I am sure there is a huge waiting list and you can't "sell" your spot, am I right? My friend was wanting to find out. I am keeping mine= )

The game is up and running right now.

It's normal at a show for someone to power down any game that is malfunctioning.

Even at a commercial arcade, I've killed power to games with stuck coils - save the owner some grief, lol.

At this point, I am not sure it if it will be as good as your Tron LE.

i backed out of getting the TRON LE. Something in my personal life came up that meant a 10K pin was not happening immediately. 5K maybe. Just curious to hear how this pin plays...

The shows are loud, you can't really hear much of the pin.

I played around 8-10 games in the PAPA tourney and there isn't even any volume on some of those. It just happens. Hard to really judge a game unless you get to hear everything about it and play it for awhile. The only two pinballs I played that I absolutely had to have after one game were Star Trek Stern and Tron.

So, I have played pinball a few years, lurked Pinside and finally made an account now after just getting home from the Louisville arcade expo. I played it once, and ended up walking away during my third ball (during a multiball), because this game was not in my opinion fun or properly functioning. I think the wear and tear of the expo must have been causing issues, because the flippers were not responsive to me flipping, they were weak, as in a dead pass bounce did not work, and they would fall down while trying to do a live catch, or not respond to a flip. One pop bumper would fire whenever I flipped.

As far as gameplay, I wasn't really able to find out exactly how, but I somehow activated 2 or 3 multiballs, and I think it was just by starting a mode (one shot). I am not sure if they just had a really long ball saver or not, but they seemed to last forever (like I drained 5 balls and they just kept coming... over a rather decent period of time), and for me I felt it was way to easy and got bored.

Take all this with a grain of salt, but I cannot really remember a game that I was so immediately disinterested in. I assumed this was a project 1-off machine, and then later found out it was going to be an actual production after talking to other tournament players. I figured I would relay the experience. Didn't seem ready for the show IMO.

Thanks for some review, I presume cameras and phones are forbidden at shows?

Thanks for this. I know we all want this game to really succeed...sounds like now that the game is done, they need to get lots of feedback before the FINAL FINAL is ready for sale. Worried these guys have probably been staring at one machine for years...that has to make it hard to know if you have a gem or dud...

I played predator twice at the show, and felt extremely disappointed. It plays and feels like a one off instead of a dedicated pin. The pin had lots of problems and it didnt seem like it was anywhere near being ready for release.

doesn't sound good. Any more reviews?

That seems very weird that the flippers are weak or not responsive. I have a PROC board and the same 70v PSU that the predator is using in a custom pin I am building and the power is amazing. I had to dial it way down so as to not break things launching the ball around my workshop!

I played several games today. Here's my opinion so far. It's a simple layout...but AFM is simple too. The game was having issues, and I didn't get very far to see a lot of modes or anything...but I think all the ingredients are there for a fun game.

The good:

The ramps are fast.
The pop bumper placement makes for a lot of random action
The playfield, cabinet, and back glass look great
Back alley toys look cool.
The predator claw ball lock works great

The unknown:

Sound...too loud at the show to hear
Couldn't really see UV layer

Schucks. Not the kind of feedback I was hoping for.

I could be mistaken, but I am pretty sure there's a multiball "Unload" mode where the flippers purposely dont let you cradle and lose power if you hold them in. Of course if it was happening the whole time then that is a different story.

If that was all by design, then I guess it could have been why it was happening... but it came off as a machine with issues to me, (seemed like a bug rather than a feature!) as I had no real indication it was happening (but I couldn't really hear if the machine indicated it since the show was so loud)... interesting to know though, kinda wish I was going again tomorrow to see if that is why... I guess I assumed it was an issue since the pop bumper was already acting weird and firing every time I flipped.

I don't know what it is, but positive or negative review - it just makes me want to take delivery of this game even more! There's so much that intrigues me about this title...KEEP IT UP KEVIN!

Well I hope Im not dumping 5 large into a dud

I may just end up dropping it and getting something else.

I'm sure there's a simple explanation, question is, will we get one.....?

I wouldn't worry about it. When JJP was bringing WOZ to shows prior to release, people reported similar issues - flippers were weak, the ball couldn't make the ramp, the lock wasn't working correctly, the house wouldn't spin, the castle vuk was broken, the game was frozen and needed a reboot, etc... JJP also had prototype machines on location which constantly needed sevice, yet they managed to get most of the issues cleared up and working properly (except for maybe those light board issues). Worst case scenario Predator gets delayed another few weeks to get the last of the issues ironed out.

Anyway, last time I checked back in December I was 27th on the Predator waiting list and I'm pretty sure some folks have backed out since then. So if anyone isn't feeling the love after these initial reports, and wants to do me the favor of backing out, I would be most appreciative.

Think I'll pass my machine on to someone who will appreciate it more than me, hope it all works out in the end, still support what the Skit-B guys have done but going with my gut on this one. I'm going to email them so it goes to the person next in order and won't be entertaining any 'bids" for my spot. I'll assume I won't be getting any fond farewells and i'll try not to let the door hit me on the way out.
Production Number: 162
Production Order: 138

The guys were there watching people play the whole time. The game does some weird flipper things during modes, ie. woz. One of the designers said that it was supposed to do that. Rules felt a bit shallow but I admittedly didn't know the game.

I'm sure that everyone who played the game was a beta tester of sorts. It froze up a few people ahead of me but I had no issues with it. I'll bet the software and rules have more room to grow but I think people will like the game when they get it.

My take is that it doesn't look or feel as polished as say Met or ST but has potential. I don't think the game is in its final stage. Just from meeting and talking to the designers I'm positive they will stand behind it and make their customers happy. They seemed to genuinely care about feedback. Hell, even if you buy it and don't like it there will be so few made you will have no problem dumping it and getting something else if you want.

Here's the big difference...Look at the size of JJP. Look at the amount of resources they have. And they still had issues and have been working round the clock to get it fixed. SkitB has how many employees? Logic would seem to indicate when they hit a hurdle, it's going to take them a lot longer to find a fix. And you guys forget the basics of engineering and why it takes a REALLY REALLY long time to make something with lots of moving parts function right...You change one thing, it effects something else. Now maybe I"m being dramatic, but I just think people are being way too cavalier with their $5,000 here. That's still a big chunk of change.

Here's my question to all of you...if there were far more than 250 being made and you kept hearing lukewarm reviews, would you stay in it? And with SkitB saying April ship dates, aren't you guys on the list concerned a bit that in March, the machine is still funky?

Take this product out of the equation and what I think is happening is a flight to a low production game, regardless of quality. People see ONLY 250 so it's rare, will hold it's value, and I can re-sell easily or make a profit. And there's definitely something to that...But man, if it were a GREAT GAME and only 250 were being made that's the win/win. But I just don't hear anything of the sort. Lots of shrugging and optimism, but nobody saying homerun.

This is the whole problem with Pin collecting today...the machines are seen as a stock or commodity. Game not that good? Aw shucks, don't worry, the volume is low so you can always dump it...I mean, a bad car is a bad car, nobody cares if they made a few of them or not...Why is a bad pin, with low numbers still valuable? I just don't get it. Again, not saying this pin is bad, but there's just this odd-world mentality in the pinworld that scarcity = value no matter the game. That may have been true 15 years ago, but times have changed. With so many GREAT pins coming out and more pins being made now than in the last 10 years or so, the market will begin to place value on quality, not scarcity. Stern isn't stopping, JJP isn't stopping...and now that prices are reaching $8K as the new standard for all LE's, this is a damn expensive hobby. It's a rich man's hobby now boys.

This has been said several times, in fact the 'done' video shows (or doesn't show) the same thing, if you recall the only time we ever have seen the 'UV' paint is when Kevin actually shines a black light like 2" from the naked PF. This is not how the black light is implemented in the game, in fact the UV paint was supposed to be the selling point of this pin and IMO until I hear otherwise or see for myself (in the game not on a naked PF with a black light 2" from the paint) it does not seem to work at all.

That was funny...it was like, "Here, look, it works!" But yeah, dude you're holding a huge black light rod over the game...It should look like this with no additional equipment.

tron.jpg

Hey kaneda, so don't buy one.

Last time I checked you joined this forum after it was long sold out, and you can't even get one, unless you're here in this thread to announce that you're an ass and are jumping in line by throwing cash at someone. So why don't you flit onto some other flavor of the moment like you do and stop crapping all over Predator, which you haven't even played?

You don't even own a pin and now you're an expert on building them? Spend less time worry about how other people spend their money and maybe play some pinball instead, that's what we like to do here.

Not true, you can still buy a working pin for $750 or even get some pins for free. You can buy honest to goodness real working pins that are very god for $2k.

Just because some pins sell for $8k or $5k doesn't mean it's a rich mans hobby now.

A Ferrari sold at auction for $24 million, does that mean Everyone have to be super-rich to buy a classic car now?

Why do you think JJP was so large when they were first developing the game prior to release? You sound like they had a huge team engineering their game. There were pictures of his daughter putting the toys together, an example of everyone pitching in where they could as they didn't have excessive resources.

Please don't talk to me about what I forget and what I don't. I know the basics of engineering thank you. I also know small tweaks can be made to prevent ball lock-ups without effecting other parts of the game. I also know weak flippers (if they are indeed an issue) can also be corrected without effecting the rest of the game.

This is a good point, in fact it's likely, probably a glitch in the program, or the mode is not known and people think the machine is malfunctioning.

Was talking about new pin buying...but good point. Just saying there no new cheap pins now. There are new cheap cars.

Jpop said when he was at Williams there were something like 50 engineers working there.

I'm thinking these Louisville reviews should be taken with a "grain of salt". Everything stated on here in the past couple days sounds like fairly minor stuff in the grand scheme of things. SkitB realizes the importance of knocking this outta the park and from what I have seen from them so far on this project; their efforts coincide with this. I think Kevin has gone more than out-of-his-way to try to please the masses here on pinside and I'm sure he will continue to do so.

Confucius Say
"The wise speak when they have something to say,
the fools speak when they have to say something. "

I love how dropping $250 is all this needed to "sell out"...please. We all know what happened...it was the most affordable limited game available so everyone jumped, that's all.

Look, I hope this game is great...I do. I love Predator. I'd want one, BUT, only if the game is great. Is that not allowed here? It's like everyone is concerned it's not a train wreck, but nobody saying it's great. That's all....God, it's impossible to have expectations here without everyone jumping down your throat.

People were buying nib Stern for less than $4k at Christmas 'flash sale' on Amazon, there are some deals out there.

Well man, here's my Point of view:

I totally Love the theme and no matter how Deep the gameplay is (i am pretty sure that it will be further developed by the community or skit-b itself) or if there are any hickups (that the pinball machines from the big companies have also) the Predator pinball machine Looks badass and is an enrichement in my man cave )

I do understand that People worry (I'm fully paid by the Way and Committed since the very first beginning #11) but I personally don't though I have to Pay a lot more for my Game because of shipping/tax/fees (Germany).

Here's my comparison:

I am a big Fan of Sports cars. I had Real cool shit Running like Porsche 911, Maserati Quattroporte V and stuff. But then i realised what I really Need and forgot about those cars People see as a Status Symbol. I am driving Cadillac XLR and Plymouth Prowler now...both are not famous in Germany and People don't like them like Porsche and Maserati...but I llove 'em as they're both really Special and unique (here in Germany both are just a few handful on The Streets I guess.

MMR, WoZ LE and the Stern LE's like met and St are porsche...and Predator is plymouth/cadillac. Not so shiny and Not that Premium but way cool and totally the right Thing...for me

Of course I also want a polished Game for delivery but i am Adult enough to know that a few enthusiasts in a basement can't compete with the big companies with their hundreds of employees and factories. They're taking 4750$ Not 8000$ and so far they surprised with what they were able to realize in my humble opinion.

I Trust Kevin and i Support Skit-B but I am Not a dreamer. And I am Not still here because it is so rare but because it is such a cool theme and an (optical) attractive machine with hopefully but not necessarily nice gameplay. Sounds, Graphics are cool Too by the Way )

well said.

No, it was part of the code. I can't remember what the developer called it, but it was intentional.

that dude Kaneda is SO wrong. For instance, for me, Predator is a dream theme. If they can get it in my house, I am sure over time I can fix any issues. And I am also sure that if there is anything I don't like about the software, it's PROC, so I can get exactly to what I want. I want to enter the gameroom and HEAR the Predator callouts, see the attract stuff going off. That's before I even press Start I want this in my gameroom. And at the price point it's a no brainer for me compared to everything else I bought. The rarity means nada to me on this pin. Ok it means one thing - if I drop out it's likely I won't be able to get back in later. I like the way this pin looks and sounds. The music from the movie Predator is some of my favorite all time.

Several people said "They" were there watching. Was Aaron there? Did anyone ask Kevin where he is at?

+1

Aaron has left the building. Nuff said!

I will give you props for knowing you are out and just doing the right thing and passing it on the the next guy on the waitlist.

I TRUST in SKITB. nuff said.

If you have doubts that all issues will be addressed then you should probably bail at this point and let someone else fill the spot.

I love the optimism of Skit B (production starting in April and 40 a month after that) and fully expect some delays. Bets guess is the first 10 will go out and then a lag while those early testers are able to help work out the bugs. Thing swill get better and grow once in our homes. Those of us lucky enough to be IN are a sub community and really all part of the (Some Kids In The Basement) gang.

I am excited to still be in on this ride and wish I had the financial capabilities to toss them 100% payment at this stage. My gut shows me that this will be a polished game when I get it and I think the reviews are very positive as there are big improvements since expo. If all the physics are worked out then all these minor bugs are relatively small potatoes. Looking forward to playing one at MGC in April!

Extremely admirable endeavor SkitB! Been watching the progress the entire way and you should be very proud of this game.

Great theme I'm in til the end, I just want a video of gameplay and some pics all in good quality. That's it, I like to look and listen and get excited about the prospect of Predator pin in my house. I can't really take any ones opinion too seriously as I haven't played it myself, I bought Tron somewhat blindly but based on all the hype and sold in a month, wasn't for me. I will never buy a pin based on someone else's experience. Just give me a nice HD vid showing some modes and features for now.

Please dont hate me for my opinion...I am #13 in line.

At this time, Gameplay info seems limited. I got excited over the UV, and have posted concerns that the center playfield wont receive enough UV to show, to the level I think we/I would like.
I know this is a stretch, but I had a dream that the Chopper was on a swinging arm with a UV spotlight on its bottom, and in UV mode, it swept across the playfield, lighting all that great UV layers...
I know too late, a complex toy...it could be borrowed.
I believe the game will succeed with code and play, but be a "players" game as first intended. Not bad, in any way, but the market today seems to want "Pop" and "toys".

While we had a local gathering, BBQ, and tournament, last night.
WOZ, STLE, were present, but Bad Cats, Nascar, Dr Who, POTO...All were enjoyed equally, but each has a unique
feature or toy. For me, Predators is the UV mode......I hope it works well....

Still hanging in the que.....with more of a wait and see, but a zillion thumbs up, for what they are doing.....it aint easy.

Look at Kiss. Horrible, boring pin to play but nice ones fetch $2500?
Rescue 911. Horrible, repetitive game to play. One of the most collected GOttliebs.

You don't think there's 250 Predator fanatics in the world that would HAVE to own one [even non pinheads] if they found out one existed?

Iron Maiden. I would buy and LE regardless of WoFish unfinished code or crappy layout because I LOVE THE THEME.
I don't think there's any chance of taking a loss on a $4750 game with only 250 being available. Not all style games appeal to everyone. Different tastes, man. Don't like it? Don't buy it - or even play it.

But even with that...You could have it featured, under some small UV lights, big sub hooked up, those skull ears hanging down, and then a callout for attract mode. Love Predator. Love Pinball. They should definitely go together.

Sorry, but the game is sold out, and the waiting list is too long for you to possibly get one.

No one is going to sell theirs to you, either.

You are just going to have to accept that you will never own this title, no matter how great it is.

The problem is that you have been all negative, negative, negative on this thread about a machine and company you have had no interaction with. You are basing your opinion from reviews in which the reviewer says they had no idea what the rules were or had no idea that Predator was a production pin. It's one thing to be cautious, which I think most of the people on the list are, but it's another thing to downright bash a company and game you have no experience with.

My first time playing SM was at Disney Quest in Orlando and due partly to the game not being taken care of partly to me not knowing the rules, I thought the game was no fun. I now own a SM and it is my favorite game in our collection.

My wife and I do not want to sink our money into a game that we are not going to enjoy, but after waiting patiently for almost two years, I'm not about to take a review from a random expo attendee who has no knowledge of either the game or the company and go "Well that's it, we're out". I worked for a long time in the world of high-end electronics. I am all to experienced with a $5K-$10K piece of equipment working flawlessly until you go to demo it and then it deciding not to work at the exact time I needed it to.

It seems that a lot a negativity surrounding Predator come from people like you who aren't even on the list to get one. It is almost like you are so upset that you cannot get your hands on one that you feel the need bash it and tear it down in hopes that others will drop off the list. While the rarity of the pin is why we got in when we did, it is not the reason we are planning to buy one. We are still in because we like the features, the rules and we like Skit-B.

Static electricity causes game resets. Not saying they are having that problem, but if they are there going to need some help!