(Topic ID: 242867)

PoTC - Who has playfield cracking & wear around sling posts?


By harryhoudini

1 year ago



Topic Stats

  • 2,984 posts
  • 217 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 days ago by MarZ_78
  • Topic is favorited by 63 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“What kind of issues are you seeing?”

  • I have visible dimples but no chipping 45 votes
    22%
  • I can see chipping but haven't done anything yet 67 votes
    33%
  • I can see chipping and installed mylar, washer and/or larger star post 30 votes
    15%
  • My playfield looks fine (but I haven't removed the star posts) 31 votes
    15%
  • I removed the star posts and my playfield looks fine 15 votes
    7%
  • My game had clear washers installed from the factory 15 votes
    7%

(Multiple choice - 203 votes by 191 Pinsiders)

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There are 2984 posts in this topic. You are on page 38 of 60.
#1851 10 months ago
Quoted from harryhoudini:

Got a reply from my playfield request case that it was "being sent to management for approval" ...
Anyone get any information on playfield stock? I'm hearing that there may not be any and it may be months of delays to get more from Mirco. If this is the case, why still go with Mirco? Maybe they'll be better, lol.

So it occurred to me after reading all the hubbub about the warranties, I’m second owner, but I was able to get a playfield replacement... so I guess I should consider myself lucky or something?.. that jjp let me spend 550+ on a replacement lol

#1852 10 months ago
Quoted from VillaThrills:

Well, now my star post are bubbling. Time for some neoprene. Will probably grab the official ones.

Ugh. Bottom posts? How many plays?

I'm considering getting double stars and neoprene for the other slings too. I don't want to buy another playfield.

I am at the point of a divorce, more so than digging deeper.

#1853 10 months ago
Quoted from wesman:

Ugh. Bottom posts? How many plays?
I'm considering getting double stars and neoprene for the other slings too. I don't want to buy another playfield.
I am at the point of a divorce, more so than digging deeper.

I have had mine in since November but I don’t play as much as most do. Bottom slings. Maybe another 300 games.

#1854 10 months ago
Quoted from wesman:

Ugh. Bottom posts? How many plays?
I'm considering getting double stars and neoprene for the other slings too. I don't want to buy another playfield.
I am at the point of a divorce, more so than digging deeper.

What I used:

https://www.pinballlife.com/plastic-translucent-double-star-posts-1-116-tall.html

amazon.com link »

You will have to adjust the leaf holders for the sling switches slightly after doing this, as they won't be reponsive after the switch.

This hid the problem and put it out of my mind. I hope it does for you as well.

#1855 10 months ago
Quoted from zaphX:

What I used:
https://www.pinballlife.com/plastic-translucent-double-star-posts-1-116-tall.html
amazon.com link »
You will have to adjust the leaf holders for the sling switches slightly after doing this, as they won't be reponsive after the switch.
This hid the problem and put it out of my mind. I hope it does for you as well.

Did you use these for the BP slings underneath and the starmap too, or just the lower slings?

I did the lower two. Just figure I'd rather buy for the other slings if necessary. I don't want to have to pay of a mistake not my own.

Thanks for the input Derek!

#1856 10 months ago
Quoted from wesman:

Did you use these for the BP slings underneath and the starmap too, or just the lower slings?
I did the lower two. Just figure I'd rather buy for the other slings if necessary. I don't want to have to pay of a mistake not my own.
Thanks for the input Derek!

I only did this for the slingshots (all 3 posts on each.)

The other posts are not damaged, for me.

#1857 10 months ago
Quoted from zaphX:

It wouldn't surprise me a bit if all this was due to rushing things into production without enough cure time.
I remember seeing a Stern factory video with racks of playfields stored flat, waiting for their cure date.

I have the same thought about the JJP production. I'd suspect they're probably doing just in time delivery and timing their playfield (and other part) orders as close to the out-the-door date as possible to sync up their payments to suppliers with the cash received from customers. Doesn't leave much time for testing/validating that what they get from the supplier is quality, and even if they do find a quality issue then they likely have to make the decision to ship 'em out anyway.

#1858 10 months ago
Quoted from Soulrider911:

So it occurred to me after reading all the hubbub about the warranties, I’m second owner, but I was able to get a playfield replacement... so I guess I should consider myself lucky or something?.. that jjp let me spend 550+ on a replacement lol

No. Because this is not a warranty matter. In fact, almost no one is actually under warranty because if you've had your game more than 30 days, you are out of warranty except for electronics components.

#1859 10 months ago

Since this thread has become a beacon of light in a weary world and those here seem fun and interesting, I thought I'd share something fun and interesting.

If you happen to have a 3D model of the rock outcropping SIMILAR to what JJP sold for the Devil's Triangle and you wanted to get it printed, you could. You could choose say 20% infill which isn't a lot but for this kind of piece should be fine. You should use the cheapest materials and since you'll paint it use the default color, which makes it cheaper. I got some pink parts once, I didn't want pink but it was cheapest and I painted them.

So if you wanted to save money and could do this, it would cost you $86 at the bulk printing place to have this done. I think you probably have to pay shipping on that as well. After the kind of time you'd have to put in to design something like this it doesn't really seem worth it, right? But you could do bulk, no? Let's say you did 20! Because it definitely gets cheaper with quantity. 20 makes it only $63 each!

If you can find them cheaper, you should get one. Ours won't be cheaper, sorry.

Get_instant_CNC_machining___injection_molding_quotes_-_3D_Hubs (resized).jpg

#1860 10 months ago

Seems to me the warranty is worthless aka not an actual warranty, more like a grace period

#1861 10 months ago
Quoted from harryhoudini:

Since this thread has become a beacon of light in a weary world and those here seem fun and interesting, I thought I'd share something fun and interesting.
If you happen to have a 3D model of the rock outcropping SIMILAR to what JJP sold for the Devil's Triangle and you wanted to get it printed, you could. You could choose say 20% infill which isn't a lot but for this kind of piece should be fine. You should use the cheapest materials and since you'll paint it use the default color, which makes it cheaper. I got some pink parts once, I didn't want pink but it was cheapest and I painted them.
So if you wanted to save money and could do this, it would cost you $86 at the bulk printing place to have this done. I think you probably have to pay shipping on that as well. After the kind of time you'd have to put in to design something like this it doesn't really seem worth it, right? But you could do bulk, no? Let's say you did 20! Because it definitely gets cheaper with quantity. 20 makes it only $63 each!
If you can find them cheaper, you should get one. Ours won't be cheaper, sorry.
[quoted image]

You should research resin casting. Once you make your mold, cost per part would be under $10 each.

#1862 10 months ago
Quoted from JodyG:

You should research resin casting. Once you make your mold, cost per part would be under $10 each.

Pretty sure that what the maker of the incredible monkey mod for woz does.

#1863 10 months ago

Gouvea, correct. Resin was pretty expensive in volume. But we have it and will try it out. Seems like it might not be much cheaper but whatever is best we'll do.

#1864 10 months ago
Quoted from Soulrider911:

Seems to me the warranty is worthless aka not an actual warranty, more like a grace period

Essentially like a car battery or tire mileage wear warranty. As you said, worthless.

#1865 10 months ago

There should be a law against selling a product of certain complexity and price without a legit warranty

-2
#1866 10 months ago
Quoted from Soulrider911:

There should be a law against selling a product of certain complexity and price without a legit warranty

As a conservative, I STRONGLY endorse the reality of personal responsibility, over the idea that the Washington bureaucrats can make better decisions for me.

Liberals want to control your wallets and the conservatives want to control your mind, you cannot control my mind, so leave my wallet the fuck alone!

Take personal responsibility for your action.

POTC is a terrific, mindbending, innovative product albeit with a flaw or two. With innovation comes risks, purchasing such innovations is a risk which you chose to make.

Kind Regards,
Mike

PS As my father always joked, if you are under 30 and not a liberal you have no heart if you are over 30 and not a conservative you have no brain.

#1867 10 months ago
Quoted from zaphX:

It wouldn't surprise me a bit if all this was due to rushing things into production without enough cure time.
I remember seeing a Stern factory video with racks of playfields stored flat, waiting for their cure date.

This is very likely the entire root of the problem. JJP has been under tremendous pressure (and criticism) about the timing of the release of their games compared to when they show them. The spinner issue forced changes to the playfield design. It's quite possible that playfields were needed for production units that weren't fully cured yet. It's why JJP would fall on their sword for Mirco, and why Mirco would be silent.

#1868 10 months ago
Quoted from Jackalwere:

This is very likely the entire root of the problem. JJP has been under tremendous pressure (and criticism) about the timing of the release of their games compared to when they show them. The spinner issue forced changes to the playfield design. It's quite possible that playfields were needed for production units that weren't fully cured yet. It's why JJP would fall on their sword for Mirco, and why Mirco would be silent.

Extremely plausible

#1869 10 months ago
Quoted from mjruser:

As a conservative, I STRONGLY endorse the reality of personal responsibility, over the idea that the Washington bureaucrats can make better decisions for me.
Liberals want to control your wallets and the conservatives want to control your mind, you cannot control my mind, so leave my wallet the fuck alone!
Take personal responsibility for your action.
POTC is a terrific, mindbending, innovative product albeit with a flaw or two. With innovation comes risks, purchasing such innovations is a risk which you chose to make.
Kind Regards,
Mike
PS As my father always joked, if you are under 30 and not a liberal you have no heart if you are over 30 and not a conservative you have no brain.

The problem is the part that’s failing is something that isn’t innovative and it’s something that’s been done for a few decades now that’s the playfield clear coat. It’s the protective layer over the playfield art work. The playfield haven’t been cured properly add to the fact that they’re using those tiny posts so the area they’re pressing on is about 1/2 that of a Star post.

#1870 10 months ago

I do want one of these machines but for $15k AUD I don’t want the headaches that potentially come with it

#1871 10 months ago
Quoted from harryhoudini:

Extremely plausible

Put me down as very doubtful this is a curing or installation issue. This is a final hardness or durometer issue. Something changed in the manufacturing process that's making the clearcoat or ink soft and malleable.

I would like to know if someone has tried putting a solvent-based clear coat over the JJP finish and if it fixed the issue. I doubt it would fix the problem as the soft underlayer will likely still bubble and crack under similar post/washer interface.

#1872 10 months ago

played one tonight at the local bar. sure enough, chipping around every post!

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-5
#1873 10 months ago
Quoted from mjruser:

As a conservative, I STRONGLY endorse the reality of personal responsibility, over the idea that the Washington bureaucrats can make better decisions for me.
Liberals want to control your wallets and the conservatives want to control your mind, you cannot control my mind, so leave my wallet the fuck alone!
Take personal responsibility for your action.
POTC is a terrific, mindbending, innovative product albeit with a flaw or two. With innovation comes risks, purchasing such innovations is a risk which you chose to make.
Kind Regards,
Mike
PS As my father always joked, if you are under 30 and not a liberal you have no heart if you are over 30 and not a conservative you have no brain.

They will have none of that logical conservative stuff here.

#1874 10 months ago
Quoted from zr11990:

They will have none of that logical conservative stuff here.

Can you guys keep politics out of our pinball fun?

I come here to escape that stuff.

-11
#1875 10 months ago
Quoted from zaphX:

Can you guys keep politics out of our pinball fun?
I come here to escape that stuff.

See what I mean

#1876 10 months ago
Quoted from ccbiggsoo7:

played one tonight at the local bar. sure enough, chipping around every post! [quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Woof!

Quoted from zaphX:

Can you guys keep politics out of our pinball fun?
I come here to escape that stuff.

I'm at the point where I want to find a new location to escape pinball discussions!

This site gets so fucking intense most days, which is weird, but I guess sadly even an escapist based hobby will bring out the same conversation styles, personalities, arguments, and treatment of one another the same as any other walk of human life.

Time for me to go find Hobbiton or wherever Mole People live!

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#1877 10 months ago

The ink isn't adhering to the wood, a weak foundation does not a strong house make. The clear coat was made intentionally soft. That was told to me in an email from the manufacturer so the idea of it not being "cured" is not correct. Now take into account that kruzman can clear a play field and IIRC he said he generally waits a few weeks for curing to occur and for arguments sake let's say a month and it gets installed and no issues like this. I've read several HEP restore stories. Never read any issues there either. Machine is ready to beat on right away. Ask yourselves with what appears to be a 2 tier issue what's the fix?
I do feel really bad for all the owners, god speed on finding resolution.

#1878 10 months ago

Didn't you just disprove your point by saying he waits a month before installing the hardware on the playfield?

If Mirco is shipping playfields, says wait 60 days for a cure (IIRC CPR says somewhere around that time frame) and JJP is installing them immediately anyways because they need the line moving would that not be a reasonable possibility?

#1879 10 months ago

It's actually against pinside rules to discuss politics.

#1880 10 months ago
Quoted from harryhoudini:

It's actually against pinside rules to discuss politics.

My bad it won't happen again! But I still advocate personal responsibility.. e.g. I should have been a more responsible drinker the night I posted that!

#1881 10 months ago

Does anyone have a pirates that is not bubbling and chipping?

#1882 10 months ago
Quoted from DougPiranha:

Does anyone have a pirates that is not bubbling and chipping?

I'm curious about this too. Anyone with no playfield issues?

#1883 10 months ago
Quoted from pipes:

I'm curious about this too. Anyone with no playfield issues?

Yes, I had none at unboxing and none now. I bought my game from the last run. I did put down neoprene washers and star posts just in case, but my game seems perfect.

#1884 10 months ago
Quoted from DougPiranha:

Does anyone have a pirates that is not bubbling and chipping?

None here, early February build with factory washers under sling posts. I put two squares of mylar under each post just as a cautionary measure, game had under 100 plays at the time. I did order the washer kit just in case but haven't installed it yet. Have also since turned down the sling power just incase.

9e86b1608f2a9370bea9d3f1ab32ef63489e7a02 (resized).jpg

#1885 10 months ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

None here, early February build with factory washers under sling posts. I put two squares of mylar under each post just as a cautionary measure, game had under 100 plays at the time. I did order the washer kit just in case but haven't installed it yet.
[quoted image]

That's great!

Mine is bubbling at every post that touches the playfield. So the slings just seem to start failing first. EVERY point of post or metal to playfield is bubbling and peeling!

#1886 10 months ago

Sorry to hear about all the issues. It's disappointing. Good to hear some of you aren't going through any of that though.

#1887 10 months ago
Quoted from DougPiranha:

That's great!
Mine is bubbling at every post that touches the playfield. So the slings just seem to start failing first. EVERY point of post or metal to playfield is bubbling and peeling!

Oh no, I'm sorry to hear that. Its BS that JJP isn't doing more for owners with games affected to that degree. A free replacement playfield should be a given once pictures are provided to them. For JJP to offer a 50% off playfield after a customer buys a nearly $10k game is an insult in my opinion. I like JJP a lot but they really need to step it up here.

#1888 10 months ago

Update! Production is complete! We are getting closer to having the clear silicone washers for under the star post and narrow post. Hopefully just a couple or 3 more weeks.

#1889 10 months ago
Quoted from Titan_Pinball:

Update! Production is complete! We are getting closer to having the clear silicone washers for under the star post and narrow post. Hopefully just a couple or 3 more weeks.

Realize that the little posts on the lanes and all around the playfield need washers too. I used metric SS washers and rubber washers from Lowes.

#1890 10 months ago
Quoted from DougPiranha:

Realize that the little posts on the lanes and all around the playfield need washers too. I used metric SS washers and rubber washers from Lowes.

Are you replacing every post with washers underneath?

#1891 10 months ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Oh no, I'm sorry to hear that. Its BS that JJP isn't doing more for owners with games affected to that degree. A free replacement playfield should be a given once pictures are provided to them. For JJP to offer a 50% off playfield after a customer buys a nearly $10k game is an insult in my opinion. I like JJP a lot but they really need to step it up here.

We put factory black nylon washers underneath after 10 plays. No cracking or peeling....knock on Wood.

Totally Agree that they should provide a replacement, but people that are having issues should not have to do the hardware swap. There's no way that I could do that not to mention the time involved.

People should be able to send playfield in and JJP do the Swap...PERIOD! They have the tools to do this. A lot of of don't have the proper tools or the time to do this!

#1892 10 months ago
Quoted from Titan_Pinball:

Update! Production is complete! We are getting closer to having the clear silicone washers for under the star post and narrow post. Hopefully just a couple or 3 more weeks.

Nice!! This will be a great product.

On a side note, I got confirmation that my playfield is shipping. I guess they are in stock

11
#1893 10 months ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Oh no, I'm sorry to hear that. Its BS that JJP isn't doing more for owners with games affected to that degree. A free replacement playfield should be a given once pictures are provided to them. For JJP to offer a 50% off playfield after a customer buys a nearly $10k game is an insult in my opinion. I like JJP a lot but they really need to step it up here.

I couldn't agree more....the icing on the cake is that they are actually charging customers for new play fields...what an insult. At a minimum they should provide a replacement for free since the work involved in a play field swap is egregious....my experience with JJP is they are great with minor stuff, but are not so great when it comes to cabinet and play field issues (I had problems with one of my NIB cabinets).

#1894 10 months ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I couldn't agree more....the icing on the cake is that they are actually charging customers for new play fields...what an insult. At a minimum they should provide a replacement for free since the work involved in a play field swap is egregious....my experience with JJP is they are great with minor stuff, but are not so great when it comes to cabinet and play field issues (I had problems with one of my NIB cabinets).

totally agree

#1895 10 months ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I couldn't agree more....the icing on the cake is that they are actually charging customers for new play fields...what an insult. At a minimum they should provide a replacement for free since the work involved in a play field swap is egregious....my experience with JJP is they are great with minor stuff, but are not so great when it comes to cabinet and play field issues (I had problems with one of my NIB cabinets).

I don't feel a line should be drawn by them. The ENTIRE set of components is their product, not just washers, screws, wireforms, etc. If a part of that product is faulty, replace it, and do so without a customer have to jump through hoops, worry about the situation, or worst of all PAY.

#1896 10 months ago
Quoted from wesman:

I don't feel a line should be drawn by them. The ENTIRE set of components is their product, not just washers, screws, wireforms, etc. If a part of that product is faulty, replace it, and do so without a customer have to jump through hoops, worry about the situation, or worst of all PAY.

I totally agree.....I suspect JJP is bleeding cash so I'm sure they can't take the financial hit on replacing on these play fields.

#1897 10 months ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I totally agree.....I suspect JJP is bleeding cash so I'm sure they can't take the financial hit on replacing on these play fields.

Agreed.

I think it’s pretty clear that they do not have the liquidity to properly handle warranty issues.

#1898 10 months ago
Quoted from Mike_J:

Agreed.
I think it’s pretty clear that they do not have the liquidity to properly handle warranty issues.

Uh-oh...This, if true, is a bad situation to be in.

#1899 10 months ago
Quoted from cosmokramer:

Uh-oh...This, if true, is a bad situation to be in.

I hope I’m wrong, but I’m not sure what else it could be.

When folks are dropping 9K-12K per machine, you better take care of them.

-1
#1900 10 months ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I totally agree.....I suspect JJP is bleeding cash so I'm sure they can't take the financial hit on replacing on these play fields.

Quoted from Mike_J:

Agreed.
I think it’s pretty clear that they do not have the liquidity to properly handle warranty issues.

Pretty speculative. Even if they had to replace 100 playfields, that’s like $50k, hardly a huge financial hit or one that would cause liquidity issues. people are very quick to jump to conclusions without facts.

From what I understand, Wonkas have been selling well, potc flew off the shelves and ybrs have been sold so why would anyone think they are bleeding cash. They have handled warranty issues quickly for me, not for a playfield, but for parts.

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