(Topic ID: 82361)

PMD – Fathom Restoration

By PinballMikeD

10 years ago


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#20 10 years ago
Quoted from PinballMikeD:

Checkout what I found inside the cabinet:

Pretty cool, this will be a fun little project - but it's nice to have an original cash box.

If it is important to you to have that cash box, by all means restore and keep it. Personally, I have found those old cash boxes to be more of a safety hazard with those sharp edges and want nothing to do with them. After several small cuts over the years reaching around those damn things I just toss them out these days. Going to a plastic bottom was one of the better changes of the cash box design.

#43 10 years ago
Quoted from Gatecrasher:

That's because someone probably removed them and painted them other than the factory and then put them back on.

I have seen it both ways, painted on both sides and unpainted. Can't tell you how much I hate pulling those staples out. Finally was able to figure out how to remove the side rails quickly without damaging them. Just keep wiggling the side rail back and forth. Rail comes off pretty quick. Make sure you remove any stray screws that might be holding it in first, though.

2 weeks later
#65 10 years ago

Did you remove all of the connectors prior to this tumbler bath? I would be concerned about corrosion with the female side of the connection. Unless you will be replacing all the crimp contacts later, which is a good idea anyway.

1 week later
#101 10 years ago
Quoted from PinballMikeD:

Cleaning printed circuit boards...
In general, I don't really worry about the components on the boards getting wet (except for the capacitors). However, due to the age of this machine I've decided to go ahead and replace all of the caps on both the Squawk & Talk and Solenoid Driver boards, so no worries this time around.
This boards is a little toasty, but functional. I'll replace the fuses, re-flow the solder on all of the connectors, and test each component to ensure they are within spec.

You mention replacing the caps. Are you going to replace the header pins on the Solenoid Driver board, too? New header pins really help make for a solid connection and will make the game more reliable.

Of couse, if you want to make the PCBs up to the level of the rest of the restoration, replace that old SDB with the Alltek as the Alltek board is superior to the original design.

#118 10 years ago
Quoted from PinballMikeD:

I work with Excel on a daily bases for my real job, so it just seemed natural to create spreadsheets for tracking pinball parts. I do this for every PMD restoration; it allows me to sort my parts by vendors and keep track of what I've ordered and what I have yet to order. Here's an example:

As I order parts I highlight those items yellow. Although, it never hurts to stock up on parts

This looks like a good way to keep track of all of the items you need to replace, and those that you have already replaced.

By the way, I sure hope you are not paying $69.00 for one sheet of playfield glass... If you are, look for a local glass company and they should be able to beat that price by a wide margin.

2 weeks later
#153 10 years ago
Quoted from Hellfire:

Alltek boards arent realy superior they are just new replacement boards but rebuilt originals are just as good if the tech knows what they are doing.
Alltek and rottendog boards are just for the people who cant fix the originals properly besides the way people generaly complain about the cost of a higher end restoration how do you think another $500 would go over on the bill and to my knowledge Alltek also dont make any replacement board for the Bally S&T.
Also it has been observed the Alltek Mpu has program glitches in several games same as the rottendog 327 multigame MPU.
The light driver boards only have a a power wire upgrade same thing can be modded onto an original boards they dont eliminate all the Led flicker as everyone thinks they do.
The driver board is the only real upgrade but then again replacing the obsolete LM323 regulator with a current voltage converter and rebuild for less than a new board makes an original just as good as the new replacements.
But I do agree on one point the header pin connectors should be changed or at minimum reflowed.

Over the past 12 years working on hundreds of classic Bally/Stern games, including operating these games on location, I have found that Alltek holds up far better than original boards, and properly repaired original boards, and Rottendog, too. Hey, if you want to trust repaired original boards in a high dollar restoration, go right ahead. I believe HEP uses Alltek where available, too.

Clearly, Rob, you can work on your own stuff and I am sure do a great job at it. Can all of your customers do the same level of electronics work as yourself? Probably not. So when that repaired original board breaks in 2, 5, or 10 years, do they call you for a warranty replacement? Alltek has replaced several MPU boards for me in warranty that had over 5 years of service, no questions asked as they have a lifetime warranty. I can assure you that people that buy high end restorations don't want to have to repair their own boards.

Also, saying that the original solenoid driver with a current voltage converter is the same as the Alltek just isn't accurate. Do you have any practical experience working with the Alltek solenoid driver board? It has indicator lights for bad coils, at a glance info available, not to mention short circuit protection--very helpful. These are great features that are not part of the original SDB.

Not sure why you are throwing rocks at the replacement board guys, especially Alltek. Their boards have saved many games.

#156 10 years ago
Quoted from Hellfire:

.

Its not a matter of throwing rocks at the altek and rotten dog but its true they have glitches ask anyone with a black knight about the 327 board having missing features in the game. i have also noticed all the way through version 9 if you use the altec board in a medusa it has a olympus bug and targets stop resetting, on xenon the software also has a tube shot and xenon bug among others.
Further rottendog boards ive dealt with on routed machines have more problems than reworked original boards along with numberous posts here in the forums about people having issues with new boards out of the box or arrive non working.
As far as HEP restorations hey anyone wanting to spend $10k to restore a SS Bally Ide be more than happy to use Altek boards for them like HEP if they like. i do offer altek boards on my restorations if the customer requests but typicly they dont want to pay the extra money for them
And well the pretty diagnostic lights i can add but realy they are kinda a waste of time since sol. malfunctions are so easy to track down on these ballys. esp using the Sol. test the number coil that dosnt fire is the bad one the same test you have to run to use the diagnostics lights on an altek board is only good if the problem is on the board itself.

I should have been more specific, Alltek boards are miles beyond Rottendog. In fact, I won't use Rottendog in any of my games as I have had the same experience you describe above. Some people like the cheaper alternative and don't mind troubleshooting them, though that is not for me. Thanks for the tip on Xenon and Medusa, I haven't run into it yet, but will keep my eyes open.

Short circuit protection is helpful if there is a coil with a dead short it won't take out any components on the SDB. Yes, it is easy to find problem coils and not hard to replace the parts on the board, either. Yet, this feature saved me plenty of time on location when coils shorted out as I didn't have to do any more work than necessary in a noisy, crowded bar. On an original SBD, that shorted coil would usually damage board components before the fuse would blow. I agree that some of the features don't matter as much to someone that understands how the game works and can troubleshoot on their own.

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