Thanks for all the duotron comments!

Going the other way...what WOULD you recommend for a first EM? (for someone with no experience with EMs)

I realize this is now off-topic...so feel free not to reply

A one-player game, 1960 or later.

Never the right choice for any skill level: Target Alpha.

Lots of great one player Williams 60s pins.

Whatever you do don't get a Zale Bally. Send those my way.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/thinking-of-buying-an-em-buyers-guide

A one player machine with a playfield that intrigues you and a theme you like. Check here and on ipdb for the machine's rating comments, but keep in mind that you may really like a machine that others don’t. Everyone's tastes are different and some folks post negative reviews before taking the time to really learn a game. One of my favorite machines is one that only gets medium ratings.

EM's can be very different from brand to brand or even over a span of time.

Mid-60's EM are notorious for cleaning you out in 2 to 3 minutes. As the old operator saying goes, if they are playing for more than 3 minutes you are losing money! I have found this to be very true for Bally in particular. In the early 70's this changed a bit with the introduction of 3" flippers.

All the Williams I have own struck me as "many ways to win" while Gottlieb designs tended to gravitate towards sharp shooting and doing things in a certain order. Bally marched to the beat of its own band with master Zale turning out titles during this period.

My 1964 Williams has been very reliable once I got everything working. Was going to suggest Williams.

Segasa-Sonic Butterfly for $775

Located in Summerville, SC

https://www.facebook.com/commerce/listing/576503543859196

Not really a project, although the cabinet has some damage on the edges. I posted it due to it being rare/unusual.

283771990_5343759295681306_1142549674071346596_n (resized).jpg283960507_5343759279014641_3907796961458303233_n (resized).jpg283747238_5343759452347957_95902827792888226_n (resized).jpg

Nice! I do wish I was closer on that one.

Perhaps the seller means it's sort of a "Ranson of Red Chief" thing. He'll give YOU $150 if you take the machine.

I'm just not seeing the value there unless you have another Bally 4 player with battered cabinet and swap everything over. Assuming this cab is in great shape.

That is Thad's game. He is a good dude. We have done a few deals over the last couple of years.

Don't see this title often.
newjersey.craigslist.org link

Thank you for the helpful comments and link. More homework to do

#fireball

1976 EM
$200
Cedar Rapids, IA

Bally Fireball Home Edition Pinball Machine - Needs Repair

Bought it for a winter project and didn’t get around to fixing it. It will need repaired. Will need at a minimum a new rubber ring kit. No pinballs in the game currently. Both flipper bats are responsive. Sold as-is.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/444763530793694/

280031894_5521716727852550_8509249658180170620_n (resized).jpg

As an unfortunate Target Alpha owner who is decently familiar with EMs, this is totally correct!
My game is fully working, and yet still does bizarre random stuff and has a bunch of nonsense caveats that make it just not worth it.

If there was ever a candidate for electronic conversion… this would be it.

I’m sure if Gottlieb had System 1 ready for Target Alpha, it would have been the first on the production line.

Well there's El Dorado City of Gold with the same layout, from 1984. Personally I don't like the backglass or the sound package of that game though. I think it was from the era of Gottliebs that would just play some random damn sound for a given scoring amount. Unacceptable to my OCD.

Wild Life for $200

Located in West Newton, MA

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/5219696538145108/

280229646_7445683798840029_6866475269957941359_n (resized).jpg

Ah, all these wonderful opportunities on the wrong side of the country.....

Always

Cover Girl for $100

Located in Toms River, NJ

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/526626162495234/

In rough shape, but playfield looks surprisingly nice under all that dirt though.

283659365_4901352799977699_394306223476333551_n (resized).jpg283552422_5621312741230712_8103701006200610801_n (resized).jpg283241003_4921447634649859_3918199808126286905_n (resized).jpg

Gorgar and Safari for ???

Located in Freedom, NH

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1143916969796731/

"These machines are in great condition but do need some parts replaced. I have the original manuals and the parts to be replaced.
These will be in perfect working condition if someone that knows what they are doing repairs them. My handy father had planned on repairing them but unfortunately he passed away and we will not have a place to keep them. Probably something you would want to get a look at first.
Serious buyers only please. I cannot answer any other questions so please don’t ask. Your more than welcome to come by and check them out. Buyer is responsible to transport and price is negotiable."

Impossible to know how much this person wants, so could or could not end up being a good deal.

282813090_10223406540805846_5515219103364855633_n (resized).jpg

If all else fails, you can update the game to
RuPaul's Cover Girl Drag Race.

Wish me luck, guys! I couldn't say no

So far I got "Maybe tomorrow" in response to my message... I'll update if this happens!

Good luck, and if you get it, I'd like to see how well all that dirt preserved the playfield!

Saw this when it first popped up, been chatting with the seller. Trying to work it out. She's probably getting bombarded more now though, so who knows.

Hit n run
Gottlieb woodrail
Make offer
Florence, SC
https://m.facebook.com/groups/1495208617395027/permalink/3125710824344790/

Arrowhead
Williams woodrail
$500
Douglasville, ga
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/3347674428802779/

Hi-Score
Gottlieb em
$500
Schaumburg, IL
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/3347674428802779/

This is the exact reason this is my least favorite thread on pinside. Posts like this drive the games sky high, and now they will be listed forever because the person thinks they have gold.

We are all looking, all the time, at all the same markets. This just creates unnecessary noise. And if I remember correctly, you only post games you ARENT interested in, but magicly forget to post the ones you are

Imo, end this thread. Rant over. ✌️

You are wrong. So every project pin found in the wild should be offered up here even if the poster wants it? Lets get real! I post games too far away or games I'm not interested in. What sane person would post the $450 Evel, Two Stern Stars I found for under $500, or the dozen of Gottlieb EM's under $500?

Finding cheap projects takes work. I do the work and share here those I don't want or are too far away.

And the $450 Evel and the Stern Stars were sold to local friends who wanted them at near cost because they are friends who wanted them more than me. I could of flipped them, but friends come 1st.

There is always the chance that posting here could drive up the price, but from the past couple months I've been posting here that has not been the case the majority of the time.

In fact, there have been several pinsiders that have acquired incredible deals thanks to the posts I have provided. I'm not saying this to brag, only to show that posting here has helped fellow pinsiders see a great deal they would have otherwise missed out on.

That Cover Girl is a steal at $100. A new glass and some cleanup (hopefully the plastics are OK), and it would be a stunner.

However, it is very much a "play for specials" game. Only get it for the sheer, nail-biting thrill of lighting up all the girls... because there's no need for score reels. The rules for scoring points are exceptionally stupid...

"Plunge the middle lane. Keep hitting the pops. Do nothing else."

You speak in generalities. Please post 3 examples over the last 6 months that have ended up in pinsiders hands because of your posts.

I have proof of quite the opposite flooding my pms

So you dont like the thread…cool. Well you’ve said your piece so no need to hang around your least favorite thread any longer.

I actually understand the96stang 's frustration here. And you actually sort of proved his point a bit with your comment here. Think about this for a second. You only post things that are not near you, and that you don't want. Why do you do that? Because you don't want to tell everyone about a deal you found that you want, right? Makes sense. Now think about that from the perspective of somebody who wants a game and sees it posted on someplace like Facebook. They get excited, maybe they're first in line because they saw it right away, and then someone goes and posts it here because they don't want it, so why not tell the world about it, right? Well, then suddenly a lot more eyes can be on it, and a feeding frenzy can occur. Price gets driven up frequently, and that person who saw the deal first maybe loses out. I have personally had this happen multiple times.

I find it highly unlikely that any pinball machine posted clearly on a place like Craigslist or Facebook isn't spotted right away by many of us in the hobby at this point. Broadcasting games you don't want in a place like this only causes more people to pile on a potential deal, potentially ruining the deal itself. You can say you're just trying to help people in the hobby pick up a pinball machine, but the hypocritical nature of it is apparent when you only post things you don't want.

If you see a great deal near you, and you hurry off to get it without telling anyone, are you thrilled when you see it posted in a place like this? Of course not. You're hoping no one else sees it, and that no one posts it here before you can grab it. I'll call anyone that says otherwise a liar in a heartbeat. So why do it to other people? That's the part that doesn't really make any sense to me. You wouldn't want it done to you, so why would you do it to others?

It would make a lot more sense if stuff posted here were things that might not have been noticed. Games poorly listed so not many eyes are on it, or deals that have been sitting for a while because they were obscure in their posting. Games buried in some estate sale maybe.

It is eternally frustrating when I'm driving off to pick up a deal near me, then I see it posted on this thread while I'm on the way, and arrive to find out a couple dozen new people are messaging the seller, jacking up the price, or telling them not to let me buy it as cheaply as it was listed. Can that happen without it being posted here? Of course! But does this help avoid that? Definitely not.

I appreciate the level of work that goes into finding deals, because I put the effort in just like many of us do. I think what the deal hunter / posters lose sight of is how posting those deals in a place like this affects both the market, and the ability for local buyers to pick it up. Yes, maybe a Pinsider will say hey, thanks for posting that, I grabbed it. But how many other Pinsiders or hobbyists were already trying to get the deal/game, worked hard to watch for deals too, but lost out because it got posted here?

I am definitely an example of one. Every time I spot a deal, I feel like I'm racing against this thread every time. I come check it as I try to work on securing the game, and I dread every time it gets posted here. After multiple experiences with this thread causing me to either pay more, or lose the game altogether, I cross my fingers and hope local guys like HydrogenHuman don't post the game before I can get it. It's a crappy feeling, having to worry about a Pinside post screwing up a pickup for me, but it's become a frequent concern. And I know I'm not the only one, plenty of people complain about it. It's been discussed in local threads, and a good number of people prefer to keep those kinds of posts to a minimum, or out altogether.

Put simply, if you're not willing to post a deal you want, why post a deal that will hurt somebody else's chances of getting the game? I would be shocked to find out that any of the games or deals posted here haven't already been seen by at least a few people who want it in that area. Not a single game HydrogenHuman posted in this thread was one I hadn't already seen when he posted it, from my recollection. I'm only mentioning him because he's the local guy (to me) that seems to be doing that a lot over the past year or so. Broadcasting it really is just feels like it's about flexing deal hunting and posting quickly skills, more than anything else. But that's just my two cents. It is a free country and free forum to post on. I for one wish that people didn't do that though, and have lost out on something I wanted several times because of it. That's why I don't post about any games. I know people will see them, so if I don't want them, I let the other hard working hunters find and grab them. I don't want people to feel the way I do when this kind of thread drives up prices, and pulls games away from someone that worked hard to find it, or be first in line for it.

I appreciate those of you that think this is altruistic, and you're just trying to help. If you're not just doing it to show off your deal finding skills, or race to be the first one to post a deal, then maybe you really do think you have the best interests of others in mind. Maybe you're just looking out for the people that can't, or don't know how to, put in the effort to find games and deals. I can see that angle. And I'm sure some of those people appreciate it.

That being said, perhaps this gives you a little different perspective on what your posts can do, or how they can also be detrimental. You might just be hurting as many or more than you're helping, if you view it all from a different angle. I'm not raging at anyone, just providing a perspective. Although I admit sometimes I do want to comically strangle Mr Hydrogen like Homer strangles Bart when he posts a game I'm already trying to snag.

I stay on this thread just to see if any cool projects pop up. The rat race of always looking for deals is unhealthy. Same with the bidding wars that start.

Also I find the guys complaining about this thread messing up their “deals” hilarious. Keep them coming!

We need perspective from the mom and pop sellers! They must love this thread lol.

Which was part of my (way too long) point above. I'm sure it's great for those that don't want to do all the hunting, hope they'll find something here, and get lucky that way. I'm certain you really appreciate the deals near you that get posted. But it can also hurt the people that are putting the work in on their own to find games.

Double edged sword, I guess. Much like many things in life, there are positives and negatives, and people will fall on both sides of the fence with it. I've fallen victim to the negative side a lot, but I'm sure some people have ended up on the positive end too.

This is my most favorite thread on Pinside. Keep posting the project pins. I've come across some great deals here. Thank you.

And this right here is a perfect example of two sides to every coin. I'm happy to upvote that post because it shows the positive side to counter the negative. It's all about perspective. Just as easy to show some thankful support as it is to show a little frustration. I get both sides.

While I know this won't change your mind or how you feel, I can at least provide proof of pinsiders acquiring deals I have specifically posted.

Example #1, 10 days ago: Genie for $100: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/post-project-pins-for-sale-here-cl-ebay-pinside-and-others/page/462#post-6929823

Example #2, 15 days ago: Pro Football for $275: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/post-project-pins-for-sale-here-cl-ebay-pinside-and-others/page/460#post-6921904

Example #3, 30 days ago: Genie for $200: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/post-project-pins-for-sale-here-cl-ebay-pinside-and-others/page/459#post-6898082 A person on a pinball discord group I mentioned this to picked it up as their first pin. Proof in the image below:

genie (resized).PNG

Anyway, I'm not going to continue talking about this further, as this thread is for projects and projects discussion. This is all the effort I will put in to show proof of the three examples you wanted. As it is I've basically stopped posting on almost every other thread on pinside regarding deals/selling due to receiving either hostile or passive-aggressive replies.

I appreciate your posts and the amount of time it takes you to do them. Don’t let trolls ruin your fun.

Second-ed-ed.

I'm going to go flick my balls in your honor. (Probably on a game I found here, that I didn't bid up.)

Hopefully that's not directed my way. No trolling from my end, was just providing a different perspective. HH and I actually exchanged some good PMs tonight about stuff. He gets both sides, there are no hard feelings either way.

A majority of my games are thanks to this thread. A great resource.

I flipped through to backstop my memory, might have gotten 2, perhaps 3 pins tops from this thread. Mostly I enjoy people having a good time hunting them. Usually if a CL ad is posted, I have already seen it.

The 5 pin lot someone posted last week? I saw the ad minutes after posting to CL, just dumb luck.

Good luck Max. We have a place in freedom and when we’re there I move my marketplace search that way. I would have been floored to find 2 project games right in town. Neither are on our short list, but it would have been very tempting.

Dave

Actually I got this one before you posted it on hear. As I was driving back home I checked to see if you had listed it. Sure enough. Its cool though