(Topic ID: 98940)

PPS / MMR communication - it's NOT about the coin mechs (or is it?)

By jfh

5 years ago

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  • 700 posts
  • 130 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by TigerLaw
  • Topic is favorited by 7 Pinsiders


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#244 5 years ago
Quoted from jfh:

(I keep seeing people post "Why not just call or write Rick?" - what makes you think that a private answer is going to be different than a public one? Or that you will even get an answer? Rick has been very generous in encouraging anyone with a concern to call or write. But that's a two-edged sword that can just as easily be used to shut an uncomfortable topic down as it can be to provide transparency)

The answer is simple - due to prior error/misplanning, at this point it would cost Rick money to do anything other than simply omit the mechs. Rick doesn't want to spend the money to fix this properly, so no mechs in MMR. He obviously doesn't want to say that straight-out, hence the hedging. He knows most games won't be operated and made a calculated decision that the bad PR over this will blow over is worth the $40K or so he's saving.

For everyone who keeps saying Rick is doing the pinball community such a big favor by making this game, let this be your wake-up call. MMR is making Rick (and others) lots of money. WE (or I should say, some of YOU) are doing HIM a favor by buying this remade, profit-filled game instead of a new IMVE or Hobbit or Full Throttle or TWD or a Multimorphic or TBL or any of the other games that are or soon will be available.

#245 5 years ago
Quoted from taylor34:

It's a little hard to complain about the manufacturer being 'cheap' when they're including a $200 shaker motor that the original didn't have plus offering custom trim. Those aren't things that happen when you're trying to 'cheap' out. At least in my opinion.

The original was around 3600 MSRP. This one is 8000. Yea, I think there's room for a shaker. But not a shaker and mechs

#248 5 years ago
Quoted from StevenP:

Just wanted to point out here that IMVE is *also* a "remade, profit-filled game."

Absolutely. But it only cost a lil over half what the MMR costs, and actually includes coin mechs.

IMVE is what we bought after we canceled our MMR.

#256 5 years ago
Quoted from fosaisu:

but unless you spend that on another NIB, non-remake title (as opposed to beer and burgers as most of us probably would) you're not supporting the development of new title any more than the people buying MMR.

I agree in part, but IMVE is much different than MMR. Biggest being that IMVE is still Stern's current system. All they had to do to tool up the VE run was add a couple tiny boards to the lamp matrix to smooth out the LEDs they now use instead of incandescents, and tweak the software for these LEDs (and add one for Monger). Other than that it's about the same tech as Mustang. There's precedent as well... Stern ran TSPP and LOTR for multiple years. IMVE isn't much different than that last late LOTR (non-LE) run.

MMR is a whole lot more time/effort/money being spent on a 17 year old game.

#342 5 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

This is comparable to a Stern Pro that comes pre-drilled for a shaker but doesn't include the shaker. If you want the shaker, you CAN put it in. Likewise - you CAN put the coin mech in. The coin door hasn't been redesigned to never function with a coin mech. We're talking about a standard Happ coin door. A mech is a part that pops in and out easily.

C'mon Greg, you're not that stupid.

A shaker is an accessory. A coin mech is an integral part of the machine.

Every commercial pinball machine manufactured in quantity for the past century or so has shipped with a device to take coins. The one exception I know of is Gene's BBB run, and he was bleeding cash towards the end.

#345 5 years ago
Quoted from jalpert:

It was until about 2007. Ever since, I think you can argue that it isn't.

"coin mech" = "money-taking device"

Out of the box, MMR cannot earn on location. It's balls are cut off.

#352 5 years ago
Quoted from viper001:

Hey, they used my list as a basis for answering questions! Bonus points for anyone that noticed what was omitted, but it was nice to see published answers to a lot of these questions...

Here's the missing questions...

3) Will there be a goodie bag?
4) If 3 is yes, will it contain spare plastics?
5) If 3 is yes, will it contain those wing bolt things for securing the head on location?

He answered affirmative to wing bolts, so assumption is there will not be a goodie bag or spare plastics since these were specifically not mentioned.

10) Original had a dedicated power supply for the flipper coils, does this one?
11) WPC can compensate for a broken EOS switch, can this one?

Answer to #10 is likely no, based on current knowledge of the game/electronics.

Answer to #11 has to be a yes, since every solid-state flipper game since Data East has enough basic programming to kill the flipper even if no EOS state change is detected.

13) Original could not be programmed to take a single coin for 1 credit, which some found to be a nuisance. Can this one?

Since it's running original code, the answer is likely no. In theory they could add code to the hypervisor to detect a single coin drop and feed the necessary coin switch inputs to the emulated MM code. This could be offered as an option in whatever hypervisor interface is used to set options such as screen color, etc.

#366 5 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

You guys are really going to beat the "what else will be missing!?!!?!" thing to death, eh? ....and Metallik calls me 'stupid'.

Do you know 100% whether anything else has changed? Or not?

Since Oct 2013's announcement of an "identical remake" we've lost the original shiny gold trim, Fliptronics (cry), coin mechs, apparently the goodie bag, and now the internal help screens require a translation documents. And that's just off the top of my head. Every month it seems something "new" is announced. Like the fact that this project is actually being driven by Chicago Gaming - they are the decision-makers - and that Rick is merely a licensor and advisor to the project.

"Stupid" is blindly believing everything you're told despite significant evidence to the contrary.

#375 5 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

I'm just going to remove myself from this irrational discourse.
I'll come back when my game arrives and I'll be happy to tell you if the flippers, legs, translight, harnesses, etc are missing...I'm sure you're totally right, I bet I'll open the box and there won't even be a game in there.

I said changed, not missing, but feel free to drain the thread I do hope you enjoy your game when it shows up.

#376 5 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

The original was stainless steel, not shiny gold.
Are the flipper coils not double wound ? Looks like fliptronics to me. Doesn't have a separate fliptronics board, which the original didn't either.

Gee Lloyd, don't you think I'd know that considering I've stated repeatedly I own a WMS original?

I refer to the original TAFG-style shiny gold folks were expecting for this machine, and what appears to be shown on PPS's flyer for it.

Fliptronics.... Of course the original game doesn't have a separate fliptronics board. WMS incorporated all the same circuitry into the WPC95 board, and that is where it lives in MM original. You are REALLY stretching with comments like that. Wow. The flipper parts are the same but that is not Fliptronics. You know better than that, just as you know why there's no separate Fliptronics board in MM original.

#389 5 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

I'm just going to remove myself from this irrational discourse.

Quoted from Rarehero:

They're only making coin-op games. Learn what a coin mech is & stop being maniacs, maniacs.

Now we know where LYING MAN went...


#394 5 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

The absolute stupidity in this thread is so compelling I cannot stop combatting it. Stop being insane and I'll go away lol

The thread is only as stupid as you keep making it. The point of debate is not about coin mechs so much as it is about customer service, or lack thereof. Obviously there is a wide range of opinions on the importance of mechs, but the FACT that they will not be present, along with the FACT that Rick is doing nothing to compensate customers over this news after deposits were final is certainly worth discussing.

Considering the thousand+ posts on trim color, I'd say there is no problem here. If you don't like the discussion, drain it.

#499 5 years ago

So when does the game hit the line? Original announcement last Oct had it in production late Spring. The pile of pitchforks and torches is still warm from JJP....

#588 5 years ago
Quoted from fosaisu:

[EDIT: Or are you just practicing the time-honored tradition of starting a horrible false rumor to spur PPS to make an official announcement about production delays?]

Kinda like how everyone kept baiting JJP? Hey, if it worked then....

#647 5 years ago
Quoted from vicjw66:

They are behind schedule, that much is clear.

What's the last pinball project that's BEEN on schedule??

#657 5 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

I'm not the one freaking out about coin-mechs. Remember what this thread is about - and remember I'm in the "I don't care" category.

That one post full of your quotes would seem to indicate otherwise. You are quite obsessed with this thread. Hell, you already ragequit at least once, and yet here you are

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