(Topic ID: 117038)

Poll: Favorite EM playfield target


By DirtFlipper

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 66 posts
  • 26 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by presqueisle1
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Topic poll

“What is your favorite type of EM playfield target?”

  • Spinner 17 votes
    28%
  • Vari-target 4 votes
    7%
  • Drop target 26 votes
    43%
  • Kickout hole 1 vote
    2%
  • Standup target 3 votes
    5%
  • Roto unit 9 votes
    15%
  • Messenger ball 1 vote
    2%

(61 votes)

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There are 66 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.
#1 4 years ago

Would you rather nail a spinner or bury a vari-target? Sweep a bank of drop targets or land in the kickout hole? Curious minds want to know...

#2 4 years ago

Love me some Drop targets, but I also love nailing a Spinning Target which would be my second choice.

Ken

#3 4 years ago

wishy-washy answer coming up...

standup targets are my "favorite" target (a change for me, drop targets were for a long time) to shoot at...

but nothing feels as good as burying the vari-target...

#4 4 years ago

I like to hit the swinging target.

#5 4 years ago

I feel roto-targets are unique to EMs so I voted for them. I love KOD and Spin Out for the roto targets. Now, having said that, I'm sure someone will point out some DMD game that has a roto-unit...

#6 4 years ago

I don't know, you hit any of them solidly & it feels good!

#7 4 years ago

Sky jump drop target with its pink and white lights lit and the red star lit. I love the sound of that free game knocker!

#8 4 years ago
Quoted from ccotenj:

wishy-washy answer coming up...
standup targets are my "favorite" target (a change for me, drop targets were for a long time) to shoot at...
but nothing feels as good as burying the vari-target...

Time to paraphrase, kind of.

Drop Targets are my "favorite". But as the guy from NJ writes, "Nothing feels as good as burying the Vari-Target".

Nuts! I can't decide. Hitting the center Stand Up target on Abra Ca Dabra, which advances the Bonus Unit and resets the Drop Targets is great as well.

Post edited by Darcy: Added more ACD info.

#9 4 years ago

I really liked the drop targets on Teacher's Pet. It's a little different than the traditional drop target because sometimes you want them up and sometimes you need them down and out of the way. Up and they can score big points. Down and you can hit the rebound switch behind them to light that badly needed letter to finish lighting "Teacher's Pet." Williams wasn't big on banks of targets but were pretty creative with just a few.

#10 4 years ago
Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

Love me some Drop targets, but I also love nailing a Spinning Target which would be my second choice.
Ken

I'm with Ken.

Drops with the spinner a close second.

If I ever get a chance to play a vari target for lots of time I may change. But just here and there at a show or Silverball I just can't get the feel.

Bert

#11 4 years ago

Nothing better than the sound of a drop target. I think that's why I like Gottlieb's because they used them so much.

#12 4 years ago
Quoted from AlexF:

Williams wasn't big on banks of targets but were pretty creative with just a few.

My Palooka and Big Daddy are both like that. Single drops that really mean a lot and take good aim to hit. Seems Williams were pretty much the only ones using drop targets at the time.

I still like that swinging target on Magic Clock. The fact that your shot not only has to be accurate, but timed as well. With two inch flippers to boot.

I'm surprised gobble hole isn't on the list of options either.

#13 4 years ago

It all depends on the reward given for hitting any of the above.

Hitting a stand up target for multiple specials is a real buzz!

#14 4 years ago

Who doesn't love tearing through a spinner and hearing the sounds of the relays, score reels and chimes trying to keep up with the revs?! So satisfying!

#15 4 years ago
Quoted from 5280wzrd:

Who doesn't love tearing through a spinner and hearing the sounds of the relays, score reels and chimes trying to keep up with the revs?!

It depends on the spinner and where it is located. The one on Bon Voyage is my favorite because if you hit it dead on the ball will make it through one of the rollover lanes and back to the top. That is a very satisfying shot and really makes those parts work.

Now on the other hand the Fun Land I played last week had spinners that even if you hit them full power would barely even spin and make one bell ring.

#16 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

It depends on the spinner and where it is located.

Definitely. I always felt that on EM pins even back in the day that Williams and Bally Spinning Targets were the best in both how much spin you could get out of them and their location on the Playfield to maximize this.

Gottlieb Spinning Targets on the other hand always felt misplaced and lame on the spinning factor, almost as though they treated these as an after thought to the game as opposed to their own Vari-Targets which were much better used IMO.

It's because of this opinion why I have decided to get a Bally Hokus Pokus in the future, three (3) well placed spinning targets that spin well and are located where they should be to maximize this feature. I know , I know, I said no more Multiplayers but I can't find a single player I like with Spinning Targets so when I expand my arcade in the future to Eight (8) pins I can then easily accommodate a 2 Player machine once again.

FYI: The new Arcade with accommodate 8 pins, 2 gun games, a submarine game, and 1 ball bowler. Construction to begin in 2016.

Ken

#17 4 years ago

Vari-target is almost always a risky death shot, but I think that's what makes burying it so fun.

#18 4 years ago

Well, I just read that some Williams games gave 200 replays - I know that whatever I had to hit to get this would be totally amazing

#19 4 years ago
Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

Gottlieb Spinning Targets on the other hand always felt misplaced and lame on the spinning factor, almost as though they treated these as an after thought

So this isn't just Fun Park? I guess you could almost count on one hand the amount of games they had with spinners. I think it was a missed opportunity. They seemed content to use a lot of the same features on many of their games during certain eras like the roto targets in the 50s and 60s and drop targets in the 70s. Just moving them around.

#20 4 years ago
Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

Gottlieb Spinning Targets on the other hand always felt misplaced and lame on the spinning factor, almost as though they treated these as an after thought to the game as opposed to their own Vari-Targets which were much better used IMO.

I don't know, the spinners on my Gottlieb King Kool really zip when you hit the sweet spot. Had both of them going full tilt at the same time last week with a couple of well placed shots.

#21 4 years ago

IMHO, right behind the powered bumper and the flipper, the third most important element of the modern pinball machine is without a doubt the drop target. Although there are many games without them that are tons of fun, drop targets really revolutionized pinball. It's really a blast to pick them off.

#22 4 years ago
Quoted from jrpinball:

drop targets really revolutionized pinball.

Perhaps.

image-22.jpg

#23 4 years ago

Minstrel Man has some cool drops.

image-11.jpg

#24 4 years ago

Wild West had that style drop target too. I have never played one but it sure looks cool.

#25 4 years ago
Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

Definitely. I always felt that on EM pins even back in the day that Williams and Bally Spinning Targets were the best in both how much spin you could get out of them and their location on the Playfield to maximize this.
Gottlieb Spinning Targets on the other hand always felt misplaced and lame on the spinning factor, almost as though they treated these as an after thought to the game as opposed to their own Vari-Targets which were much better used IMO.
It's because of this opinion why I have decided to get a Bally Hokus Pokus in the future, three (3) well placed spinning targets that spin well and are located where they should be to maximize this feature. I know , I know, I said no more Multiplayers but I can't find a single player I like with Spinning Targets so when I expand my arcade in the future to Eight (8) pins I can then easily accommodate a 2 Player machine once again.
FYI: The new Arcade with accommodate 8 pins, 2 gun games, a submarine game, and 1 ball bowler. Construction to begin in 2016.
Ken

That's right isn't it.

Gottlieb spinners seem a bit misplaced and you don't get as much from them.

If I have the thousands lit on my Williams Space Mission and I hit it just right you can get some great scoring and the sound is like no other.

#26 4 years ago

It looks like Keeney's Arrowhead was the first to use the modern style drop target and then Williams pretty much took over for the rest of the decade and fine tuned it.

#27 4 years ago

LOVE the roto-target units, on my Cow-Poke and Diamond Jack pins ... such a cool and addicting concept!

#28 4 years ago

I like the carousel type roto on "DJ", "KOD", and "Dancing Lady". They should have used it more often.

#29 4 years ago

I like drops then stand up targets and roto-targets vari targets the least!
target pool next to 2001 is the perfect 1- 2 punch
as for spinners, Williams spinners al the way.
nailing the spinners on grand prix are a blast when tuned just right. gottlieb never had great spinners

#30 4 years ago
Quoted from frb:

Vari-target is almost always a risky death shot, but I think that's what makes burying it so fun.

yup... that is why is is my favorite shot to execute, but not my favored target to shoot at...

#31 4 years ago

I went spinner but drop targets are a razor thin second. The reason I gave spinners the edge is that there is no luck involved a glazing bounce can take a drop out but you have to nail a spinner dead on to really make it sing.

#32 4 years ago

Was surprised pop bumper didn't make the list or kickers. As young pinhead i have always thought no pops and drops made a machine not worth my time. But this was mostly due to what i was exposed to. Have had some use of all the target types but probably not enough of some. With more exposure to em and a chance to interact with more of these the list may change. I look at the stand up target as the cop out to something better either by choice or due to cost.

1 Drop target
2 spinner
3 Pop bumper
4 Roto unit either style drum/roll
5 spinning disc (I know this didn't make to many machines but i like them)
6 Kicker sling
7 Vari-target
8 stand up target

#33 4 years ago

My favorite has not been listed. I like roll overs. Games like North Star and Sweethearts supply this. My next favorite would be pop bumpers and them having a purpose like in games like Slick Chick and Gigi.

#34 4 years ago
Quoted from Rat_Tomago:

I like roll overs.

I like them too! Lanes or buttons. Throw in a couple of pop bumpers, passive bumpers, kickout holes and maybe even a drop target or two, and it can be a fine game. You can keep the roto and vari targets.

#35 4 years ago

+1 pop bumpers: pinball MUST have some randomness and those dc Williams pops really make some games. And lighting and then shooting for the 1000 pop on Bally Blackjack is beauty. Love me some "when lit" action on pop bumpers. And in games like Triple Action, there are some things you can't really hit without some help from the pops.
+1 spinners... especially in Night Rider and Space Mission. I think I got almost 30 grand out of a good Space Mission-1000 lit spinner rip once. There is nothing like the sound of a killer em spinner shot: the clackity clack of the score reels reeling and the dindingding of the chimes at the same time...
Drop targets if I had to choose or die though.

#36 4 years ago
Quoted from Rat_Tomago:

My favorite has not been listed. I like roll overs. Games like North Star and Sweethearts supply this. My next favorite would be pop bumpers and them having a purpose like in games like Slick Chick and Gigi.

I too like the traditional lane rollover. However, I like it most when there's a challenging flipper shot to a "chimed" rollover at the top of the playfield, as in the JACK rollover at the top of Hit the Deck (photo below).

Equally, I really like the enigmatic roll-under. Gottlieb's 1952 Queen of Hearts has great roll-unders flanking each side of the upper playfield (photo below).
20140825_220458.jpg
Image 23.jpg

#37 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

Perhaps.

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Say, Odin is that Drop Target on Big Daddy a trick shot, leading to a SDTM drain?

#38 4 years ago
Quoted from Darcy:

Say, Odin is that Drop Target on Big Daddy a trick shot, leading to a SDTM drain?

It can be. But what you don't want want to do is shoot it there once the target is down. Then it will most likely go STTM. I learned by watching my daughter play. She doesn't mess with that target much. She likes to get the ball back up top. With the outlanes the way the are and the bounceback from the target, even a few seconds down below can be too much. Ask rat, he'll tell ya!

#39 4 years ago

Yup...That game is all about keeping the ball at the top as long as you can.

#40 4 years ago

I debated, but I intentionally left off pop bumpers, dead bumpers, rollovers (lane or round), and slings (powered or not), since their roles are more commonly incidental. Yes they score points, and yes there are some "sequence" games that are solely based on them (well, not slings so much). I was more curious about 'target' type features that rarely have an incidental role. Of course there are exceptions, but that's where I drew the line.

I did forget gobble holes though!

Looks like drop targets and spinners are favored (so far), and I'm surprised by the strong showing for roto units.

I think it would also be interesting to ponder what one "modern day" playfield feature would work well on an EM, like ramps, trails (despite there being one example) - stuff like that. Something that could be supported with EM-era technology and playfield physics. Probably a separate thread though.

#41 4 years ago
Quoted from DirtFlipper:

I did forget gobble holes though!

You were probably safe leaving that one off the list. I personally don't dislike gobble holes. It would be surprising if it were anyone's favorite feature though.

#42 4 years ago
Quoted from DirtFlipper:

I did forget gobble holes though!

Quoted from AlexF:

You were probably safe leaving that one off the list. I personally don't dislike gobble holes. It would be surprising if it were anyone's favorite feature though.

Well said Alex. Yea, I can't remember the last time someone said to me, "Gee, I sure wish they had put a few Gobble Holes on this game".

Ken

#43 4 years ago

I could imagine using a gobble hole though, that instead of just draining the ball, randomly sent it to one of two or three 'kickout' holes and launched the ball back into play.

Below the playfield on gobble holes are these troughs that funnel the ball back to the main ball cage (gobbles holes were only used on games that still used five balls and a mechanical ball lift, so they funneled the balls back to there). I could envision routing those to a form of kickout hole that brought the ball back up onto the playfield. Maybe a gobble hole up top, and two kickback holes left and right down field.

Then a gobble hole might be more interesting to shoot for.

#44 4 years ago
Quoted from DirtFlipper:

I could imagine using a gobble hole though, that instead of just draining the ball, randomly sent it to one of two or three 'kickout' holes and launched the ball back into play.
Below the playfield on gobble holes are these troughs that funnel the ball back to the main ball cage (gobbles holes were only used on games that still used five balls and a mechanical ball lift, so they funneled the balls back to there). I could envision routing those to a form of kickout hole that brought the ball back up onto the playfield. Maybe a gobble hole up top, and two kickback holes left and right down field.
Then a gobble hole might be more interesting to shoot for.

I like it! They can be a great risk/reward shot on a lot of the games I've played. You are right though, they could have been a little more creative with their use. Maybe one hidden behind a drop target with narrow opening and a healthy reward. Maybe a nearby rollover would reset the drop to block the opening. It could be an added ball and a replay like on some of the convertible games. That would be fun to shoot for.

#45 4 years ago

The roll over targets on Surf Champ are just as fun as the drops. Only game I have played where that's the case.

A gobble hole is a great feature...to avoid. I like having it (on just one game I own), just to avoid it.

Hey, you know what, wouldn't it be cool to have a single drop/standing target somewhere that you needed to avoid and not hit, where you could lose something, like points or a bonus? Maybe to make sense it would have to be in a line or bank, so you have to aim for something close to it.

#46 4 years ago
Quoted from presqueisle:

wouldn't it be cool to have a single drop/standing target somewhere that you needed to avoid and not hit, where you could lose something, like points or a bonus?

Literally losing points would be tough to implement on an EM I think.

But Volley has a rule set that is somewhat along these lines (as does Jacks Open). The drop targets aren't worth as much until after you get the top rollovers. On Volley in particular, it's better to avoid the drop targets until after the corresponding colored rollover is achieved. This of course runs counter to the conventional "just knock down all the drops" one might expect. You can do that, but won't rack up many points in the process. It's better to avoid them and send the ball back up top to the rollovers, and then only go for the color that has the rollover achieved. And that's hard, since the bank arrangement sends the ball over to the other banks.

It might be fun to set up a drop target that can only be achieved by first sending the ball into a gobble hole, which sends it to a kickback hole, which is aimed at the drop target...

#47 4 years ago

True on the Volley and Jack's Open. Some of the strategy is to avoid.

"Literally losing points would be tough to implement on an EM I think."

Yes, losing points may not have worked, but how about where you lose the ball...like on a tilt? Wow, that would've been maddening.

#48 4 years ago

I think Alex's idea of a downed drop target revealing a gobble hole would be interesting. You need to get the drop target, and then need to avoid it!

#49 4 years ago

Team One has 'hidden' targets, where you need to hit the drops first to get at them. Yes, a hidden target to avoid, or a hidden gobble hole would've been neat.

#50 4 years ago

Neat. I think I may enjoy Team One and Volley. I do enjoy games with drop target banks but it seems aside from Pop-A-Card, the ones I owned were much as Dirtflipper described. Just knock down all the drops. There were some benefits to sharp shooting for a moving light for an added ball or getting the card hand. Essentially though if you get down all the drops in repetition your going to have a hell of a game. When I found myself not thinking about what I'm shooting at anymore I'd sell them.

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