(Topic ID: 106247)

Please help me refurbish this Gottlieb system 80 power supply

By solarvalue

9 years ago


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  • 33 posts
  • 10 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by ForceFlow
  • Topic is favorited by 6 Pinsiders

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#1 9 years ago

Hi all,

Although I have owned pinball machines for a few years now, I am a complete beginner when it comes to circuit board work. I have decided, however, that I would like to start down the road of doing my own circuit board repairs.

I currently have a set of Gottlieb System 80 circuit boards which, I believe, came out of a Black Hole. These were sold to me cheap and I thought that trying to refurbish these boards might be a good place to start.

Although I will endeavour to work on these boards as carefully as possible, it won't be the end of the world if something goes wrong because the Black Hole pinball machine I own has Alltek/Rottendog replacement boards in it. My machine is not set up for my supply voltage, however, so I won't be able to test the boards using the machine for the time being.

So I am looking to get some advice on how to go about refurbishing these boards one at a time and to get some practice testing and replacing components. I thought it would be best to start with the power supply board, seeing as it looks to be the most simple with the least amount of components. I have a multimeter and a soldering iron which I have some experience with and I just bought a desoldering tool which I am keen to learn how to use.

Here is the board in question:

DSCN4494-231.JPGDSCN4494-231.JPG

So....

First question: Do I start by desoldering the transistor at Q3, so I can then remove the back cover?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

#2 9 years ago

Ok, I removed Q3, here's what it looks like now. How can I clean this area? I have some circuit board cleaner but it didn't remove everything.

DSCN4510.JPGDSCN4510.JPG

This part is broken, anyone know where I can get a replacement and what it is called?:

DSCN4523.JPGDSCN4523.JPG

I also removed diode CR7 and connector J1 because they looked ugly. I's a bit messy under CR7:

DSCN4513.JPGDSCN4513.JPG

Ok, so this is what the board looks like at the moment:

DSCN4507.JPGDSCN4507.JPG

DSCN4508.JPGDSCN4508.JPG

So far so good, which components should I change as a matter of course and how can I test the other components?

#3 9 years ago

30-year-old electrolytic capacitors should always be changed, especially on a power board. Diodes should be changed if they fail tests or look swollen or melted. Transistors should also be checked.

For cleaning, I've been spraying simple green on a toothbrush, then scrubbing the affected area, rinsing with water, and then with 91% isopropyl alcohol. Blow dry with an air compressor around 30-60 psi.

#4 9 years ago

ForceFlow, thanks for your help.

Quoted from ForceFlow:

30-year-old electrolytic capacitors should always be changed

So, would you change all capacitors C1-5?

#5 9 years ago

The life expectancy of an electrolytic cap is more a function of run time (plus heat, size and some other factors) rather than how old they are.

http://www.cde.com/tech/reliability.pdf

#6 9 years ago

Here ya go...
http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Gottlieb_System_80#Recommended_Updates_and_Repairs_for_the_System_80.2F80A_Power_Supply_Board

You can simply scratch that solder flux off the board. Or you can use a solvent like naphtha and a light wire brush.

The insulator can still be used. It's there to isolate the transistor leads from the cold plate.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info

#7 9 years ago

For the insulator -- use a MicroPlastics 18PTI1HDWOB as found here:
www.greatplainselectronics.com/products.asp?cat=136
Perfect fit.
Or just shove the pads of the broken one you have back into place and reuse...it'll work fine.

Caps age is definitely a function of age AND run time. Yes, a cap sitting on a shelf and never used can also go bad with time...just takes longer. I've found that the smaller caps (e.g. 1uF sound board caps) will go bad with age even with very little use. Large computer grade caps tend to have longest life spans unless they are overdriven.

Ed

#8 9 years ago

Thanks, great information here.

Quoted from G-P-E:

For the insulator -- use a MicroPlastics 18PTI1HDWOB as found here

Thankyou very much.

3 weeks later
#9 9 years ago

Ok, removed the parts and got the board cleaned up.

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I guess I need some double-sided tape for under C1 and C2.

#10 9 years ago

Nice work, coming along just fine. Yeah double sided tape, silicon caulk or hot glue would work too.

#11 9 years ago
Quoted from CNKay:

Nice work, coming along just fine.

Thanks. A couple of questions:

Is there a right way and a wrong way to put in the capacitors at C3 and C5?

How do I know which way to put the LEDs in?

#12 9 years ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

How do I know which way to put the LEDs in?

See how one leg of the LED is longer, or the plastic body has a flat side?

#13 9 years ago

LED-polarity.pngLED-polarity.png
#14 9 years ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

Is there a right way and a wrong way to put in the capacitors at C3 and C5?

Polarized caps have a (+) on the circuit board.

#15 9 years ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

Is there a right way and a wrong way to put in the capacitors at C3 and C5?

direction will not matter for those.

oh and you may want to take a piece of cut off resistor lead and form a loop and solder to test points. this way you can easily hook a test lead on at a later time.

#16 9 years ago

Vid, thanks for the help.

Quoted from CNKay:

direction will not matter for those.
oh and you may want to take a piece of cut off resistor lead and form a loop and solder to test points.

Thanks, and will do.

#17 9 years ago

OK, I have the new components on.

I tested all the resistors (probably should have done that before) and R8 and R12 are out of spec, so I will have to get some replacements.

The big transistor Q3 tests OK so I think I will use it again, even though I have a new one.

DSCN4548.JPGDSCN4548.JPG

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#18 9 years ago

Those are probably testing out of spec because you are testing them in circuit.
Resistors don't fail that often.
I'd connect the input power then measure the outputs.
It may be good to go.

Don't forget to put the LM723 in.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info

#19 9 years ago

OK, thanks.

Quoted from ChrisHibler:

Don't forget to put the LM723 in.

Does this have to go in a certain way up?

#20 9 years ago

looks like the socket is upside down? the notch and the dot on the pcb show the end that is pin one

#21 9 years ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

OK, thanks.

Does this have to go in a certain way up?

Yes it does. There are pictures in the System 80 sections of the PinWiki that will help.
The "notch" goes down.
System 80/80A power supply. Pic from PinWiki.comSystem 80/80A power supply. Pic from PinWiki.com
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info

#22 9 years ago
Quoted from wiredoug:

looks like the socket is upside down? the notch and the dot on the pcb show the end that is pin one

Rookie mistake! I'll fix it.

#23 9 years ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

Rookie mistake! I'll fix it.

There is really no need. The white dot silk screened on the board will be enough to indicate pin 1.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info

#24 9 years ago

OK, thanks everyone for your help with this power supply, I really appreciate it. I am learning a lot along the way and I hope this thread will be of use to others who are wanting to start out with circuit board repair.

Seeing as this board is pretty much done I think it might be time to move onto the CPU board. Here are a few pictures of the CPU board which is in my possession, I have tried to photograph the dodgy looking areas. Do you think this is repairable? Where to start?

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#25 9 years ago

Yup. Repairable. It'll be a bit of work.
Neutralize the alkaline corrosion first.
Does it boot?
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info

#26 9 years ago

the flux residue not cleaned just use ipa and a soft toothbrush. you have two of the RIOTs socketed nice. not much damage at all board looks nicer than any of mine so you might as well go buy a new one and send those to me.

So you built the PS and what NO readings? At least give us the no load voltages, before you think you are done with that board.

#27 9 years ago

Not the original CPU board, that looks like it's from an 80A (7 digit) since U2/3 are socketed and they look like they've never been touched. I can't remember if anything needs to be jumpered for it to work with 6 digit A2/3 and game ROM, anyone know? Since the CPU is replaced (probably due to major alkaline damage), I wouldn't trust any of those connector crimps at A1J1, A1J4, A1J5 & A1J6. I'd replace them all before trying to troubleshoot that board. It's also missing a capacitor (C26) at Z19.

Steve

#28 9 years ago
Quoted from ChrisHibler:

Neutralize the alkaline corrosion first.

Where are you seeing corrosion? Just under where the battery was?

Quoted from CNKay:

So you built the PS and what NO readings? At least give us the no load voltages, before you think you are done with that board.

OK, so I guess I'm going to have to set the machine up and test the power supply before proceeding(haven't done that yet).

Quoted from blownfuse:

I wouldn't trust any of those connector crimps at A1J1, A1J4, A1J5 & A1J6.

I'm pretty sure that's been done but I will check.

Quoted from blownfuse:

It's also missing a capacitor (C26) at Z19.

Good eyes!

#29 9 years ago

The fat trace that loops around the positive battery connection has light alkaline damage.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info

5 years later
#30 3 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

30-year-old electrolytic capacitors should always be changed, especially on a power board. Diodes should be changed if they fail tests or look swollen or melted. Transistors should also be checked.
For cleaning, I've been spraying simple green on a toothbrush, then scrubbing the affected area, rinsing with water, and then with 91% isopropyl alcohol. Blow dry with an air compressor around 30-60 psi.

Hey Force - any tips on desoldering Q3 without destroying it? I want to get at the solder side of the board to do a refurb. Is Q3 worth preserving or should I just cut it out?

#31 3 years ago
Quoted from AlonzoMoselyFBI:

Hey Force - any tips on desoldering Q3 without destroying it? I want to get at the solder side of the board to do a refurb. Is Q3 worth preserving or should I just cut it out?

Add some new solder to the old solder, then use a desoldering iron to suck everything out. Then unscrew it and (gently) remove it from the PCB. If you try to pull too hard without getting all the solder, then you might end up pull out the eyelets.

#32 3 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

Add some new solder to the old solder, then use a desoldering iron to suck everything out. Then unscrew it and (gently) remove it from the PCB. If you try to pull too hard without getting all the solder, then you might end up pull out the eyelets.

Awesome, as per usgh, Force - thanks. I managed to get it off before reading this by adding and removing as much solder (with a solder sucker) as i could then held the iron on both leads while gently prying, and it eventually let go. The top eyelets are fine, but I may have lost one on the back?

I'll have to look in to this "desoldering iron" you speak of.

Thanks again - Paul

#33 3 years ago
Quoted from AlonzoMoselyFBI:

I'll have to look in to this "desoldering iron" you speak of.

Take a look at the Hakko FR-300 or FR-301. It's light years better than a spring loaded solder sucker. I made the switch years ago and haven't looked back since.

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