Best rumor to date is PTC with custom call outs and updated software.

LTG : )

Can you advise where i can find these please

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/official-williams-and-bally-software-upgrades

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/official-williams-and-bally-software-upgrades/

If there is a radical remake i would be so stoked!

White Water would be cool but I hope they make some more AFM SE.

Cactus Canyon is coming...I’m in but can’t see it being realistic to expect by Christmas at this point. Hoping to hear something official soon!

What's the appeal of cactus canyon? I played it for the first time last weekend and it has some cool features, but the game play didn't wow me at all.

maybe some people like the cheesy western theme, I'm not interested, will wait until an A list pin is remade.

And yet another pinhead is enlightened to the mundane gameplay of CC... even people playing the Pinball Arcade version have figured out how mediocre the gameplay is. Placed side by side, you get way more fun out of BBB than an OG CC, and I wouldn’t call BBB a very deep game either. Like so many who have had access to play a butt ton of CC over the years, you really can feel that “death of pinball” vibe in how short changed the whole game development became. Not only is CC a boring title, the “chop woodiness” of its gameplay makes it a really piss poor candidate for a home collector title, especially if in a smaller collection. If I ran the circus, CGC would be pumping out Totan, TOM, WH2O, TAF, IJ, TZ, Shadow, Fishtales, CV or any host of other B/W classics before I green lighted CC. So seeing as CC has all but been confirmed as the next title by the pundits, color me unimpressed if it is CC without some kind of code update. Hell, I bought a MBrLE and that code is a tad shallow, but at least it was a complete and finished game. CC has that shallow code stench hanging all over it and no amount of CGC treatment (topper/dots/RGB GI etc...) will change that without a code update.

I thought code update was happening. Isn’t that why half of the hype exists? Might also be why it’s taking them so long.

For me personally, it’s a lipstick meets pig situation, but if it makes other people happy, then I am happy for them.

I will patiently wait for a title that tickles my fancy.

Will they ever be in a position to put out 2-3 games a a year? MB was how long ago?

With the people they have hired and moves they made. I suspect they will get to two games a year. Not all remakes.

LTG : )

My problem with CC is not the missing/weak code (that can be fixed). I just didn't find the layout all that great - and that's something that can't be fixed by new code.

The pop-up drop target "shootout" thing is really fun/cool. The rest of it is just blah. The Bart toy takes up way too much room for what it provides, the toilet bowl has been done before (and better) on both Creature and WH20, the train (while looking cool) doesn't interact with the ball, and the ramps are nothing special.

I wanted to really like it (and actually do like the theme), but the layout just isn't that interesting - and I don't see how CGC can fix that.

But I only have space for 4 machines!!

Won't happen over night. You have plenty of time to find more room.

LTG : )

I think some of you are overly harsh on the layout. The playfield drops are really fun. 3 ramps. The moving Gold Mine entrance adds a fun challenge. If they add saloon doors I think the Bart toy would be fun.

Most importantly to me though is the game always make me smile (who doesn’t love the banjo!) and I think it will look fantastic in my lineup.

“Honey, just shoot anything”

I like CC but I hope they redo the code.

And I have CG keep pumping out the classics like MM/AFM/MB as long as people keep buying them.
Just flood the market with these titles, please. (maybe one day I'll be able to get one...)

Fingers crossed they eventually take on Twilight Zone...
but at this rate they'll still have plenty of top-50 Bally/Williams games from 90s to remake when it's 2030.
one new game every 2 years...
CC in 2021?
TZ in 2023
TOM in 2025
WH20 in 2027
IJ in 2029
SSTNG in 2031
Scared Stiff in 2033
CV in 2035

then if pinball is still alive, The Shadow, CFTBL, BSD...

Again ... something built , update ....anything but silence!
They are way overdue and folks here pounded JJP for the same thing.

For those who love the theme, lets hope they get a code update for their sake. Lets just say even with a code update, this title is DOA as a theme for me. mbeardsley was right about the layout, not that great either.

Now as for the length of time to update the code, this would require CGC to either recode the whole thing in a different OS (so NOT WPC compatible) that runs on their platform OR they recode the 68000 machine code so it runs emulated under their currently developed platform.

Since the former is the most unlikely, that leaves the latter... now as far as the code base that Planetary has access to, I do not think they have the original source code, they simply have ROM images of the original code. If this is true, the first step of the process is uncompiling that code back to some symbolic source, then reanotating that code to reverse engineer the project. To do this legally requires WMS to grant reverse engineering clearance to Planetary and then they licensing that ability to CGC... then and only then can they start the disassembly and then somebody wise in the way of real time controller coding needs to do the anotation. Now you have someone study and learn the WPC hardware or find someone with this knowledge and have them identify all the guts of the code, subroutines and what they are used for, hardware memory locations and driver ID's, DMD handling routines, switch matrix and lamp matrix coding, etc...

OK, now reconcile what the code does and what it doesn't do, and then baseline where and what additions to the rules and gameplay you want to enhance... Now try and fit those changes into the existing codebase without introducing a slew of bugs you will have to squash before you even get a working prototype up and running...

Yeah, this could take some time depending on size of developement team and resources you have to throw at the project... When you have a working codebase (lets say the production ROMS of MB for example) you need only make sure your platform "looks" like a WPC motherboard driving a WPC driver board, and the code should (in theory) require no additional programming, but we know that is not the case, as they have their underlying CGC menu and OS system handling things like DMD images, GI lighting routines, etc... so there is some developement time there... but not like trying to recode CC... There is WAY more work for that task than what they had to do for AFM or MB once they had the MM original platform developed.

CGC should do the IJ IPA remake, classic and blinged. How soon is subjective but it would be a grand slam like the top 3 were.

Seems like an awful lot of work to do when they could instead just build a remake of Addams Family with no needed code changes.

Just over two years now.

No #TAF?

Chasing the value of collectability of CC over the possible amount of money to be made on other B/W titles is one of the biggest (and ONLY IMHO) mistakes CGC has made so far. I love the crap out of my MBrLE, but going after that high dollar CC money on a title that most players at the time thought was a VERY disapointing "last real pinball machine ever produced" (and yeah it really wasn't but that's how people felt at the time), was/is a big mistake. Banking on rarity to sell a title that was mediocre at best is a real hard sell in my book.

I wonder how many machines does CGC need to sell to break even/profit? When you consider the technology is there and the assembly line is there etc... does CGC need to sell 1,000 Cactus Canyon's to consider it a success or does it need to sell more? Maybe it considers 1,000 a home run. I really have no idea. Every company would love to sell 1,000,000 machines but I wonder what the sales goals really are and how they have adjusted over time from MM to AFM to MB?

With the increased number of strong competitors it seems to me that they all need to try and hit home runs with theme and code on each release. Perhaps a CC wouldn’t fit that bill.

^This! Exactly- Before covid hit I would have said CC was a possible hit due only to rarity, but people want Fun and long lasting fun. It doesn't fit that mold right now.

PPS has the original source code and has compiled the original source code ... how would you be in a position to state what we do or not not have?

ugh

Glad you posted! I was thinking the same thing when I read his post.

Hi Rick,
Since your here can you confirm the title of the next game and when it will be announced? Also could you get with CGC and hash out a plan to make BBBr the next remake.

Thanks a lot!

it's been 2 years since the last cgc remake. i'm moving on to something else. tired of the waiting.

That sort of proves my point. Pin makers need to let known their scheduled releases. If They really feel they have a winning title on their schedule then announce it. Consumers will move on otherwise.

Well ... let me check on the title ... no I can't disclose that. Timeframe from announcement soon (the 'pinball' version of soon). BBBr we will relay the suggestion to CGC ... lol

If the next game is an Addams Family Remake - please say nothing and don't respond to this comment.

[waits 1 minute]

I KNEW IT!

Holy shit, TAF confirmed!!!

I am not in a place to state with certainty what PPS has access to. But I guess it was enough dis-information to get a response, so thank you. Now we know where they really started on recoding CC, so we know the delay isn't related to reverse-engineering the original code. Still hoping for something other than CC though...

Rick,
Will there be another run of MMRSE’s this year or in early 2021?

I am going to start using the pinball version of “soon” at my work. When my boss says are you close to finishing that project I’ll just keep saying “soon”.

I’m moving on. Lots of other options out and coming out.

Reminds me of Duke Nukem’ Forever. That was a perfect title.

-seems to always translate to "sometime this year" unless you are CGC then its "sometiime next year", but Deep Root has given a whole new meaning to the word (and it sounds suspiciously like "Never").

Hard to turn down a Stern theme like BTTF, 007, or Godzilla if there is no CGC news.

You'll see when it comes out and buyers finally get their hands on the remake, when it breaks the top 3 that you were wrong.... ahem.

Yes, sarcasm

Back when I was in the video game industry, we would refer to it as "Duke Nukem, Whenever".

I think CGC needs to start rethinking their strategy and ditch any remakes on their list. All you need to do is make something new like GNR and you will sell 5000 machines in one day. Make games like MBrLE and you can't sell 1500 LE's in over 2 years.

This is a little misleading... CGC sold 1500 LE's on a title that had been released 22 years ago and already had 3200 units in play... so not really something "Brand New" like GNR2
I wouldn't call that an apples to apples comparison.

The upside for the 4 year wait between games is the interest on the money your saving

Or the amount of time that has passed since you asked the wife to spend $8K+ on a shiny new toy...

And when it finally came out it was like WTF is that???