well done!!

Have you thought of taking some still photos?

I love the new location of the hanging body.

And the Skull of course.

I just checked my production number is 197

but production order is 143 (I think this is the build order)

not sure what you mean about "might be able to increase sales" they are sold out. Can't increase more than sold out.

I liked the intro of video, but the actual game play video was a terrible, I can't think that anyone thinks that's an acceptable gameplay video.

No shots made, no scoop or diverters made. Basically nothing but a dark video which I could make little to nothing out of.

Kevin, thanks for all the effort looks really good, I hope I didn't sound too critical when I said the video was hard to see anything of the flow or the shots etc..

It's just the intro was so very well done as good as Stern does, but the actual gameplay video was a letdown.

I know that sounds like I'm complaining, but if you look at the main body of the video I'm sure you'd agree it's worse than any of your prior gameplay videos.

Great job, overall the finished product looks fantastic, but I think you'll agree with me the gameplay video, is well below average.

That is just cinstructive criticism, it's fine for what it is ( I mean it's better than no video ) but to me I would try for a more accurate representation of an actual game rather than a demonstraton of a handful of glow balls which aren't even a part of the game in the first place.

Hard to believe really with so many movies made into pins that Predator had not been made until now.

Koodos to Kevin, as for the low number made it's always better to leave them wanting more as the saying goes.

In case you missed or can't find the old thread where Kevin explained the rules:

I love how you have evaluated the pinball, we agree on many aspects.

However, I disagree with you on the Hopper. I think it's location before was too obvious, or too prominent if you will. I think, now with it being back and by default 'higher' as well as the back of the game is higher. It gives the illusion of him being hung from a tree what is called the rainforest canopy. This is physically the highest point of the play field. Also, out of the way enough that it's more at the periphery of the game so that it's an ornament, but not the main focus of the game.

Plus being farther back gives the illusion of being in the distance and it's smaller size than the skull in the foreground blends better as small object in the distance. I know these are not size appropriate, but just as in a picture farther away things get smaller, I think that this is the best overall placement (as well as the prior placement was quite out of place to me).

Ted, can you do a pro video if it makes it to Allentown? I know with your movie background it would be epic. Loved you critter movie ('Hell Spawn' was it?)

That's just wrong, hope you have the copyright on that bad boy could be Skit-B number 2 pin.

Don't you know Arnold as well?

If My wife lets me go to Allentown we should get together all the Predator crew.

I would get on the waiting list, it's free and I suspect ~50 people will back out.

We shall see, but no harm in getting on the waiting list.

you should sell a plug and play Choppa mod for Predator. I'm sure you'd get lot of buyers.

What is the hold up for decent pictures and a decent video? I mean decent pics could take less than an hour start to finish.

Something's not right with the lack of exposure, I mean one totally dark video in all these days or weeks since it was 'done', come on man.

what is to prevent Kevin from taking a pic and posting it here?

I could take a picture of a pinball machine and post it on the Internet in 20 seconds. I see no reason why Kevin could not as well.

I hear people say he's probably too busy working on the pin, too busy he can't take 30-40 seconds and snap a picture?

That does not sound good.

Thanks for some review, I presume cameras and phones are forbidden at shows?

This has been said several times, in fact the 'done' video shows (or doesn't show) the same thing, if you recall the only time we ever have seen the 'UV' paint is when Kevin actually shines a black light like 2" from the naked PF. This is not how the black light is implemented in the game, in fact the UV paint was supposed to be the selling point of this pin and IMO until I hear otherwise or see for myself (in the game not on a naked PF with a black light 2" from the paint) it does not seem to work at all.

Not true, you can still buy a working pin for $750 or even get some pins for free. You can buy honest to goodness real working pins that are very god for $2k.

Just because some pins sell for $8k or $5k doesn't mean it's a rich mans hobby now.

A Ferrari sold at auction for $24 million, does that mean Everyone have to be super-rich to buy a classic car now?

This is a good point, in fact it's likely, probably a glitch in the program, or the mode is not known and people think the machine is malfunctioning.

Jpop said when he was at Williams there were something like 50 engineers working there.

People were buying nib Stern for less than $4k at Christmas 'flash sale' on Amazon, there are some deals out there.

I think the owners will be happy with the end result, especially for the price..

I think this implies the price is especially cheap? I can point to ST pro for the same price. Just saying $4800 is not cheap.

Some say new Stern pros are stripped, however no one says there is less on a Predator than on a Stern pro (IMO).

Don't want to argue, but $5k is $5k no mater who makes it. In other words, to me this game needs to equal or surpass ST pro or Tron pro for it to be considered 'cheap' at $5k.

On a side note, if the UV paint is supposed to be its killer feature and yet if you can't see it, what good is that? How is that a bargain?

CFTBL without hologram...

I am not saying the UV paint does not exist. I am saying it's invisible ink. That's a pretty big deal. If you need a UV flashlight 2" from the naked playfield to see the UV effect, than in other words it is a failure.

Mission complete video did not show any UV paint effect, show reviewers could not see it. it's not there (in the sense that being able to see it is the main point) edit: this according to people that have played it, I have not seen it in person myself.

This has got to be the most disappointing 4 week span, since the whole "mission complete" nonsense (no real video or pictures), not working at convention, invisible UV paint and top it all Kevin radio silence mode. I can not think of a worse follow up to the initial post of this thread.

not yet, but it's getting close. I'd like to see a few picks and a video of the so called complete game, I don't think that's too much to ask for.

Ok,

The game is 'complete' I'm using Kevin's words, can we not even see a few pictures of the final game? We have nothing from the convention or from Kevin, it takes about 8 seconds to take a picture and post it.

I just took a pic of this post to show how simple it is to take a picture and post it on the thread.image-551.jpg

Sorry, don't mean to put Kevin down, but since day one on this thread all I asked for was can we see a few pics or a video that is not 99% in the dark?

It's been 4 weeks, if there is no pictures or video nor any reply from Kevin, I just assume the pin is not really a complete working game.

Thanks, I will refrain from posting negative posts.

It's not directed at Kevin who seems super cool, and I know he's working.

It's more about me being a pessimist overall, and since there is nothing to talk about I like to stir the pot, rather than talk about ponies or ear rings or other nonsense.

Please, everyone don't attack any negative reviews. I want to hear the bad as well as the good.

Too often, I have expressed a question or concern and had people say "why don't I just drop off if I didn't like it! Instead of questioning this pin which is the best pin ever made obviously, Predator rules all".

This is kind of the vibe I get from some whenever anything is even the slightest bit negative against Predator.

I just hope this does not prevent some people from posting their free opinions.

I have talked to some people on PM who told me they don't want to post anything negative for fear of the fanboys here on this thread.

All I said is don't hold back on honest reviews for fear of intimidation posts and instantly I get a negative reaction I was warning against.

Thanks for proving my point.

Like when I say I can't see the UV paint and next thing the 'so called' complete game is changed so that more powerful UV light is added.

thanks for the great review.

I was telling someone that I was on the list for Predator, he said "that's the game with the UV paint", so that's something to me that is almost the essence of the game. Like CFTBL that's the game with the Hologram. Now take Hologram out of CFTBL it's still plays the same but it's missing something that is almost it's calling card.

I never did understand the two stand up targets in the center of the PF.

I believe it's getting a new video done so we can actually see gameplay

this is my main concern, stand up targets very close to the flippers.

I think he's saying the reviews he doesn't like are biased. Not really sure unless he gives an example.

Of the people who have played it, is it as good as say LOTR or SM or other $5k games such as Tron etc?

I know it's rare, and has a great theme, but gameplay wise, does it stand up as a $5k game?

Not trying to start anything, I'm just trying to ask, if I'm not a super duper Predator fan, would I be better off with a LOTR, IM, Metallica (ish) pin?

Thanks Rosh.

That's all I'm asking, I ask an honest question and people jump on me.

You planning on Saturday?

Thanks for the above posts, I am not trying to put Predator down when I asked if it's worth $5k the same money as LotR or Tron or ST pro.

I want people's opinions, I am not saying Predator sucks. But I like a full feature game not not a full compromise game.

I am sure some will like it, but equally sure some will not, but that goes for all games, I was reading reviews of Tron and LotR which put them as poor to very poor. Doesn't mean I agree with the reviews, but I have an open mind and like to hear what others think about pins.

Thanks

Are the center targets a lot closer than TNT targets on AcDc ?

Wow we agree.

A video is not hard to do, the game has been 'done' for two months now for Pete's sake.

Have you looked at that video? Or was it a glow ball display? I forget.

If I recall 80% of the video was in total darkness! I mean just a dark game with glow balls. If I recall, the video did not display one made ramp shot, not one made loop, not even sure if I saw one shot to the hole.

'mission complete' video didn't show anything worth seeing. Plus things have changed since 'mission complete' such as the light tube. Hard to tell if anything else as we never did se any high res pics which I think Kevin said he would do.

He said the 'mission complete' video was quick and dirty since he was trying to get something out quick, but that does not excuse the next 50+ days with no real pics or real video of the game.

Great job Kevin looking forward it seeing you at Allentown hopefully.

Plus, Kevin pulled the videos from Thanksgiving and before. I can not even see the old examples of play or the way it flows or ramp shots, loops, rules or sound effects.

I know those were prototype games, but he pulls everything and does not post any new pics or videos. I would not be expecting people to pay the balance until the game was shown to be 'complete' which we have not seen yet.

I don't mind the delay at all, it's more the lack of a single picture of the game since it's been 'Complete' and the lack of a real video since 'complete'.

No matter, if it's at Allentown, I'll get a real look see and play the game if it's there and working. And I will give my personal review.

like to know that too.

The silence is deafening

So they display The unfinished prototype last year but not the actual 'complete' machine?

That's a bit odd IMO

If I can't see the game and play it, I'm out. I had though and hoped to see it at Allentown and it's a location within driving distance of 90 million or more people so I thought it would be ideal and a lot of pinsiders were planning on seeing it there.

I played the ST pro and that was good enough, the LE is the same game with a few minor additions.

Besides, I know Stern can build games. It's like buying a Honda or buying a car build in a basement, there is a level of credibility at Stern that SKit-B has not reached.

I've seen hundreds of videos on the internet, by people with a video camera. It doesn't have to be the second coming of Stanley Kubrick. It just has to be a video. It doesn't have to be a $3000 camera. Whoever is using that argument is delusional. I am not saying take a video on a camera phone, but something decent a $300 video camera is probably great. And Kevin was making videos for years. It's not like he's inventing the wheel.

Not going to Allentown is bad, not talking some photos and video is simply unbelievable at this juncture what are we 70 days since it's been 'complete'?

how hard is this to do?

I thought Allentown was unknown if Kevin is going to be there.

don't show that to Wahchintonka, he'll say that takes as much talent as being a F1 driver, or maybe Nascar since it's not quite as great as the one I posted.

There was a $300 camera pointed at Mustang from above , doesn't look too hard to me.

This is a pic of that live feed.

image-685.jpg

Can't see a bloody thing on that video, no ramps made, no loops made, total dark can't see a darn thing, no UV paint whatsoever.

Greatly disappointed not to see the game at Allentown. It could have dispelled or confirmed a lot with a show appearance. Almost like they didn't want to be seen.

That was a great reply.

I will say the only thing I would expect to have changed at Allentown would have been me or other prospective owners who could have played the game, this was my chance to play and Kevin's chance to showcase the game to an audience of potentially 50 million people within driving distance.

I could have formed an opinion and given another review to prospective buyers.

I think it took Ted less time to film his masterpiece 'Deadly Spawn' than it has taken to get a simple gameplay video made since this thread started with 'mission complete'.

Maybe the invisible ink is different?

My excitement has gone from 100% couple of years ago to about 22% now. I can not imagine a worse roll out and this whole 'mission complete' thread was about 3 months premature at least.

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I believe this is bad, and should be followed by our ability to 'sell' our spots.

Kevin said he'd have a better video 2 and a half months ago, said the first was a quick and dirty 5AM video don't even know why bother with that in the first place. But let's see what is taking months and no reply to people who want refunds and no reply on this thread? Seems like something is wrong with the game or he might have got a video out by now.

Good news for you and someone on the wait list!!

so sorry to hear about your situation. Best of luck to your son.

Kevin is know for not responding to emails or PMs for sometimes weeks at a time. I would not count on getting a refund quickly. I am sure eventually, but don't count on quickly. I would make other plans if you are counting on this refund. No stocks to sell or anything like that?

I'm starting to wonder what happened to Kevin.

I think you need a team to do this kind of project, one person can simply not do it all, or if he can it adds exponentially to the time.

One year anniversary bump
happy-first-birthday.jpg

Why did Kevin needed all that money back in June 2014, and there's not a pin to be seen yet?

I was on board with this project as it was originally presented that the money would be collected as the machines were being built, or that the machines would be built in batches (like AMH) and you could pay for your machine once it was on the schedule to be built.

So, then instead of that (which to me was a reasonable plan and it works for Spooky). I didn't feel that Kevin needed $750K to start the ball rolling. IMO.

I'm sorry.

Didn't realize you guys were so sensitive.

Sorry, just having a little fun.

I understand building a great pin is not an easy thing to accomplish as JJP and PPS both illustrate, I expect it's many times harder for one person to pull off.

I am very optimistic that Predator pins will be shipping very soon and that all will receive their pins in the next 6-9 months.

It's not far fetched to assume that WOOLY is hurting by Kevin's actions.

Maybe it's a good thing that crowd sourced pins will no longer have success they enjoyed 3 years ago with Jpop and Skit-B leading the way.

How could resurrecting this thread cause the project to fail? I think that's a straw argument. It's in Kevin's hands, he has the funds he wanted. This thread will not cause the project to fail.

This, Predator was not complete 366 days ago.

But, IMO if you don't want to be called out on this, you shouldn't post you are complete, don't collect $750k in hard earned money for building and say you will be shipping in October 2014, here we are 7-8 months after Kevin started collecting $750k without nary a pin shipping.

I still don't understand how people feel fine with Kevin handling this situation.

However, my intention when bumped this thread, I pointed out how it's been one year now since the game was 'complete'. I had my doubts at the time, I really had my doubts when Kevin changed the money collection plan (that was a deal breaker) and now looking back, it seems I was more correct than some people would like to believe.

I don't understand why I am being shushed in any way. I never made any delivery dates or never collected any money for this project.

This situation is absurd, and people let it happen. First thing I did when Kevin asked for $3,000 up front money, was to say, that's not what we agreed to, we agreed to $250 deposit, I am not shifting the risk of this venture to myself. He's the company, if it makes money he gets rewarded. I don't pay Best Buy a year in advance of buying a TV. I can't recall a thing I buy where I have to pay for it a year in advance.

Does anyone notice far less Kevin posting and responding to anything after he collected $750K?

Is this a coincidence?

Is everyone comfortable with Kevin being able to budget and handle $750K? Does he look like he's had that kind of money and responsibility before?

I'd say the people petting Kevin and not asking hard questions, not allowing others to criticize when they have a valid concern, not pushing back when he asked for $3000 in advance deserve some blame for this fiasco. If we all had said to Kevin, talk is cheap, stick to the plan, cash on delivery (this method works by the way, see AMH).

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