Get some Velcro strips. Make a small wooden pad. Velcro the pad to your transformer board. Apple some Velcro to the plastic side of the relay and attach it to the wood pad you made. Sort of a jury rig but it will hold the relay in one place.

Nine Ball problems: I have never got NB to work properly since I brought it home 4 years ago. My hands have been full with working on my other pins. I am now seeing daylight so I have been working on NB.

One of the problems I am dealing with is that damnable ball lock saucer in the left hand side. When I am about to describe does not happen all of the time but when it does happen it really fouls up the game.

When the first ball drops in the saucer lock all is well. But then ball 2 drops into the lock and holds down the switch wire, the pin seems to think that I have just drained the ball and it moves the ball in play from 1 ball played to 2 balls played. And then when I shoot the third ball the pin considers it ball 3 but with 2 balls locked some switch will make contact and think ball 3 has drained and then shut down the game. When in reality, I am still on ball 1.

My thinking is that when 2 balls are locked they should not be sending signals to advance the ball in play number.

I am at a loss for this behavior.

Any thoughts appreciated.

IMG_2722 (resized).jpg

Someone else had this same problem recently and resolved it.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/stern-nine-ball-left-ball-lock-schematic-needed/page/3#post-5328690

All the outhole switch and the left lock mecanism outhole are in the same matrix...

C3E7FA24-51EA-442D-8AB3-24F8E1E4E548 (resized).jpeg

Some of the issue can be resolved with careful adjustment of the switches.

There's been a larger issue with nine ball forever though which is why we're working on changing the software to compensate for errors like this. The code is really a mess; super hacky. They don't count the ball locations correctly, and they don't double check anything, either. Likely they were under pressure to get some kind of code released with the game back then.

Part of the discussion is in the thread referenced and the new thread is here as a clearinghouse of errors that can't be explained solely by hardware:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/9-ball-software-rewrite

Do you have ceramic caps on the ball trough switches?

Anyone have a stripped out Cabinet they are willing to part with? trying to save a Classic stern. Standard cabinet, not a widebody.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/wanted-standard-classic-stern-cabinet

A Bally cabinet will work if one of those comes available for you.

I’ll have to look when I get home tomorrow evening

https://www.facebook.com/coinopwarehouse/photos/pcb.10157872053437375/10157872053127375/?type=3&theater

Looks like Lloyd unearthed a Dragonfist from somewhere. Sold for $3600 in under 20 minutes!

I'm home and just checked. There are no caps on any of the 3 left hand ball lock switches. The game plays famously if I don't get 2 balls locked on the left side.

Ball 1 locks: Game plays great.

Ball 2 locks: Not immediately but a few seconds after ball 2 locks the ball-in-play advances to Ball 2.

Ball 3 comes to the play field and play action is very good, however, I can hear the shooter coil activating and it is shooting blanks since all balls are on the play field (but the shooter should be dead because the shooter switch is not closed). It will let me play on Ball 3 for a few seconds while the shooter is firing blanks and then Ball 3 is signaled as drained and the game is over.

Currently, I have the pin setup with a newly reconditioned Stern MPU-200 board, an Alltek SDU, and a Bally LDA board.

I'll triple check my switch adjustments and see what happens.

Thank you for all of the work your are doing on these early Sterns. I have my hands full ATM but I want otto get an EPROM burner and add that to my list of skills.

Thank you Bluespin. I was following that article and printed it out.

All I can really say right now is that this is the 1st time I have owned NB that I have it really playing well. It is a blast to play.

Check that shooter lane switch. If it’s flakey it will never think that third ball is served hence the repeat firing of the coil every couple seconds. It’s one of the many quirks of nineball.

The 2 ball lock switches are the definition of... Well I don't know what but something that is a real pain in the ass and touchy.

CottonM4 I meant were there any ceramic capacitors on the ball trough microswitches. If so, remove them. They are not needed.
Next, ensure your shooter lane switch is clean and gapped properly. Third, remove the apron and roll each ball one at a time in the trough to
ensure the switches are triggering properly. Some of the wire forms may hit the adjacent balls in the trough. Also, you may need to adjust the
ball trough wire forms to ensure that they click down when the ball passes and that they stay down. Sometimes vibration from the targets going
up and down and while playing the game can make the wire forms lift a little and give a false reading in the ball trough. The trough microswitches
must be perfect. (Three things that must be adjusted perfectly (Left ball lock switches), shooter lane switch and ball trough microswitches). They
all work with each other.

One last thing, remove ceramic disc caps on the sling shots if you have any. They're not needed here and can disrupt things.

First, I need to correct what I said earlier. I have both an Alltek MPU and Alltek SDU powering this pin. I have to assume that both of these relatively young boards are working correctly.
===========================================

There are none.

Check. It is gapped properly. It is not binding. All looks good.

I have had the apron off more games than I can count. Manually manipulating all of the switches. I have triple-checked all my gaps. All are opening and closing correctly. All 4 micro switches are opening and closing correctly.

Here is what I have:

The 3 switches colored in green represent the 3 switches on the left side of the play field. The 2 switches highlighted in pink are the left saucer( Kick out hole) and the the micro switch that sits closest to the kick out hole.

switch (resized).jpg

With this pic below , the switches highlighted in blue represent the two micro switches and the outhole switch. If I have a ball loaded in to the kick out hole and manually push the first micro switch in the outhole lane I get the same behavior in that the pin thinks I have drained and it kicks out the next ball and bumps ball in play to #2.

switch_2 (resized).jpg

Without turning this explanation into a confusing morass, basically, when the kick out hole is activated, either one of the two other switches highlighted in pink act just the same and advance ball in play

All of the switches in question have the common yellow/red power wire. It may not be relevant but the Left Midlane switch connects to MPU A4-J2-13. And the Left outhole switch connects to MPU A4-J2-12. None of the other switches in the Y/R array behave like the 3 switches I have highlighted in pink. The ball shooter lane switch causes some funky action but will not advance me to the next ball in play. And I can press Advance Spinner To End switch and all it will do is keep scoring 7000 points; It will not cause a ball in play advance.

The short answer to all of this is that the Left Midlane switch acts like the Left outhole switch and makes the pin think a ball has drained.

This is my last hurdle to having this pin play like a million bucks.

At this point in time I am still scratching my head.

Have you checked the diodes on the switches?

I know, it may be a stupid question, but I don't remember reading if you had or not.

I was going to go there as well. I'd place the game into switch test and ground each switch before the banded end of the diode. As you do this, look up at the
display to ensure the correct number shows up for the switch on the display. Compare the number with the switch matrix number. If one is incorrect or not
triggering, you found a problem.

Yup. Sounds diode related. There must be other switches causing bad behavior. If you find other ones we can draw a box and pinpoint what 4 switches you need to examine the diodes on.

I had replaced every diode on this play field and thought I had that fixed. I guess not. It is not a solenoid which I hace disabled by pulling the 1 amp fuse. So either a switch or---the remote possibility that a diode I replaced is bad from the start.

I have to move to some other things for awhile. NB is getting shoved back in the corner to be conquered on another day.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Anybody know the part number for these, so I can get the up on the website for sale?

Stern_Twin_Baffle (resized).JPG

LOL, I just created some too. Great minds.

Brian.

20200109_220621 (resized).jpg

World just works like that sometimes.

-Hans

They are called back box light baffles.

https://www.marcospecialties.com/control/keywordsearch?SEARCH_STRING=baffles

https://www.pinballlife.com/search.html?Search=baffles

I have not seen them referenced in any of my Stern manuals. I cannot offer a part number.

Lectronamo sb-100 replacement complete! Woop! Thanks to @Gott-leib and especially @Slochar!

just be mindful if home 3d printing light baffles / shrouds that depending on a few elements like
- the home 3d printer print material used & the percentage of fill as home printing is rarely solid filled
- the globes (filament or led)
- the game environment (atmospheric temperature, sunlight and even transporting)
that temperature may come into play causing the shrouds to warp and distort

Nice. Just getting ready to change the VFW s to Chimes

that is sweet. um, what how who to do this? I'm sure my Dracula would sound better with chimes.

2 hard parts: a badass has to have written the ROMs and you need to procure a chime box. The rest is wiring.

hmmm, I have a spare gottlieb chime box and wire, now I just need a badass LOL

So happy with this mighty foursome.

IMG_0387.jpeg

Dude, where is the NSFW tag???

If you're going to have 4... that's a pretty good set.

where is Catacomb?

Here I is!

96CCCC4A-9E8D-4B1D-9A0D-23E895839091 (resized).jpeg

Was hoping to see it next to a Quicksilver and a Nine Ball

Can’t accommodate that request, but how bout between a Stars and a Flight 2000?

9C1E4881-56A9-4A52-94A3-4230AA94F87C (resized).jpeg

A085A145-2573-41C6-AEA9-DA5891BFFF7E (resized).jpeg

How about cheetah and Big Game

6D91ACF4-17EA-4B20-A4C6-5F5AB21AB3B8 (resized).jpeg

Heaven!! Lucky bugga

Been on the hunt for a nice one!

Yes Cheetah. I'm desperate for it.

Cheetah or big game would be a hard choice.

They might be the two best early sterns. Would love to set a cheetah next to my big game. Someday.

What a lineup! And a Minor Threat fan to boot. Wish I could find a Big Game and/or Cheetah as well.

With all the interest in Classic Stern's these days I'm very glad I got my Big Game when I did, even though it's a real beast.

Guess I'm in the minority that likes the original sound set up.

I also like my Lectronamo with the processed sounds. My Sinbad on chimes is enough for me lol

Why is#cheetah such a harder game to find?

It's "hot" right now and only 1223 made.

I don't think it's particularly a great player, I think I kept it a couple years and moved it along. Different shot geometry for sure and you can sure see the influence of previous Harry Williams designs on the playfield.

Too bad there's no saucer. It could be a good multiball game. I always thought the 5 bank was begging for a sweep award, but the software doesn't react fast enough (If you sweep all 5, it usually thinks you got targets 5 and 4 and sometimes 3 out of order).

I used to actually try to get the matrix completed on the upper right 3 bank, if you can get the spinners lit, you can get killer scores. And of course the removal of the left lane bonus collect to but once per game was essential.

Wasn't aware of that. Huh. I've ALWYAS wanted one - a friend and I had one back in the early 90's, but we parted it out because the playfield was crap. He still has the backglass (which, if I recall correctly, was in GORGEOUS shape) framed and hanging up on the wall.