I've also installed the latest v07 version of the slochar code, which I've been testing the last month. If you are unfamiliar, he has done an excellent job adding features to the already-packed base code.... including spinner rip counts, spinner specials, retaining spinner high scores, 50K bonus for 4-bank sweeps, etc, etc. I swear most the time I'm playing, I'm not thinking about points. I'm trying to rip the spinner as hard as I can. It's so much fun!
So if you are interested in seeing what this new code is like, or just want to see how fast a better-than-new restored Quicksilver plays, then please tune in
A wizard followed me home today
Quicksilver, Cheetah & Nine Ball….. I think my Classic Stern collection is complete!
This one will be getting the full 5* restore someday, but boy I’ve been away from this thread a long time. Gonna put the Cheetah in the shop & dive back in!
8CFB93CF-3BEB-40B6-94E0-5CE5E1FAA8BA (resized).jpegBoy it has been too long since I've poked around my favorite pinside thread. Glad to see the same familiar names posting & working away
I thought I would mention that I've been debating the last few months whether I should just bite the bullet & purchase a subpar Mirco Nine Ball playfield....or just keep waiting for the slim chance that CPR might decide to make one.
Well imaging my surprise last week when I visited CPR's website & was STUNNED to see them offering Nine Ball playfields now, with corrected errors that were present in the original art! I couldn't click the buy button fast enough.
I expect to receive it this week. Not sure if anyone has purchased this PF from CPR, but I'll post some pics when I receive it.
Quoted from cottonm4:I recall when Kevin at CPR called my self and some others on the phone, that Kevin said something to me about correcting some NB art but I did not understand what he was talking about.
What are the errors you are speaking of?
Described here in these images.
For the record, Mirco had is own issues producing this playfield. He ignored requests from customers to fix the original artwork & did an initial run was that full of errors & muddled graphics. When enough people complained, he went back and improved the artwork, but you never know what you're going to get from him. My friend ordered the a Mirco 2nd run playfield with the corrected artwork, but it arrived more warped than a potato chip & he's spent the last year trying to get it flattened out.
I'm happy to support CPR. My playfield arrived yesterday but I didn't get a chance to take photos. I'll try to do it & post them tonight.
nb1 (resized).JPGnb2 (resized).JPGQuoted from Mad_Dog_Coin_Op:I know what you mean about Mirco. These are the two things that really bug me about the CPR playfield. [quoted image]
Thanks for pointing out. I'll take a close look at that when I open the box tonight
Well I’m pretty damn impressed! CPR Nine Ball. Arrived flat as a board, zero warping, vibrant colors, sharp details, and no major errors to my eye. Very satisfied
1ABB9D40-5796-45E3-A917-B936DE0EAA54.jpeg57DFBFC9-AA21-4506-93D8-18C7ECB1EC68.jpeg71DC13B2-D4C0-4483-A4C8-68F1A5C6761F.jpegF043DCD0-599B-4E71-A777-EEC431946EA9.jpeg43EA19A7-0C5D-4E37-98FF-81C3F5997BE8.jpegDE51D4D5-DB46-40EA-94A8-20B012B45759.jpeg9FA23976-5025-4F31-8977-C61C2EEAE0B1.jpegB7B8E1D9-147C-4A20-9AF5-7F55CF16D4B8.jpegFCCE8092-6F7B-4B33-9AB2-8D7082B12F5C.jpegThought I would share this rare bird…
I was able to play my buddy’s Iron Maiden for the first time tonight Gameplay might be a bit lacking, but you sure have to admire the unique mechanical ball lock feature, the Heavy Metal inspired artwork, pulsing layered backglass, and the odd ruleset. I did manage to start multiball, which was rather difficult, so that was pretty satisfying. Cool game for sure, but way too rich for my blood.
0409C99B-B80E-4C54-BA2B-8B0E5563E520 (resized).jpeg9ED22E53-3672-4314-BACA-BA70B15BC617 (resized).jpegLook what floated like butterfly right into my garage this weekend Any Ali lovers out there?
Never thought I would find one, but this fell right into my lap, so I couldn’t resist. Got some interesting plans for this one. Think I’ll start a thread on it.
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Quoted from cottonm4:It looks to be in very nice condition.
It has some expected scratches, scuffs & dings on the cab, but other than some insert keyline wear the playfield is great. Pretty flawless apron too. It's a nice little project that won't require extensive resto work.
Quoted from snyper2099:It’s one of my favorite games and I have owned at least one for 10 years. It has something about it… Something I can only describe as a pinball soul. Probably has a hint of the soul of the man who created it, Harry Williams. Under appreciated these days… but not by me.
Well that's good to know. Watching gameplay videos is one thing, but I'm really looking forward to flipping it. I want to see if collecting all those bonus payouts multiple times before draining is as satisfying as it looks.
Quoted from DanMarino:Didn't Harry Williams also design Flight 2000? Such a good game with a challenging to earn multi-ball.
And Cheetah
Quoted from snyper2099:Anyone that owns Alien Star, Nine Ball, Ali, Taxi, and BSD knows great games and has my respect.
Gameplay is king
I was debating this myself while going though my Ali parts order list. Whether to rebuild the existing flippers or drop in entire Gen2 setups. I've got mismatched coils on the flippers now, and I was going to replace the flipper shafts anyway, so I'm leaning towards just throwing in the Gen2s. Almost twice the price of doing a rebuild kit tho.
But when it comes to mechanical parts, I'd rather just spend the money & get it working flawlessly for many years.
What's the issue with the Gen1 Stern flippers? Just a different base plate & a shorter flipper shaft? I can't remember.
I have a curious question....
Noticed on IPDB that there are no production numbers listed for Catacomb. Anyone have any idea how many they ran? Since it was produced around the time of Split Second, Viper & Dragonfist.... I'm guessing around 500 units?
I was playing my buddy's the other night. While I love most classic Sterns, Catacomb is really special IMO. The ultimate thinking mans game. You really gotta know what you're doing. Colored lights & numbers, managing the post drain bagatelle, difficult multiball, collecting the whole piece of toast for 5x, and even then it's still super hard to break a million. The only Stern I wish I owned. Maybe someday
Quoted from snyper2099:Outside of shaking the game and risking a tilt, I call nonsense on your statement. Next you'll be arguing that there is some skill on the Jungle Lord bagatelle. They are both slot machines... Also, that's just one minor issue I have with Catacomb, you pointed out the other major ones.
Well first off, you always have to be thinking & scanning the playfield during gameplay. The numbers are randomized across the drop banks. The colors are rotating on the drops constantly during gameplay The arrangement of the colors/numbers on the the toast is odd too. You really have to memorize the arrangements before you even start. You need to know color rotation order & which numbers are located where.
While your playing you have to keep checking for the numbers & colors you need. When a drop bank gets to one last target, trap the ball & make a timed shot to hit the drop when the number you need is lit. This takes skill. It's not just random failing & hoping you complete the banks. Unless you just want to start MB & hope for the best.
Then after the ball drain, you have seconds to assess which numbers/colors you need to complete on the toast. You can press the LT flipper button to change which color you want to try for before you launch the bagatelle. But if you collect a number you already have, the bagatelle ends. (ex Ok I need Blue-9 & Blue-8, that's in bank A & B) Change the banks to blue, then launch the bagatelle. Is it going in A or B? Yes it went in A, now I need B to complete all the blue numbers. Oh shit! it's bouncing & looks like it's going to go in D. QUICK! Hit the LT flipper button & change to the next color before it drops in D. WHEW! I got Orange-13. I can keep going! I need A, B & C now. Launch! etc etc etc.
All that is happening within split seconds in your brain. You gotta think fast & react fast. The bagatelle launch is timed & you have seconds to launch. You can't just stand there & slowly scan the playfield. You have to move quickly. If you are just watching the bagatelle ball bounce around & not changing the colors & monitoring the letters, you're doing it wrong & not getting the full enjoyment that Catacomb has to offer.
Hands down.... the ultimate thinking mans game. But definitely NOT for everyone. It's so difficult to explain to a pinhead, let alone a novice. Plus it has ball lock stealing, a great spinner for ripping, the beautiful artwork, killer colors & cabinet, strange sounds, etc. It's a real gem IMO.
Quoted from cottonm4:It is called a Magic Square. In any direction you add the numbers up in the square, up, down, sideways, and diagonally, the numbers add up to 34.
There are 4 colors. The 4 red inserts add up to 34. The 4 green inserts add up to 34. Same for blue and amber inserts.
The bonus score is 34,000.
https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=magic+square&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
Thanks for the fun fact. I thought they were just doing that arrangement to screw with my head. haha
Quoted from swinks:thanks for mentioning the stern tombstone drops guys
just if anyone is interested send me a message and not go straight to Shapeways - Shapeways ones are my design and is my shop front but are more expensive as you are buying them one at a time and they give poor discounts. I order in batches of 75-100 to get a much better price which I pass on and it's the community out.
v3's on the left are replicas of the original
v4's on the right are replicas but modded with the back of the target filled in
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Is there someone that makes the decals (various colored S, Stars, numbers or blue dots) for these drops? That was the only thing holding me back from trying them out.
Maybe I’m missing something here, but if this is a Trident, those pops are a diffrent design than the drop-in design found on Big Game, Quicksilver & Cheetah. Trident has the pops with the metal plate mounts.
I just went through this when rebuilding the pops on my Ali this month. Are you sure the correct height spacers & washers are present on your trident pop? That simply might be causing the base to sit low? See photo.
Referenced the work I did here of that helps.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/stern-ali-project-improving-the-greatest/page/2#post-7430847
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Quoted from play_pinball:Big Game used those same style on your Ali (and Trident). I dislike them and feel like they provide weaker pop action, but maybe it's just in my head. Plus dealing with those feet/washers. No thanks.
I agree the feet/washers were a PITA to reinstall & a terrible design. But my pops are are pretty lively now after a complete rebuild. I added capacitors to the switches as well & I'm pretty happy with the action. No more dead hits.
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:From what I can tell most every single "yellow" LED has been god-awful. I'm curious to see how the new "yellow" LEDs I sent turn out in Quicksilver. They supposedly are actually yellow, unlike previous offerings.
I always use warm whites in yellow inserts.
I just bought one of the early Stern coin door decals from Marco & I wasn't very happy with it. It was oversized just slightly so that it wouldn't fit neatly within the recessed square area of the door. It was going to leave ripples around the edges, so I ended up cutting the blue border off.
Should not be that difficult to correctly reproduce something as simple as a sticker. Pinball Resource was the very best. Shame they are no longer in business.
Added 12 months ago:My bad. I meant Pinball Rescue out of Australia
Quoted from Mad_Dog_Coin_Op:It sounds like new ones are coming
From who? Just curious. I haven't seen anyone make repro apron decals since Pinball Rescue folded.
Well speaking of all this updated Stern code talk, I have something to add
Slochar & I have been working on updating the base code on Ali for several months now. I know there aren't that many Ali owners out there. I feel it's a great game that just needed some rules tweaking & some added features to improve upon on a pretty cool open layout. We've finally gotten to the point where the code is ready for public testing. I'll be taking it to GSPF next week to let people try it out & get some feedback. Might need a few more scoring balance tweaks but that's what testing is for.
It's really amazing to me that Slochar is able to do all this new rule coding & add features yet still manage to fit it all on a standard ROM. I'm so grateful for the work he's done. This is the type of updated coding that I like. Improving a game by adding features & rules that should have been there in the first place that match the era of the game.....instead of these new kits that add new music, DMDs & rules that don't even correlate to what's written on the playfield.
This new Ali code adds features like freeplay, spinner counts, a skill shot, adjustable difficulty settings, and EB limits. Wiring was added to support 7-digit displays, a 8-inch Ringside Boxing bell & new feature lamps to indicate new scoring rules. The idea was to make the fun spinner U-Turn shot a more focal part of the game (which it is now), and by adding hurry-up features like double spinner scoring & hurry-up saucer bonus collects. As a result, it's a much more balanced game & more suitable for tournament play IMO. And it's way more fun now!
It's been a fulfilling little project these last few months. You can read about it here if you like.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/stern-ali-project-improving-the-greatest/page/3#post-7570219
Quoted from Tsskinne:Another Stargazer brought into existence. Still needs a few finishing touches but this one is headed to a fellow pinsider soon!
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Hey I know where that’s going! Wonderful job. He’s going to be very happy
Quoted from play_pinball:Tip on the bell mod for Ali — check eBay for fire alarm bells! I scored a 10” bell that has the same ring to it for 1/8th the cost of a “real” boxing gong.
Good thinking! But I like to reach in the cab & yank on the boxing bell lever to manually ring the bell just for fun
I kinda wish I had bought the 10" instead of the 8" though. The sound is significantly dampened when the glass is put on & the door is locked up. It's still loud though regardless!
Quoted from trecemaneras:Bowen’s tutorial and Reno Pinball’s stream of Poaky’s scratch built game are the rest of the reason.
(I love seeing this thread on fire )
Thanks for the mention! I'm glad people are still watching & enjoying that QS stream. Which reminds me...... I really need to setup another stream of my restored Ali with Slochar's new code for anyone thinking of updating their game. You guys would probably like to see the new rules in action. Hopefully we can get something setup for next month.
Quoted from play_pinball:Extremely small nails are used when attached to a wooden ball guide rail. The rivets are used on the metal L-brackets.
HoakyPoaky Did you find a sufficient source and size for those little nails? I am down to literally my last 2 (and I need more!)
No I never did find a new source for those nails. But djblouw’s drive screw suggestion seems like an interesting option.
Since I finished my Ali project, I've gotten really behind on this thread. Nice to hear so many people are attempting uncommon Stern scratch builds. This summer really had me sidetracked with home improvement costs & other projects. Seems like all I do now is collect more pinball projects & playfields to install, instead of actually restoring them. Sound familiar?
Quoted from snyper2099:It’s black, not mirrored. Looks better to me. Especially since I’m painting my cabinet different colors. Navy blue is so ugly.
It appears that the mirroring is applied to the glass and the same film is used to make both products.
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I've ordered mirrored BGs from COOs before, but I wasn't aware you could order the film & apply to old glass yourself. What's the process for adhering the film to your old glass? How much $$$ did you save doing this yourself?
Quoted from gdonovan:Video in my Seawitch from scratch thread.
That's awesome! Thanks for the link. Looks like a really interesting thread too, I'll have to read through it
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Copenhagen
Des Moines, IA