Ah, okay, thanks for the heads up.

predator.jpg

I saw this scrap metal art predator in the Pittsburgh strip district. No, not that kind of strip district.

hey, i saw a similar but different one last summer in San Diego. it was on an artist's table in Old Town.
totally forgot about that. too cool

Here is a sweet picture I just came across......

Screenshot_2014-04-06-15-19-04.png

That's a cool pic, but I still blame Michael McDonald for the downfall of the Doobie Brothers.

Production Launch 2day!!!! F&@# yeah!

Predator shot from the Michigan Pinball Expo (MPE)

IMG_0104.png

I thought Kevin was gonna be at some Pinball shows? How is it gonna start production today?

I just read the last email that was sent out by Kevin. It didn't give April 7 as a production start date, but it did say early April.

I believe Kevin is bringing the machine to MGC, but not Zoo, so wondering if MGC will be his last show for a while.

and I saw it through a Fish EYE lens.......fish eye lens.....fish eye lens.

http://tosh.comedycentral.com/video-clips/ldijqb/cooler-through-a-fisheye-lens

April 7th was the day Kevin stated (with reluctance) back in January that he hoped they would start shipping by.

As per the interview Kevin did at TPF he said that production was still on course for an April start, although he didnt give a specific date.

As stated probably a 100 times over by a lot of people, I'm all for Kevin getting this thing right in his eyes before he starts sending these things out.

See that's the thing, I don't think the game is "fast" either and for some reason a lot of people are flipping out and saying different things towards it.

I've played the game. It needs work. It's missing some stuff.

The guy that compared this to a Stern Pro, I have to ask, REALLY???????

I mean, I am glad these guys are trying to bring this game out, but let's go back to this and sit down and realize the following:

You have guys that have full time jobs and have never really made a production pinball before. This really is coming out of a garage so to speak.

This is P-ROC and you don't have experienced designers behind the game. To say that this game plays like Stern Pro games or games released lately either you don't know a thing about pinball or apparently 26 years of Data East/Sega/Stern factory stuff is just tossed out the window.

Almost EVERY pinball has problems. People complain about Stern stuff being broken out of the box, and Williams had tons of incorrect stuff all over their board causing a plethora of problems.

If you're patient I am sure this game will be fine and play fine and come out eventually. However, anyone who is into a pinball for just looks and not playability please find the nearest Wizard of Oz, I am into it for the reverse. I like games that play well, looks can be deceiving (Shadow/Demolition Man) and pretty games can be there just for shiny lights but you have to realize this is essentially being done out of a garage type thing with hard working guys who have other stuff going on.

I hope the game gets the treatment it deserves but I don't agree with the product as it sits right now. I just think people pay so much attention to details of the cabinet(s) vs the actual gameplay issues at hand with things that need to be addressed.

We just finally received some protos of a new COB UV Panel....It is insanely bright and small.
It has mirror framing around it.....One heck of an amount of UV from a small rectangle...
More, then anything else I have seen....
It might fit somewhere good on Predator....
It is 1" x 1.5"

UVCOB.JPG

UVCOB2.JPG

Ok with that being said what are the actual gameplay problems in your eyes? I'd really like to know cause im about to be out on the game

That's pretty cool. Maybe from under the apron?

Mostly....

IMG_3870.jpg

You don't know how refreshing it is to hear someone on Pinside wanting to discuss gameplay over bling, lighting, and toys.

P.S. Oh! Hey! It's Dreamtr. Is there a forum where I won't bump into you?

I will try one out tonight, and see the throw....

Cool!

I am kind of all over the place, haha!

Specific gameplay stuff, now mind you, I played the game maybe 10 times and it was down quite a bit but this was in Louisville.

The main problem is the layout of the playfield. I think everyone takes for granted how good some of the designers are with their games and why they are so respected.

The design to have standup targets in the middle of the playfield and almost the same distance of ramps for each flipper (very long shots) means there just is not much "flow" in what specifically there is going on. If you play the game you will understand. Each shot in various games (like Tron) has a purpose. It seems that you may be stuck hitting a bunch of nothing on a lot of these but with first glance the layout looks fine, until you see the foot of space in the middle of the playfield (where most people on 90% of pinballs shoot for) ends up being drop targets and badly positioned pop bumpers. In short, you end up hitting a lot of nothing for awhile unless you are going for very long ram shots and trying to set up a very ambiguous multiball.

With that being said it doesn't seem like much code is in the game for the DMD for callouts and what is going on. The ball getting stuck in spots where there is a ton of dead space isn't making sense either, but the bottom line is the game needs work, but it's to be expected. It's a prototype and has the ability to be a decent game, but you can't confuse it with a Stern title. The "blood" doesn't get flowing with this game so to speak whereas your heart can really be pumping when you play a lot of pins.

Unfortunately most of the "new breed" of pinball collectors only care about mods. I can't even believe how many people just talk about mods and don't care how the games play and to them a game that really has some terrible gameplay somehow looks amazing to them because they added $600 in mods. I understand this is a hobby (car enthusiasts pump up their vehicles to the max) but the thing is I don't claim to be an interior designer, looks aren't as important to me. (Though I have to say some of the alternate translites coming out these days are horrendous and people think they are the greatest things since sliced bread but it is what it is.)

The bottom line is I have played tons and tons of pinballs and I regularly go back and give plenty of pinballs second and third chances to see if I was losing my mind because in my opinion you can't really rate a pinball on a handful of games alone but I go back and reacquire pins that I feel I did not give credit where credit is due.

I still feel this game will be fine if the code is updated but let's me honest, there have been other "custom" games made before this game has even went into production yet. Personally I would like to see this game out and about but you're talking the first pin from a group that does not have Jersey Jack backing, and you see how "well" (being facetious here) WOZ turned out. You just have to know what you are getting into, and this is coming from a Predator fan.

I never did understand the two stand up targets in the center of the PF.

LOFL

Just because many (myself included) like to tinker with mods does not mean we don't care about gameplay that is nonsense. It seems some that don't like mods like to take shots at us for no real reason. It's part of the hobby for some of us and for others it's not no big deal. Doesn't mean pinheads with either preference do not covet gameplay.

I *only* buy mods. With so many readily available, who needs the actual machines anymore?

Like I said, it is just like modding a car. No problem in that. The issue I have is that in the past 3-4 years the new crowd that has just gotten into pins pretty much insists that is what makes a good pin these days. Though I will say what I have said for awhile, the "prettier" newer stuff it seems that most people that are not as gameplay oriented will salivate over (family friendly) and the hardcore pinball players tend to stay away from some of those. Just an observation. When you have windfalls of people selling certain "pretty games" that they thought were keepers you can definitely see what I am referring to.

So are you gonna mod your mods?

Haha. I laughed out loud.

If a new Whiplash figure with added EL wire qualifies? ...then I suppose, yes!?

I disagree with you, just because you don't like mods does not mean your a hardcore player and vice versa. That is a bit silly IMO. Many mods actually add to the experience and when I play a nicely modded pin verses a stock one the stock one is much more bland. Of course that's just like my opinion man. If some like stock better more power to em but if they think they are a more 'hardcore player' for it they are a bit delusional.

People enjoy modding pins does it mean they will keep them forever? No that is also silly. It's part of the hobby for some we get enjoyment out of enhancing a pin even if it will go some day. I've always gotten more for my modded out pins then you would a stock one so the money loss is not significant and sometime you even come out ahead. However, it's not all about the money it's about the enjoyment a pinhead gets from a pin (both playing and modding). To say one is more hard core player then the other is pretty inaccurate and short sighted IMO. To each their own as always.

Sorry to go off topic all I'll let you have last say so we can get back.

I put black mirrors on the inside panels of my tron pin arcade mod.
Is that overkill ?

tron-pin-mini-arcade-onbb.jpg

I am not saying I don't like mods. I am agreeing with sosage is that the only thing people care about nowadays are mods.

I mean, I can join fracas too.

YOU GOING TO UPDATE THE CODE OF THE UPDATED CODE FOR BETTER GAMEPLAY HERPA DERPA? I mean, don't get me wrong, I am a fair opportunity person that calls out the mod and gameplay community =)

All you have to do is look at Demolition Man. Why the heck anyone felt the need to "mod" that game (for gameplay) and change the music when the gameplay was already amazing made absolutely no sense to me.

If you read what I previously stated I completely understand this is like a vehicle to some people, but when you have $2000 in mods and you don't even play the game, it really does turn it into a showpiece you can't play. I will always be a pinball player with minimal mods but I don't dislike them.

And it is definitely not short sighted. I come from a competitive background in arcade gaming, fighting games, and pinball. All 3 have the same type of "modding" going on where there are separate communities within. USUALLY the people doing the mods are not into "playing" the games as much, just modding code, marquees, arcade sticks, etc. Believe me from 23 years of tournaments and all these games I can tell you it is true for many people.

Usually the guy with the gold $500 arcade stick is going to lose 1st round to someone in Street Fighter using a PlayStation pad with a $20 converter. Just saying, lol

https://www.stanwinstonschool.com/blog/the-original-predator-suit-jean-claude-van-damme

I agree 100% on this. The modding around here has become priority more so than gameplay or even setting a game to play correctly. Tweeking the gameplay instead of the looks, and many don't even know what that even means.

Yes. That is over kill. Would be hysterical though.

I don't get worked up over Mods either way. I have very, very few and the ones I have done are often about fixing game play issues, protecting the machine or helping an inexperienced player (e.g. the piano in TZ, since before that telling someone to shoot the piano was of little value, since hard to see it on the playfield).

Some of the best players I know, who are "hardcore" have mods, maybe not a ton, but some. And some of the best players I know have no mods and would not even think about it (other then to fix game play issues or to protect the machine). So, I don't think you can draw any direct correlations between skill and 'hardcore' and modding.

I will say that newer players to the hobby seem to like mods more then those who have been in it longer. If modding a game makes you happy, so be it, if taking a piece of crap game and bringing it back to life is what gets you pumped, good for you. If re-theming a game gives you enjoyment, have fun. And if building a game from scratch is where you want to spend you time, think twice, but if you still want to do it, go for it. If just playing your games is what gives you a rush -- then just play!! Bottom line, do what makes you happy, life is short and don't ever give a shit what others think.

Any new news on the Predator pinball?

I believe it's getting a new video done so we can actually see gameplay

MPE Impressions:

General

I went on Sunday as things where wrapping up. The game was up and running up until the last hour or so when they had to do some P-roc stuff. Didn't get to see the boys, but I did get 4 or 5 games in. I have played the game many times over the past few years/expos so I have an idea of the game in terms of the rules.

Approach

I believe most peoples issues stem from it not being the most approachable game in the business. Its not like CV, MM, AFM ect. that have very obvious goals for newcomers. That in combination with the stand-ups in the middle resulted in many very quick games for the people I was watching. Also the hunt mode was basically unused by most as they had no idea what the other flipper buttons did. It is not an easy game to approach but the rules are very deep which leads me to believe it will do well in a home setting, but not as much in the bar.

UV

The UV... I wanted to see it, but I couldn't unless I got just the right angle on the board. It wasn't overly bright and most of the overhead lights where off (welcome change from years past). I hope a combination of brighter (more) black lights, thicker coating of the UV and a slightly darker room will help this, but who knows.

Gameplay

Gameplay was good, however the rear post that actuates on flipper movement was not appearing to do anything. I was working on locking balls and starting modes but never got anything really stringed together. The shots are tight and it really feels like a shooters game. You need to be able to call it and make a tight shot to advance. Very little is accomplished in the game by random or missed shots (stand ups like Green Goblin on SM for example). I have felt for a while, and still do, that this will be a very challenging game for anyone to work through.

DMD/Sound

I play most pinball based on sound and don't really look at the DMD unless absolutely necessary. In general I have issues in these settings as I cant really hear the game. That being said I could tell even at its reduced volume that the sound system is deep, and really wants to be cranked up. The DMD animations looked ok, but its not really my first concern... As long as I have distinct sounds for different modes and accomplishments that's all I personally need.

Art

Looks good and fits well. The plastics above the field of play are nice and add a bit of the jungle feel. With some creative use of LED's I feel this can be enhanced to more of a pimped out Congo LED feel if you know what I'm saying. The things done by Backalley are all top notch and look great in the game.The skulls/spines off the side are a nice touch, however it wouldn't work for my set up... Think ill have Laseriffic do something up personally.

Takeaway

My machine is near the middle of production as of last indicated. I am in for the time being, but I hope to have some of these things addressed in that time. The place I have is good because I can see some completed machines rolling out before I buy. That being said, I am very tempted atm by the new premium Luci pkg that AC/DC has.... Time will tell.

Cheers

Very cool looking image, but one which I think highlights that as of now, Predator, with its setting that is supposed to make Cambodia look like Kansas, instead has a sort of Fremont Street Experience vibe to it:
http://www.gannett-cdn.com/media/USATODAY/USATODAY/2013/03/27/lights8-16_9.jpg

Still pleading for alternate lighting scheme.

Yes!...Tweedlefuzz got it when he said give it a congo vibe...most of the bright white leds need to be changed to green, the slings to red and the pops to red also. Alternativley (a pie in the sky) it would have been nice if the plastics were clear with the graphics printed on them so when the black light kicked on they would glow like the ramps.

Yup I knew someone would get it.

I have finished testing the COB Panel.

UV Light carries a distance of 3-4 feet with no problems and has an effect up to 6 Feet.
It will light the majority of a playfield with one panel, 1" x 1.5".

I wil try some pictures to share, but Kevin, My Predator Master...pick up the phone and call me....
you really need to try this....

Art

Priority mail me one ready to wire in and I will take it to MGC!

I will cover the cost if you want to do this!

Great idea. You could temp it just to see the effect. Did I read that the arcade room is now in the big room where the venders were last year? I hope they keep the lighting down a bit.

Ill send you one Priority with the others coming your way....

Are you sure he is going...Its not posted on his site according to M...

Art

spoke with Kevin a few days ago, as of then he was going to be at MGC.

On its way priority...Make it so!

Looks like this has some good potential. Thanks for looking into it and sharing it with us. Hope that this may make the UV layer much more visible.

can't wait to see Predator Mods
anyone have a list yet?
hehehehe.....