(Topic ID: 319159)

Pop Bumpers Not Lighting After 5SMD Insane Bright New Bulbs

By Kingjowjow

1 year ago


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    #1 1 year ago

    Greetings Everyone,

    I recently purchased my first pinball machine a 1990 Bally Dr. Dude and was installing some new 5SMD Insane Bright New pop bumper bulbs to replace the old original ones. When I turned the game back on, 2 of the 3 pop bumpers were no longer light. They still function correctly in gameplay but just 2 of them are not lit. I've tried to wiggle the new bulbs in place and messed with the pins in the pop bumpers to get a better connection but I still can't get them to light. I have a Multimeter a checked the continuity of the area where the wires go from the light socket of the pop bumper to below the playfield and on the 1 working pop bumper I get a .3-.4 from the "OL" setting on the Multimeter, but on the two that are not working when I test continuity on those same points I get no Ohm reading. I'm not sure if I need to follow these wires back to the main board to find the issue and if they connect to a pin connector or a fuse/transistor that may be bad. That being said I'm not sure where to turn next or what to replace if I'm not getting a reading on those two or why they just stopped working randomly. Thanks for any comments or tips on how to fix this I hope to hear from you all soon. Thank you!

    Pop_Bumper_02 (resized).jpgPop_Bumper_02 (resized).jpg
    Pop_Bumper_03 (resized).jpgPop_Bumper_03 (resized).jpg
    Pop_Bumper_04 (resized).jpgPop_Bumper_04 (resized).jpg

    #2 1 year ago

    You ever think you'd have less issues not changing so many things?
    I kid

    #3 1 year ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    You ever think you'd have less issues not changing so many things?
    I kid

    Ugh I know. The old lights were so dim and I love bright lighting. Really new to all of this pinball modding and the game is a gift so I'm trying to get it in tip top shape before I gift it to a special person. Any Idea how I can fix this issue?

    #4 1 year ago
    Quoted from Kingjowjow:

    When I turned the game back on, 2 of the 3 pop bumpers were no longer light. They still function correctly in gameplay but just 2 of them are not lit.

    I don't quite understand what you mean here.

    What exactly is happening or not happening?

    #5 1 year ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    I don't quite understand what you mean here.
    What exactly is happening or not happening?

    Basically 2 of the 3 Pump Bumpers do not light after putting new bulbs in. I've tried bending the tabs inside the pop bumper for a better connection but no luck. The lights are still good cause I tested them in the 1 working pop bumper and they still light. There is not continuity below the playfield where the 2 non working lit pop bumpers are, but the working pop bumper has a reading of .3-.4 from the "OL" setting on the Multimeter. I circled in red on the picture I posted where im testing. Not sure how to get these two pop bumpers to lite again.

    #6 1 year ago
    Quoted from Kingjowjow:

    There is not continuity below the playfield

    Testing across the bulb does not count as continuity testing. I thought I indicated that in your other thread, but maybe I didn't describe it well enough.

    Continuity means that the signal continues along a path without interruption. For example, from one end of a wire to the other. This is usually to test for any breaks in a connection somewhere between one end to another.

    For example, you would do a continuity test from one lug of a lamp socket all the way back to the connector on the driver board. If there is continuity, that means there are no breaks along the signal path between the lamp lug and the connector. If there is not continuity, that means there is a break somewhere that you will need to track down (broken wire, bad crimp in a connector, burnt/corroded connector pins, etc).

    So, when you are trying to test a LED bulb with a "continuity test", that's not really a valid test. There isn't a direct path within the bulb since there is circuity inside. And the better test would be just to plug it into a working socket, like you later described.

    The purpose of a continuity test is to make sure that the path to power/ground/signal is intact and reaches the device (bulb, coil, motor, switch, etc) that you are trying to troubleshoot. If continuity is broken, then the device is never going to operate.

    #7 1 year ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    Testing across the bulb does not count as continuity testing. I thought I indicated that in your other thread, but maybe I didn't describe it well enough.
    Continuity means that the signal continues along a path without interruption. For example, from one end of a wire to the other. This is usually to test for any breaks in a connection somewhere between one end to another.
    For example, you would do a continuity test from one lug of a lamp socket all the way back to the connector on the driver board. If there is continuity, that means there are no breaks along the signal path between the lamp lug and the connector. If there is not continuity, that means there is a break somewhere that you will need to track down (broken wire, bad crimp in a connector, burnt/corroded connector pins, etc).
    So, when you are trying to test a LED bulb with a "continuity test", that's not really a valid test. There isn't a direct path within the bulb since there is circuity inside. And the better test would be just to plug it into a working socket, like you later described.
    The purpose of a continuity test is to make sure that the path to power/ground/signal is intact and reaches the device (bulb, coil, motor, switch, etc) that you are trying to troubleshoot. If continuity is broken, then the device is never going to operate.

    Thank you for the reply. I tested the bulbs in the working Pop pumper and they still light. So if I dont have continuity on the lug of the lamp sockets on the non working ones, it must mean that when I follow the wire to the connector on the driver board it should be blown and I just need to put in new connector pins I take it.

    #8 1 year ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    (broken wire, bad crimp in a connector, burnt/corroded connector pins, etc).

    I think when I get to the driver board I will need to replace the non working pop bumer light connector pins. It is similar to what happend to my GI connector pins they got burnt when trying to hook up LED strips will Alli clips to a Gi light and burnt that connector pin which eneded up looking like this.

    Lower_GI_03 (resized).jpgLower_GI_03 (resized).jpg

    #9 1 year ago

    Wedge base LEDs often don’t work unless you reshape the contacts on the bulb base. Bend the free end of each contact slightly outward over the raised edge of the base and then reinstall.

    #10 1 year ago
    Quoted from Jenk540i:

    Wedge base LEDs often don’t work unless you reshape the contacts on the bulb base. Bend the free end of each contact slightly outward over the raised edge of the base and then reinstall.

    I have tried that, but did not raise the edge of the contacts to high outward, ill try that again. Not sure if thats the issue though because I get no Reading from the bottom two pop bumpers at the two points I have circled, but the one does does work gets a reading of .3-.4 from the "OL" setting on the Multimeter. Any ideas? Mabey these new lights installed were too strong and burnt the connector pins on the driver board.

    Pop_Bumper_04 (resized).jpgPop_Bumper_04 (resized).jpg

    #11 1 year ago

    Have you tried putting the old bulbs back in the non lighting bumpers? That would at least verify if the bumper lights are still working.

    Are you using the correct volts on the bulbs? Wondering if using one of the SMDs is drawing too much, and not allowing the others to light.

    #12 1 year ago
    Quoted from SterlingRush:

    Have you tried putting the old bulbs back in the non lighting bumpers? That would at least verify if the bumper lights are still working.
    Are you using the correct volts on the bulbs? Wondering if using one of the SMDs is drawing too much, and not allowing the others to light.

    I tried putting the old bulbs back in the non working sockets and no luck. The new bulbs I installed worked for 1 game then 2 of the 3 are no longer working. One of the pop bumpers with the new bulbs still lights with old or new bulbs.

    #13 1 year ago

    OK, with verifying using the old bulbs no longer work, I have to ask: what did you do to the machine(work wise), between the bumpers working with the old bulbs, and now 2 of them not working currently?

    Were you swapping them out with machine off or on? Is the connector pictured above, for the bumper lights, or was that the other issue you mentioned regarding the GI and alligator clips incident?

    Side note, any time you have to replace a burnt connector, you need to strip said wire(s) back far enough to remove any burnt portion of wire, replace with new pins and connector. Also, highly advise to replace the header pins on the board, as any scarring/heat damage on those pins will cause resistance.

    If you’ve done that, and have continuity on each wire from board connector to bumper, then you’ll have to dig deeper into the board.

    #14 1 year ago
    Quoted from SterlingRush:

    OK, with verifying using the old bulbs no longer work, I have to ask: what did you do to the machine(work wise), between the bumpers working with the old bulbs, and now 2 of them not working currently?
    Were you swapping them out with machine off or on? Is the connector pictured above, for the bumper lights, or was that the other issue you mentioned regarding the GI and alligator clips incident?
    Side note, any time you have to replace a burnt connector, you need to strip said wire(s) back far enough to remove any burnt portion of wire, replace with new pins and connector. Also, highly advise to replace the header pins on the board, as any scarring/heat damage on those pins will cause resistance.
    If you’ve done that, and have continuity on each wire from board connector to bumper, then you’ll have to dig deeper into the board.

    Really appreciate the tips. So, I swapped the Bumper lights out with the machine off. I dont remember doing anything between when I installed them and when they went out besides turn the game on and off a few times. The connector picture above is for the bumper lights. I've read that the connector white plastic housing should still be okay as long as I strip and replace the connector pins. Here is a pic of the GI connector plastic house I was going to re-use and just strip back the wires that got burnt connector pins. The board is a little black, but I've been told all should be okay and I can clean up the black areas with an eraser. If I make my way to the driver board and the pop bumper housing is a little black, would it just be okay to strip the blown wires and replace new connector pins?

    #15 1 year ago
    • Those points you are testing look like switch points not lamp points. I can't tell for sure since the image is 2D.
    • The connector that is burned is a FLASHER connector not a GI connector. This kind of burn is NOT common for flashers.
    #16 1 year ago
    Quoted from DumbAss:

    Those points you are testing look like switch points not lamp points. I can't tell for sure since the image is 2D

    I think its the right spot, wish I had a better picture on hand. In the picture the two wires coming down from the pop bumper connect to where I tested.

    Quoted from DumbAss:

    The connector that is burned is a FLASHER connector not a GI connector. This kind of burn is NOT common for flashers.

    The burnt connector pin I showed a pic of is an example of my burnt GI pin I need to fix, it was just an example of what I think my pop bumper plastic housing may look like if I popped it out. Or does the pop bumper lights wires not go to a plastic housing?

    #17 1 year ago
    Quoted from Kingjowjow:

    I think its the right spot, wish I had a better picture on hand. In the picture the two wires coming down from the pop bumper connect to where I tested.

    If you have installed all LEDs then you won't get continuity between the power (supply) and return. The GI is AC. It looks like your pop bumper lamp is connected to the YEL and WHT-YEL wires. Williams manuals don't document the GI layout other than the connection points at the board. If you have incandescent bulbs installed then you should have continuity as the bulb is a wire not a diode.

    Quoted from Kingjowjow:

    The burnt connector pin I showed a pic of is an example of my burnt GI pin I need to fix, it was just an example of what I think my pop bumper plastic housing may look like if I popped it out. Or does the pop bumper lights wires not go to a plastic housing?

    I would recommend that you post images of YOUR connectors and headers not someone else's. That pop bumper is not Williams standard. It's Bally (Midway Manufacturing) so I'm not familiar with the wiring and the assembly. That's why I have to go off images that you supply.

    You seem to have multiple problems. My opinion is that you try to get some local (onsite) help. You could be going back and forth on this for multiple days in multiple posts across multiple threads. If you're not in a hurry to get it fixed this may work for you but, honestly, from what I see in your threads you aren't getting too much help. I can't speak for others but I like to see images of what you're dealing with rather than a description. A picture is worth 1,000 words. Please don't take that personally. Just trying to help.

    #18 1 year ago
    Quoted from DumbAss:

    If you have installed all LEDs then you won't get continuity between the power (supply) and return. The GI is AC. It looks like your pop bumper lamp is connected to the YEL and WHT-YEL wires. Williams manuals don't document the GI layout other than the connection points at the board. If you have incandescent bulbs installed then you should have continuity as the bulb is a wire not a diode.

    I would recommend that you post images of YOUR connectors and headers not someone else's. That pop bumper is not Williams standard. It's Bally (Midway Manufacturing) so I'm not familiar with the wiring and the assembly. That's why I have to go off images that you supply.
    You seem to have multiple problems. My opinion is that you try to get some local (onsite) help. You could be going back and forth on this for multiple days in multiple posts across multiple threads. If you're not in a hurry to get it fixed this may work for you but, honestly, from what I see in your threads you aren't getting too much help. I can't speak for others but I like to see images of what you're dealing with rather than a description. A picture is worth 1,000 words. Please don't take that personally. Just trying to help.

    Thanks for the kind words, I know your trying to help and I really appreciate it. I get a chance to work on the game again Tuesday to further investigate and will supply better pictures and start a fresh thread instead of kinda going all over the place and focus on 1 issue at a time. Thanks again

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