I think this made the ramps look a bit less clear during the game. I wonder if it also attributed to stuff looking more washed out than normal with cool white GI. The best way to sell games is to make them look fantastic and lighting is part of that. Stern has finally figured that out. Of course these games are already sold so it doesn't matter as much but for future titles it will be a larger issue.

At the Tacoma show I saw an utterly gorgeous ice world theme on Whitewater. It had pretty a similar take on GI as Predator. Haha. Something's wrong there.

As much as I think the plastics contribute to the "homebrew" feel that cause complaint, I guess I would be amazed if there aren't 100s of these things sitting in boxes at Kevin's shop. As pro as some of the machine looks, more than anything else, I'm just so very surprised the art on these plastics ever got the go ahead. I think people toss around the, "Har har, that looks like my kid drew it!", line way too often... but, uhm, I have an 8 and a 5 year old. They really do have color books that look a lot like those plastics.

Without having played it in its newest incarnation, my only list of changes that would seem to me to have a very high return on investment would be; 1) Lighting and, 2) Plastics. I could rest a lot easier with Hopper's banishment if the rest of the field was little more, mmm, polished? It should be stated that changing the lighting may very well in some ways address the plastics as well.

EDIT: Just watched the "Complete" video again. Forgot how cool those green flashers look.

EDIT2: Are we assuming the reason the UV banks are now always on is because as florescent they'd never *snap* on as required for game play? Also, with where the UV banks are, the ramps are directly infront of them. Given how they light up when hit, might they be soaking up a lot of the energy and creating a UV "shadow" right in the middle of the table?

I can't think of any way around that. A couple of spots pointed popward on the slings? Maybe an additional on the standup bank point toward the flippers? Anyone?

EDIT3: Can anyone who played this weekend comment on the user controlled orbit, both in function and strategic implementation as it applies to the rules. Savvy? I mean, it's one thing if it works, but there needs to be a good reason to use it or not. Right? Kevin might be the best person to answer that one.

I am hoping to play a few games in Allentown. I am still in for this game and I am sure Kevin and the team will make sure it all looks professional and functional before it goes out the door.

Why couldn't there be slots cut into the front of the apron and add uv tubes there to shine up the playfield then the side uv could be changed back to what it was?

Great suggestion. I worry about the day one of those tubes shatters. That'd be a nice mess to clean up.

My Review of Predator at TPF:

So I played about 10 games on it and watched at least 30. My son played doubles with me on it as well, he is 8yo.
I will preface this by saying I have been on board with this game from the start...I am #7 with production #10. I was hoping to go there and determine why there was so many conflicting reviews regarding it and if I should stay in til the end. So here goes:

When you first see the pin, it really does capture the Predator feel and theme. The red armor looks great as well as the backglass and playfield. What I did not like, as a first impression, are the "earrings" (as some people call them). I really don't like the hanging skull/spines on the machine. I know this is an aftermarket mod, but they should take em off so the customer/buyer sees the pin as what they will actually get. IMO, the playfield and its artwork are well...just bad ass!! It is probably some of the best artwork I have seen in person on a pin. I looked closely at it looking for the UV layer. You can see it if you look close. I think the UV paint they used is just not reacting to the UV light. I don't know why, but it isn't. I don't really think even if the lights were off that the image would react.

The toys on the game are a mixed bag for me. The hanging body just does not cut it for as it is. I like the concept, but it really does look unfinished. It needs something to cover up where it hangs from. It is not really a part of the game and has really, no impact on your scoring in it either. The VUK looks killer and is by far the best feature of the game. It was still glitchy. The ball got stuck there like the optos weren't seeing the ball, so the guy there (not Kevin) had to do some auto ball find and it would kick the ball out. The claw diverter was cool but would place below the VUK.

I like the jungle plastics, but imo there are just too many of them. I would have liked to have seen some Predator artwork on them. Like maybe a predator high up on a tree.

The lighting is pretty much what others have said here. It is just way to bright and washes out some of the artwork, which for me is a big no-no. The artwork has to be showcased and it just is not right now. I do like the insert lighting. It looks well thought out and the colors light up nicely, especially when you hit modes.

The dmd, sadly for me, just did not do it. I know people have raved about it, but I just think is is not clear enough. I know the dmd has limitations, but maybe they reached too far on it. I know a lot of people will disagree, but that's where I stand. I think it being just strictly orange is a step backwards.

The audio is a big win for me! I love games with great audio. A game can have a great design, flow, be deep, whatever you want to call it, but with weak audio, it would kill the deal for me. Once again, just for me. So this is another area in which the game shines. I would give the sound a 9/10. I would definitely put a sub on this and let the gunfire rip!

So, I played the first game and really stunk it up. From what I can tell, the left flipper was weak compared to the right. It may just need some adjustment. The from two middle targets are a real bitch! You gotta be on your toes when you go for them or accidentally hit them. The come back at you super fast. I don't really mind them, but what I ended up with is a game that I really never wanted a shot to go straight up (if that makes sense). I was always trying to angle my shots outward. So basically, I tried to eliminate 1/3 of the playfield from my shots.

The ramps were not too difficult in hitting...the right flipper worked great and I could hit the left ramp fairly easily. I think the left flipper being weak caused me to miss some ramp shots. The ramp designs themselves were not bad, and I did not mind them. What I did not like was the clunky looks of them as many have mentioned. They do look unfinished. Imo, they need to be modified.

The game itself does not play "fast". The area above the pops really slows down the game. I would consider this somewhat of a stop and go kind of game...kinda. It is fun trying to get some of the modes going, even though I was asking on the fly, "What the hell did I just start?", lol. My best game was 350mil.

So what do I take away from all this??

I am now MORE confused on whether to stay in or bail on this game. I love the theme and the positives I mentioned above. The things I do not like...I really don't like.

I hope there are some revisions that will still be made...I mean some cosmetic changes would make a big difference. Lighting changes, plastic to cover the hanging toy, get the UV paint to work!

I really wanted to go to TPF and love this game and say SB knocked it outta the park, but it just feels unfinished. Like I said...more unsure now than before.

Lastly, on the plane home I asked my son, "What was your favorite machine?" He said, "World Cup Soccer and Terminator 2 are my favorites." I asked, "What about Predator?" He shook his head and just said, "Nah."

I understand he is only 8, but the kid plays a lot of pinball at home. The excitement factor wasn't there for him.

What to do...what to do?!

^^^^Thanks for taking the time to share your impressions, good and bad. Much appreciated.

This was my strategy, as well. Maybe that's why I found the game easy while others found it hard. I almost never deliberately shot at the lock targets unless I was getting close to multiball. I would pick them up on wild balls often enough and the outside shots were getting me through the modes in the meantime.

I had a very similar experience with my own pinball son, admittedly after only playing the prototype in Tacoma. He watched my one and only game, probably 15 minutes or so. There were guys behind me in line of course, so after I beat feet when my last ball finally drained we went to do other stuff. Later in the show I asked if he wanted to go have a turn on the machine and he said, "Nah".

:-/

I really do think the first step to acceptance is love for the movie

do you guys really think Skit B has the resources or time now to change the lighting, the plastics, the UV, the hanging toy? I thought they were done? All of the complaints were about UV and so they went in threw in two huge UV light fixtures. Now people are complaining about those. I think they need to just ship and let the mod community handle at this point.

Question, with only 250 games total, will mods even come out? There's not a big market for mods with such a small production number.

If people didn't think it then it probably would not be posted.

i'm gonna burn a J and play the crap outta mine. Y'all talking cray

Four out of four Ghostbusters agree, it's spelled "Zuul".

I have to say I am not a fan of the plastics either. I am a fan of the playfield but the it's like they switched artists for the leaves, also do we really need all leaves for the plastics. Could have mixed it up with more predator stuff, like weapons, anna, or a muddy arnold.

I don't think the UV light for the playfield will ever work in normal light which is fine. But I also don't want it to only work in pitch black either. I do like how the ramps look when the UV mode kicks in.

There are many smart people on pinside I would hope if Skit-b ran into some problems they are having trouble with solving that they would listen to other ideas or ask for some ideas.

I don't care if they don't make deadlines, just make the best predator they can no matter how long it takes.

I don't think it is there yet but I do think it is getting closer.

Still in!!!

#34

Fairly certain Kevin said they did.

+1

I've read every post and all the reviews. I really haven't posted much because everything was hearsay. I'm build # 40 or so, and it seems it's really coming soon. I can't wait for the MGC to put hands on it in it's final state. I never thought when I signed up a year or two ago that this would be a Stern type machine with a theme that was super cool. I always knew it was being made by some kids in a basement. They didn't do a JJP and ask me to plop my money down on faith. Just put up $250 and go along for the ride. Has it all been roses and lolly pops? Nope. The playfield art was not what I was expecting. But now that the whole package is out it makes more sense to me. This isn't the Predator that I had the nuts to make. ( Which I don't. ) This is their Predator they envisioned and BUILT. In the last few post guys are talking about improvements Skit-b should make or they might mod up. I love that. How cool will it be to get a game that will be few and far between and make it even more unique. That may sound like a load of crap to some folks but I love modding pins to what I enjoy. ( I'm not a big seller so I do it for me, not the next guy.) I think in the end if it's not what you expected and it's not worth the money to you, pass. That dollar amount will buy you all kinds of pins. But if it does it for you and ends up in your collection, you've got something special as hell.

Anybody go to MPE today/gonna be at MPE this weekend?

MPE pred.jpg

I was there for 3 hours when the show opened Friday, but Skit-B was not there to turn Predator on at that time. Some lights were on, on the Predator, and I saw people try to start a game, so I imagine some people are going to say it was broke again. I guess since Kevin is running the show machine off of a laptop still, for feedback, it would be hard to leave it on without someone being there to watch it. I will say that the Predator looked a lot better to me in person than the pictures I have seen. I was disappointed though that I did not get to play it.

Awww, you poor baby. That's the spelling used for a popular strain of deep CA bud. It's not your fault you didn't get it!!!!!

I was there on Friday early, most of the games were on but some seemed to be on quarter play (maybe no batteries to hold memory) an hour or so later most were fixed. Predator was on but just displayed P-roc on the dmd. Kevin was there somewhere around 10 or 11 and had it up and running, I talked to one of his guys he said they were pretty busy from the Texas show with traveling and such (said there was 2,200 plays on the machine).

The game looked pretty impressive since the last time I saw it in whitewood and the old cabinet, If I had to nit pick the plastics the resolution did look a little blah when you looked up close (should be easy to fix) and the hanging body which I like where its at could use some better plastic to simulate tree foliage that way it covers the eyelet it hangs from. I think it would be nice to have plastics to cover the lanes if you wanted to experiment. the new uv light doesn't look as good as the old one does but in person it looked a lot better than the pics I saw from Texas, If the body of the light that is silver was painted black like the inside of the cabinet it would be much less noticeable, while playing it didn't seem to get in the way of anything in my opinion.

Playing the game in my opinion was a lot of fun and challenging the first few games were very short and I couldn't seem to get anywhere, also noticed that anyone else in line didn't seem to do any better than me. I played around 20 games through the day and after figuring out some of the rules I started to get better, I had no problems with the flippers hitting any of the ramp shots (week flippers is a huge pet peeve of mine playing pinball) the center shot is brutal, liked the hunt mode, and the multiball where you cant cradle the ball, which seemed to confuse people that didn't understand the game, it confused me a bit because its timed and at the end of the mode the flippers go dead so all the balls can drain, but on the dmd it says keep shooting (might be something to change at the end of the mode to be less confusing). The uv looked awesome glowing the ramps but there's no way your going to see any uv paint with all the lighting in the room. I think as much as it lights up the ramps that I would take Kevins word that in a dark room it will pop out at you. I think it was mostly a positive experience for me, and the game is heading in a good direction. Taking the price point into consideration in my opinion its not anywhere near a stern LE but on par with a pro.

Wow, the hanging skull + spine is.... intense.

I guess I'm just not cool enough to hang out with Californian stoners. Somehow, I'll struggle on.

How much would it cost to rig a little black curtain tent around it? You know? Like a hospital partition type of deal, or, one of those enclosures at science museums for viewing glowy minerals? You could have a county fair barker out front telling people in to get line for their chance to look behind the curtain.... if they DARE!!!!

But seriously. Some clothing racks and black cloth? Out of the question?

I think the game looks pretty nice. Things I would like to see improved (which don't affect gameplay)
1) a nicer looking apron
2) maybe a decal or long plastics with a design to cover the top of the UV lights
3) better designed plastics (exspecailly the one over the right ramp),
4) plastics over the inlanes - I can see someone designing these after market and selling then since it could be profitable ($30*250 = $7,500). It could be foreseeable being able to fund a free game by designing nice plastics for the inlanes.
5) better implementation of the hanging man to cover up the hardware
6) a way to move one of the side skulls and make it a topper instead of mounting on the sides (probably what I will do on my own).

also would like something else instead of the teal bumper caps. Too bad they couldn't of come up with something like a semi-clear brown cap shaped like a top of a bamboo hut....

I must say that the Skit-B guys did a great job on making this project come to life. You guys started out in a basement and created a great looking pin! Im sure you guys gave it your all and it shows. Its very easy for anyone to sit back and say I would of done this or that. The fact that you produced a pin with cool stuff is good for pinball and that's good for me! Kudos guys....Kudos!!

Yeah, the game was set up right next to the doors that face an entire wall of floor to ceiling windows.

The GI could have been turned off and you would have had no problem playing the game, lol

This is directed to Kevin... at MGC, could we look at taking Predator to a small interior room (for pitch black play) or even up the elevator to a hotel room? for the guys that are in on Predator (myself included) to play and see the game in a total dark environment? I'd really like to see the UV in this setting. I traveled specifically to Expo last fall to play Predator but the game never worked, so I'm going to MGC to make a final decision on your game. I really want to see all it has to offer. Thank you for considering.

This is directed to Kevin... at MGC, could we look at taking Predator to a small interior room (for pitch black play) or even up the elevator to a hotel room? for the guys that are in on Predator (myself included) to play and see the game in a total dark environment? I'd really like to see the UV in this setting. I traveled specifically to Expo last fall to play Predator but the game never worked, so I'm going to MGC to make a final decision on your game. I really want to see all it has to offer. Thank you for considering.

Hmmm, so you're asking a man over the internet if he will take you back to his pitch black hotel room so you can play a game with him.

This is why my wife keeps shaking her head and demanding to know why I keep watching videos of men in their basement rather than porn like a normal bloke.....

a pin in an elevator would suck balls. I can just imagine how crammed it would be in there. Plus having to play pinball with it going up and down would take a toll on you eventually.

I didn't say play it in the elevator. Sheesh read people.

I do not know, but can only assume that Predator will be in the regular arcade area. This means that the after party has an added draw! Bring a game and be part of the fun and hopefully also get to play predator in a dark after party arcade experience!

I think playing in the elevator is a great idea

Exactly.

I can barely stand behind some of the unwashed pinheads at the shows.

There would be no way to survive a 4 player game of Predator in an elevator without SCUBA gear.

You could easily simulate the effects of a dark room by putting a piece of cardboard over the glass to block out 90% of the light, and lifting it up enough so you can peek in and see. Since 100% of the UV light source is already under the glass, you would just be trapping the UV in there without any other lighting source...

Would not be hard to take a piece of cardboard someone brought in with their pins to protect the glass to do this.

Who wants to build a fort?

I do, I do!! Can we? Really?

Oh, wait ...... that's not what you meant. Nevermind. Nothing to see here, move along.

Makes me wonder how the up and down motions would effect the ball. Moving downward would make the ball lighter and effects of spin would do some funky things, I would think.

Pinball Olympics elevator here I come

Love in an elevator..

predator-elevator.jpg

Love in an elevator
Flippin' it up when I'm goin' down
Love in an elevator
Flippin' it up till I hit the ground

Predator's in the elevator
MMR on second floor
She said 'can I see you later
And love you just a little more?'
I kinda hope we get stuck
Nobody gets out alive
She said I'll show ya how to hunt-mode in the mail room
Center targets won't have you home by five

steven-tyler-predator.jpg

holy cow !

Sometimes my farts smell like I'm melting on the inside, so we'll keep it ventilated.

stop drinkin' holy water

That's the last straw damn it! If the only way I get to play Predator next weekend is in a elevator, I will be canceling my pre order!!

Was a video supposed to be posted by kevin this weekend or next?

He was hoping to do it after the MI expo but I am guessing since he will be heading out to MGC soon afterwards it might not happen until after MGC.